WP users are mad at Google!

The screen is 60 Hz but boy I would love it if my desktop ips screen was as responsive and blur free.
 
The screen is 60 Hz but boy I would love it if my desktop ips screen was as responsive and blur free.
Can't be 60Hz. Fastest you can update 60Hz screen is every 16.66 ms :confused:

Have to get up to 102 Hz in order to get down to 9.8 ms

Edit: Though Nokia says they were seeing 23ms out of an average IPS panel (which can't even display 60 fps content without blurring), so I suppose even 16.66 ms is a massive improvement.
 
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I guess you missed one of the big new features of IE10 being that it now has a built-in update service, allowing it to be patched for security/new features at any time (same as Firefox and Chrome)?

Just because it has a built-in service for patching doesn't mean it will be used for upgrades. Microsoft has a history of *not* updating their software, unless they were security holes, as I pointed out. Bugs or no bugs, Microsoft called them features. Will Microsoft actually use their new "technology" to actually perform upgrades? Future will tell.

Also missed that Microsoft is moving to an annual (yearly) release cycle for major OS updates, the first of which being "Windows Blue," which will be released as an update for Windows 8 that adds new features + other upgrades?

So they rename service packs with code words (oh yeah, code words are hip!), and force them out of the shelf on a yearly basis, finished or not finished? We'll see a lot of half-baked stuff if they keep that promise. Unless, of course, they cut out features that are not fully finished, at which point a major upgrade might become a very minor one...

Also, with these "other upgrades", going back to Microsoft's history, did they ever add major features to their OSes, post launch? Maybe a handful. Most service packs were always huge stability patches and security improvements. Again, it it's not a security hole - no need to fix it.

And you somehow also missed that a headline feature of Windows Phone 8 was OTA updates? This allows Microsoft to patch the OS whenever they feel like, and they have already added a nice number of features to WP8 since launch.

Yes, whenever they feel like it. Or, if they don't feel like it, they can abandon it if it doesn't become the success they want it to be. Looks like the stars are not aligning they way that they want so far. No love from Google.

Looks to me they're now upgrading the desktop based on their mobile-device strategy, not the other way around. Means we can expect a steady stream of new features.

I'll be happy if these promises are true. More competition is good, as long as it doesn't hinder progress.

They don't need to release a Gmail app. WP7 and WP8 support IMAP, which is Google's new preferred method of accessing Gmail. That will keep working.

The removal of ActiveSync screws up calendar sync and and contact sync, though.

That said, it's not hard to simply export that data from your Google account. Contacts can be exported from Google and then imported into Outlook.com (they will immediately show back up on your phone). Google Calendar can be set up to auto-forward to Outlook.com as well, so events still show up just fine on WP7 / WP8 (though they'll be on your primary calendar, rather than being color-coded as a Google Calendar appointment).
 
Kinda like how google has a history of this obtaining IP addres bug that is in android and they have not solved it for ever?
 
Just because it has a built-in service for patching doesn't mean it will be used for upgrades. Microsoft has a history of *not* updating their software, unless they were security holes, as I pointed out. Bugs or no bugs, Microsoft called them features. Will Microsoft actually use their new "technology" to actually perform upgrades? Future will tell.
Why would they implement such a service only to not use it? That doesn't make any sense. They've been stating over and over that they want to deliver more updates and more features more quickly. Everything they're doing right now points to this being the case.

So they rename service packs with code words (oh yeah, code words are hip!), and force them out of the shelf on a yearly basis, finished or not finished? We'll see a lot of half-baked stuff if they keep that promise. Unless, of course, they cut out features that are not fully finished, at which point a major upgrade might become a very minor one...
You obviously have not been paying attention to how Microsoft has been executing in the mobile space recently, and are making a MASSIVE assumption that they will push out features and updates before they're ready. This HAS NOT been the case at all.

For example, Windows Phone 7 and Windows Phone 8 were both released on a deadline, but the features considered "not ready yet" were disabled for the RTM release. In Windows Phone 8 these included things like a notification center and VPN support.

Microsoft will add them in when they're ready to, whenever they want, thanks to the new OTA patching system. There is absolutely nothing "half baked" about releasing features only when they are ready...

