Google Discloses Its Diversity Record, And It’s Not Good

Stiletto said:
That's such a load of dumbass that even Cornell West would tell you to hush your mouth.
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I've actually met Cornell West in person. Mu nephew-in-law is a PhD in history and teaches as at the school that bought him in last year and my wife and I went to see him. Honestly though, I didn't find it that interesting. People have been throwing around a lot black names in this thread. While the idea of a black family that wasn't destroyed by the liberal agenda I know comes as a shock to some, it might explain why some many around here think that every black person gained their knowledge and formed their opinions of race issues from the liberal media or MSNBC.

I learned about the subject and formed most of my opinions from my parents who lived in the heart of Jim Crow and the Civil Rights Movement. They were there, went through it, and came out on the other side. Just average people trying to live their lives without all of the nonsense and with no agenda than to take care of their family and themselves.

When this topic of diversity comes up, so many of you think its about some grand liberal agenda and completely ignore that a workforce that is diversified might actually be able to relate better to a society that is diversified thus that company might be able to sell more products and services! Do you really think that companies think about diversity without consideration of the bottom line?
 
evilsofa said:
Which parts of those two sentences do you disagree with?
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The entire thing was bullshit. 2/3 typo no edits, don't go feeling too superior there.

kac77 said:
Probably the same way every right leaning person always has some bizarre story where the evil HR person told them to hire the unqualified minority guy or girl (it's a damn meme at this point)....even though if they weren't qualified they wouldn't have made it into the interview stage to begin with as most people don't put their race on their resume. :rolleyes:

What's more puzzling is that if all of the unqualified minorities are taking all of the engineering and computer science jobs in the name of diversity how come the numbers never reflect that?

The reality of this discussion as always, is that the responses say more about the people against diversity than the people for it. Especially considering diversity isn't synonymous with someone being qualified. Yet all through out the thread the statements suggest that's the case when it's factually and literally not.
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Glad you were able to pinpoint my political leanings there..oh wait, I'm not right leaning..Damn you gotta try again. Or you could quit making assumptions to justify your stance and realize that sometimes the Truth hurts.

For the record, I work IT. Most of the people I have hired over the years are Indian/asian, which quite frankly are minorities by definition as well. The handful of "Forced" hires I was made to do over the years were usually women fresh out of community college over someone with 5-10 years of actual experience. Sorry if I failed to meet your preconceived notion. No one said anything about unqualified minorities taking all the jobs, just that there shouldn't be a thing as someone being hired solely due to their race/sex over someone with actual qualifications. It really isn't a difficult concept to understand. Unfortunately some of you are either extraordinarily daft, or feel like the world owes you something.
 
Dekoth-E- said:
Unfortunately some of you are either extraordinarily daft, or feel like the world owes you something.
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It's not a difficult concept to understand at all. I'm black and have been in IT for 22 years and where I work, whites are a minority as well. As for the world owing something to some, yes, I think that my parents were denied opportunities and benefits because of their skin color. Yes, I think they are owned something. But neither they or I are going to dwell on that because few give away anything they don't have to, especially over the subject of reparations to blacks. Really, you guys freak out over government spying that won't in any real way affect one person here. So why would sane person that this group think that you'd actually care about people that were victims of the same governments that you so vehemently oppose. No one here agreed to legalized discrimination. That was some corrupt government that no one here had anything to do with. Except when it comes to the Founders and the Second Amendment that for some reason was well before the 13th.
 
heatlesssun said:
When this topic of diversity comes up, so many of you think its about some grand liberal agenda and completely ignore that a workforce that is diversified might actually be able to relate better to a society that is diversified thus that company might be able to sell more products and services! Do you really think that companies think about diversity without consideration of the bottom line?
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I actually like Cornell West. He's one of the few that can seem to discuss race without melting down into the usual label-slinging that shitbags like Michael Eric Dyson engages on in on a regular basis. He also seems to be genuinely interested in harmony between races, rather than trying to drive a wedge further between them.

As to diversity, the only diversity any company should attempt to attain is diversity of skill sets. As to qualifications, there should be overwhelming conformity. Your skin color, gender, religion, sexuality, or whatever factors that have approximately fucking nothing to do with how well you can do the job should make zero difference to someone focused on profit, positively or negatively. Meritocracy is the best hope for equality society has.
 
Oh noes Google, better hire more blacks, browns, greens, yellows, and womens. Don't want to offend any left wingers or feminists.

