Fans Have Dropped $77M On This Guy’s Buggy, Half-Built Game

Do you guys just come on here to rage out? Wired has a different opinion, big deal. The game's success isn't predicated on you writing an essay on the hardforums making weird analogies to blind dates or how reliable Chris Roberts is. The stuff they've shown so far looks interesting and exciting, can't that be enough for you?
 
Ihaveworms said:
It seems like pay to win to me.
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RSI has already said that everything will be available with in-game currency.

It's pay to support a hopefully industry changing game on a scale never seen before for a fraction of what games like GTA5 cost to market let alone produce.

I gave them $80 for a ship to see what they can do. I hope it's revolutionary. If it's not, i'll be out $80. Still a better purchase than Evolve IMHO.
 
crusty_juggler said:
The amounts of money being thrown at celebrity devs via crowd funding by nostalgia obsessed man children is both hilarious and pathetic. Hey guys, we're rebooting GEX, give us money!

Just mention an old, semi-abandoned IP, toss out the phrases old-school and retro and morons will just shower you in cash. Example.
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If Atari would have let Jace Hall remake the original Blood, I would have thrown money at it.

$77M for Star Citizen is quite impressive, although, it's not my money.
 
Games are meant to be fun and unrealistic.
The more real, the less fun it is. It think SC is doing too much.
 
Can you imagine the amount of butthurt that will exist when the people who have spent hundreds or even thousands on ships get into the final game and realize how relatively easy it is to get those same or similar/better ships?

Let's pretend this was the the Kickstarter for EVE before it came out and you just dropped $500 for a Dominix that has lifetime insurance or something.
 
I'm just saying, you literally described Star Citizen:
Blade-Runner said:
Pre-ordering simply parks your money with the publisher for a game that is already in development
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Star Citizen was already in development and parks your money with the publisher (in this case self-published).
Blade-Runner said:
There is zero benefit to pre-ordering these days because you receive no real tangible benefit in any shape or form, in fact its detrimental because the publisher and developer have very little incentive to deliver a properly working product when they already have your money in the bank.
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Likewise, if you've already given Star Citizen $200, and other people keep giving them money every week that the game is in development, what incentive do they have to deliver a properly working product? They can make just as much or more money just working on the promise of something cool... after all, one of the reasons people usually like books more than the movie is that the book allows them to fill all the blanks with their own imagination. Likewise, SC is probably more awesome in people's minds than it may be in real life upon delivery, whenever that is.
Blade-Runner said:
Crowd funding on the other hand funds the development of games that would have NEVER been made but for the generosity of backers.
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Just like with games that generate the majority of their revenue in advance in the form of pre-orders, you could make the same assumption. SC was in development for close to two years before they jumped on the free-money kickstarter craze instead of seeking regular venture capital investors, and if they didn't get the money in advance (really no different than a pre-order while the game is still in development), the game wouldn't have come to market.

We can't know for sure, and my opinion having purchased craptons of games before the pre-order/kickstarter pay in advance business model is that the games would still come out.
 
Ducman69 said:
I'm just saying, you literally described Star Citizen:
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I actually didn't, you just insist on misconstruing what everyone says to suit your warped perspective.

Ducman69 said:
Star Citizen was already in development and parks your money with the publisher (in this case self-published).
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Repeating this ad nauseam does not make it true.

Ducman69 said:
Likewise, if you've already given Star Citizen $200, and other people keep giving them money every week that the game is in development, what incentive do they have to deliver a properly working product?
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Because unlike behemoth publishers, their existence is solely attributable to the good will of the backers. If they fail to deliver then they permanently destroy their reputations with the result that anything associated with their names is tainted, just like Double Fine, Peter Molyneux, Uber Entertainment and every other indie developer who thought it was okay to fuck over their backers.

Ducman69 said:
They can make just as much or more money just working on the promise of something cool... after all, one of the reasons people usually like books more than the movie is that the book allows them to fill all the blanks with their own imagination. Likewise, SC is probably more awesome in people's minds than it may be in real life upon delivery, whenever that is.
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Whether or not its more awesome in people's minds has nothing to do with the purpose behind crowd funding and whether the developers will deliver a functioning product.