Also, with these "other upgrades", going back to Microsoft's history, did they ever add major features to their OSes, post launch? Maybe a handful. Most service packs were always huge stability patches and security improvements. Again, it it's not a security hole - no need to fix it.
Once again, this is not the Microsoft of old. As I've pointed out multiple times, they're handling updates and patches entirely differently now.

Windows Phone 7 and Windows Phone 8 updates have all included bug fixes as well as a steady stream of new features. Windows phone 7.8 is rolling out as we speak, which brings features from Windows Phone 8 back down to 1st gen and 2nd gen handsets. Windows Phone 8 just got its first update, moving it from "Apollo" to "Portico," which added features as well.

As you yourself said, it looks like Microsoft is going to start treating the desktop and mobile the same as far as updates go. That looks like a good thing to me, considering mobile updates have brought a consistent stream of new features. The "Windows Blue" update for Windows 8 is slated to be along similar lines, bringing new features and new UI (additional tile sizes, even) to Windows 8 with its first major update.

That doesn't sound anything like the service packs they used to release, now does it?

Yes, whenever they feel like it. Or, if they don't feel like it, they can abandon it if it doesn't become the success they want it to be. Looks like the stars are not aligning they way that they want so far. No love from Google.
I'm not sure what point you're trying to make here. Being able to deliver OTA updates whenever they want is somehow a bad thing?

Been working fine so far, WP8 handsets are already getting updates and new features via the new update system. I don't see what Google has to do with updates to WP8...
 
I'm confused why many vocal people seem to believe that a uniform OS across PC's, Tablet's, and phones is a bad idea... As was previously said, I really get the impression this is a different Microsoft this go around. They know they need to head in a different direction and it will be painful for users to adapt to but it's a step in the right direction. I applaud them. I also wish the "big 3" would stop attacking each other and just let their products sell themselves. iOS/Android/W8 are all completely acceptable and dare I say "good" choices. It's a great time to be a consumer.
 
Why would they implement such a service only to not use it? That doesn't make any sense. They've been stating over and over that they want to deliver more updates and more features more quickly. Everything they're doing right now points to this being the case.


You obviously have not been paying attention to how Microsoft has been executing in the mobile space recently, and are making a MASSIVE assumption that they will push out features and updates before they're ready. This HAS NOT been the case at all.

For example, Windows Phone 7 and Windows Phone 8 were both released on a deadline, but the features considered "not ready yet" were disabled for the RTM release. In Windows Phone 8 these included things like a notification center and VPN support.

Microsoft will add them in when they're ready to, whenever they want, thanks to the new OTA patching system. There is absolutely nothing "half baked" about releasing features only when they are ready...


Once again, this is not the Microsoft of old. As I've pointed out multiple times, they're handling updates and patches entirely differently now.

Windows Phone 7 and Windows Phone 8 updates have all included bug fixes as well as a steady stream of new features. Windows phone 7.8 is rolling out as we speak, which brings features from Windows Phone 8 back down to 1st gen and 2nd gen handsets. Windows Phone 8 just got its first update, moving it from "Apollo" to "Portico," which added features as well.

As you yourself said, it looks like Microsoft is going to start treating the desktop and mobile the same as far as updates go. That looks like a good thing to me, considering mobile updates have brought a consistent stream of new features. The "Windows Blue" update for Windows 8 is slated to be along similar lines, bringing new features and new UI (additional tile sizes, even) to Windows 8 with its first major update.

That doesn't sound anything like the service packs they used to release, now does it?


I'm not sure what point you're trying to make here. Being able to deliver OTA updates whenever they want is somehow a bad thing?

Been working fine so far, WP8 handsets are already getting updates and new features via the new update system. I don't see what Google has to do with updates to WP8...
By that logic, if they release the phone without the actual calling feature because it's "not ready," that makes it ok?

People have their priorities when it comes to features. When it comes to corporate phones, VPN is a pretty big one.

OTA updates are not fool proof - because the carriers essentially control the entire process. This can delay the process for months - time that Microsoft does not have to release a feature set that's competitive.
 
It's been fixed.

Not for me or any of my devices. 4 of them ranging from pretty new evo 4g lte, to older. If it has been fixed the absolute latest release it took them way to freaking long to fix it. And if its not rolling out to all devices then they need to rethink their strategy, 2 of these devices are running 4.0+

This is only one item, anyway the fact that google has turned into the MS of old and spends all of its time trying to force users to use stuff like google plus and not enough time addressing core issues like fragmentation only makes it obvious that once any company gets power they change strategy to abusing it.
 