Such BS, Companies hire who ever is qualified. It just so happens that most often white and asian males are the ones in the CS / IT fields in college. Shoot I work in the software development branch of a large US corporation and about 75% of my office is white males.
 
evilsofa said:
in a two-tier society as starkly demarcated as America is, that results in complete cradle-to-grave segregation in which blacks will never be allowed to rise up to the white people's level of education, competency and society.
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I seriously doubt that, especially when colleges (iirc) have policies where they also would prefer minorities in some cases.

At one point I was getting bounced around shelter homes with (at the time) my only parent. The parent clawed through getting various jobs and at some point we were living on food stamps (and as a note, all of this help is out there). Our situation was somewhat precarious at times yes, but do you know what the one thing I had guaranteed access to? An education. I kept going to high school and earning good marks, and then I went to GA Tech (in-state tuition) with scholarships (and it wasn't even that many in number)... enough scholarships that they were practically paying me to go there (and for most of my years, they actually were). Now, I graduated, I have a good job with a good salary and benefits. I'm living comfortably and helping my parent out when needed.

Are you telling me that people can't do this just because they have a different skin color? Tell me where in that line of events my skin color could have changed and I would not have gotten to where I am now. I think that in our time the situation is this: if people have the talent.. they will get there. And if they don't have the talents, they should choose another profession. Otherwise you're running around trying to make sure everyone can do anything. That doesn't happen. Now when legalized segregation and institutionalized race policies were in place... yeah, of course you have issues.



If there is anything that needs to be improved, it is the number of opportunities. Some communities are trash to grow up in, and there are slums. Those need to be eradicated. Some states don't have as much support for underprivileged individuals as they should. That is what needs to be changed, not encouragement of some arbitrary hiring policies that try to boost percentages to superficially make situations look better. You want to develop a group of people... YOU TRAIN THEM BETTER.

I'm so immovable on this topic because I don't believe anyone can't do what I did (provided they are in a helpful society). At no point did I think I would fail, and at no point was it really that hard. I just kept going steadily and here I am. Anyone can do it, they just have to keep their eyes on the prize. What needs to be changed is where the person has no way out due to their specific environment.
 
heatlesssun said:
what's so funny about this is that when people write stuff like this they seem to think that blacks are too stupid to understand common sense.
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I can't criticize that very much but answer me one question: How do you explain why the current moron in chief was voted into presidency...twice?
 
StoleMyOwnCar said:
I seriously doubt that, especially when colleges (iirc) have policies where they also would prefer minorities in some cases.

At one point I was getting bounced around shelter homes with (at the time) my only parent. The parent clawed through getting various jobs and at some point we were living on food stamps (and as a note, all of this help is out there). Our situation was somewhat precarious at times yes, but do you know what the one thing I had guaranteed access to? An education. I kept going to high school and earning good marks, and then I went to GA Tech (in-state tuition) with scholarships (and it wasn't even that many in number)... enough scholarships that they were practically paying me to go there (and for most of my years, they actually were). Now, I graduated, I have a good job with a good salary and benefits. I'm living comfortably and helping my parent out when needed.

Are you telling me that people can't do this just because they have a different skin color? Tell me where in that line of events my skin color could have changed and I would not have gotten to where I am now. I think that in our time the situation is this: if people have the talent.. they will get there. And if they don't have the talents, they should choose another profession. Otherwise you're running around trying to make sure everyone can do anything. That doesn't happen. Now when legalized segregation and institutionalized race policies were in place... yeah, of course you have issues.



If there is anything that needs to be improved, it is the number of opportunities. Some communities are trash to grow up in, and there are slums. Those need to be eradicated. Some states don't have as much support for underprivileged individuals as they should. That is what needs to be changed, not encouragement of some arbitrary hiring policies that try to boost percentages to superficially make situations look better. You want to develop a group of people... YOU TRAIN THEM BETTER.

I'm so immovable on this topic because I don't believe anyone can't do what I did (provided they are in a helpful society). At no point did I think I would fail, and at no point was it really that hard. I just kept going steadily and here I am. Anyone can do it, they just have to keep their eyes on the prize. What needs to be changed is where the person has no way out due to their specific environment.
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Very touching story. This is what more people need to hear. Life is not about blaming 'the man' for holding you down, its about keeping straight finding your way to success.

That's my take on it.
 
maverikv said:
Can anyone here read? Self identified problem at Google, self compelled attempt to address problem. Government not involved. Nobody is forcing Google to do anything.
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Obviously you have never worked for a large corporation.

There are groups in THIS country who target every major corporation for shakedown. They use diversity as their main vehicle for filing lawsuits. There is a twist though, since the revelations of 'jesse ja-aackson' issues, along with his childs criminal situation, the shakedown activity has been recently shifted to more to gay rights lawsuits than race based lawsuits.

