Windows 10: Your thoughts so far?

VulcaN said:
So why are some settings in the tablet style settings menus and the rest of the normal settings in the control panel?

Why cant we just have all the settings in the control panel and disable those other pages all together, they're a pain to navigate and ugly.
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Most likely it is Control Panel that will be gone. Anything Win32-related is on the way out and to be replaced with WinRT (stuff that looks like tablet mode and uses "apps"). So, sooner or later it probably will all look the same way. That has been part of the plan even before the release of Windows 8. Notice you can no longer access Windows Update from the Control Panel. It is only available in the Settings "app". Believe this happened with the last Cumulative Update. Remember, change is a good thing or so MS tells us.
 
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mope54 said:
Apology for what?

As multiple people have pointed out, the setting is available but Windows basically ignores it...nice selective reading :rolleyes:

Main problem is the latest driver from nVidia broke some SLI profiles (and some issues with G-Sync) so some of us are trying to use a driver or two back. This is what's putting Windows in a driver update loop. If you want to be at the latest drivers, and you are on the latest drivers, then setting Windows not to update and then seeing that it doesn't update (because it's on the most current, not because it's actually adhering to the setting) isn't resolving the issue we were experiencing.
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Are you on the Windows Insider track or did you turn that off?
 
I turned that off.

I don't want my desktop default to be bleeding edge builds and, frankly, it's ridiculous that MS would make that the default setting. Imagine Chrome pushing Canary to all its users.
 
mope54 said:
I turned that off.

I don't want my desktop default to be bleeding edge builds and, frankly, it's ridiculous that MS would make that the default setting. Imagine Chrome pushing Canary to all its users.
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Getting Insider builds isn't the default.
 
tordogs said:
Most likely it is Control Panel that will be gone. Anything Win32-related is on the way out and to be replaced with WinRT (stuff that looks like tablet mode and uses "apps") ... Remember, change is a good thing or so MS tells us.
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This is honestly worse than the ribbon in applications.

To this day I can still navigate the drop-down menus faster, even now that I finally know where most stuff is in the ribbon.

There are so many editions of Windows, heck you have like 6 choices in the media creation tool. They need to get off their tablet high horse and just make the RT version a separate install, or an option during install, or something in add / remove Windows features
 
tordogs said:
Most likely it is Control Panel that will be gone. Anything Win32-related is on the way out and to be replaced with WinRT (stuff that looks like tablet mode and uses "apps").
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Win32 isn't going away any time soon. Win32 apps can now be distributed through the Windows Store with 10. That said universal apps make a lot of sense for many things. They can work well across desktops and tablets. They scale better across screen sizes and resolutions and are more resistant to malware.

tordogs said:
So, sooner or later it probably will all look the same way. That has been part of the plan even before the release of Windows 8. Notice you can no longer access Windows Update from the Control Panel. It is only available in the Settings "app". Believe this happened with the last Cumulative Update. Remember, change is a good thing or so MS tells us.
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As for the Control Panel, it's probably going to around for some time as many 3rd parties hook into it. That's why I figured that it wouldn't be gone from 10, it's not really feasible. While 8 was trying to do into the desktopless feature I think 10 is a realization that that future is pretty distant.
 
heatlesssun said:
Getting Insider builds isn't the default.
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I never said that it was...the second portion you are replying to is in a different paragraph from me answering his question :rolleyes:

from the link I posted earlier:
it takes on particular significance because of Windows 10's Windows-as-a-Service concept. It's not just security fixes that Microsoft will be rolling out and automatically installing; it's going to be a steady stream of feature updates, too, as Microsoft adds new capabilities and features to its operating system.[...]For Windows 10 Home users, this isn't going to be an option. If a future update breaks something essential, the user is going to be out of luck.If a future update breaks something essential, the user is going to be out of luck.
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that's referring to Home default settings, which is similar to Canary
 
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mope54 said:
I never said that it was...the second portion you are replying to is in a different paragraph from me answering his question :rolleyes:

from the link I posted earlier:


that's referring to Home default settings, which is similar to Canary
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May bad, but if you read posts 322 and 323 together I think it's easy to think you were saying that Insider builds were on by default.
 
Big douche move to automatically start installing drivers the second windows 10 (professional) is installed. Next time I will be pulling ehternet out before it reboots into Windows for the first time. How about an option for this during all those other questions you ask us during the customized setup screens? Didn't other versions of Windows ask you about your windows update settings during install? With the Pro version this should be asked.

