NCASE M1: a crowdfunded Mini-ITX case (updates in first post)

Necere said:
Yes. Doing that now in fact: NH-C14 + Accelero Xtreme on the 7970.


Well, it's more of a value model, with the features to match. It's only $40 up on Newegg. In its favor, it 1.) has the CPU socket located away from the PCIe slot, 2.) has some overclocking options (though I didn't investigate them), 3.) has an extra PCIe slot, 4.) didn't give me any problems.

The things I didn't like about it: 1.) no USB 3.0; 2.) no power LED header; 3.) bad location for the HD audio header (right under the video card, which smashes the wires; to be fair, the ASUS board also suffers from this); 4.) extra PCIe slot is only x1.


Quite likely. I mean, we'll see new MDTX boards continue to trickle out. Will we ever see high-end MDTX boards is the real question.
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Hopfully you are correct. By the way very interested in this case and great review. Will be buying two of these case when it actually goes on sale. I was wondering if you are planning on doing a triple slot test with the asus/similar card? This is the only mini-itx I have seen with 3 slots so greatly interested in that.
 
wow, great work guys. looks incredible.

my 2c: someone posted it would be nice to have an extra 20mm for ATX psus, if that's possible to do still I think it would be a good thing. Unfortunately still not a lot of choices in SFX and I think a lot of us planning to move our rigs into this case probably already have invested in a quality modular ATX psu that won't fit.

again, great work!! looks absolutely sexy :D
 
How would this asus card be compared to using the onboard audio + dac + amplifier?

Not very knowledgable in audio setups.
 
It would, assuming you put it with the side vents facing up. You end up with a negative pressure setup though, and it would look pretty silly.
 
*Daedalus said:
It would, assuming you put it with the side vents facing up. You end up with a negative pressure setup though, and it would look pretty silly.
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why would you end up with negative pressure? if it was going to be positive pressure standing up then it will be positive pressure lying down too. yes you can do that sgtspiff, no reason at all that you cant. :)
 
ekuest said:
why would you end up with negative pressure? if it was going to be positive pressure standing up then it will be positive pressure lying down too.
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Well, yes, you could keep the fans as intakes, and have positive pressure, but you'd be forcing heat the wants to rise, back down, and out the sides of the case, which isn't ideal. That said, slightly higher temperatures are probably preferable to dust-clogging.
 
*Daedalus said:
Well, yes, you could keep the fans as intakes, and have positive pressure, but you'd be forcing heat the wants to rise, back down, and out the sides of the case, which isn't ideal. That said, slightly higher temperatures are probably preferable to dust-clogging.
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nah the force of natural convection<<<force of fans pushing the air. it wont be a problem to have the exact same setup you would if it was standing. if you were going for fanless it would make a difference, but with one or two fans somewhere in the case they will more than counteract any natural convection unless you have them on low low speed.
 
ekuest said:
nah the force of natural convection<<<force of fans pushing the air. it wont be a problem to have the exact same setup you would if it was standing. if you were going for fanless it would make a difference, but with one or two fans somewhere in the case they will more than counteract any natural convection unless you have them on low low speed.
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Agreed. I was more thinking that given how tight things are in the case, and depending what he's going to put in there, he could easily end up with pockets of air that have nowhere to go, etc. It's doable, certainly, I'm just saying it's not ideal.
 
Dephcon said:
The SoundBlaster XFi-HD USB is pretty good too. I've got two of them and they're a great value. For higher quality you'd probably be better of with a USB DAC from a non-PC company.
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Too true. A USB DAC from a music company will sound better than most anything from a PC company, at least for music. If you use your system to drive a 5.1 via analog, you may want a PC sound card, but if you are just using HDMI -> receiver, there is no point in a sound card as you should be passing everything untouched to the receiver. There may be an argument for gaming, but I personally feel that onboard has really caught up in gaming - plus, many of the 'best' headsets for gaming these days are USB and bypass the soundcard anyways.
 
I was using head-fi's DAC/AMP top-rated list as a rough guide if I decided against the ASUS Essence STX card with mPCIE adapter. I wholeheartedly agree that there's audio hardware manufacturers that outpace Creative Labs/ASUS/others in terms of sound reproduction, even if I'm not totally well versed in what's out there.

For me, I'd rather have everything condensed down to one very small box of computer goodies that does everything. This has it's own problems though... Giving up space inside the case that could be used for cooling in order to have additional HDD space mostly.
 
