Battlefield 4 Windows 7 vs. 8.1 Performance Review @ [H]

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Battlefield 4 Windows 7 vs. 8.1 Performance Review - Is in-game real world Battlefield 4 gaming performance better on the Windows 8.1 operating system or on Windows 7? We look at video card performance between Windows 7 and Windows 8.1 in this game and find out if upgrading to Windows 8.1 is worth it or not for the much rumored performance advantage.
 
Can't believe there is no Windows 8 / 8.1 hate pouring out of my monitor after that article. May just need to check back in a few.
 
I just got Windows 8.1 and I love it, sure it is a bit different but it is smooth and stable just like 7 was..Just a bit different!
 
The conclusion to this strikes me as weird. You're on the fence about recommending 8.1, but you are going to use it for gpu reviews because it "allows gpus to shine brighter".

Let's face the facts, 8.1 is all around faster than 7. It may have things that bother people (start button), but under the hood it is sperior to 7.
 
It's too bad you couldnt add in HT and No HT with windows 8.1/7. Core parking with windows 7 is screwed and there is a program you can use that helps alot of the hitching/choppiness you guys were experiencing.

I know it works for my 2700k on Win 7.

Great damn review though. Shit like this takes alot of time. Hopefully Brent finally was able to take a vacation!
 
trick0502 said:
The conclusion to this strikes me as weird. You're on the fence about recommending 8.1, but you are going to use it for gpu reviews because it "allows gpus to shine brighter".
Click to expand...

On the fence in regards to BF4 specifically, of which is what the article is about. Then I describe that fence depends on what type of a BF4 player you are, hardcore, or casual. Then I describe my opinions on my thoughts about upgrading on those two topics in regards to BF4. The fence comment is entirely about BF4 specifically.
 
DASHlT said:
It's too bad you couldnt add in HT and No HT with windows 8.1/7. Core parking with windows 7 screwed and there is a program you can use that helps alot of the hitching/choppiness you guys were experiencing.

I know it works for my 2700k on Win 7.

Great damn review though. Shit like this takes alot of time. Hopefully Brent finally was able to take a vacation!
Click to expand...

We will be doing BF4 system testing after the Mantle patch in December.
 
Brent_Justice said:
We will be doing BF4 system testing after the Mantle patch in December.
Click to expand...

Makes total sense, No point in doing anything more since Mantle might change everything. Just if you can, try to disable core parking on Windows 7. It really does help and was quite shocking how different it was to AMD and Intel users.

Hopefully the boss lets ya have the week off for Thanksgiving!!! lol
 
lol 6% advantage with a GTX 780. I am going to keep my Windows 7 thank you very much.
Great article!

Also I am running the game in Windows 7 and do not suffer from choppiness. Not sure why you guys did as it is not evident with the minimum framerates also. Placebo?
 
Brent_Justice said:
Under Windows 7, we experienced choppiness as we played. This was felt both in the "Test Range" map, and in multiplayer gaming sessions. The choppiness was more pronounced on the GeForce GTX 780. We could get on a straight path, in the "Test Range" and move down a straight road. As we did this, there would be a pause, or chop, in the frames randomly. It was like the game was hitching for no reason. This happened more on the GTX 780. This is under Windows 7.

When we tried this on Windows 8.1 the pausing, or hitching, or chop (however you want to describe it) was completely gone. Moving was smoother with no hitching in the game on the GTX 780. This affected both the test range and the multiplayer gaming session.

Therefore, the gameplay experience advantage under Windows 8.1 is a smoother gameplay experience in BF4 on both video cards.
Click to expand...

Try using a 120Hz monitor and it should improve it a good bit.

I dont get that with a 60 or 120Hz monitor but I have seen others mention it and the fix for them was a higher refresh rate.
 
Overall 8 is the way to go in general for gaming. I'm sure other games will continue this trend.
 