My machine was hitching as I was going through and disabling the settings that invade privacy, then I went to configure windows update settings and saw it was downloading a driver for everything I had on my machine. Outdated drivers, drivers I didn't want.

The kicker was when I told it to never download drivers from windows update. I then uninstalled the Nvidia drivers so I could do a clean install of them with the features I want (no Geforce experience, no 3D vision), I rebooted, and then it installed an OLDER version of the Nvidia drivers that weren't even Windows 10 compatible.

I'm a little anal, but I can only imagine the holy hell those people who have install rituals (must do things in certain order, or else reformat and start again) are in.
 
tordogs said:
Most likely it is Control Panel that will be gone. Anything Win32-related is on the way out and to be replaced with WinRT (stuff that looks like tablet mode and uses "apps").
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That's not what WinRT is.
 
Installed win 10 earlier today and it didn't support GTX260m. So I'm gonna rip that shit card right out and install a couple of radeons in the laptop instead. AMD supports mobility radeons from 5000 series up. Then I might have another go at win 10.
 
How does the new licensing work with VirtualBox machines? Ie say I upgrade a Windows 8.1 vm to 10 during the free upgrade period and want to reinstall it/do a clean install?
 
VulcaN said:
I'm a little anal, but I can only imagine the holy hell those people who have install rituals (must do things in certain order, or else reformat and start again) are in.
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I'm one of those people (to a certain extent)...so there's no way of disabling automatic driver installs before 1st boot without pulling the Ethernet cord?
 
As far I know there is no way to stop the wretched thing from starting to download and install updates--let it install offline, do all your patches and tweaks and then plug in the ethernet--pray for the best. As Insiders it was suggested to disable any security/antivirus whilst downloading the upgrade and then pull the plug the instant the files downloaded and let it install. Saves lots of broken installs and errors as way too many things are trying to happen all at the same time.

When installed and online go straightaway to the Feedback app and upvote any and all comments/problems/suggestions re: forced updates. Microsoft needs to hear our concerns.
 
So far I am disappointed that the control panel is STILL after several years of windows 8 being out in the old windows 7 aero theme. I would have thought by now MS would have had all the settings moved into the current theme.

The calendar application seems to be working with google calendar again. good thing.

I like the notifications and so on. Great to have some of the more streamlined features of phones on a desktop.

My biggest complaint has to be the backwards implementation of live tiles in the start menu. I mean really I don't get it, they should have made them available on the desktop. Why does anyone want to open the start menu any time they want to see live tiles? It just doesn't make any sense. But I guess that's what we get when all the crazy people went bat shit over windows 8. Windows 10 even more so than windows 8 doesn't know what it is supposed to be and do. We still have this silly mixture of windows 7 and windows 8 stuff.
 
Tried it today on my HTPC.

It's dog shit, no internet connection at first after the rolled out upgrade from Win 7 Pro, unleashed the usual netsh reset commands via cmd to flush and reset the IP stack. Got a connection after restart but Wifi is seriously limited and capped.

Rolled back to Win 7 Pro.
 
rudy said:
My biggest complaint has to be the backwards implementation of live tiles in the start menu. I mean really I don't get it, they should have made them available on the desktop. Why does anyone want to open the start menu any time they want to see live tiles? It just doesn't make any sense. But I guess that's what we get when all the crazy people went bat shit over windows 8. Windows 10 even more so than windows 8 doesn't know what it is supposed to be and do. We still have this silly mixture of windows 7 and windows 8 stuff.
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The desktop? The thing that's covered by my apps all the time? Why would I put anything there? The Start Menu is easy to get to on any monitor at any time.
 
Has anyone who wants to postpone updates gone into services and set windows update service to start up stopped? Does it cause any problems, does it really stop all updates?

Be nice I'd hate having to stop doing anything while an update takes place since my daytime internet connection is too slow even a "small" virus profile update can take 20 minutes on a bad day.
 
rezerekted said:
How long before we see a similar advisory about Live tiles? Microsoft claims they care about security yet they are always doing things to the OS that puts us at risk. Microsoft is on my DO NOT TRUST list, just like google.
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Desktop gadgets that could be installed from anywhere running with zero control in the security context of the logged in user is a far cry for live tiles. Store apps run in far more restricted security context, are curated and braking out of the sandbox isn't all that easy. It can be done and Windows 10 easily allows for the side loading of store apps. But again, it's just not as simple.
 