I have to say that this has been a great forum to watch mature. Every thing looks great, quite amazing to see what can happen when enthusiasts come together on a project. Hopefully the OEM's take note.

Protoype installs looks great plenty of room around everything albeit the sfx psu fan intake. I read in an earlier post about possibly increases the width to hold more off the shelf watercooling solutions. This would be ideal for air flow from the back to the front of the case.

I contributed early, and on the list to buy one !YAY! Mainly for server use though. Any extra space for cable management or airflow between the dual 3.5 hdd bay and the psu would be a great welcome to this near production piece of engineering art.


Just built:
lian li tu-200
p8z77i deluxe
16g trident x
evga gtx670 4gb
dangerden pump, betifenix top/res
black ice 120mm +140mm stealth gt
seasonic 500 watt 40amp server psu
bluray slim scythe server mini fan controller
 
I know Ncere talked about holes on the side where the SFX psu would face to allow more air flow. It would be beneficial, but also may kill the sleek styling of the case. It would be something to worth considering.
 
XcPNehVYlE4A3C said:
my 2c: someone posted it would be nice to have an extra 20mm for ATX psus, if that's possible to do still I think it would be a good thing. Unfortunately still not a lot of choices in SFX and I think a lot of us planning to move our rigs into this case probably already have invested in a quality modular ATX psu that won't fit.
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I would love to see this case accept 160mm standard or 140mm modular PSUs. I would prefer to eliminate the 3rd PCI slot, reallocating that space to the top of the case above the motherboard. That would allow the PSU to be mounted higher, providing clearance for the cables between it and the GPU. It would also provide a place for an HDD mounted above the motherboard. I don't like the idea of blocking the airflow to the GPU with HDDs. And that would put the GPU fan directly next to the air inlet which would get more fresh air.

I'm sure it's far too late in the design process to make such a substantial change. I suppose there was a reason for supporting mini-DTX, though I very rarely see mobos in that form factor. I'll hope for a mini-ITX only version in the same dimensions supporting ATX PSUs in the future. Guess I'm still stuck with a Node 304.
 
The above suggestions would completely change the case. One of the massive draws for a lot of people with this case is the third PCIE slot, as it allows the use of a dedicated sound card.
 
I dont understand the whole height increase request. The design call for a low sleek design with functionality. How much more functioncional can it be with on more fan in it compared to the before mentoined width increase thought.

Just my 2c
 
A lot of people are really hoping for more Mini Dtx designs. If that ever happens this case will be perfectly setup for it.
 
Yes, in the sense that no one builds dtx boards. From my understanding this case was built for mini ITX with the hope that dtx comes back to life. There have been signs that it might become more popular. Without a need no one is going to build one. This case is the start of a change hopefully. If it does then you are prepared. If not you still have one of the smallest itx cases out there which is positive either way you look at it.
 
it is going to take more than a limited run (+/- 300 units) computer case to convince manufacturers to start making dtx boards. even then they'll probably be mediocre, cheap and nothing to write home about.
it is only the past year or so that itx has started to have some quality boards. and no, zotac does not count as quality.
 
mini-dtx talk has increased over the last year or so it only a matter of time. Who wouldnt want to have the choice of audio card and graphics, or better yet two gpu tooling around in a small case?
 
illli said:
it is going to take more than a limited run (+/- 300 units) computer case to convince manufacturers to start making dtx boards. even then they'll probably be mediocre, cheap and nothing to write home about.
it is only the past year or so that itx has started to have some quality boards. and no, zotac does not count as quality.
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It's not going to start the revolution, but it's a drop in the bucket. I'm sure at least a couple people from the design/engineering end of these companies at least glance at the enthusiast forums from time to time.

edit:// the trend is that we're making components smaller and smaller while they require less and less current... eventually it will be difficult to justify all that empty space on an ATX build.
 
Opelgtkid said:
mini-dtx talk has increased over the last year or so it only a matter of time. Who wouldnt want to have the choice of audio card and graphics, or better yet two gpu tooling around in a small case?
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This is exactly why it will happen imo.
 
I don't see the need for ATX any more really, in all but the highest builds. 90% of people only use on GPU, and nothing else, so they could even get by with ITX, but at least mATX gives them some options.
 
For mDTX to be more mainstream, it's like the chicken or the egg metaphor, do the cases come first or the mobo?

