Diablo 3 Discussion Thread

Still haven't had the chance to hop onto the PTR yet. It still disconnects me the moment I enter the character creation screen. Has anyone experienced something like this?

edit: I got in. Man MP10 is ridiculous lol. The #1 problem by far is survivability. It made me realize how much my Wiz build hung in the balance around being able to kill quickly for health globes and simply killing things before I take too much damage and die. The damage is enough to make the time in Diamond Skin short and the time outside DS very dangerous. The nerf to Storm Chaster becomes apparent in this situation (though its still no problem at MP1, which is definitely easier than 1.0.4 Inferno). It's a lot of problems compounding on top of another when health and damage ramps up. I already mentioned on the reliance of health globes, but health pots are included as well. Using a pot to get me out of 1 sticky situation per encounter is usually enough atm. But sticky situations come up sooner and more frequently per encounter at MP10, which easily exceeds the cooldown of pots.

Getting a feel of my comfort zone. MP7 may be the most efficient in terms of monster health per exp/mf/gf gained, but it's just outside my comfort zone. I might stick around MP 5 or 6 for exp farming. I think the lowest MPs may be the best for sheer loot farming, but I'm not sure. Damn, now I gained 1/2 a level that isn't going toward my real character lol.
 
Last edited:
So I understand that turning on MP will bump act 1/2 mobs up to mlvl 63, but will that also allow them to drop ilvl 63 legendaries? If not, then it's still farming act 3 ad infinitum.
 
Mabu said:
So I understand that turning on MP will bump act 1/2 mobs up to mlvl 63, but will that also allow them to drop ilvl 63 legendaries? If not, then it's still farming act 3 ad infinitum.
Click to expand...

This is one of the important things to me. I'd like to be able to run Act 1 sometimes
 
Yes with any monster power at 1 or more, all enemies are level 63. This means all inferno acts will have the same drop percentages of ilvl gear (63,62,61). Monster power and magic find has further no affect on the distribution of ilvls past mp 1: the same percentage of 63 gear will drop in act 3 mp10 as act1 mp1. So now you can farm any act freely not worrying about losing out on drops because you're not in the final act. On top of that act 1 difficulty should also be equal to act 3 of the same monster power.
 
Breath_of_the_Dying said:
Yes with any monster power at 1 or more, all enemies are level 63. This means all inferno acts will have the same drop percentages of ilvl gear (63,62,61). Monster power and magic find has further no affect on the distribution of ilvls past mp 1: the same percentage of 63 gear will drop in act 3 mp10 as act1 mp1. So now you can farm any act freely not worrying about losing out on drops because you're not in the final act. On top of that act 1 difficulty should also be equal to act 3 of the same monster power.
Click to expand...

Great, looks like act 1 on mp1 it is.

How stupid.
 
Breath_of_the_Dying said:
Yes with any monster power at 1 or more, all enemies are level 63. This means all inferno acts will have the same drop percentages of ilvl gear (63,62,61). Monster power and magic find has further no affect on the distribution of ilvls past mp 1: the same percentage of 63 gear will drop in act 3 mp10 as act1 mp1. So now you can farm any act freely not worrying about losing out on drops because you're not in the final act. On top of that act 1 difficulty should also be equal to act 3 of the same monster power.
Click to expand...

I don't know why they didn't just take a page out of D2's book and make a bunch of the caves/areas into higher mlvl areas where things were tougher, but better loot was possible (I.E. "The Pit" in Act 1) - and then litter them throughout all the acts. I don't really get why they took the one-size-fits-all approach to difficulty, but I guess there are a lot of design choices for D3 that I don't understand!
 
Because most gamers go with the flow so they don't have to make the correct choice; just what they like. If you think the choice is wrong you need to make a thread questioning the choices of the developer and countering those choices with your fully developed and explained ideas. Even if some drunk arse clutters the thread up the first post will make it to Blizzard's weekly meetings. I've made suggestions in the past and even though I didn't get a direct answer from Blizzard, magically my idea appeared in the game.

They do listen to their community but you have to explain exactly why something isn't fun and a well thought out solution.
 
big_aug said:
Great, looks like act 1 on mp1 it is.