Not as simple but still a possible exploit vector. Remember messenger in XP? How many PCs did Microsoft cause to become infected with malware because of that idiocy? Millions.
 
So what everything in windows is a possible exploit vector. What makes live tiles or gadgets any different than windows update, edge, IE, onenote, etc or anything else than can pull content from an extermal source....? If a flaw in the code exists or if you get applications or plugins from an untrusted or trusted but compromised source you can get malware. The difference is somethings MS will keep up on, others like windows gadgets which they abandoned they will not. Singling out live tiles just doesn't make any sense.

Most people are just looking for any braindead reason to hate on windows 10. If I look through these threads I will see like maybe 1 in 20 comments is a legitimate complaint about windows 10. Once again just like windows 8 this is a shame because it means that MS will keep making goofy ass decisions because the community cannot make up their mind. half the reason windows 10 doesn't make any damn sense in some areas is because its a sad attempt to make windows 7 type S personalities happy.
 
bob616 said:
Has anyone who wants to postpone updates gone into services and set windows update service to start up stopped? Does it cause any problems, does it really stop all updates?

Be nice I'd hate having to stop doing anything while an update takes place since my daytime internet connection is too slow even a "small" virus profile update can take 20 minutes on a bad day.
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Probably disabling Windows Update in Services is the easiest way to stop the checking for and dowloading of updates. Just have to remember to re-enable it from time to time to check for updates. Have read it could disable getting new apps from the Store but don't use them so can't comment. Could also upset Big Momma Cortana since she has to be in constant contact with Redmond to let them know what you're doing, where you are and what time you'll be home. I have her locked away and could care less.

If you are on WiFi you can set your connection to Metered and Windows won't check for and download updates. Can't find any way to set up metered connection on LAN network--need to get into Feedback and raise a stink about that for those of us who are hard-wired into a metered connection.
 
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rudy said:
others like windows gadgets which they abandoned they will not.
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How do you know they will keep Live Tiles secure? What about the millions of people still using gadgets and the sidebar that do not even know they are a security risk? Avast asks to disable them and is the only reason I knew they were a security risk.

I'm not singling out Live Tiles, my point is corporations claim they care about our security and yet they do things that lower our security all the time so they don't really care, they just care about money.
 
rezerekted said:
How do you know they will keep Live Tiles secure? What about the millions of people still using gadgets and the sidebar that do not even know they are a security risk? Avast asks to disable them and is the only reason I knew they were a security risk.

I'm not singling out Live Tiles, my point is corporations claim they care about our security and yet they do things that lower our security all the time so they don't really care, they just care about money.
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How do you know they will keep windows update secure? You don't know anything its a red herring. Its a risk you take using an OS someone else built. Don't like it, build your own OS. Or if you really think live tiles are going to be a problem turn them all off.
 
Nothing is bullet proof but it can be said with complete certainty that the amount of malware spread through modern/universal apps will NEVER approach the amount spread via Win32 apps. One thing that hasn't been mentioned much and I've not played around with it a lot, but it looks like all versions of Windows 10 allow for the side loading of modern apps. It's not intended as a means of distribution, only for development purposes but it looks like anyone can do it without restriction if they want to.
 
rudy said:
How do you know they will keep windows update secure? You don't know anything its a red herring. Its a risk you take using an OS someone else built. Don't like it, build your own OS. Or if you really think live tiles are going to be a problem turn them all off.
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They are turned off. I bet you people said messenger was great when XP was released too.
 
rezerekted said:
They are turned off. I bet you people said messenger was great when XP was released too.
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I didn't care for messenger because everyone in the USA used ICQ or AIM so I used Trillian. But I would think people in many other countries found the default inclusion of messenger to be great since it was very popular outside the USA.
 
Things I don't really enjoy about W10.

1. Menu animations
2. Menu customization
3. The entire new Control Panel

I know this sounds odd, but it seems TOO user friendly.