I had a chance to speak with a few motherboard manufactures about Z87 mDTX mobo. It's possible and SOMEONE WITH MORE FREE TIME THAN US should start the crowdfund campaign for it.
 
ok, for the sake of argument, lets say it does happen. dtx was originally developed back in 2007. so far the only dtx boards are pretty crappy. itx has surpassed them in quality, and only recently. since about a year now itx has had (in my opinion) a decent quality offering on par with atx/m-atx offerings. how many more years before a decent dtx board comes out? manufacturers would have to have confidence the time/money/effort invested into making a dtx would actually sell. most people probably dont even know a dtx form factor exists.

you would have to have a huge demand for dtx, much more than what there is now. and not only that, demand for a good, quality dtx motherboard. unless like mentioned, someone started a crowdfunded campaign.
if anything, there will probably be a bigger demand down the road for something smaller than itx, for example the intel nuc. in the coming years you'll probably see more demand for itx, and less for atx and even m-atx.

with that being said, if this case actually brings about a new dtx renaissance, then i'd buy one. i'm just being realistic however. considering how long it took for us to FINALLY get a decent itx board built..
 
wahaha360 said:
For mDTX to be more mainstream, it's like the chicken or the egg metaphor, do the cases come first or the mobo?

I had a chance to speak with a few motherboard manufactures about Z87 mDTX mobo. It's possible and SOMEONE WITH MORE FREE TIME THAN US should start the crowdfund campaign for it.
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Chicken and egg is right. Silverstone's Sugo cases have space for mini DTX, but don't have 3 expansion slots. Other popular ones like the Prodigy are not wide enough. It's the same problem as SFX power supplies - why would manufacturers gamble on producing a niche product that would mostly be interesting only to SG05 / NCase owners? Or am I forgetting some other popular case that can fit a mini DTX?
 
wahaha360 said:
For mDTX to be more mainstream, it's like the chicken or the egg metaphor, do the cases come first or the mobo?

I had a chance to speak with a few motherboard manufactures about Z87 mDTX mobo. It's possible and SOMEONE WITH MORE FREE TIME THAN US should start the crowdfund campaign for it.
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The issue would how many would need to be sold at what cost.

The QUO crowdsourced motherboard, took a lot backers/$$$$ to get made, and it was just a modified Gigabyte matx board. They needed $87k after the prototype stage to go into production. I am not sure how much they spent getting the prototype done.

From what I have read from other peoples unsuccessful attempts, its $100k in design costs. And then you'd have to hit certain numbers for production. Did the motherboard manufacturer give you any rough figures?
 
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wreckem said:
The issue would how many would need to be sold at what cost.

The QUO crowdsourced motherboard, took a lot backers/$$$$ to get made, and it was just a modified Gigabyte matx board. Did they give any rough figures?
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It's hard to convince companies that don't have mDTX already to play ball.

A possibility is a Z87 based on the ECS H61H2-MV platform with dual PCIe 3.0 x16

IanM said:
Who wants to do a kickstarter for a good DTX board, a fanless platinum SFX modular PSU, and a big(ish) passive air cooler to fit the M1?
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Maybe IanM has info on Minimal Order Quantity.

When I spoke to ECS, I just wanted to see if they had a Z77 mDTX in the works, I wanted to get it for M1 testing. I didn't ask about custom mobo.
 
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wahaha360 said:
It's hard to convince companies that don't have mDTX already to play ball.

A possibility is a Z87 based on the ECS H61H2-MV platform with dual PCIe 3.0 x16



Maybe IanM has info on Minimal Order Quantity.

When I spoke to ECS, I just wanted to see if they had a Z77 mDTX in the works, I wanted to get it for M1 testing. I didn't ask about custom mobo.
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Ah okay. So my guess is ECS said they didn't have anything in the pipeline.
 
Everyone would be better off holding their breath for better on-board sound on ITX than someone releasing a DTX mobo ever. Some of the Z87 Asrock boards have either SoundBlaster Core chips or enhanced audio path + digital amplifiers, hopefully this will make it into the ITX lineup.
 
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ecs is a great builder board. they have the full pcie size on bottom. now they need to shrink down the wiring footprint where it sits bellow the pcie port. then copy it. whammo 2 slots.
mini-itx is going good but, think about how much smaller things get and the more resources are needed. its enivitable!
 
what would be interesting for me is how much would the cpu/gpu temp decrease by having a 140 fan on top of the top-panel which is pulling the hot air out of the case.
 
ipuoL said:
what would be interesting for me is how much would the cpu/gpu temp decrease by having a 140 fan on top of the top-panel which is pulling the hot air out of the case.
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Me too.

Or simply do a test with reversed fan on CPU radiator...
 
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