How stupid.
Click to expand...

Not sure what the issue is, you can now choose to farm at any act you want at whatever difficulty you want. The game can be easier to complete for those who suck, are unlucky with gear, or refuse to use the AH, and the game can be harder for those who choose a greater challenge.

I'm guessing higher monster powers will also change the probability of higher tier rolls for affixes, but I have no proof. So at MP10 you're more likely to see more 70-80 resist all gear when you roll the RA affix. You can still get it at MP1 and even MP0, but you're less likely to roll those higher tier for each affix


Aix. said:
I don't know why they didn't just take a page out of D2's book and make a bunch of the caves/areas into higher mlvl areas where things were tougher, but better loot was possible (I.E. "The Pit" in Act 1) - and then litter them throughout all the acts. I don't really get why they took the one-size-fits-all approach to difficulty, but I guess there are a lot of design choices for D3 that I don't understand!
Click to expand...

If there was only one place that dropped the best stuff, people would just stick there. Before Cows got nerfed in D2, that was the only place I farmed. If I can clear the best loot drop location, whats the point in playing any other part of the game?
 
cageymaru said:
Because most gamers go with the flow so they don't have to make the correct choice; just what they like. If you think the choice is wrong you need to make a thread questioning the choices of the developer and countering those choices with your fully developed and explained ideas. Even if some drunk arse clutters the thread up the first post will make it to Blizzard's weekly meetings. I've made suggestions in the past and even though I didn't get a direct answer from Blizzard, magically my idea appeared in the game.

They do listen to their community but you have to explain exactly why something isn't fun and a well thought out solution.
Click to expand...

It's not like what I suggested is ground-breaking or clever; I just thought of Diablo 2 and identified something I thought was good. It's been pretty clear since launch that the devs are not willing to acknowledge that much was good from D2, only grudgingly adding things here and there. I mean, they had to release a major patch just to make Legendaries moderately interesting (woo! jack up the numbers!).

There have been many many many thorough, constructive posts on their forums regarding how to fix the game, but most of that shit falls on deaf ears. I see many of my own thoughts echoed almost daily on the official forums, quite honestly. Do I need to start the millionth thread asking for basic stuff like to be able to skip cutscenes or freely travel between acts without leaving my game? No, because they've designed the game a certain way (story mode-only, single-Act instances) and we're just not going to see it. I stopped bothering to post on the official forums a long time ago: all the information is already there for them, it's up to them to beg borrow and steal ideas enough to save their game now.

This monster power system is something new, but it also works with the original design - they're just allowing the players to scale the power for the Act to their liking, that's all. Now they're letting the players "double it" instead of making everybody deal with their ham-handed balancing efforts. Don't get me wrong, I started playing again with 1.0.4, and I think 1.0.5 will be good too, but my friends list is still pretty much empty and the game is still a botter's paradise more than anything else. Lots to do.
 
Breath_of_the_Dying said:
If there was only one place that dropped the best stuff, people would just stick there. Before Cows got nerfed in D2, that was the only place I farmed. If I can clear the best loot drop location, whats the point in playing any other part of the game?
Click to expand...

I didn't ask for only one place to drop the best loot, I was suggesting that sprinkling "harder" areas throughout all the acts would be a nice incentive for players to play all the acts. Of course, it works a bit better when you can make stops throughout all the Acts in a single game (because of Neph stacks and whatnot) instead of keeping all the Acts separate.
 
Eh, sounds neat in theory, but in practice, people will take the path of least resistance. This includes analyzing the closest spawn rates, checking/farming those areas, and leaving the game, rinse and repeat. A lot of suggestions I've been reading point to the desire for predictable (and thus efficient) repetition in some form.

It's the same problem Blizz has getting people to just farm the a whole act, though it's not too extreme. Alkaizer's exp farming route for example covers a sizable amount of Act 3 which is kind of what they want (I also noticed that the route is predictable enough to be farmed repeatedly without much downtime spent exploring).

If the good stuff was holed up in specific locations, people will just try to find the most efficient way to reach them, while effectively ignoring everything else. If these harder areas are too inconvenient to access for their worth, they will be ignored. Some nice farming spots are ignored right now like the Barracks in Act 3. The Vault of the Assassin in Act 2 would probably have been ignored if there wasn't a convenient checkpoint to start from. If they're too good to ignore or conveniently-placed, they'll most likely be farmed exclusively.
 