I'm on the fence about going back to Win7 ult.
 
rudy said:
I didn't care for messenger because everyone in the USA used ICQ or AIM so I used Trillian. But I would think people in many other countries found the default inclusion of messenger to be great since it was very popular outside the USA.
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I'm not talking about Messenger chat app, I'm talking about the messenger service that was immediately exploited by malware when XP came out and Microsoft had to disable it in an update because it was Swiss cheese security.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Windows_Messenger_service
 
tordogs said:
Probably disabling Windows Update in Services is the easiest way to stop the checking for and dowloading of updates. Just have to remember to re-enable it from time to time to check for updates. Have read it could disable getting new apps from the Store but don't use them so can't comment. Could also upset Big Momma Cortana since she has to be in constant contact with Redmond to let them know what you're doing, where you are and what time you'll be home. I have her locked away and could care less.

If you are on WiFi you can set your connection to Metered and Windows won't check for and download updates. Can't find any way to set up metered connection on LAN network--need to get into Feedback and raise a stink about that for those of us who are hard-wired into a metered connection.
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Thanks for the replay.

I don't use any store aps either (well ok once in a rare while I play Majong, I'm sure I can find it else where). Don't know about Cortana, probably won't use it, I tend to either search locally for files or on the internet using duckduckgo so I doubt I'd use Cortana...still if anyone has tried this and it effects Cortana I'd be interested to know--I don't plan on trying Windows 10 for a few months yet. If this works it really isn't much harder than turning updated on/off win8.1 as I do now...well until MS comes up with a hidden un-stoppable service for this.

I don't use wifi for my connection on my desktop because the USB connection is faster and more reliable. I do use WIFI on my Surface Pro that's kind of the point, but the desktop only sits in one place why complicate the connection? I know lots of people with hardwired connections which go right to capped crappy ISP's...any connection should be designable as a metered connection (oops yeah then everyone can do this, well then just put in an easy way to turn it off).

It still seems to be a problem if you are trying to avoid certain drivers though. For example I hate the razor mouse drivers and I will not install them I just use the generic mouse driver, I can see every time I turn the service on to get important security updates and then having to delete the razor drivers until we get a tool that lets us turn off the driver updates that we don't want. I've read the tool MS provides to hide certain drivers from updating only let's you hide drivers MS has designated as a problem.
 
rezerekted said:
I'm not talking about Messenger chat app, I'm talking about the messenger service that was immediately exploited by malware when XP came out and Microsoft had to disable it in an update because it was Swiss cheese security.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Windows_Messenger_service
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Your assumption - like so many other people - is that code is automagically exploitable as written and that's simply not the case. Because nothing anywhere near as large as a complete operating system with hundreds of millions of lines of code could EVER be written and be secure with "the finished product" which is the biggest pipe dream of all I suppose.

The Messenger "exploit" was nothing more than a glitch that stupid dumbass humans decided to abuse maliciously which is pretty much ALWAYS the case in such situations. At least some folks don't do such things, but even so, the code wasn't written one day by someone thinking "You know, I'm gonna leave this little treasure trove here for someone to exploit years from now and it'll be a good laugh at parties because I can take credit for creating it."

If I recall correctly one of the most exploitable pieces of software in the history of computing was (and could still very well be) sendmail for UNIX which still has issues as late as 2014 and that piece of code has been in use for what, 40+ years now.

Code is vulnerable, period, especially when more talented people get their hands on it as time passes.

So, please, stop hopping on the bash Microsoft bandwagon, it's getting a bit tiresome. I may not like Windows 10 personally but I mean really, man, enough's enough with the near-constant trashing of Microsoft in general.
 
"Because nothing anywhere near as large as a complete operating system with hundreds of millions of lines of code could EVER be written and be secure with "the finished product" which is the biggest pipe dream of all I suppose."

Then companies like Microsoft should stop claiming their shit is secure when it isn't. Enough with the lies!
 
rezerekted said:
Then companies like Microsoft should stop claiming their shit is secure when it isn't. Enough with the lies!
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Every company lies, every person lies (no, not because House, M.D. says so), and so on. You do realize the reality you live in, right?

Right?
 
Tiberian said:
Every company lies, every person lies (no, not because House, M.D. says so), and so on. You do realize the reality you live in, right?

Right?
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When a corporation lies about something this substantial it's a bit different from a teenager lying about wanking.
 
Two bugs I found is that occasionally jump list stop working forcing a reboot to fix it. Also, sometimes when you search for things and press enter it does not open them, you have to search and press enter again.
 
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