Ducman69 said:
Just like with games that generate the majority of their revenue in advance in the form of pre-orders, you could make the same assumption.
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Again, its not even remotely the same because with a traditionally published game the development is already funded and the pre-orders are revenue. That game will be released IRRESPECTIVE of whether there are pre-orders. There could be literally zero pre-orders and the game will still be released.

With crowd funding the money contributed by backers funds the development, the game WOULD NOT HAVE BEEN MADE but for those pledges. Its hardly the same thing as pre-order revenue that sits in a bank account accruing interest.

Ducman69 said:
SC was in development for close to two years before they jumped on the free-money kickstarter craze instead of seeking regular venture capital investors, and if they didn't get the money in advance (really no different than a pre-order while the game is still in development), the game wouldn't have come to market.
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You can keep regurgitating this nonsense all you want, but the reality is that it was simply being prototyped during that period. Moreover Chris Roberts was very upfront with the fact that venture capitalists would be contributing up to $10 million because the initial amounts sought via crowd funding would not be adequate to fund the game he wanted to make. It was only after he raised significantly more than the kickstarter goals that he ditched the investors because he didn't need them.

Ducman69 said:
We can't know for sure, and my opinion having purchased craptons of games before the pre-order/kickstarter pay in advance business model is that the games would still come out.
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You keep snorting those unicorn farts and pixie dust, because there is no way in a million fucking years that any of these games would have seen the light of day had it not been for pc gamers reaching into their own pockets to fund development.
 
I've given them about $50 for this game. I figure the gamble is worth it, it's the most ambitious gaming project ever launched so even if it fails at least I feel like I'm getting something interesting to watch for the money. I'm pretty sure they're going to deliver some sort of product, there's just too much funding to not do that. If that product is any good, well it seems like they're trying to put together a good narrative and game mechanics (load up the dogfighting simulator, it's pretty solid).

I don't normally crowd-fund games, but this felt right and I can afford to lose $50. Sometimes betting on a dream is fun.
 
FPS module is supposedly dropping soon, dogfight and racing are already out. I remember when I backed Pillars of Eternity my joke with my friends was that I didn't know the title was also the timeline yet here it is and it's getting great reviews.

I didn't drop thousands on SC, I think I bought one plan for $38. If I never get a full game, i'll probably have at least gotten my money out of it for the dogfight module. I 100% plan on getting an oculus rift or vive when it comes out and worst case scenario my $38 is spent on having some cool mini content for my VR headset.

I think the only people that have a right to bitch about this are the people with capital at risk. Everyone else is just a hater.
 
Ihaveworms said:
It seems like pay to win to me.
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It's pay for win just like everything in life. If you play BF4 with a ball mouse on a dial up modem at 640x480 and i'm using a laser mouse with quad Titans across 4 monitors on gigabit, i'm pretty sure you're fucked.

People can grind out the ships but if someone spends $500 on a ship, and I spent $38 on a ship, why in the world would i think these 2 should be balanced?
 
Seventyfive said:
It's pay for win just like everything in life. If you play BF4 with a ball mouse on a dial up modem at 640x480 and i'm using a laser mouse with quad Titans across 4 monitors on gigabit, i'm pretty sure you're fucked.

People can grind out the ships but if someone spends $500 on a ship, and I spent $38 on a ship, why in the world would i think these 2 should be balanced?
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Why would you need to pay $500 for a ship in the first place?
 
Blade-Runner said:
You can keep regurgitating this nonsense all you want, but the reality is that it was simply being prototyped during that period. Moreover Chris Roberts was very upfront with the fact that venture capitalists would be contributing up to $10 million because the initial amounts sought via crowd funding would not be adequate to fund the game he wanted to make. It was only after he raised significantly more than the kickstarter goals that he ditched the investors because he didn't need them.
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Prototyping is part of the development. Kind of like the alpha and beta phase, and even the testing/bug fixing phase is.

