My Good "OLD" Sysytem

Basically, here's my situation. My main workstation is a machine I built in 2008 and have upgraded slightly since. Here are the specs.

[email protected]
XFX-780i
G-skil-4gb ddr2-800mhz
EVGA-GTX275 896gb Superclocked edition
Corsair-TX850 Watt PSU
Corsair-H50 High performance CPU cooler
Fractal design Define R3
1x Western Digita-750gb Caviar Black HD
Dell U2311H

I use the system for gaming, video editing, and the usual web browsing. As the years go on I can feel the general slowdown of the system, especially while gaming and editing. I know this should be expected with such an old system so here's my question. If I could make a rational upgrade of this system to last me maybe another 2 years what components should I upgrade? Any specific suggestions would be great. This would have to remain somewhere around $200-350. Or, should I just wait it out and upgrade the entire system in another few years? I would use Crysis 3 as a benchmark of the type of game I would like to be at least playable on the system.

BTW: It's a 1080p screen so I dont think that much GPU horsepower is necessary but you all can decide that. Thanks!

SSD

896GB on video card, holy smokes! lol....


An SSD wont give you any performance really. Programs would open a little snappier, but that's about it.

A video card upgrade would be your best bet to get better gaming performance. Something along the lines of a 2GB 760 GTX would give you a considerable performance boost in gaming.

B-Sal said:

Or, should I just wait it out and upgrade the entire system in another few years?

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I think so. You're on a Q6600 with ddr2 ram... I don't think a GPU upgrade would really help. you probably dont have SATA 3 for an ssd either...

And $350 isn't much


I would try and make a whole new system.

I would just make due with what you have and save the $200-$350 towards a new system. You will probably be able to reuse several components like the drives, power supply, etc.

Oh come on guys, OP said he "feels" the "general slowdown" of the setup. An SSD is the single best bang for the buck upgrade available, can be reused in the eventual replacement system, and does NOT require SATA3

Right, but an SSD wont make a system that's not capable of playing Crysis 3 suddenly capable.

I realize the system is incredibly old and slow by today's standards (I still love her for being my first and only build). It is still reliable however. I probably wasn't clear before. By general slowdown I meant in games and newer programs. I have no problem with bootup and access speeds currently. (Probably because I haven't experienced how fast SSD's are first hand). I don't really want to go the ssd route yet because as mentioned before, I don't have SATA 3 built into the board. If I upgraded the GPU would that really make a big difference in games and such?

I'm 17 and I'm currently working but I hate to spend money on a brand new system when the one I have still works, just works alittle slower. I need to spend money on the fun things like gas and food

For gaming, a GPU upgrade is the single best thing you could upgrade on an aging system. Even if you were CPU limited, a GPU will still show noticeable improvements.

While it wont help with other programs, unless they are GPU accelerated, it will help with games. For those other programs, overclock the CPU which you've already done.

your system would be the 3rd fastest box in my house and would be a very welcome lan overflow station

'tis true the 275 could use an upgrade, I wouldn't spend more than $150 for graphics for a Q6600 at this point, I think a 650ti would be a fine choice for that box

Wait and upgrade everything. You'll be inefficiently spending money if you upgraded only one or some of the components.

You could say that about any upgrade then. The OP just wants to get another 2 years out of the system. A GPU will help him achieve that goal more so than anything else.

I think an SSD is worth for the reasons jojo69 mentioned.

For less than $350, you can get 120/128 GB SSD + GeForce GTX 660.

For about (or a little more) than $350, you can get 120/128 GB SSD + GeForce GTX 760. But I think the first option is better for a system that old.

Also, depending on how heavy is your video editing, 8 GB of RAM can give you a good performance boost.

I'll toss in a "wait and save" vote. I was in a very similar situation when I decided to build all new. Honestly, there's probably very little you can do that will make a noticeable difference.

Maybe you spend $50 on a good cooler and go for a big overclock? That definitely helped my aging rig, as I found I was getting processor bound...

And, if you must spend the money - buy something you will use in the new rig. SSD and GTX7x0 as others mentioned (but I'd still wait).

Assuming ~$350 budget for upgrades...
$150 - i5 2500+mobo (used)
$40 - 8GB DDR3 RAM
$160 GTX650 Ti Boost

You can sell the Q6600+mobo+ram for $50-75 shipped

Skillz said:

You could say that about any upgrade then. The OP just wants to get another 2 years out of the system. A GPU will help him achieve that goal more so than anything else.