I would bet that there is not a fortune 500 company in the USA that does not have a legal team dedicated to fighting discrimination and diversity shakedown lawsuits filed from non-related external parties.
 
heatlesssun said:
It's not a difficult concept to understand at all. I'm black and have been in IT for 22 years and where I work, whites are a minority as well. As for the world owing something to some, yes, I think that my parents were denied opportunities and benefits because of their skin color. Yes, I think they are owned something. But neither they or I are going to dwell on that because few give away anything they don't have to, especially over the subject of reparations to blacks. Really, you guys freak out over government spying that won't in any real way affect one person here. So why would sane person that this group think that you'd actually care about people that were victims of the same governments that you so vehemently oppose. No one here agreed to legalized discrimination. That was some corrupt government that no one here had anything to do with. Except when it comes to the Founders and the Second Amendment that for some reason was well before the 13th.
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Here is the thing though that many just don't seem to get. We don't live in that world anymore. Now certainly if companies/people engage in that type of behavior then it needs to be addressed on a case by case basis. However the Fact is, Laws that specifically favor a group for X reason over another are no better then the shit that happened in the past. You don't gain equality by passing laws that are by definition treating groups as unequal. I have worked a similar environment to you. I spent a good bit of my career in the Atlanta Ga area and being blunt "white" is the minority in most of the places i worked. I would say 75% or more of my co workers were black. Now technically I look whitish erring on the brown side. I am not a particular race I am as human mutt as they get. I have black, asian, italian and european in my ancestry. I don't have a particular ancestry that dominates in my family, nor do I really care. Simply put I was raised with one core belief, Equality means Equal in all things. And Special interest laws and groups are the absolute opposite of pushing equality.

As I said, I have done quite a bit of hiring over the years. I could not care less what Race/Sex or anything else someone is. I want the person who has the qualifications I want and brings the most to the table. I absolutely take major issue when I have some tool from HR come down and hand me a candidate I've never interviewed, and looking at the resume never Would interview and telling me "This is the person you are hiring for the position so we can meet our X diversity quota". Completely over riding me and sticking me with some useless baggage that can't get the job done and I spend the next 6+ months wasting my time building a case to get rid of them. Yes I take issue with that, because that is 6 months of my time I could of spent investing in someone who had the skills I needed and actually developing them into someone who would be an asset to the company over the years..Not some dead weight loser who only gets hired because they play the "diversity" card long enough to reinstate their unemployment benefits for another 26 weeks.
 
Dekoth-E- said:
The entire thing was bullshit. 2/3 typo no edits, don't go feeling too superior there.

Glad you were able to pinpoint my political leanings there..oh wait, I'm not right leaning..Damn you gotta try again. Or you could quit making assumptions to justify your stance and realize that sometimes the Truth hurts.
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Dude let's not pretend Ron Paul drinks lattes and watches MSNBC on his free time OK? I know what your political leanings are it's not the first time we've talked.

Dekoth-E- said:
For the record, I work IT. Most of the people I have hired over the years are Indian/asian, which quite frankly are minorities by definition as well. The handful of "Forced" hires I was made to do over the years were usually women fresh out of community college over someone with 5-10 years of actual experience. Sorry if I failed to meet your preconceived notion. No one said anything about unqualified minorities taking all the jobs, just that there shouldn't be a thing as someone being hired solely due to their race/sex over someone with actual qualifications. It really isn't a difficult concept to understand. Unfortunately some of you are either extraordinarily daft, or feel like the world owes you something.
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Sorry but that sentiment comes from exactly from that feeling. Who talks about something that never occurs? That's right no one. The fact of the matter is that the meme that somehow we should all be on the look out for the overabundance of non-qualified minorities being hired in highly skilled positions is repeated all through out the thread. That's not going to happen unless someone believe it's happening en masse. It's ridiculous to repeat something as a problem when the numbers just don't show it.....yes not even for women. People who are afraid of things that don't exist are usually children.
 
kac77 said:
Who talks about something that never occurs?
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Let me just get in my X-Wing and fly to Namek to stop the Yetis from killing Bigfoot in order to please my one and only tangible god: Zeus.

The frankly what you're suggesting is absolute idiocy at best, and it's not just because of pure fiction. People talk about things that aren't actually occurring all the time. What people talk about depends on perception, not reality. It is subjective by definition. What you said is probably one of the reasons politicians get away with stupid propaganda like "this guy did this back at this time, don't vote for him". Most people don't look beyond initial impressions, either, to get an accurate grasp of the situation. Abusing that quality has been done by those in power for a LONG time.

Furthermore, you don't actually substantiate who "throughout this thread" has anything to back that claim and why.
 