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By that logic, if they release the phone without the actual calling feature because it's "not ready," that makes it ok?
I did not say that. You've assumed that there is no priority system in place, which I can assure you, is not the case. I mean really, why would they release a phone OS that is unable to make calls? That makes no sense, and would have obviously pushed back the RTM date if it were not ready yet.

They priorities features. They finish features with the highest priority first, then move on to lower-priority features. When the deadline rolls around, they include all features that have been deemed stable and release the new update. Features that did not make the cut are pushed out to the next update and released when they're stable as well.

This sounds like a responsible and sensible way to handle updates to me, and is exactly what they've been doing every step of the way since WP7 launched in 2010.

People have their priorities when it comes to features. When it comes to corporate phones, VPN is a pretty big one.
Right, and it wasn't ready for the RTM of WP8, so they didn't include it.

It would have been FAR WORSE for consumers and for Microsoft's PR department if they had released it with VPN included, but half-broken.

By accounts I've heard from testers, VPN was present in earlier builds of WP8, but removed during final shakedown leading up to RTM. It's probably very close to finished, and likely to show up in the next major update for WP8.
 
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Can't be 60Hz. Fastest you can update 60Hz screen is every 16.66 ms :confused:

Have to get up to 102 Hz in order to get down to 9.8 ms

Edit: Though Nokia says they were seeing 23ms out of an average IPS panel (which can't even display 60 fps content without blurring), so I suppose even 16.66 ms is a massive improvement.

Afaik they are saying that the response time is that, less than 16,66 ms to avoid blurring. Pretty standard stuff. Like those many 2 ms displays are still 60 hz and active 3d ones are 120 hz.
 
I like how everywhere on the Internet there are shouting matches about who's to blame here, when it doesn't matter at all. What a consumer will see, and hear from others, is that their brand new WP8/Surface/Win8 device doesn't have a way to read gmail, which is many times more popular than outlook.com will ever be. This is not how you sell more.
 
What a consumer will see, and hear from others, is that their brand new WP8/Surface/Win8 device doesn't have a way to read gmail, which is many times more popular than outlook.com will ever be. This is not how you sell more.
Except that is an entirely false statement. This change does not prevent the email client on WP7 and WP8 from accessing email stored in gmail accounts. The inbox will simply be set up as IMAP rather than as Exchange ActiveSync. Tada! You have Gmail!

The only thing this change screws with is syncing contacts and calendar entries from Google's services. It's annoying and requires configuration to fix, but it is possible to work around this new Google limitation.

Contacts are very easily sorted out. Simply log into your Microsoft account, open Account Settings > Permissions > Add Accounts. Once you're in there, link your Google account with your Microsoft account and contacts will be automatically pulled from Google into your Live account.
Calendar isn't quite as easy to fix, but still do-able. Export the calendar from Google as an ICS file, then "Subscribe" to your Google calendar from your Microsoft calendar using the ICS file. All your appointments will appear.
 
Can't be 60Hz. Fastest you can update 60Hz screen is every 16.66 ms :confused:

Have to get up to 102 Hz in order to get down to 9.8 ms

Edit: Though Nokia says they were seeing 23ms out of an average IPS panel (which can't even display 60 fps content without blurring), so I suppose even 16.66 ms is a massive improvement.

It's still a 60Hz screen. Taking a look at that white paper all Nokia did was "re-invent" RTC / overdrive which is really standard stuff on LCDs and has been for many years now. There's nothing new there.

EDIT: Some more info about overdrive and the potential drawbacks of it are here: http://www.tftcentral.co.uk/advancedcontent.htm#overdrive
 
There's nothing new there.
Sure there is. This is the first time I've ever heard of this being employed on a phone. That's new.

After messing around with one, I can say it's doing its job. Probably the smoothest ghost-free motion I've ever seen on a phone.
 
I was 99% sure I was going to make Windows Phone 8 my new smartphone, probably the HTC 8x, when I finally upgraded from my basic phone. But then I discovered that WP8 can't connect to certain wireless networks like the one at my university that uses PEAP/MSCHAP for authentication. I don't believe Windows 8 RT can do this either. Wtf? This is a pretty popular wireless authentication method, not to mention it's Microsoft's very own. Talk about alienating a potentially huge clientele base--how are people supposed to use your products if they can't use them at work or school?

