Confusing myself with RAID 0

Hi all, and thanks for taking time to read.
I'm building a whole new system, from the cpu to the mouse. I've got me a 4770K with a Gigabyte GA-Z87X-UD3H mobo, along with 2 x Samsung 840 Pro 128GB ssd's.
It's my 1st pc build for 5 years. I'm going to set up a RAID 0 with the 2 ssd's I have. I konw a lot of people don't agree with this kind of setup, but I'm determined to do it, after having a snail of a pc for so long I want max performance possible.
I've been trying to do some reading about setting up the RAID 0 array, and it's all becoming a blur.
Theinstruction manual for motherboard has instructions for setting up RAID 0 which seems ok. The instructions say about setting the size of the array???? The array will be 256GB surely (128GB + 128GB) ??? Why does it ask this, surely there would be no option for any other size?
Also, whats with the RST ?? I understand Intel RST is needed to enable TRIM support for the RAID? Am I right here.
I've also heard mentioned UEFI RAID array, or have I missunderstood, WTH is this?
It seemed straight forward at 1st, but the more I read the less so.
I've seen in a review that the stripe size may be better performance wise set to 32KB instead of 128KB. The main use of pc will be gaming.
I was linked to Intels guide previously by someone on these forums, but I've stumped myself with these questions.
I'll be installing them new, with a new OS install. Is it true that the firmware can't be updated on the drives once they are in a RAID. To get around this, would I be best to plug them into current system, install firmware, then fit them into new system and install OS.
I'll be going with the abomination that is Windows 8.
Thanks for any help.

It would be a lot easier to setup just 2 drives instead of Raid0
Install the OS to C:\ and then install games and apps to D:\

Thanks, but I really have my heart on a full bore RAID0
Just for the hell of it !! I just wanna have the best pc I possibly can on the budget I have. I have all the parts now, took me 9 months to get them all. Ready to put it all together once I figure out the RAID.

Go into bios with only the 2 ssds connected, put them to raid, reboot with windows disk in, you should a raid menu or something after the bios menu flashes not sure how it does it on different boards, select the drives, stripe size, etc, reboot, install windows onto the raid, then go into windows and install the intel RST drivers and chipset drivers. Then you will have raid 0 .

I'm not really a raid expert, but let me see if I can help you out with a few of the simple questions you had:

Rogue007 said:

Theinstruction manual for motherboard has instructions for setting up RAID 0 which seems ok. The instructions say about setting the size of the array???? The array will be 256GB surely (128GB + 128GB) ??? Why does it ask this, surely there would be no option for any other size?

Click to expand...

The reason for this is you could actually specify a size smaller for your array, like 220 GB instead of the full amount. There are various reasons why, but I don't think you have to worry about it, just make it the full size.

Also, whats with the RST ?? I understand Intel RST is needed to enable TRIM support for the RAID? Am I right here.

Click to expand...

Rapid Storage Technology. Basically I view it as Intel software that runs in Windows to help you manage stuff. Build your array in BIOS, install OS, then install RST and check it out.

I've also heard mentioned UEFI RAID array, or have I missunderstood, WTH is this?
It seemed straight forward at 1st, but the more I read the less so.
I've seen in a review that the stripe size may be better performance wise set to 32KB instead of 128KB. The main use of pc will be gaming.
I was linked to Intels guide previously by someone on these forums, but I've stumped myself with these questions..

Click to expand...

I can't really help you with those questions, but I will say, since you are starting fresh, I would suggest to just go out and do it. If you get into a tight spot where something isn't working as expected and you can't get it right, let the guru's here know, they will help.

I'll be installing them new, with a new OS install. Is it true that the firmware can't be updated on the drives once they are in a RAID. To get around this, would I be best to plug them into current system, install firmware, then fit them into new system and install OS.
I'll be going with the abomination that is Windows 8.
Thanks for any help.

Click to expand...