Just keep in mind your money isn't going just towards a game, but also the establishment of a company.
 
ocellaris said:
...and this is why SC will fail.
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Not really. Since ships and items can be bought with in-game currency it just mean you need to play for a while to earn the in game credits to buy a better ship.

Also there are a multitude of ships and classes. A $500 isn't necessarily that much better, it could just be built for a different purpose. Some of these larger more expensive ships need real crews to man turrets and what not. That puts you at a real disadvantage if you don't have plenty of friends who want to sit in a gunner chair. While you're getting a crew together I'm out solo raping a pillaging to my hearts content.

It's no different than knowing your classes in an MMO.
 
Fanattic said:
The whole point of crowd funding a game is you don't have shareholders or a publisher breathing down your neck to make a quick casual profitable game. The Devs get to realize their vision without EA or Activision yelling at them to release the game before it's finished so they can make money. You get investors and publishers involved you lose creative control.
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In some instances, this works great. But why do you think this isn't the norm? Perhaps creating games, art, isn't as compatible with the business of sometimes saying, "Enough is enough, quit feature creep and finish the game." Sometimes the publishers, management, if done right is needed to keep focus and make hard calls. Many times it's pure unadulterated idiocy and short term profit at the expense of quality, but there is a reason that developers making their own money and running their own companies are rare.
 
ocellaris said:
...and this is why SC will fail.
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It's the same reason why League of Legends failed. Allowing players to buy champions with real money completely killed the game. Ya you could grind out "XP" to get champs but enough people we're able to get an advantage by paying cash for them that the game is now a complete failure and a wasteland.







/s
 
Meh.

This game is horribly ambitious yes.

And it may never succeed. I don't do risky investments so I won't contribute to the kickstarter.

That being said, Chris Roberts is a fucking legend, and if anyone can pull this off, it's him.
 
I pledged my money back when it was first on the RSI site. I have spent a total of $30. I plan on playing the campaign more than the online so maybe I don't care about pay to win as much. I have been happy with what I have seen and played. Even if I were to lose out of my money I pledged it so long ago it doesn't even matter to me. I wanted to help bring this game to life and I can't code. Helping to fund it is the next best thing I can do. I will continue to fund games that present me an interesting concept. AAA doesn't seem keen to cater to my needs of DRM free and Linux compatible games so I turn to those who do: indie devs.

One funny story I have is the night that Roberts got his Kickstarter money I texted my buddy saying that he had been found dead face down in a pile of blow. He believed me and his reaction was priceless. I couldn't hold back laughter as he worried what that meant for the game and his money.
 
Ducman69 said:
*facepalm*

Star Citizen was already well in development long before they made a kickstarter (close to 2 years) . :rolleyes:
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Isn't that irrelevant to the conversation since you said ALL crowdfunded games are failures in your eyes? From behemoths like SC to people working on a laptop out of their beat up studio apartment. Why are you facepalming if you're against ALL crowdfunded games? Isn't it all the same to you?
 
Advil said:
Ok, at this point in time I have to come to the screaming defense of Cloud Imperium.

In the future my opinion could change, but I do follow the development of the game both weekly and monthly. They REALLY ARE building a gigantic game. They are very open about what they are working on. There has been plenty of proof of things like their gigantic and well equipped mocap studio, their team of persistent universe coders, the company doing the AI work and images of their workstations showing their progress and tools.

It's not like we have ONLY their word to go on. Their monthly dev reports and insider videos of their various teams working pretty much show a fully functional game development company.

It's absolutely nothing like most other crowdfunded games where you only get a dev blog and some promises that could be pure bull.

A great example would be DayZ. It's fun, and we all like to play it, but what do their dev studios really look like? How many are working, what are they working on and are they really putting in the hours? It's hard to tell. With Star Citizen, it is very easy to see the work getting done.

So no. It's not vaporware. It's a buggy half-built game because they are not even halfway there yet. Building something the size and scope of WoWs economy and backend gameplay systems and marrying it to real-time sim and fps combat is just as difficult as it sounds. It hasn't been done before. So as long as they continue to openly show what's going on during the work day, we don't have anything to complain about.