I decided I wasn't going to wait forever to see if they'd implement support for it and purchased an Android phone last week. So far "it just works."
 
I was 99% sure I was going to make Windows Phone 8 my new smartphone, probably the HTC 8x, when I finally upgraded from my basic phone. But then I discovered that WP8 can't connect to certain wireless networks like the one at my university that uses PEAP/MSCHAP for authentication. I don't believe Windows 8 RT can do this either. Wtf? This is a pretty popular wireless authentication method, not to mention it's Microsoft's very own. Talk about alienating a potentially huge clientele base--how are people supposed to use your products if they can't use them at work or school?

I decided I wasn't going to wait forever to see if they'd implement support for it and purchased an Android phone last week. So far "it just works."
You jumped the gun. I can confirm that WP7 and WP8 can connect via PEAP once the root certificate is installed on the device (this isn't required for all PEAP-protected networks).

My college's network uses this security system, and both my WP7 and WP8 handsets have connected to it without complaint. So far they "just work" too ;)
 
Sure there is. This is the first time I've ever heard of this being employed on a phone. That's new.

Yes, marketing a standard feature of LCDs as a new innovation is, in fact, something new. That's also something I'd expect from Apple more than Nokia, but whatever.

After messing around with one, I can say it's doing its job. Probably the smoothest ghost-free motion I've ever seen on a phone.

Can't say I've seen any mobile screen suffer from ghosting except for the god awful panel on the Motorola Xoom. Google's high speed shots of the Galaxy Nexus don't show any ghosting either: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FCVMvvXHqxU

Also don't confuse building a better screen with doing something unique/innovative. All desktop LCDs have overdrive but not all of them get it right or do it well.
 
Yes, marketing a standard feature of LCDs as a new innovation is, in fact, something new. That's also something I'd expect from Apple more than Nokia, but whatever.
Standard feature of phone LCD's? I don't think so... Can you find any other phones with an an IPS LCD that has a true sub-9ms response time?

Google's high speed shots of the Galaxy Nexus don't show any ghosting either: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FCVMvvXHqxU
I see plenty of ghosting there, it's just masked by the fade effects used in the UI. They never pan the UI left/right, so it's really difficult to pick out.

Also don't confuse building a better screen with doing something unique/innovative. All desktop LCDs have overdrive but not all of them get it right or do it well.
So screen with...

1. Higher PPI and higher resolution than the iPhone 5 or the Samsung Galaxy S III (Lumia 920 packs 1280x768 onto a 4.5" screen)
2. Full RGB matrix (None of that Pentile nonsense)
3. ClearBlack (low-reflectance, making the screen very viewable in direct sunlight)
4. PureMotion (sub-9ms response times on an IPS panel)
5. Super-sensative touch (touchscreen will work through gloves or with almost any object being used as a stylus)

...all rolled into one product isn't unique or innovative? uh... I don't know of any device besides the Lumia 920 with a screen like that.
 
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You jumped the gun. I can confirm that WP7 and WP8 can connect via PEAP once the root certificate is installed on the device (this isn't required for all PEAP-protected networks).

My college's network uses this security system, and both my WP7 and WP8 handsets have connected to it without complaint. So far they "just work" too ;)

Well sure it "just works," once you made WP do what iOS and Android figured out themselves.
 
Well sure it "just works," once you made WP do what iOS and Android figured out themselves.
I'm not sure what you mean here... what did I "make" it do, exactly? As far as I can tell, WP "figured it out" all by itself as well...

Both WP7 and WP8 handsets have connected to my campus wifi (which is secured with PEAP) by simply entering a username and password, exactly the same thing you do on iOS and Android.

The only situation where you have to install a certificate by hand is if it was self-signed (I mentioned not all PEAP-secured networks require manual cert installation, remember?). If the network is using a self-signed cert, then Android and iOS will also require manual certificate installation.

So, yeah, it just works...
 
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Standard feature of phone LCD's? I don't think so... Can you find any other phones with an an IPS LCD that has a true sub-9ms response time?

I said *OVERDRIVE* is a standard feature - yes, even on phone LCDs.