Regarding Kepler and DX11.1, NVIDIA had this to say:

The GTX 680 supports DirectX 11.1 with hardware feature level 11_0, including all optional features. This includes a number of features useful for game developers such as:

Partial constant buffer updates
Logic operations in the Output Merger
16bpp rendering
UAV-only rendering
Partial clears
Large constant buffers

We did not enable four non-gaming features in Hardware in Kepler (for 11_1):

Target-Independent Rasterization (2D rendering only)
16xMSAA Rasterization (2D rendering only)
Orthogonal Line Rendering Mode
UAV in non-pixel-shader stages

So basically, we do support 11.1 features with 11_0 feature level through the DirectX 11.1 API. We do not support feature level 11_1. This is a bit confusing, due to Microsoft naming. So we do support 11.1 from a feature level for gaming related features.
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So, it has DX11.1 for basically any purpose Hard|OCP is concerned about--I think.

---

So, I'm curious why you guys chose a pure GPU test....A Frostbite 3 developer stated this on Reddit:

Some of the graphic lag is related to how the OS handles the CPU cores. The main reason the game runs better in Win 8 is due to better handling of the cores.
Click to expand...

So, it also has CPU benefits. Another site happened to test medium settings (to add the CPU back into the equation), like most of the general gaming population will be running it at. Their Ultra 1440p tests show basically no improvements, like yours. But, drop to 1080p @ medium and wowza!

Full resolution link.

Just looking at a GTX 770 with a i5-4670K, Win 8.1 vs Win 7:

Minimum FPS: 37% faster (142 vs 103)
Average FPS: 29% faster (160 vs. 124)

This matters, really, only to 100Hz+ users. But, look at the rest of the results. You can definitely find huge performance increases with Windows 8 if you game over 60Hz. :)
 
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DASHlT said:
It's too bad you couldnt add in HT and No HT with windows 8.1/7. Core parking with windows 7 is screwed and there is a program you can use that helps alot of the hitching/choppiness you guys were experiencing.

I know it works for my 2700k on Win 7.
Click to expand...

This. I would love to see how disabling core parking would affect Win7 scores.
 
trick0502 said:
The conclusion to this strikes me as weird. You're on the fence about recommending 8.1, but you are going to use it for gpu reviews because it "allows gpus to shine brighter".

Let's face the facts, 8.1 is all around faster than 7. It may have things that bother people (start button), but under the hood it is sperior to 7.
Click to expand...

Agreed!
 
DASHlT said:
It's too bad you couldnt add in HT and No HT with windows 8.1/7. Core parking with windows 7 is screwed and there is a program you can use that helps alot of the hitching/choppiness you guys were experiencing.

I know it works for my 2700k on Win 7.

Great damn review though. Shit like this takes alot of time. Hopefully Brent finally was able to take a vacation!
Click to expand...

There's a program that makes BF4 smoother on Win 7... so... what is it? :D
 
Anything that improves your minimum framerate on a consistent basis.
 
ikjadoon said:
Regarding Kepler and DX11.1, NVIDIA had this to say:



So, it has DX11.1 for basically any purpose Hard|OCP is concerned about--I think.

---

So, I'm curious why you guys chose a pure GPU test....A Frostbite 3 developer stated this on Reddit:



So, it also has CPU benefits. Another site happened to test medium settings (to add the CPU back into the equation), like most of the general gaming population will be running it at. Their Ultra 1440p tests show basically no improvements, like yours. But, drop to 1080p @ medium and wowza!

Full resolution link.

Just looking at a GTX 770 with a i5-4670K, Win 8.1 vs Win 7:

Minimum FPS: 37% faster (142 vs 103)
Average FPS: 29% faster (160 vs. 124)

This matters, really, only to 100Hz+ users. But, look at the rest of the results. You can definitely find huge performance increases with Windows 8 if you game over 60Hz. :)
Click to expand...