Also, the FPS module should go live within a month. That's big. The first persistent universe features should go in toward the end of the year. That's gigantic.

Now as to the SANITY of anyone who has donated $1000+ to this game? That is not the same issue at all and not relevant to whether they are working on the game. I've got about $75 tied up. I'm more than happy with that risk. I may put in a few more dollars before it's done.
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I have to agree with this. We are seeing progress reports in many forms constantly from the developers. You can't say that about any AAA title being worked on by major companies. You hear things and see some media a few times each year with a game like Dragon Age Inquisition, Mass Effect 4 or GTA V. Other crowd funded projects show you even less and don't seem to materialize anything much less parts of the game that you can interact with and download while the game's in progress.

I don't think there is anything to be concerned with here. The game is an ambitious project and that's got some people feeling skeptical. What I see here is a developer and development team that's actually pushing the boundaries of computer gaming and taking it some place that's not only a logical progression of gaming technology, but something that we haven't seen yet.
 
Wow... people are so used to having shitty rehashed games pumped out and thrown at them every 6 months that they all forgot that actual game dev from the ground up actually takes time and resources?

Fans are helping Chris Roberts build an entire dev studio for multiple games. I've seen plenty of progress in the development of the game and the house to say that I'd even be okay if I spent a couple hundred more than the $40 or so I've spent personally. This might actually be the first game that reaches for the moon and comes really damn close to touching it. If not, I missed out on a fancy dinner or two.
 
Lets not forget that there are many game journalists who have a vested interest in seeing this fail.

They have been saying - for years - that PC gaming is dead. The market is too small to support major new developments and we should be happy to get the console ports we get, etc. etc.

And then this one guy (who happens to be the legend behind Wing Commander and Privateer) gets this "too small market" to donate over $77million to produce his game.

It proves that the market isn't as small as they've suggested, that it isn't dying as many have suggested, that when a quality game is promised, they will come, and by deduction, that what's on the market today just aren't those quality games.

There are a lot of people who wind up being pretty butt-hurt by this logical conclusion, and thus have a vested interest in poo-poo:ing this project and seeing it fail.

Bias in games journalism and all that.

I don't know if Star Citizen will succeed. It is a very ambitious project.

That being said, Chris Roberts knows what he is doing and has a lot of experience with ambitious games projects. He also has a remarkable budget to work with, and his hands aren't tied by investors. He can pretty much do what he wants and take a John Carmack-esque "when it's done" attitude to it.

I just don't think this is a story of doom and gloom. It's a story if risk, and great reward, and I'm looking forward to seeing how it will turn out.
 
Mr. Bluntman said:
QFMFT.

$2,500 for JUST ONE ship? Even if this were to see the light of day as a finished product, those who pick up the game for $50 or so are going to be at a massive disadvantage compared to those who have dropped thousands, tens of thousands on the game. Batshit insane isn't even the phrase I would use to describe this madness.

What worries me more, though, is that this could set a precedent for other publishers to do the same thing. Want this uber cool gear? $1,000, please. Want to actually stand a chance against others in multi? We'll have to sacrifice your first born for that.

Overblown reaction? Maybe. I still think it's insane, though.
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First of all, you are confusing what pay to win is, and how the PU actually works, this is not a PVP focused game (yes you can pvp) But the whole PU will have a 10 or 20 to 1 ratio of NPC's around 20,000,000 NPC's. Nown consider this they only sold 200 of those $2500 Javelin destroyers, that means 1 in every 100,000 people/npc's you com in contact with has a chance of being that person that paid for a destroyer, well are you going to cry fowel if one of those npc's was magically given a destroyer for free? i mean you know they are out there does that change the game? how does it affect you personally if someone in that vast expanse of a universe that you will likely never EVER see paid for a ship? IT DOESN'T! even if they kill you with it, which is likely your fault for getting too close to it since your smaller ship is likely faster how is it any different from an npc owned ship killing you? it really is no different at all.

And there is no winning in the PU it is a complete sandbox, how do you win in a sandbox that has no end? If you get knocked out, you start at a hospital pick up the pieces and move on with your life if you get perma killed your next of kin picks up the pieces and they move on with thier life.