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But at 1080p Crysis 3 will already be significantly held back by the Q6600, where a GPU upgrade would be a waste of money. A stock Q6600 will already be the limiting component with a GTX275. Of course you can buy a new GPU now that you can use in a future system, but with all of the other components considered, it will be a waste of money.

Here is one CPU benchmark of Crysis 3. http://www.pcgameshardware.de/Crysis-3-PC-235317/Tests/Crysis-3-Test-CPU-Benchmark-1056578/ It doesn't matter that the article is in German, the graphs are easily understood. With a GK110-based card (my assumption is it's a GTX 780) a Q9550 at 2.9GHz--the closest thing I could find to a Q6600 at 3GHz--is only getting 29fps average at 1280x720 with no AA or AF. That's not even 1080p, and already falling below 30fps. That's a lot of money to spend on a component that will not deliver the performance the OP is hoping for in the game they mentioned.

I'd upgrade the GPU a bit - conservatively - and then upgrade the whole system when you can. I made a similar jump recently.

Old System:
Q6950 @ 3Ghz (had to get that cache! lol.. small OC, 1:1 FSB/DRAM which seemed clever but I don't know if it was good, bad, or relevant)
10GB DDR2 1066Mhz or 1333Mhz, not sure what it runs at now but at one point it was 1333 (random brands, some budget some quality - was about quantity using it as a server/video processor by the time this system was replaced - when purely used for gaming it had 6GB of nice RAM)
Gigabyte P43-ES3G (iirc the model properly, if not it's close. had to swap mobo at least twice in this machine while upgrading it piecemeal due to one failed board, then the mini-ATX I got for cheap to replace it not having enough slots for RAM and expansion cards)
AMD Radeon 6950 tri-slot ASUS DCII
A lot of random-ass hard drives, but the system is on a 750GB SSHD (for a long time a 32GB SSD but that thing crapped out on me).
ALL the expansion cards and drives.. seriously, it can read 5.25" floppies, every kind of memory card, has an internal USB 2.0 hub, a USB 3.0 card, ZIP drive, TV tuner with a setting for no delay, etc..

Love that machine, but it couldn't keep up anymore even with the video card upgrade from an ATI Radeon 4870 2GB Sapphire X-Vapor (really nice card at the time, BTW). It could max out Skyrim with texture mods, MLAA, and 2-4xAA with 2xMSAA with no issue (could go higher and be playable but I wanted it smooth) - got 40-50FPS with that setup.

I distinctly remember finding that the highest-tier C2Q processors were neck-and-neck with the lower-end i7s up through at least Sandy (IIRC) for real-world game performance at the time (both from personal experience and in benchmarks online). I don't know/care about Crysis 3, but I know it holds true for everything up to and including Skyrim. I owned an i7 2.8Ghz (Ivy) laptop (Clevo W110ER, Mythlogic branded) with an Nvidia 650M and 16GB DDR3 1600Mhz at the same time as this was my main desktop toward the end, and while the laptop ran many things better it was worse in some cases, too.

New Machine:
i7 4770K @ 4Ghz (tiny OC)
32GB DDR3 @ 1333Mhz (stuff is rated 2400Mhz, and I can probably get it running at 1600Mhz, but can only get it as high as 1866Mhz by removing half the RAM - Haswell sucks for RAM speed but it isn't as relevant as in the previous generations believe it or not)
GTX TITAN SuperClocked EVGA
4x750GB SSHD in RAID 1+0

Obviously new system kicks it's ass to the curb and then causes it to melt in its sheer glory.

Can run Skyrim with 32xCSAA, 8xSSAA, FXAA, in-game 8xAA (yes, all at once), as well as everything else forced up to max and still get solid 60FPS with vsync on. It can run three default-settings copies of Furmark at 40FPS each - while forcing AA on them at the levels above.

The 6950 was a bit bottlenecked by the system in the old box, so I'd go for something a tad weaker than that (560Ti is a good choice, friend has a similar system but with that card and that runs everything nicely without being bottlenecked/wasted). Uprgade later when you can totally redo the system, because trying to do it piecemeal is just throwing money into filling potholes when you know you need a new road eventually either way.

The onboard SATA controller is limited to 3gb/s. Even if you bought a SATA3 PCIe controller, you'll be bottlenecked by the PCI bus, and won't see much improvement over the onboard controller.

An SSD will make your system more responsive and snappier, but you're not going to get the huge increase in throughput that you'd get using an SSD on a more modern motherboard.