I'm not sure about the firmware thing in RAID. I know on my OCZ I cannot update it in Windows because it is my boot drive. So I use a utility CD that boots into Linux and does the update for me. Also, Windows 8 isn't so bad, I just boot to desktop essentially and I really like all of the back end improvements. I just wish they would have kept Aero as I was just getting around to liking it...lol

thanks guys, much appreciated.
Been googling like mad trying to find out. Most of the things google throws up refer to raid with hdd though so wasn't having much luck.
I managed to find a mention somewhere of making the array a little smaller than the full disk size to allow for errors. I presume this is to compensate for if sections of the ssd begin to fail it can use other sections instead.
I'm only really stuck on the firmware issue now. I'm thinking i might be able to plug them into old pc, install new firmware, then fit into new pc.
Thanks again for replys. My current pc has a 256gb hdd, and takes a good few minutes to boot and and be usable. The difference will be immense. Can't wait.

you have to be careful, some firmware updates can be destructive

you can just split your drives and update them on another computer and put them back together, but if the firmware update did any breaking, you'd be a bit in trouble

I've been using Intel RAID0 for @ 4 years.

Did you get this working?

Old Hippie said:

I've been using Intel RAID0 for @ 4 years.

Did you get this working?

Click to expand...

Not yet. I've been busy with birthday party and visitors last 2 days. Put together case with mobo, cpu etc and downloaded a few drivers. I'll prob finish it off tomorrow. Fingers crossed. Any advice for a RAID noob? what do you set stripe size as? I read in one article that they got slightly better performance with 32KB stripe size. What do you use. I've downloaded the latest firmware, but not put it on them yet. Was gonna use Samsungs magician software to do it on my current pc.
Thanks for the replys all.

Old Hippie said:

I've been using Intel RAID0 for @ 4 years.

Did you get this working?

Click to expand...

Not yet. I've been busy with birthday party and visitors last 2 days. Put together case with mobo, cpu etc and downloaded a few drivers. I'll prob finish it off tomorrow. Fingers crossed. Any advice for a RAID noob? what do you set stripe size as? I read in one article that they got slightly better performance with 32KB stripe size. What do you use. I've downloaded the latest firmware, but not put it on them yet. Was gonna use Samsungs magician software to do it on my current pc.
Thanks for the replys all.

Old Hippie said:

I've been using Intel RAID0 for @ 4 years.

Did you get this working?

Click to expand...

Not yet. I've been busy with birthday party and visitors last 2 days. Put together case with mobo, cpu etc and downloaded a few drivers. I'll prob finish it off tomorrow. Fingers crossed. Any advice for a RAID noob? what do you set stripe size as? I read in one article that they got slightly better performance with 32KB stripe size. What do you use. I've downloaded the latest firmware, but not put it on them yet. Was gonna use Samsungs magician software to do it on my current pc.
Thanks for the replys all.

Not yet. I've been busy with birthday party and visitors last 2 days. Put together case with mobo, cpu etc and downloaded a few drivers. I'll prob finish it off tomorrow. Fingers crossed. Any advice for a RAID noob? what do you set stripe size as? I read in one article that they got slightly better performance with 32KB stripe size. What do you use. I've downloaded the latest firmware, but not put it on them yet. Was gonna use Samsungs magician software to do it on my current pc.
Thanks for the replys all.

read in one article that they got slightly better performance with 32KB stripe size.

Click to expand...

The smaller the stripe, the better performance on small files.
I have mine set at 32KB.

Was gonna use Samsungs magician software to do it on my current pc.

Click to expand...

That's just a management tool and has nothing to do with creating a RAID set-up.

