http://www.theregister.co.uk/2015/07/16/amd_q2_2015_results_bloodbath/
I knew it was bad, but not this bad.
I knew it was bad, but not this bad.
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AMD's Computing and Graphics division down 54.2%
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looks like AMD will test some new lows, but more importantly if you believe that there wont be any new GPUs at 28 or 22/20nm this may be a good opportunity coming up to start taking a small position.
PC market is horrific, and only accounting tricks from Intel managed to hide it.
PC market is horrific, and only accounting tricks from Intel managed to hide it.
TaintedSquirrel
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This news combined with their completely unappealing lineup makes me more than ready to jump ship.
If I were building a fresh PC today there's absolutely nothing worth buying from AMD across the board.
If I were building a fresh PC today there's absolutely nothing worth buying from AMD across the board.
atp1916
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Woudn't it be nice if AMD just concentrated on making game-changing pure CPU-only and GPU parts like in their glory years when they were releasing Athlon XPs and Radeon DDRs?
TaintedSquirrel
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Is that really the problem? Intel and Nvidia are doing the same thing as AMD...
D
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They needed a home run with Fury/3xx but it seems they never even arrived at the ballpark. This shit is getting frustrating when you really have no serious competition anymore. Seems like Nvidia just hit AMD too hard with the 680 when it came out and since then just kept shitting all over them with performance and power consumption.
5150Joker
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http://www.theregister.co.uk/2015/07/16/amd_q2_2015_results_bloodbath/
I knew it was bad, but not this bad.
RIP AMD.
AMD has done one thing and that is that GPU's have been nothing but competitive. Guess what that is the only part that has held them together. They shot themselves after the bitcoin boom where people stacked up on amd cards and prices shot up and all of sudden nvidia cards were cheaper. I saw a really good analysis on youtube and forgot what the website was. But it made perfect sense,
I even couldn't find any decently priced amd gpu's as they were all over priced. GPU was the biggest loss this year, it wasn't because product wasn't competitive it was because bitcoin and even after their failure to drop the price on 290 and 290x when the gtx 970 came out. It took them a few damn months to drop the price while nvidia ate up the market. They had idiots running the show.
Next year when zen comes out and they have 14nm gpu's out is when I would be able to say if it is indeed nail in the coffin for them. I think they have another few years left and I am sure GPU's will be back on track. If zen ends up being decent chip I would say they should come out of it okay or they will probably get bought out before they are bankrupt and gone for good.
The only thing that can save the hardware market is if there was a massive sweeping push toward steam boxes (which are just custom built PC on a small form factor made to run PC games), and do-it-yourself PC gamers buying and upgrading hardware.. I think platform gaming needs to die out and we need to rethink the way gaming is done. Steam Boxes are the only thing i see that could start propping the market back up but it needs to get popular and fast, if the steam box idea fails and platform gaming continues, AMD fails and the hardware market monopolizes and the consumer suffers in many ways.
good point. I agree that AMD should be way more aggressive on Steam Machines. With Valve pushing Vulkan API on their new games coming out for SteamOS, there's an opportunity there for AMD's APU's to create some compelling pricepoints.
AMD was so adamant to getting into the Xbox One and PS4, but how has that really benefitted them? Steam Machines seem like a no brainer for AMD and could begin paying dividends quickly.
cageymaru
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US government banned Intel from selling Xeon chips to China. Why would they allow AMD to be sold to the Chinese or any other foreign country when they share the same designs freely?
So you have to scale back your thinking to USA based buyouts.
Starrbuck
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OMG, that is so true! I've been struggling to get hybrid Intel/AMD graphics to work in Linux on a laptop for weeks.
Actually, they have to do both... They need to dominate the Linux arena because nvidia is not involved there... That will build them a better pathway to Steam... However... Is Valve really going to risk making any investment in AMD or any API with market numbers like this?
AMD needs 14nm to be competitive... Unfortunately, Nvidia may really turn it up on 14nm as well.
CarbonVirus
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I'm not sure what you are talking about... I recently wiped my dual boot install to only run Ubuntu because the open source drivers for my R9 270x became as good (if not better than) their Windows equivalent; I currently get 80-100 fps in both CS:GO and DOTA2 on my 1440p monitor and haven't looked back.
Do you actually run an AMD card in Linux, or are you just making things up to stir the pot?
I actually was going off of what I had read. Stuff like this: http://www.pcworld.com/article/2911...pen-source-but-the-best-for-linux-gaming.html
So basically if you care about performance, and don't care whether or not the drivers are open source - so basically everyone - AMD isn't as good as NVIDIA on Linux. They aren't going to get Steambox design wins unless they improve their drivers.
It isn't about Valve, its about adoption of the steam box, it will do well, but a steam box can use other graphics cards and cpus other than AMD's right? its the same ecosystem as a PC.