Yoshiyuki Blade said:
Eh, sounds neat in theory, but in practice, people will take the path of least resistance. This includes analyzing the closest spawn rates, checking/farming those areas, and leaving the game, rinse and repeat. A lot of suggestions I've been reading point to the desire for predictable (and thus efficient) repetition in some form.

It's the same problem Blizz has getting people to just farm the a whole act, though it's not too extreme. Alkaizer's exp farming route for example covers a sizable amount of Act 3 which is kind of what they want (I also noticed that the route is predictable enough to be farmed repeatedly without much downtime spent exploring).
Click to expand...

What's wrong with efficiency? Nephalem Valor stacks were added to combat a couple of things: one of them was high game creation rates. Adding in some "tough" spots in "easier" Acts shouldn't really change as long as NV stacks were required and they weren't stupid enough to make it a Pindleskin-like easy-access route.

But that suggestion was meant for the game in the pre-1.0.5 state, not to go along with the Monster Power system (which is their solution to having no reason to farm A1/A2 once you out-gear it).

Yoshiyuki Blade said:
If the good stuff was holed up in specific locations, people will just try to find the most efficient way to reach them, while effectively ignoring everything else. If these harder areas are too inconvenient to access for their worth, they will be ignored. Some nice farming spots are ignored right now like the Barracks in Act 3. The Vault of the Assassin in Act 2 would probably have been ignored if there wasn't a convenient checkpoint to start from. If they're too good to ignore or conveniently-placed, they'll most likely be farmed exclusively.
Click to expand...

It's not about having the good stuff exclusively dropping in one spot, it's about giving higher-geared players a reason to jump into Act 1 or 2...which as I said, only really works when a player isn't confined to a single act per game created. The point would be to have spots in Act 1 that would be equal to A3/A4 in toughness and loot reward. Players would still need to get their 5 NV stacks and it would give them a reason to travel to an earlier act and hit a few tougher spots.
 
Yoshiyuki Blade said:
Alkaizer's exp farming route for example covers a sizable amount of Act 3 which is kind of what they want (I also noticed that the route is predictable enough to be farmed repeatedly without much downtime spent exploring).
Click to expand...

Exactly what he did was go to the zones that have a predetermined layout, not a random one for the most part.
 
butterfliesrpretty said:
I thought for sure they said that higher difficulties will drp better loot at work right now but will check on it later
Click to expand...

This is a blue response

Does this mean that items from monsters from act 1 inferno (monster ilvl 61) will roll stats = ilvl 61 even if the item is ilvl63 or 62 or 58 or...
On the PTR currently, an item's level will determine its base DPS and armor stats, and the monster's level will determine the level of the affixes that roll on the item. There is an exception to this, though:
Click to expand...

So higher monster power will over time give better loot because the affixes will roll higher more of the time. This doesnt mean you wont get crap, you can still roll a socket/arcane resistance/pickup radius ring. When you do roll something like Main stat/Mainstat+vit/Avg dmg/Crit/CritDmg/IAS affixes, at MP10, you're very likely to have near perfect rolls (meaning top tier) on every affix you do roll on.

I believe most affixes have something like 8-10 tiers of rolls, so for example all resist could be something like (arbitrarily made for examples sake)
Tier 1: 20-30
Teir 2: 30-40
Tier 3: 40-50
Tier 4: 50-55
Tier 5: 55-60
Tier 6: 60-65
Tier 7; 65-70
Tier 8: 70-75
Tier 9: 75-80

At lower monster levels, and most likely how its on live right now, the chance of rolling each higher tier is less, its not an even distribution. The way the blue responses are going, it seems like monster powers will shift that tier distribution in favor of higher tiers.

This would be similar philosophy to how Act 1, and Act 2 work with ilvl 63 on live. You always have a shot at the higher ilvls in Act1 and 2, but if you can make it through act 3, your odds of getting ilvl 63 items goes up, and thus over time your chances at better loot go up. Good loot still isnt guaranteed though, even at the best Monster power, a bad legendary roll could still turn out to be crap because you didnt roll the right affixes and end up with something like pickup radius.