Excellent post. I run 2560x1440 at 110hz and use a mix of high/ultra settings (medium post-processing) with 2x MSAA and an oc'd 780, which yields great results on Windows 8.1 for me. The newest drivers especially (331.82) seem to have helped my minimum framerates, which was a pleasant surprise. And wow at those results on settings anyone without a top-end card (780/780 Ti or 290X) would be running at... difference is huge between amd and nvidia there, and win7 vs win8 :eek:.

And yeah, Win8.1 is pretty much superior in every way to Windows 7... if someone's concerned about having a start screen vs. start menu (neither of which get much use from me, winkey+typing at most) there are plenty of start-menu replacements available from free to five dollars. And if you have any touch-enabled device like a Bay Trail tablet or a convertible laptop, Win8.1 rocks, as well.
 
GoldenTiger said:
And yeah, Win8.1 is pretty much superior in every way to Windows 7... if someone's concerned about having a start screen vs. start menu (neither of which get much use from me, winkey+typing at most) there are plenty of start-menu replacements available from free to five dollars. And if you have any touch-enabled device like a Bay Trail tablet or a convertible laptop, Win8.1 rocks, as well.
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Yeah and if you only knew that Windows 8.1 is pretty trivial in desktop usage to keep the [H] results 3% gain is not worth the money. Windows 8.1 has nothing to offer for desktop. That it works better on touch devices is also trivial MS has so many gimmicks and sadly there is no need for it except when you are using some things like AMD APU.

Windows 8.1 for touch devices still requires more hardware then an Android counterpart. Which makes Windows 8.1 not that great for manufacturers.

The only thing that Windows 8.1 provides is hype and one of the oldest and insecure file-system known to mankind NTFS.
 
GoldenTiger said:
Excellent post. I run 2560x1440 at 110hz and use a mix of high/ultra settings (medium post-processing) with 2x MSAA and an oc'd 780, which yields great results on Windows 8.1 for me. The newest drivers especially (331.82) seem to have helped my minimum framerates, which was a pleasant surprise. And wow at those results on settings anyone without a top-end card (780/780 Ti or 290X) would be running at... difference is huge between amd and nvidia there, and win7 vs win8 :eek:.

And yeah, Win8.1 is pretty much superior in every way to Windows 7... if someone's concerned about having a start screen vs. start menu (neither of which get much use from me, winkey+typing at most) there are plenty of start-menu replacements available from free to five dollars. And if you have any touch-enabled device like a Bay Trail tablet or a convertible laptop, Win8.1 rocks, as well.
Click to expand...

331.82 fixed alot of problems with BF4. And I am using Win 7. So I would think it was more drivers then OS.

3% performance isnt anything to pay $100 for if you ask me. If you use the Core Parking program. It fixes the stuttering/smoothness [H] noticed (I too noticed it).

Don't get me wrong, I won't bash windows 8. I used 8.1 trail to check it out. Not bad, but it's not worth paying $100 for 3% performance.
 
Dayaks said:
Fantastic, thank you. I am currently at 130% video scaling, any higher I get some choppiness (at 80 FPS) with this perhaps I can get 150%. Looks like a lot of postive in that thread.
Click to expand...

No problem! It really is shocking how much the Core Parking program fixed my issues with Win7. It could even make up that 3% performance [H] said win8/8.1 showed.
 
Brent_Justice said:
Of course, we wanted to test the OS at its default settings, no third party tweaks.
Click to expand...

I agree, but didnt you guys use radeonpro to try and fix AMD's stuttering at one point? What would be different with that 3rd party program?
 
DASHlT said:
I agree, but didnt you guys use radeonpro to try and fix AMD's stuttering at one point? What would be different with that 3rd party program?
Click to expand...

Two different articles man, two different goals. The radeon pro test was specifically done to test radeon pro to try to get smoother performance on crossfire. This article is all about finding out if Windows 8 is faster under BF4. The goal wasn't to find out how to make BF4 smoother in Windows 7.