I got this sorted, just wanted to say thanks for the help.
One more question, the Windows write casche buffer flushing policy, should I enable or disable ??
I turned off defragmenter, do I have to do anything for TRIM ??
Thanks again

The Z87 chipset is supposed to support TRIM in RAID 0, 1, 5, and 10 with RST 12, but it's worth checking to see if it is. To check if TRIM is enabled in Win 8:

Go to the Desktop.
Press the "Windows Key" + "X" on your keyboard.
Click the "Command Prompt (Admin)" option.
Type fsutil behavior query disabledeletenotify
DisableDeleteNotify = 1 (Windows TRIM commands are disabled)
DisableDeleteNotify = 0 (Windows TRIM commands are enabled)

To enable TRIM:
Go to the Desktop.
Press the "Windows Key" + "X" on your keyboard.
Click the "Command Prompt (Admin)" option.
Type fsutil behavior set disabledeletenotify 0

(Taken from Sean's Win8 walkthrough)

The Z87 chipset is supposed to support TRIM in RAID 0, 1, 5, and 10 with RST 12, but it's worth checking to see if it is.

Click to expand...

Just a note.....this will tell if TRIM is enabled but it's got nothing to do with TRIM actually working and IDK of any test that will do that.

Hopefully your drivers are the latest version and Intel got it right.

Enjoy your RAID set-up!

To be best strip size to pick is 128kb its a well rounded for all different file types in windows . Go smaller if you wanna bench more or work with small files

The Speeds of Raid 0 will never touch a RAM drive.

Thanks for all the replies. I tried the command prompt check, and it says that TRIM is enabled. So hopefully all is good.
I'd already set the stripe size to 32KB, so too late to change now without a complete reinstall. I'll mostly be using it for gaming, and I understand that game use (once the levels are loaded) mostly involves small read and write operations. So hopefully I made the right choice there.
Thanks again all

Don't mean to be negative, but running one 256GB SSD instead of two 120s in a RAID 0 will give you similiar, if not better, performance. If you look at the stats of those Samsung Pros you will see that the 256 and higher sized drives have faster Random and Sequential read/write speeds, plus double the cache size. This is usually the case with larger SSD drives.

I'm not hating on your setup. I had the same desire to run two SSDs in a Raid 0 myself, and have been running two 520 series Intel drives in Raid 0 for my OS for over a year now in my current build. I just want to point this out for anyone else considering this type of setup. If I could do it again I would run one large (256 or higher) SSD without the RAID for my OS.

I'm glad you got everything up and running nicely though. I have been pretty happy with my setup so far. Post some benchmark results!!!

WHITE80 said:

Don't mean to be negative, but running one 256GB SSD instead of two 120s in a RAID 0 will give you similiar, if not better, performance. If you look at the stats of those Samsung Pros you will see that the 256 and higher sized drives have faster Random and Sequential read/write speeds, plus double the cache size. This is usually the case with larger SSD drives.

I'm not hating on your setup. I had the same desire to run two SSDs in a Raid 0 myself, and have been running two 520 series Intel drives in Raid 0 for my OS for over a year now in my current build. I just want to point this out for anyone else considering this type of setup. If I could do it again I would run one large (256 or higher) SSD without the RAID for my OS.

I'm glad you got everything up and running nicely though. I have been pretty happy with my setup so far. Post some benchmark results!!!

Click to expand...

not to hijack thread but your right I came from two intel 520 120gb raided drives back to a single 256gb samsung pro and desktop feels much faster cause of the low 55ns access times I have now

i got the 2 x 128gb for roughly the same price as 1 x 256gb so thought, what the hell why not. I read a review, think it was on tomshardware where they compared 2x128 against 1x256 on benchmarks and general use such as load times. The 2x128gb were generally quicker, though the margins were quite small. So for same proce roughly i went with the raid0. Never done anything like this before either, so was interesting (and nerve wrecking) to have a go. Massive difference from my old pc, 5 or 6 sec boot time versus 30 sec plus on the old one.
The difference between 1 ssd vs 2 in raid is prob negligable, sometimes prob no difference, but tis nice to have it.
Can't wait to try out bf3 tonight, 1st game i've played on new system. I'll actually join a game before half the points are already captured! Plus the eye candy with my new gpu and cpu
thanks all.