Still though, killing efficiency matters, if it takes an hour to down each elite, you're not farming in the right areas, its still better to have many rares to roll on, than just a few at higher monster powers. It's all dependent on your gear and play style, so there is no universal "most efficient Monster power"

Also, according to that response, all armor is worth picking up again starting at monster power 1. If affix is based on the monster power, that means that even the lvl 58 boots that drop can roll the best affix tiers, the only disadvantage is that you lose out on some armor.
 
Yoshiyuki Blade said:
Still haven't had the chance to hop onto the PTR yet. It still disconnects me the moment I enter the character creation screen. Has anyone experienced something like this?
Click to expand...

Yeah I have been having this issue also, seems like a lot of people have. I found some threads on reddit giving some weird/random fixes but I still haven't gotten in. Did you do anything special to get in? Or did you just keep trying? All I've done so far is reinstalled the client. I'm not even sure I'll bother anymore unless someone has a good fix.
 
Rdzona said:
Yeah I have been having this issue also, seems like a lot of people have. I found some threads on reddit giving some weird/random fixes but I still haven't gotten in. Did you do anything special to get in? Or did you just keep trying? All I've done so far is reinstalled the client. I'm not even sure I'll bother anymore unless someone has a good fix.
Click to expand...

just keep trying
 
Not that I'm aware of. Anyway, the solution I used to get in was the changing the language one. I switched to French, let the launcher download enough data to make the game playable, and then I was able to log in. From there I played a bit, but eventually changed back to English and it still worked fine. I was getting kicked regularly last night though, so idk if another issue cropped up.

Aix. said:
What's wrong with efficiency? Nephalem Valor stacks were added to combat a couple of things: one of them was high game creation rates. Adding in some "tough" spots in "easier" Acts shouldn't really change as long as NV stacks were required and they weren't stupid enough to make it a Pindleskin-like easy-access route.

But that suggestion was meant for the game in the pre-1.0.5 state, not to go along with the Monster Power system (which is their solution to having no reason to farm A1/A2 once you out-gear it).
Click to expand...

Nothing wrong at all, but the trend has always been about finding the most predictable and consistent spots to farm. It's kind of a funny predicament since people generally claim to hate boring repetition, but look for it to maximize efficiency. It's a problem by design I guess. A proper solution would be well beyond the scope of the game's current state IMO. I haven't even begun to think of one.

Aix. said:
It's not about having the good stuff exclusively dropping in one spot, it's about giving higher-geared players a reason to jump into Act 1 or 2...which as I said, only really works when a player isn't confined to a single act per game created. The point would be to have spots in Act 1 that would be equal to A3/A4 in toughness and loot reward. Players would still need to get their 5 NV stacks and it would give them a reason to travel to an earlier act and hit a few tougher spots.
Click to expand...

From my perspective, having the reason to jump into 1/2 for specific farming hotspots kind of defeats the purpose of going to 1/2 in the first place, except for a change in tilesets I guess? People want to go back there right now because they like the designs of the acts themselves, not because there are potential "bonus caves" to farm. It's hard to toss in little bonus zones without having people end up skipping over everything to access them. Resplendent chests were in the same boat. Most of them are at least 1 level deep into a zone (and often those zones are separate from the story progression path), yet they were still farmed to the point of being nerfed.
 
Last edited:
A better idea to avoid skipping lots of areas and farm specific spots is to have access to those best drop spots locked with a key and hide it in a single monster hidden in the whole act. The drop of the key is guaranteed but you don't know if it is the first monster you encounter or the last one before the boss. This would force to clear many areas and if you happen to find the key, you still need to find where the key belong if you didn't find the locked area.
 
Yeah I can't help but think that a good solution would have to be objective-based, meaning that they are reasonably predictable but unaccessible unless you meet certain conditions. Randomly generated things, that are too random, generally lead to player frustration. The item system is pretty much the textbook example of people hating pure RNG. But objective-based systems seem much much more exciting. The new Hellfire Ring is a good implementation for this. It has some RNG to it, but the rewards are mostly knowable and you can foresee your next roll by acquiring more keys, infernal machines and parts. The RNG for the components aren't too horrendous either. I was farming keys on the PTR and acquired 2/3 before I was disconnected.
 