Thank you for the information on core parking, but at this point I'm not going to do anymore cross OS testing, we have made our conclusion. My test system will have 8.1 on it for all future reviews.

What we do have planned is future system testing for BF4, after Mantle, and toggling HT is on the list of things to be tested.
 
Brent_Justice said:
Two different articles man, two different goals. The radeon pro test was specifically done to test radeon pro to try to get smoother performance on crossfire. This article is all about finding out if Windows 8 is faster under BF4. The goal wasn't to find out how to make BF4 smoother in Windows 7.
Click to expand...

I mean I know they are 2 totally difference articles, but I mean you said it yourself, you used it to get a smoother performance for crossfire.

Maybe you could do an update to test to see if a program for core parking could help smoothness in BF4 in win7? I mean it's not just me saying it works, there is a HUGE thread on the official BF4 forums where it worked for alot of people that had choppiness/stuttering you guys mentions in the review.

I really am not trying to bitch or complain, I honestly looked forward to this article. All I am saying it there is a fix to your chopiness/stuttering you guys encountered.
 
Very nice article again guys. I've been telling my gaming clan that Win 8.1 runs BF4 butter smooth, but the only feedback I get is that they hate change whether it is the UI, Start button, etc. Most of them have stopped playing because they keep dying while the game is hitching and stuttering. These are the type of guys that covet their KDR and win ratios. They keep telling me that there is going to be a miracle patch to fix the Win 7 stuttering and they will start back playing then. For the life of me I can't figure out why they don't just assimilate. :)

@Brent_Justice.
You should try playing the game with the AA, Post AA, and Motion Blur off. Set the vegetation to Low because of the bug that reverses the setting. Then set your resolution scale to 150%. Game looks and plays buttery smooth. And you can actually see things to shoot in the distance instead of fuzz!
 
cageymaru said:
Very nice article again guys. I've been telling my gaming clan that Win 8.1 runs BF4 butter smooth, but the only feedback I get is that they hate change whether it is the UI, Start button, etc. Most of them have stopped playing because they keep dying while the game is hitching and stuttering. These are the type of guys that covet their KDR and win ratios. They keep telling me that there is going to be a miracle patch to fix the Win 7 stuttering and they will start back playing then. For the life of me I can't figure out why they don't just assimilate. :)

@Brent_Justice.
You should try playing the game with the AA, Post AA, and Motion Blur off. Set the vegetation to Low because of the bug that reverses the setting. Then set your resolution scale to 150%. Game looks and plays buttery smooth. And you can actually see things to shoot in the distance instead of fuzz!
Click to expand...

I can't stand games without AA, the jaggies melt my brain. I must have AA, all the AA I can have. Maybe 4X AA AND 150% scaling? hehe I'l try it when I get home next week. Motion blur is another thing I can live without, in games like this it annoys me too.
 
Alright - so serious question...

what was the default renderdevice.renderaheadlimit set to with each GPU and within each OS?

I find 2 to be the smoothest. By default my machine in Win7 and 8 will set it to -1.

bring the console down ~

Type - 'renderdevice.renderaheadlimit' (without ') and it will show what its set to. You can then change it by using 'renderdevice.renderaheadlimit 2'... or put this line into a user.cfg in the game directory. I'm curious if Windows 7 was setup differently than 8. using renderdevice.renderaheadlimit 0 vs renderdevice.renderaheadlimit 2 makes a huge difference in smoothness though.

I could sit you at a machine and make it go from chop to butter by just changing this one command.

btw Windows 8 UI is easily remedied with startisback or one of the many other start menu replacements.
 
Dave65 said:
I just got Windows 8.1 and I love it, sure it is a bit different but it is smooth and stable just like 7 was..Just a bit different!
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Agreed. W8 is a great OS, better in every way than W7.

If you don't like metro then set your OS to boot to desktop and be done with it.

I feel like a lot of the people who hate W8 have difficulty learning new things in general.
 