Vildayyan2003 said:
Its pretty sad that companies even need to keep "diversity records". It simply means those qualifies to do a job will passed on while those less qualified will get the job simply based on race/gender/religion/insert any thing else
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They need to keep records because of the past, Because in the past any non-white male or any female was not considered for work even if they had experience so of course the Government went overboard with that and said who cares about they're experience, you need X amount of this and Y amount of that!
 
StoleMyOwnCar said:
Let me just get in my X-Wing and fly to Namek to stop the Yetis from killing Bigfoot in order to please my one and only tangible god: Zeus.
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If you believe they exist by all means I can't stop a fantasy. But I can point out that it's BS.

StoleMyOwnCar said:
The frankly what you're suggesting is absolute idiocy at best, and it's not just because of pure fiction.

People talk about things that aren't actually occurring all the time. What people talk about depends on perception, not reality. It is subjective by definition.
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That's a really lovely strawman argument. However, with regards to this discussion I was talking about fact vs fiction against actual known values. Sure you can believe something and even talk about something that's completely BS. Mentally deranged people do as well. However, that doesn't mean that what some drugged out nutbag says while cowering in his / her own feces is the gospel, much less the truth. So when I say things like 'Who talks about something that never occurs?' I am assuming the person: A) Isn't a crazy, mentally deranged person that smells like urine, and B) can follow basic logical arguments without the need to distract, or misdirect.

Understand?

StoleMyOwnCar said:
What you said is probably one of the reasons politicians get away with stupid propaganda like "this guy did this back at this time, don't vote for him". Most people don't look beyond initial impressions, either, to get an accurate grasp of the situation. Abusing that quality has been done by those in power for a LONG time.
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I disagree. I believe what you have written here seems more like what a politician would say because it doesn't make any sense nor does it relate to what we were talking about. Really it's just something to say in order to fill up space in hopes that the person you were talking with forgets what the main topic was.

StoleMyOwnCar said:
Furthermore, you don't actually substantiate who "throughout this thread" has anything to back that claim and why.
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Aside from the obvious detour away from the main subject, I was assuming every one could read. Hell you don't even have to go back that far. Read the last couple of pages, or do you want a handout? Maybe I should just hand the answers to you. Is that what you are used to? I guess we can carve out an entitlement for those people who can't find the obvious or easily found. It wouldn't be the first time that a person decries unfairness and then turns around and wants an exception to the expected.:p
 
kac77 said:
If you believe they exist by all means I can't stop a fantasy. But I can point out that it's BS.



That's a really lovely strawman argument. However, with regards to this discussion I was talking about fact vs fiction against actual known values. Sure you can believe something and even talk about something that's completely BS. Mentally deranged people do as well. However, that doesn't mean that what some drugged out nutbag says while cowering in his / her own feces is the gospel, much less the truth. So when I say things like 'Who talks about something that never occurs?' I am assuming the person: A) Isn't a crazy, mentally deranged person that smells like urine, and B) can follow basic logical arguments without the need to distract, or misdirect.

Understand?
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I'm just going to cut it off there because the rest was so stupid.

I don't understand crappy logical arguments, nor are you actually understanding what I'm pointing out. Did you notice the "not limited to fiction part?" Probably not, because you're the one that can't read worth a crap. Or maybe you're just a troll that wants to keep a stupid argument going even though your points don't make a shred of sense and you look like a fool from all angles.

You're apparently telling me that everything people whisper and gossip about has definitive truth at some point. This is a load of crap. Pure and simple. Go back throughout history and tell me that there has never been a time when there was a public attitude/opinion that was unsubstantiated. Go ahead, try it. I'm waiting. This'll be a real laugh.
 
Also, when Google changes its hiring policies to satisfy this stupid equal employment crap is when you'll see their numbers shift to including possibly non-qualified people, not before. Obviously right now you're not going to see that on their data sheet because they're just picking up the people best suited. Now that they've had to release their numbers and they have to change their policies... that's when you'll see the numbers shift.

Also, just basing your argument off of blind numbers isn't saying much. In fact it means nothing. Each company has to be evaluated on a case by case basis, and one that has a lot of diversity could actually have people that deserve to be there.. or it could not. There's no way to tell from the outside. That's why blind numbers and statistics mean nothing towards proving what you're saying either way.

What's more valuable is actual anecdotal evidence like Dekoth-E-'s, where he as a hiring person has clearly gotten overridden to put an unqualified person in place. If anything, that tells you there is a problem. Not looking at a table and saying "herp derp but they don't have those minorities now, so how could there be unqualified ones there for the sake of diversity".
 
Can this thread just get moved to the Soapbox where most of these posts belong?
 
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