This is a skill based game not a pay for equipment and you will win based game, there are no magic toggles to kill someone because you have better gear (even lock on missiles are easy to defeat with chaff/flares and dodging), in this case you have a ship and you actually need to know how to fly the ship, the guy that spends 100hours flying his ship is going to be far more skilled and better off than a person that spent $250 on a ship and crap low quality gear with real money (the best equipment is only found in game not on the website store) which means that person that played for 100 hours will actually have much better equipment than the person that tried to shortcut as well as more pilot experience.


Hornet said:
While I'm ok with the idea of crowd funded games, I'm not a fan of the idea about selling concepts of in-game item (expensive concept of a ship in this case) of a game that is basically still in it's crowd funded development process. Isn't that kind of taking the idea a little too far at this point.

It's like paying to win in a game that you don't even know how it will turn out yet.
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It is not pay to win, it is pay for convenience. what someone else has in the game will not impact you at all, because there are 10-20 npc's that are already in a position better than you for each person in the PU, so you should be complaining about the 20,000,000 npc's having better equipment than you at the start of the game as well if you are worried about a player that you might never see having something better than you.

shspvr said:
That right a BIG SCAM
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Sorry no.

Ducman69 said:
*facepalm*

Star Citizen was already well in development long before they made a kickstarter (close to 2 years) . :rolleyes:
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wrong-wrong-wrong.jpg


Why are you commenting on this topic when you are so horribly misinformed? are you just trolling? or do you actually believe the crap you spew here about Star Citizen?

The game was not in development before kickstarter, I repeat IT WAS NOT IN DEVELOPMENT before kickstarter.

Chris Roberts was spending his own money and time with a couple other people to put together the Video for kickstarter it was not a game, or even part of the game it was just a CGI VIDEO not a game, there was nothing about the game when kickstarter started other than some concept art and ideas

It took about another year After kickstarter to just build out the 200-300 member team from scratch as well as put the various multiple studios around the world together and while doing that they also managed to work on portions of the project but i would not call that first year full scale development as there was a lot of moving office set up hiring legal stuff, as well.

So i would say that maybe the past year only has been full scale production, and that include things like rewriting Cryengine for 64-bit double precision so we can has star systems that instead of being 8kmx8km, can be 38,000,000x38,000,000 kilometer across, to put that in perspective if you try to fly across one of those systems at normal flight speeds it would take you between 2-4 years of REAL WORLD time.

No other game offers 64bit double precision for locational data.

There are so many thing under the hood that are needed for star citizen that its not just a matter of slapping some ships together putting them in empty space and having a game there is so much behind the scenes that needs to be done before they can build the PU, expecting it to be done a year after kickstarter or even 2 years is idiotic with how much has changed and how the project has evolved and how much work they have had to put in to get the state they are right now, which is still not even close to done.

You have no idea what you are talking about.


Ducman69 said:
I'm just saying, you literally described Star Citizen:

Star Citizen was already in development and parks your money with the publisher (in this case self-published).

Likewise, if you've already given Star Citizen $200, and other people keep giving them money every week that the game is in development, what incentive do they have to deliver a properly working product? They can make just as much or more money just working on the promise of something cool... after all, one of the reasons people usually like books more than the movie is that the book allows them to fill all the blanks with their own imagination. Likewise, SC is probably more awesome in people's minds than it may be in real life upon delivery, whenever that is.

Just like with games that generate the majority of their revenue in advance in the form of pre-orders, you could make the same assumption. SC was in development for close to two years before they jumped on the free-money kickstarter craze instead of seeking regular venture capital investors, and if they didn't get the money in advance (really no different than a pre-order while the game is still in development), the game wouldn't have come to market.

We can't know for sure, and my opinion having purchased craptons of games before the pre-order/kickstarter pay in advance business model is that the games would still come out.
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Again your claims that the game was in development for 2 years before kickstarter is made up bullshit by you.

Full scale production really only started about 1 year ago, with some production after kickstarter leading up to that. They had nothing before kickstarter, unlike Elite which was in production well before kickstarter and kickstarter was used as a way to get money to push the product out.