Brent_Justice said:
I can't stand games without AA, the jaggies melt my brain. I must have AA, all the AA I can have. Maybe 4X AA AND 150% scaling? hehe I'l try it when I get home next week. Motion blur is another thing I can live without, in games like this it annoys me too.
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My understanding is video scaling = SSAA. I turned all other AA off besides video scaling based on the [H] article and I think it looks better.

Edit: I just realized I responded to Brent, I am so confused. Anyways video scaling seems to get rid of jaggies for me without nasty side effects! MSAA 4x still had jaggies I could see on a 24" at 1200P. Video scaling made it beautiful.
 
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Great article. Nice to see it all laid on the table after all the speculation.

I'd like to see a comparison between a 3930k or a 4930k against a 4770k and a 2600k.

I'm dying to see what affect 2 extra I7 cores has on min frame rates.

It would be cool to run the x79 in both dual and quad channel during the tests to shine more light on Corsair's high speed mem claims regarding BF4.
 
trick0502 said:
The conclusion to this strikes me as weird. You're on the fence about recommending 8.1, but you are going to use it for gpu reviews because it "allows gpus to shine brighter".

Let's face the facts, 8.1 is all around faster than 7. It may have things that bother people (start button), but under the hood it is sperior to 7.
Click to expand...

I wouldn't drive a fully tuned Fox Body Mustang over a 2013 stock.
 
Lith1um said:
Great article. Nice to see it all laid on the table after all the speculation.

I'd like to see a comparison between a 3930k or a 4930k against a 4770k and a 2600k.

I'm dying to see what affect 2 extra I7 cores has on min frame rates.

It would be cool to run the x79 in both dual and quad channel during the tests to shine more light on Corsair's high speed mem claims regarding BF4.
Click to expand...

This can be found here. Note that it's from a few weeks ago using the initial-retail version so YMMV.

http--www.gamegpu.ru-images-stories-Test_GPU-Action-Battlefield_4-test-bf4_proz_2.jpg
 
Thanks guys, it was definitely interesting.

Disabling core parking at a registry level will pretty much squash hitching under Win 7.

Hopefully, they will get BF 4 more stable soon.
 
Brent_Justice said:
Two different articles man, two different goals. The radeon pro test was specifically done to test radeon pro to try to get smoother performance on crossfire. This article is all about finding out if Windows 8 is faster under BF4. The goal wasn't to find out how to make BF4 smoother in Windows 7.

Thank you for the information on core parking, but at this point I'm not going to do anymore cross OS testing, we have made our conclusion. My test system will have 8.1 on it for all future reviews.
Click to expand...

I understand your point, but it is a simple registry key change that is much quicker, easier and cheaper than a $100 OS upgrade. You spend way more time tweaking specific game graphic options than this would require.

For those who would like to try:
- Go to Regedit (admin)
- Select Edit > Find... and find this key: " 0cc5b647-c1df-4637-891a-dec35c318583 "
- Within this key, there is a value called: " ValueMax " This value represents the % number of cores the system will park
- Change the value of " ValueMax" to 0 so that, it matches " ValueMin "
- You will have to find the key a few times and repeat the process for each time it is found - the number of instances will depend on the number of power profiles in your system. To do this go back up to Edit > Find Next.
- Do a full shutdown and power-off and cold-re-start.
Click to expand...
 
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Blacklash said:
Thanks guys, it was definitely interesting.

Disabling core parking at a registry level will pretty much squash hitching under Win 7.

Hopefully, they will get BF 4 more stable soon.
Click to expand...

W8 has core parking disabled by default for those who are running W8 and considering trying this.
 
Meeho said:
I understand your point, but it is a simple registry key change that is much quicker, easier and cheaper than a $100 OS upgrade. You spend way more time tweaking specific game graphic options than this would require.

For those who would like to try:
Click to expand...

I doubt it will buy you the performance improvement 8.1 has.
 
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