Well the problem is as simpel as it gets, AMD does not have enough fonds to put into R&D.
amd: http://picpaste.com/ycharts_chart__2_-ceJs54gY.png
nvidia: http://picpaste.com/ycharts_chart__1_-sdPjdwoH.png
Intel: http://picpaste.com/ycharts_chart-cKUCUpS0.png
Well as you can see Intel is in a class of its own, but its clear that on paper AMD does not stand a chance vs intel and nvida. Its sad, i rember the good ol days when it was fun to read abaut intel vs amd and ati/amd vs nvidia. So unless something magical happens, reading abaut amd vs nvidia is going to be just as boring as reading abaut intel vs amd.
But i do have to command AMD, they "fight" back with all they got as long as they can. I have done my part for the red team thou, have built round 70 pure red team pc since 1993, but its only gameres left in private marked that does not buy a laptop now adays.
Edit:
You have to take into consideration that intel has it own fabs, amd used to, but now nvidia and amd uses glofo and tsmc.
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Well a big part of the reason for Linux drivers being such a headache for IHV's is that OpenGL is such a mess - decades of legacy code. Vulkan is a clean slate that drops backward compat with OGL and allows IHV's to more narrowly focus. Once Vulkan based titles start coming out I'd like to see AMD get aggressive with supporting it, rather than sitting back and letting NVIDIA and Intel run away with it. I think Intel will be the most aggressive as they stand to gain the most, they'd love nothing more than a new market to open up for their IGP's.
Vulkan being a closer to metal API means less hardware abstraction.
I dont see much of an issue with decent support.
Its Mantle at the core, so in some respects most of the driver is already done, it would just need to be ported/compiled for linux.
I dont see much of an issue with decent support.
Its Mantle at the core, so in some respects most of the driver is already done, it would just need to be ported/compiled for linux.
Just because Vulkan might help AMD with better drivers, doesn't mean Intel and nV will drop the work they already have been doing with their products. The main reason why AMD hasn't been able to keep with Linux support is because of lack of resources that will not change any time soon. They still have to make the drivers in the first place from Linux......
Driver support "should" be better but that's up in the air, its how much money and time AMD can put into Linux.
One of the reasons why AMD opened linux drivers so they can get help from the community.
Driver support "should" be better but that's up in the air, its how much money and time AMD can put into Linux.
One of the reasons why AMD opened linux drivers so they can get help from the community.
The proprietary version of Mantle was never released for Linux. It will be a long time before Vulkan based games are available. Without knowing how much code from Mantle, previous versions of OpenGL and contributions from other companies went in to Vulkan, no one can say how well it will perform on any hardware.
AMD's CEO has already said they are going to move away from developing for the PC market so I would not hold out hope for them focusing on Linux.
Q1 was pretty bad with AMD halting CPU shipments due to a glut in OEM hands (not a good sign coming out of the holiday season). Temporary gluts happen sometimes, but C&G down another 29% sequentially suggests even bigger problems.I knew it was bad, but not this bad.
As revenues steeply decline, operational expenses are cut. That means fewer engineers in both software and hardware, plus the negative feedback on reduced R&D. The year began with an 11% drop in OpEx from Q4'14, and the trend continued with Q1. Q2 should be no different. Plans don't go far without money to execute them.
Its more like AMD is too lazy to release capable drivers for linux, so they must resort to open source drivers
TaintedSquirrel
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I don't think that's legal... Unless Intel starts producing discrete GPUs.
?
Where does this stuff come from? Nvidia has by far the best drivers for Linux. They're not allergic to it like AMD is.
Yeah that's hard to believe. The Phoronix benchmarks show a 750 Ti regularly beating AMD's high-end.
staknhalo
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It's completely legal to have a monopoly in the US.
crusty_juggler
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Yes, AMD needs to aggressively court those 0.87% of gamers who use Linux. That will save them.
Are you guys on shrooms?
Are you guys on shrooms?
lol
Yeah, I think people sometimes forget that people who insist on open source drivers and are Linux gamers don't represent a very large market. Proprietary drivers are suggested for most commercial games ported to Linux due to performance issues and feature limitations in the open source drivers. At this rate the open source AMD and Nvidia drivers will reach quality and performance parity with the proprietary drivers around never.
And Nvidia has had such an engineering and financial lead for quite a while now that they can literally afford to shift a lot of idle attention to a small market like Linux. AMD is struggling just in the general market, which is Windows, let alone anything else.
It really paid off for Nvidia to invest heavily in their driver division for all those years, even if lately they've been somewhat iffy since the 600 Series. At the very least it gave them the reputation of having "solid drivers" whereas AMD has the reputation from days of old as having mediocre/bad drivers in a lot of peoples minds.