Star Citizen was not in production before Kickstarter.

Kick starter was used to gauge the interest in Chris roberts and his super small teams idea, after which he would use the money combined with another 15-18million from investors to produce the game that has not been in development yet, Chris roberts used his own money and time to produce the CGI concept video showing his idea but there was no game in development.

Also the incentive to finish the game, is that they want to play it as much as we do, especially Chris Roberts.

Chris is a Gamer, and there was no space sim for him to play so he is making his own, That is his drive, it is not about the money, he is rich he has money, he just wants to make the Best Damn Space Sim Ever that is his current goal in life.

People are so worried about how other people spend their money they forget that it doesn't matter if you spend it on booze or lose it gambling or some other crap hobby, why does it matter to you if someone believes chris roberts can deliver on a space game that you apparently have no clue about or did no research yet claim the stuff you talk about as being fact, and your experience in buying other games does not really matter because this is not those other games.

A lot of game companies and developers like to milk people, the biggest scam is Day-Z, started as crap a free mod then they went to a full blown pay model with the expectations it would improve the game but it has sat in the same state with no progress just sucking at the tit of gamers.

But because there are a few bad apples does not mean everyone is out to steal your money, it is up to you to decide what you want to spend your money on and what you feel is worth your money to help out.

From the countless hours i have poured over Star Citizen, from behind the scenes to interviews to other aspects of the game that is in development, i can unequivocally say you know Nothing about the subject that is Star Citizen.
 
Man, these Star Citizen backers are pretty dedicated. Their long-winded rants rival the diatribes I post in Linux gaming/Steam Machine threads.

Which is really saying something.
 
Wildace said:
Why are you commenting on this topic when you are so horribly misinformed? are you just trolling? or do you actually believe the crap you spew here about Star Citizen?

The game was not in development before kickstarter, I repeat IT WAS NOT IN DEVELOPMENT before kickstarter.
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The development of the game started in 2011 on a modified version of the CryEngine 3 game engine, later updated to the 4th generation: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Star_Citizen#Development

http://www.pcgamer.com/star-citizen-preview-the-open-world-space-sim-of-our-dreams/
PC Gamer said:
He spent a year producing a prototype of Star Citizen: a multiplayer, persistent-universe space combat sim with monstrous ambition and no publisher support.

“I was having conversations with EA to do another Wing Commander, but I'm not really that interested in doing a next-gen console game and being a part of that loop,” Roberts tells me as he sets up the demonstration. It's a few weeks before he plans to debut this prototype to the world.

The game loads, and a modified CryEngine renders the interior of a cavernous carrier. His character, wearing a frighteningly high-poly flight suit, climbs a ladder into the cockpit of a fighter. He plugs a tube into his suit and taps away at touchscreens. Yes, it will have Oculus Rift support, Roberts tells me -- he's going to see the VR headset prototype in a week.

http://www.pcgamer.com/star-citizen-preview-the-open-world-space-sim-of-our-dreams/
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crusty_juggler said:
Man, these Star Citizen backers are pretty dedicated. Their long-winded rants rival the diatribes I post in Linux gaming/Steam Machine threads.

Which is really saying something.
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Why would anyone need to post long threads about the obvious failure and pointlessness of Steam Boxes?
 
Ducman69 said:
The development of the game started in 2011 on a modified version of the CryEngine 3 game engine, later updated to the 4th generation: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Star_Citizen#Development

http://www.pcgamer.com/star-citizen-preview-the-open-world-space-sim-of-our-dreams/
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You do realize that "prototype" was the CGI video, the prototype was not a game it was the basis for the idea of the game.

He worked with a few other people to make the CGI video.

They made it within cryengine to show what they were going for, all of that was essentially scrapped when they moved into real production of the game, they only used it for references like the hornet model we we have now is nothing from the original used to make the CGI video.

Basically he spent a year building out his idea to present it to kickstarter and investors, he did not spend that time actually making the game.
 