"true sub-9ms response time" would need to actually be measured (for the 920 as well), which I don't think anyone is doing. Of course, that also gets into the whole 9ms response time for what transition.

I see plenty of ghosting there, it's just masked by the fade effects used in the UI. They never pan the UI left/right, so it's really difficult to pick out.

Then your desktop/laptop monitor suffers from ghosting, go buy a new one.

So screen with...

1. Higher PPI and higher resolution than the iPhone 5 or the Samsung Galaxy S III (Lumia 920 packs 1280x768 onto a 4.5" screen)
2. Full RGB matrix (None of that Pentile nonsense)
3. ClearBlack (low-reflectance, making the screen very viewable in direct sunlight)
4. PureMotion (sub-9ms response times on an IPS panel)
5. Super-sensative touch (touchscreen will work through gloves or with almost any object being used as a stylus)

...all rolled into one product isn't unique or innovative? uh... I don't know of any device besides the Lumia 920 with a screen like that.

1. A whopping ~3% higher - no, that's not worth mentioning. Also, 920 gets curb stomped by the Droid DNA here.
2. iPhone 5, Nexus 4, HTC One X, etc... don't have pentile either
3. Other devices make similar claims (for example, LG's "Zerogap Touch" claims to improve outdoor visibility) - need actual comparisons
4. Without actual measurements and comparisons to other screens this is meaningless.
5. Works through gloves, yes, but you made up the part about using "any object as a stylus".
 
Then your desktop/laptop monitor suffers from ghosting, go buy a new one.
Nope, it's in the video itself... which is a slow motion video recorded at 300 FPS. At such a slow playback speed, the properties of my monitor pretty much don't matter as far as ghosting goes (viewed this on a Dell U2412M, for reference).

Also, the ghosting wouldn't stick around when I paused the video if it were my monitor causing it ;)

1. A whopping ~3% higher - no, that's not worth mentioning. Also, 920 gets curb stomped by the Droid DNA here.
As I mention later, this entire list, taken TOGETHER, on one screen makes a pretty compelling offering. You're not going to find any other screen with ALL of these features at once.

2. iPhone 5, Nexus 4, HTC One X, etc... don't have pentile either
Never said they did, but they also don't have many of the other things in this list. Again, this list was meant to be taken as a whole... I quite clearly wrote "all rolled into one product"

3. Other devices make similar claims (for example, LG's "Zerogap Touch" claims to improve outdoor visibility) - need actual comparisons
None of them have this polarizer setup (it's exclusive to Nokia). I'd be very surprised if they could exceed the 920's low screen reflectance. The iPhone has made a big deal about its low reflectance before, and Engadget found that the Lumia 900 (which also uses ClearBlack) beat it.

The lumia 920 has an even more extensive "outdoor mode" with contrast adjustments and a 20% backlight boost when sunlight conditions are detected. Combined with ClearBlack it's the most daylight-visible screen I've ever encountered. It REALLY makes a difference when it's on a dashboard being used as a GPS.

4. Without actual measurements and comparisons to other screens this is meaningless.
You said yourself it was "standard," surely you have comparisons with other phones if it's so common? ;)

And 9ms is a concrete number for average G2G response time. Not sure how that's meaningless, since it's not a relative measurement...

The measurements and what type of transitions they tested are all in the PureMotion whitepaper I posted previously.

5. Works through gloves, yes, but you made up the part about using "any object as a stylus".
No, no I did not. Nokia and various users have demoed some pretty random objects being used to interact with the Lumia 920's screen, including a silverware and a banana...

Also, I said ALMOST any object. I don't appreciate the misquote.
 
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Nope, it's in the video itself... which is a slow motion video recorded at 300 FPS. At such a slow playback speed, the properties of my monitor pretty much don't matter as far as ghosting goes (viewed this on a Dell U2412M, for reference).

Also, the ghosting wouldn't stick around when I paused the video if it were my monitor causing it ;)

Alright, then maybe double check your eyes. There wasn't any ghosting in that video.

As I mention later, this entire list, taken TOGETHER, on one screen makes a pretty compelling offering. You're not going to find any other screen with ALL of these features at once.

Correct, you won't find 2 Nokia marketing terms in other smartphones - you will quite easily find other phones with equally good displays with their own party tricks the 920 doesn't have, though.