AMD just couldn't afford to do investments like they should if their life depended on it. This was always one of the worries from the very time AMD bought out ATI. The belief that one business would completely flop or both would have a slow death because one would drag the other down with it. The latter is exactly what happened over the past 8 years.
horrorshow
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No, it is not. Not since the Sherman Anti-Trust Act of 1890.
Regardless, this news is both sad and expected.
staknhalo
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You should know what you're talking about before you say it
+ said:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sherman_Antitrust_Act
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Its kinda fun this, AMD vs Nvida, it is Intel vs AMD all over again, when it was amd vs intel , intel had round 80% of the marked, for some years amd had the best cpu money could buy, and also the best bang for buck, but money talks, for some reason hardwaresites always found some fault, rember using pi benchmark as a meussure how good a cpu was, well i say intel paid the hardware site, tomshardware was noturious with fiding any flaw with an amd cpu, even if it was better. Then after marked share lost, amd sold of glofo to get money, Well today there is no Intel vs AMD. Thats a fact, as a side note [H] was a laufing stock back in the 90ties among us that built gamer pcs.
Well i will again tell you, AMD will lose against NVIDA to, for the same reason as it lost against Intel. Even with good or better products AMD cant win against all ods. They dont have the money to fight against those ods.
Its kinda fun to se as a hardware entusisast since the days of 8086 how the hardware sites changes, Tomshardware, witch used evry dirty trick in the book , and was the biggest intel fan back in the 90ies, now adays they changes and give amd a fair chance.
What can i say abaut [H] as a cpu reviwer they sucked big time, as videocard revier, im still not sure, for some reason, they seem to make up their mind and go with that, are they bought, no i dont think so, are they fanbois, no, are they objectiv, no for hell they are not,
But rant over, even me a red team gamer , from way back, withc used to build pc,s stopped building PC, couse i will never build a pc with intel inside, and i dont build a pc for another if its not the best pc for hes use money can build, and well on the cpu side amd has lost.
GPU side AMD have only to cards left (becouse on the lower end peps buy nvida becuase of nvida has the top card), They have form factor with Nano, nano will be expensive , becouse performace its not its goal, its size, hbm is the other, the y have first priority to HBM2, but with a marked chare of 20%, that will not count for much. Nvidia will after a littel delay get as much HBM2 as they want, so if something real magical happens, in 2018 all we we do on hardwaresite is to discuss wich Intel CPU is best or Wich NVIDA card to choose.
Thats the [H] facts of money.
Edit: Typos and stuff, round 10 bears, but the anaylis is pure facts, fore thouse who understand it. For those older once , how on earth could amiga dos loose agains windows, thats the best proof that money talks , not the best product.
Edit 2: I maybe should explain why [H] was a laufing stock amogs us that builted gamer pcs, when [H] tested cpu back then they set resolutin down as much as they could and gpu settings down as much as they could, so in oposit how it is was in real gaming, where amd excelled, well on thouse terms, intel excelled, feel free to coment on this Kyle
They didnt test as
in real game play, figure that
Well i will again tell you, AMD will lose against NVIDA to, for the same reason as it lost against Intel. Even with good or better products AMD cant win against all ods. They dont have the money to fight against those ods.
Its kinda fun to se as a hardware entusisast since the days of 8086 how the hardware sites changes, Tomshardware, witch used evry dirty trick in the book , and was the biggest intel fan back in the 90ies, now adays they changes and give amd a fair chance.
What can i say abaut [H] as a cpu reviwer they sucked big time, as videocard revier, im still not sure, for some reason, they seem to make up their mind and go with that, are they bought, no i dont think so, are they fanbois, no, are they objectiv, no for hell they are not,
But rant over, even me a red team gamer , from way back, withc used to build pc,s stopped building PC, couse i will never build a pc with intel inside, and i dont build a pc for another if its not the best pc for hes use money can build, and well on the cpu side amd has lost.
GPU side AMD have only to cards left (becouse on the lower end peps buy nvida becuase of nvida has the top card), They have form factor with Nano, nano will be expensive , becouse performace its not its goal, its size, hbm is the other, the y have first priority to HBM2, but with a marked chare of 20%, that will not count for much. Nvidia will after a littel delay get as much HBM2 as they want, so if something real magical happens, in 2018 all we we do on hardwaresite is to discuss wich Intel CPU is best or Wich NVIDA card to choose.
Thats the [H] facts of money.
Edit: Typos and stuff, round 10 bears, but the anaylis is pure facts, fore thouse who understand it. For those older once , how on earth could amiga dos loose agains windows, thats the best proof that money talks , not the best product.
Edit 2: I maybe should explain why [H] was a laufing stock amogs us that builted gamer pcs, when [H] tested cpu back then they set resolutin down as much as they could and gpu settings down as much as they could, so in oposit how it is was in real gaming, where amd excelled, well on thouse terms, intel excelled, feel free to coment on this Kyle
They didnt test as
in real game play
, figure that
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5150Joker
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What the hell did I just read?