What's crazy to me about the whole thing is that unlike with publisher cash, there's no one to pay back. Their first game sale is pure profit. There's no number they have to reach in order to break even.

As such the game really should be free to play, with no cash shop. The money was gifted to them, they should gift it to the world. It's not like they're not getting paychecks for their time.

I also have to wonder what's going through your average publisher's mind with the success of this kickstarter. How long before publishers start asking for donations for games, then loaning your donation money to their developers?
 
chockomonkey said:
What's crazy to me about the whole thing is that unlike with publisher cash, there's no one to pay back. Their first game sale is pure profit. There's no number they have to reach in order to break even.

As such the game really should be free to play, with no cash shop. The money was gifted to them, they should gift it to the world. It's not like they're not getting paychecks for their time.

I also have to wonder what's going through your average publisher's mind with the success of this kickstarter. How long before publishers start asking for donations for games, then loaning your donation money to their developers?
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Absolutely, but can you imagine how many heads would explode when people that laid down thousands of dollars and spent hours pre-alpha testing such a broken unfinished game, something you would usually have to PAY someone to do, and then at launch everything is free? :D

It would be like Chinese fireworks with heads exploding abound.
 
inbedwithhomer said:
Development began in winter 2012/2013. Ramp up to full staff took another year. Effectively, the game has been in full-bore production for about two years.

Completion percentage is hard to gauge. Assume they have 75% of the core game systems completed, perhaps rounding out to 50% complete overall. That clocks us in at 4 years development time. Ask Bethesda how much of an Elder Scrolls title they have complete in 4 years :cool:.
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This,,,,,, just this.

Triple A titles take years of development to bring out. If you want, you can even look at the last Duke Nukem and how utterly terrible it was, but still brought in cash after a "10 year" or so development phase.

I mean, the funding had to be there or the game wasn't going to be made. They didn't have a publisher backing them so they literally had no funding.
 
chockomonkey said:
What's crazy to me about the whole thing is that unlike with publisher cash, there's no one to pay back. Their first game sale is pure profit. There's no number they have to reach in order to break even.

As such the game really should be free to play, with no cash shop. The money was gifted to them, they should gift it to the world. It's not like they're not getting paychecks for their time.
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I do not think you understand what it will take to continue to expand this game for the next 6 to 8 years, they can not do that if they just gift the game away.

It doesnt matter how much money you get for your project if you use most of it to build that game, you will have nothing left to continue it for the years to come.

The game is not done when it hits retail, there is no done sign you can post on this project this is not your average game where they hit a release date and then move all resources to a sequel, this is not battlefield or dragon age or assassins creed, where once the game is out its time to move on.

There is no Star Citizen 2, there is just Star Citizen and its long term goal of evolving over the next decade.

There will be more mission disks for single player, but 90% of the assets involved with those will filter into the PU for free for all backers regardless if you pay for the single player mission disk there is not pay walls in the PU.

So you buy the game once and you have access to ALL future content in the Persistent Universe for the next 6-10 years. You never have to spend a dime on the game again if you do not want too.

But just because you do not need to pay anything for the PU does not mean they wont still need money to continue development of new game features, or total infrastructure changes for the PU, graphic overhauls or just new ships and content they want to add, it will still cost money to continually evolve the game.

I swear some people are so short sighted its not even funny.

The only way it will be able to achieve its goal of being a decade long project while still making the PU completely free for ever once you buy access once, is with a cash shop, there is no way around it.
 
Flogger23m said:
Prototyping is part of the development. Kind of like the alpha and beta phase, and even the testing/bug fixing phase is.

Just keep in mind your money isn't going just towards a game, but also the establishment of a company.
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Of course its part of the development, but only the preparatory stage of it. However, it is utterly asinine to contend that just because Roberts funded the prototyping stage by himself that this is somehow conclusive evidence that he could have developed a full featured game to completion without crowd funding.

In fact it is not at all unusual for many Kickstarters to have done some prototyping in order to demonstrate to potential backers what the developers have in mind, but again how is that demonstrable that the games could have been made without crowd funding? Its a tenuous straw man argument that has no basis in reality.