None of them have this polarizer setup (it's exclusive to Nokia). I'd be very surprised if they could exceed the 920's low screen reflectance. The iPhone has made a big deal about its low reflectance before, and Engadget found that the Lumia 900 (which also uses ClearBlack) beat it.

Perhaps, but the N4 also has a polarizer on it and has superb outdoor visibility, as does the Droid DNA's screen.

As for objective measurements, DisplayMate puts the Lumia 900's contrast under high ambient light (aka, outdoor simulation) at 90 ( http://www.displaymate.com/Mobile_Brightness_ShootOut_2.htm ) whereas the iPhone 5 scores 121 ( http://www.displaymate.com/Smartphone_ShootOut_2.htm )

So if you assume the 920 is a better version than the 900 (as otherwise the "best outdoor claim" is rather debunked), I'm not finding much in the way of direct comparisons either subjectively or objectively. Reviewers say it is excellent, but they don't make any direct comparisons to other phones that they've said are excellent.

You said yourself it was "standard," surely you have comparisons with other phones if it's so common? ;)

You really, really suck at "reading comprehension", huh? I said overdrive is standard, not that 9ms G2G is standard. I said numerous times that response times and quality of RTC/overdrive implementation vary.

And 9ms is a concrete number for average G2G response time. Not sure how that's meaningless, since it's not a relative measurement...

Because we don't have anything to compare it against? Also as a general rule you should never, ever trust the numbers manufacturers give you when it comes to displays - this is a rule proven over, and over, and over again on the desktop side of things, and I see no reason they wouldn't pull the same stunts on the mobile side as well.

No, no I did not. Nokia and various users have demoed some pretty random objects being used to interact with the Lumia 920's screen, including a silverware and a banana...

Also, I said ALMOST any object. I don't appreciate the misquote.

In what universe does 2 objects == "ALMOST any object"? It's still a capacitive screen - all the same rules of what can and can't be used as a stylus remain unchanged as a result...
 
Alright, then maybe double check your eyes. There wasn't any ghosting in that video.
Sure there was? You can see it clearly when the slower version of Android drops frames and quickly skips ahead in an animation, there's a clear after-image that shows up even with the video paused. It's not a compression artifact, it's underneath the macro-blocking.

it's much easier to see on panning effects, but you chose a video that shows none...

Correct, you won't find 2 Nokia marketing terms in other smartphones - you will quite easily find other phones with equally good displays with their own party tricks the 920 doesn't have, though.
I never said anything about finding the Nokia marketing terms in other phones... You're putting words in my mouth.

I simply said you're not going to find that particular polarizer setup (which Nokia happens to call ClearBlack) in any other phone because it's Nokia's proprietary patented tech and they haven't licensed it to anyone else.

As for objective measurements, DisplayMate puts the Lumia 900's contrast under high ambient light (aka, outdoor simulation) at 90 ( http://www.displaymate.com/Mobile_Brightness_ShootOut_2.htm ) whereas the iPhone 5 scores 121 ( http://www.displaymate.com/Smartphone_ShootOut_2.htm )
I said "iPhone," I did not specify iPhone 5, you assumed that without basis. Given that I said the comparison was with the Lumia 900 and not the 920, it was pretty obviously an older review against an older iPhone (the iPhone 4, in this case).

CNET agrees, stating "the Lumia 900 has the lowest screen reflectance of any mobile device I have ever measured,[...] 4.4 percent, which is almost 40 percent lower than the iPhone 4." Source: http://news.cnet.com/8301-1035_3-57...-900-screen-looks-so-darn-good/?tag=mncol;txt

Apple has made improvements since then, obviously. Nokia claims to have done the same, but I have yet to see any numbers on further reflection reduction on the 920 vs the 900. (this is likely because they're making a bigger deal about PureMotion this go-around, where as ClearBlack was a headlining feature on the Lumia 900).

Edit: Also, contrast ratio != absolute reflectance. And you complained about my reading comprehension...

You really, really suck at "reading comprehension", huh? I said overdrive is standard, not that 9ms G2G is standard. I said numerous times that response times and quality of RTC/overdrive implementation vary.
My reading comprehension is just fine...

Overdrive is what Nokia uses to get their response times down to under 9ms. You said overdrive is standard, ergo lowered response times derived from overdrive should be standard and you should be able to pull some statistics on this "standard" feature.