Best way to avoid skipping parts of the map would be to have designed randomized maps, better map design, and better monster placement.

I don't have too many complaints about D3....but this is one of them. If Toe Jam and Earl on on the Sega Geneses can manage randomized maps......I think D3 could of done so too.
 
Yoshiyuki Blade said:
Yeah I can't help but think that a good solution would have to be objective-based, meaning that they are reasonably predictable but unaccessible unless you meet certain conditions. Randomly generated things, that are too random, generally lead to player frustration. The item system is pretty much the textbook example of people hating pure RNG. But objective-based systems seem much much more exciting. The new Hellfire Ring is a good implementation for this. It has some RNG to it, but the rewards are mostly knowable and you can foresee your next roll by acquiring more keys, infernal machines and parts. The RNG for the components aren't too horrendous either. I was farming keys on the PTR and acquired 2/3 before I was disconnected.
Click to expand...

Yeah I'm pretty stoked about the ubers and hellfire ring. Although once I build a good one for my main and alt what will be the point to farming them. From the streams I was watching, the loot wasn't all that great for the time they invested at MP 9&10. I feel like there should be a good chance at a legendary. Something to make farming them over and over advantageous.

Also, I would be interested in getting a good group of 3 to play with when this goes live. 90K WW barb here and I am usually on in the evenings us eastern time. Anyone interested let me know.
 
Got this and I'm wondering how much it could be worth... Can't really find similar Amulet on the AH.

Senechal Grinder:
+13 Max Damage
+250 STR
+64 INT
60% crit damage
Health globde + 5116
 
chairshotmyu said:
Got this and I'm wondering how much it could be worth... Can't really find similar Amulet on the AH.

Senechal Grinder:
+13 Max Damage
+250 STR
+64 INT
60% crit damage
Health globde + 5116
Click to expand...

Really needs crit chance to be honest. Crit chance > crit damage
But nice rolls on the str and crit damage.

Also if what they are saying about 1.05 is true, everyone will want new rings and ammys after the patch anyways making your find essentially obselete already.
 
When does 1.05 become official? I don't want to download the separate client just to try out the new features...
 
yeah PTR suddenly just let me in last night, can handle up to MP10 running CM Wiz with WW - because of new CC behaviour and high mob health it's back to permanent freeze on mobs - but taking 20 minutes to kill one elite pack isn't viable :) MP5 will be OK though. You can be far less defensive with lower monster damage making this patch quite fun, tried a few other builds and there is definetly room for more diversity. Looking forward to 1.0.5 as exp to paragon levels is super-charged :)
 
Hmm, it seems that the drop rates of the organs (from uber bosses) themselves are subject to the same rates as the keys, which increase by MP level. This makes the "quest" for the ring much more time consuming at lower MP levels. They say it scales up to 100% at MP10, so I'm assuming the drop rate increases by 10% per level. I farmed the keys at MP2, which was a reasonable rate if it was 20%, but I did not get the organ from the uber boss fight. Compounding potential failed drops from uber bosses, plus the fact that the portals open randomly, will make things very tough at low MP levels. You are also required to stack 5 NV before killing key wardens and uber bosses for a chance at their components in the first place. The overall RNG involved *might* be a bit much, but we are talking about a legendary ring after all. Still, getting 3-4 good rolls on it will take a while for many. I've only attempted 1 of the 3 boss fights and it was pretty doable at MP2, but I haven't tried the other fights as of yet.
 
chairshotmyu said:
Got this and I'm wondering how much it could be worth... Can't really find similar Amulet on the AH.

Senechal Grinder:
+13 Max Damage
+250 STR
+64 INT
60% crit damage
Health globde + 5116
Click to expand...
I think you are searching too many stats. To me the only stuff that really matters on that is the Str and CD. There is one slightly better for 450k on the AH.
 