As for the funds being used to establish the company, CIG has been very transparent about what pledged funds would be used for, such as setting up in-house motion capture and sound recording studios. If backers had a problem with that then they would have withheld funds rather than continuing to pledge. The reality is that CIG would not be able to deliver a game with the scope and depth promised unless it invested heavily in the capital resources required to achieve that.
 
Ducman69 said:
Absolutely, but can you imagine how many heads would explode when people that laid down thousands of dollars and spent hours pre-alpha testing such a broken unfinished game, something you would usually have to PAY someone to do, and then at launch everything is free? :D

It would be like Chinese fireworks with heads exploding abound.
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You do realize the game is only $45, people spending thousands know this.

if the game ever went purely free to play in the future it is not that big of a deal, people are only out the $45 to buy the game not the whole $1000 or $2500 they have spent.

Because anything over $45 spent is for helping game development above and beyond what you are required to spend to play.

If you spend more than $45 it is purely optional, no one spends $2500 on a ship because they are forced too, or with out any expectations that the game might not be purely free to play at some point (it is free to play after the first $45), it doesn't matter, they got their backer reward ship which will be worthless after month in as people can start to afford destroyers within their org.

People pay $250 or $1250 because they want to start with a certain ship and start playing the role they want to play from the beginning, even if the game was purely free to play you couldn't do that you would still need to earn those ships with normal play.

BTW CiG is not going to make getting ships a grind they have said from the start they want to game to be fun, and it needs to be fun for new people joining.

Which means the value people are paying for ships is likely not really worth it for the average gamer, we are pledging to support the game more than we are buying a specific ship because of its overall in game value or the advantage it might give you within the first week or second week.
 
Wildace said:
You do realize that "prototype" was the CGI video, the prototype was not a game it was the basis for the idea of the game.

He worked with a few other people to make the CGI video.

They made it within cryengine to show what they were going for, all of that was essentially scrapped when they moved into real production of the game, they only used it for references like the hornet model we we have now is nothing from the original used to make the CGI video.

Basically he spent a year building out his idea to present it to kickstarter and investors, he did not spend that time actually making the game.
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There is no point trying to engage in an intellectual discussion with him about this, he thinks he has the smoking gun proving his position that Star Cititzen and all kickstarters are scams despite it being explained repeatedly that there is no way these games would have otherwise been developed.

Let him continue to revel in his unhinged psychotic reality where apparently publishers are more than happy to develop PC only space sims, rpgs, rogue-likes, etc but have forgotten to do so for almost two decades :rolleyes:
 
Blade-Runner said:
There is no point trying to engage in an intellectual discussion with him about this, he thinks he has the smoking gun proving his position that Star Cititzen and all kickstarters are scams despite it being explained repeatedly that there is no way these games would have otherwise been developed.

Let him continue to revel in his unhinged psychotic reality where apparently publishers are more than happy to develop PC only space sims, rpgs, rogue-likes, etc but have forgotten to do so for almost two decades :rolleyes:
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Its not that they forgot, its that there is no "demand" remember :rolleyes:

lol
 
People spend tons on this because the demographic is 30-45 year old nerds with plenty of money to spend. Which sums up most of us.

If the game is successful, the gaming industry jumps forward, not crawls forward. I'm definitely not spending hundreds of dollars on this, though.
 
SunnyD said:
Wow... people are so used to having shitty rehashed games pumped out and thrown at them every 6 months that they all forgot that actual game dev from the ground up actually takes time and resources?

Fans are helping Chris Roberts build an entire dev studio for multiple games. I've seen plenty of progress in the development of the game and the house to say that I'd even be okay if I spent a couple hundred more than the $40 or so I've spent personally. This might actually be the first game that reaches for the moon and comes really damn close to touching it. If not, I missed out on a fancy dinner or two.
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1) The game has missed deadlines and no finished product is in sight.
2) How much time and resources considering in either 2 or 4 years depending on when development started the game is still not close to being finished and delivering what was promised.
3) People paid to back ONE game, not multiple games, if they are using SC money on other games then that is pretty much fraud.
 
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