But, in my situation a single SSD was faster than the two HDD's I had running in RAID0

I have the exact same problem with my current system. I upgraded to an SSD, but I'm seeing roughly half the performance that this drive is capable of because it's running on a SATA2 controller. And my motherboard only has PCIe version 1.0.

So if I wanted to squeeze alittle more life out of the system and upgrade the GPU, would a GTX 650 Ti Boost be a reasonable option? For $169, that seems to be a pretty good upgrade.

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814130909

Edit: Maybe I could bring the CPU clock up to 3.2 or 3.4 as well.

$170 for a GPU upgrade is a lot of money to spend on little improvement (other than DX11) while using a Q6600 and DDR2. When do you plan to upgrade your CPU/Mobo/RAM? Your gaming performance is probably already limited by your Q6600, not your GTX275.

well, you know my view by now, I would run it. I would hunt around and wait for a 650ti at less than $150, clock the living snot out of it and boot off an SSD.

I have a sister in almost the exact same situation as you, same CPU, same budget, same usage but a GTS 250 GPU.
You should wait for a complete overhaul, but you can do a 2 stage upgrade.

If you take a 2 stage approach:
Get a proper GPU now and upgrade the rest when you can afford it.
You can get a good GTX 760 with your budget and the card can push some nice pixels.
You will still be CPU limited in a bunch of games, but when you can afford a new mobo + CPU + RAM you'll just move the GPU to the new system.

The dumbest thing you can do right now is getting a mediocre GPU for the Q6600 and then be GPU limited when you get CPU + mobo + RAM in 6 or 8 months time.

Refurb 7970s recently going for about $250. Can't go wrong there. It's exactly what I would do. Your Q6600 at 3GHz is enough CPU for a long while. I might also try to get a total of 8GB for system memory.

Don't listen to the detractors, they have absolutely no idea what they're talking about. The performance boost would be huge.

Is a proper upgrade of the major components possible under a $600 budget?

For $600, and assuming you buy everything new, you're upgrading either the core components (motherboard, processor, memory, and CPU cooler) or the video card (e.g., GTX 770 or HD 7970).

You can make a modest upgrade to everything, but you won't have the best of the best nor would you be able to overclock the processor. For example:

$200 - either i5-3470 (Ivy Bridge) or i5-4570 (Haswell)
$80 - Intel B75 (LGA1155) or Intel B85 (LGA1150) motherboard
$65 - 2x4GB DDR3 1333 or DDR3 1600 kit
$260 - GTX 760

Then again, either processor paired with the GTX 760 would outperform your Q6600/GTX 275 combination.

Kongar said:

Maybe you spend $50 on a good cooler and go for a big overclock? That definitely helped my aging rig, as I found I was getting processor bound...

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$50 buys him a brand-new motherboard for a new CPU. If he can get a nice cooler on a good sale for like $15, (which he can), that's a little different. Plus, he already has an H50.

B-Sal said:

So if I wanted to squeeze alittle more life out of the system and upgrade the GPU, would a GTX 650 Ti Boost be a reasonable option? For $169, that seems to be a pretty good upgrade.

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No, because you can get 7850 1gb right now for $100 after rebate and a 2gb has been $125 recently.

When I first starting reading the OP, I thought, "Didn't we just have this thread the other day?" About a Q6600 and playing games. Q6600 is still pretty strong, especially when OC'd a bit.

I don't know if OP is running a 32-bit OS, but I'm wondering about that 4gb of memory. Maybe 4gb is fine if he closes other programs while using big programs, but then again maybe it's not.

If he's feeling the upgrade bug, I guess I'd agree with the SSD logic of it could be used on the next build as well, so the only real loss would be of price reductions between now and then. An SSD isn't really going to help him play Crysis3 better, though.

Speaking of, I don't understand the low Crysis 3 benchmarks. I played it on a Phenom x4 and 7850 at 1080p and it was just fine. Usually up around 50fps, I think, with drops during heavy fights to about 30, maybe 25. I don't remember. But I do remember it looked and felt just fine other than maybe a brief spot here or there. I think textures were one notch below the highest, and no AA. I don't know if the Crysis3 benches are from a worst-case-scenario part of the game or what.

Anyway, if the choice is up to $350 for upgrades, especially if you buy used, you can buy a whole newer system basics for that. $50 new mobo, $80 used i3, $100 new 7850, $60 new 8gb DDR3. That's under $300, and you can sell the old parts for about half that.