As far as I can tell, the Lumia 920 is the only phone doing this to this degree of effectiveness, and it really wows when using the screen in-person.

Because we don't have anything to compare it against? Also as a general rule you should never, ever trust the numbers manufacturers give you when it comes to displays - this is a rule proven over, and over, and over again on the desktop side of things, and I see no reason they wouldn't pull the same stunts on the mobile side as well.
Like i said 9ms G2G is not a relative measurement. 9ms is a finite unit of time. The average time it takes the screen to transition between black and gray / white and gray is 9ms. That is an absolute value.

I have the whitepaper from the manufacturer. If you have better material demonstrating the response times of phone LCDs (Including the 920's), please, present it. I'll gladly look it over.

In what universe does 2 objects == "ALMOST any object"? It's still a capacitive screen - all the same rules of what can and can't be used as a stylus remain unchanged as a result...
A universe where there are categories of material properties shared amongst multiple objects of similar type?

In this case, yes, those two examples were meant to demonstrate that almost any object can be used to interact with the Lumia 820 and Lumia 920's screen when Super Sensitive Touch is enabled. They're two items that generally DO NOT work on capacitive screens, and they fall into the larger categories of metallics and plant matter.

You already knew cloth worked (and it's not just sensing your finger through cloth, you can fold up a towel and it'll still register). The above two examples also add metallic objects and plant matter to the list of items that work.

If it can sense flesh, cloth, plant matter, and metal using its touchscreen (when traditionally only flesh and materials modeled to mimic the electrical conductance of flesh) then it obviously works with a pretty large range of objects that fall well outside the scope of a normal capacitive touchscreen. Inductive reasoning, use it...

Try using a towel, a gloved hand, a banana, a fork, a toothpick, or fingernails to interact with a normal capacitive touchscreen. They don't work on normal capacitive touchscreens.

I know for a fact all of the above register on the Lumia 920's screen. I'm not going to post thousands of photos showing object after object interacting with the Lumia's touchscreen when it's pretty obvious that in fact, yes, almost any object CAN be used as a stylus on these phones.
 
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Man, and I thought Medion is the only one here who likes to argue by misquoting, misrepresenting, or completely making quotes up... Just you wait, when you make a mistake once, he will declare victory on everything you ever argue about despite being wrong way more often.

The screen in the Nokia Lumia 920 is one of the best screens in market. If it is not the best, it is only second to iPhone 5's (and this is partially due to RDF affect).

Compared to the Lumia 900, which was then the best outdoors readable device, the 920 totally kicks its ass. Yes, 920 improved upon is predecessors, like the iPhone 5 did. (The only company that just keeps on shoving a larger or a higher pixel display without improving much such as color or contrast is Samsung).

I believe I can sum up the entire debate here:
http://blog.gsmarena.com/apple-ipho...a-920-has-its-most-advanced-title-taken-away/
 
I'm not sure what you mean here... what did I "make" it do, exactly? As far as I can tell, WP "figured it out" all by itself as well...

Both WP7 and WP8 handsets have connected to my campus wifi (which is secured with PEAP) by simply entering a username and password, exactly the same thing you do on iOS and Android.

The only situation where you have to install a certificate by hand is if it was self-signed (I mentioned not all PEAP-secured networks require manual cert installation, remember?). If the network is using a self-signed cert, then Android and iOS will also require manual certificate installation.

So, yeah, it just works...

Ahh k I see what you're saying. Is your network PEAP with EAP-MSCHAP v2? That particular config, which my school happens to use, is what I kept reading about everyone having the issues with (the MSCHAP v2 part). Maybe everyone with those issues just needed to install a certificate. I guess it's a moot point now.
 
ok so with the new Gmail thing, can you or can you not get push Gmail on WP8 anymore?
Since Google is falling back to IMAP, Gmail accounts will no-longer push email to devices.

WP8 can be configured to pull down email from Gmail every 15 minutes. Not quite instant, but not bad.

Edit: It's worth mentioning, if you configure your Google account as an Exchange ActiveSync account before the end of january, it will continue to function (full push + calendar + contacts sync) forever. Google is only preventing new devices from registering an ActiveSync partnership after that point. If you set up gmail in the near future you will get push forever.
 
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