KaptainKhaos said:
yeah PTR suddenly just let me in last night, can handle up to MP10 running CM Wiz with WW - because of new CC behaviour and high mob health it's back to permanent freeze on mobs - but taking 20 minutes to kill one elite pack isn't viable :) MP5 will be OK though. You can be far less defensive with lower monster damage making this patch quite fun, tried a few other builds and there is definetly room for more diversity. Looking forward to 1.0.5 as exp to paragon levels is super-charged :)
Click to expand...

Lots of people testing out certain efficiencies and from the sounds of it, because monster hp scales up so much faster it actually becomes very inefficient very fast. Damage vs HP is actaully 1:10 ratio. So its hard to just throw out 1 MP level fits all kind of statement because everyone is geared differently, but basically as soon as you stop one shotting white trash mobs, its probably going to become inefficient to farm at any higher level. At least thats what I got out of it.
Here's an example of what I'm talking about, seems like he did a decent analysis, again I think it ultimately boils down to gear, but even if you have godly gear, the sheer hp of monsters at MP10 will probably never make it worthwhile.

http://www.reddit.com/r/Diablo/comments/10hbf7/in_depth_monster_power_analysis_with/


dalamchops said:
there's a new exploit allowing dual wielding of 2handers :) have fun!
Click to expand...

Yeah this is all over reddit also. Likely that its nothing new, probably just now leaked, but I would of imagined that this could've been happening the whole time. Likely to be hotfixed very quickly now I assume.
 
Yoshiyuki Blade said:
Hmm, it seems that the drop rates of the organs (from uber bosses) themselves are subject to the same rates as the keys, which increase by MP level. This makes the "quest" for the ring much more time consuming at lower MP levels. They say it scales up to 100% at MP10, so I'm assuming the drop rate increases by 10% per level. I farmed the keys at MP2, which was a reasonable rate if it was 20%, but I did not get the organ from the uber boss fight. Compounding potential failed drops from uber bosses, plus the fact that the portals open randomly, will make things very tough at low MP levels. You are also required to stack 5 NV before killing key wardens and uber bosses for a chance at their components in the first place. The overall RNG involved *might* be a bit much, but we are talking about a legendary ring after all. Still, getting 3-4 good rolls on it will take a while for many. I've only attempted 1 of the 3 boss fights and it was pretty doable at MP2, but I haven't tried the other fights as of yet.
Click to expand...


Yeah this seems to be the word. Guaranteed drop at 5NV and MP10. And decreasing 10% per MP level seems like a logical estimation.
Check out this roll, imagine if that LoH was crit damage. :eek:
And I've seen some crafted that went as high as 6% crit chance, these things can be pretty godly to say the least. And no level requirement, imagine slapping this on a new char lol.

http://i.imgur.com/hw3Hk.jpg
 
Rdzona said:
Yeah this seems to be the word. Guaranteed drop at 5NV and MP10. And decreasing 10% per MP level seems like a logical estimation.
Check out this roll, imagine if that LoH was crit damage. :eek:
And I've seen some crafted that went as high as 6% crit chance, these things can be pretty godly to say the least. And no level requirement, imagine slapping this on a new char lol.

http://i.imgur.com/hw3Hk.jpg
Click to expand...

If drop rates are 10% per key wardens and über boss, this is the average number of key warden kills needed to get enough keys to get enough infernal machines to kill enough über bosses to get all 3 ring piece drops.

Mp10: 9 key warden kills
9: 11.1 key warden kills
8: 14 key warden kills
7: 18 key warden kills
6: 25 key warden kills
5: 36 kills
4: 56 kills
3: 100 kills
2: 225 kills
1: 900 kills

It goes up exponentially because of the double dip of drop rates: the key itself, then the ring crafting mat, assuming you don't get the same part twice
 
Any point to using a character in this Test program if the money/exp/items don't carry over to the regular game?
 
Khaydarin said:
Any point to using a character in this Test program if the money/exp/items don't carry over to the regular game?
Click to expand...


To get a feel for upcoming changes and to provide feedback on the upcoming changes. If you dont want a headstart in finding where you would best fit in monster power, then no.
 
Looked at the Price per million last night at it was at .64 per million on auction house and .55 from gold botters. 3 weeks ago it was something like 1.25 and 1.00. Pretty soon gold botters may be out of a job.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top