the court is still in the dark ages
![[H]ard|Forum](/styles/hardforum/xenforo/logo_dark.png){kind=logo}
Apple vs. Samsung Jury Has Reached A Verdict
- Thread starter HardOCP News
- Start date
the court is still in the dark ages
heatlesssun
Extremely [H]
- Joined
- Nov 5, 2005
- Messages
- 44,154
Yeah, kind of odd to hear comments like the ones that you responded to. The Metro UI has generally been pretty well regarded on Windows Phones. I know that people will point to the low sales of Windows Phones as an indication of the dislike of Metro but I think the sales problems of Windows Phones are rooted in many issues that have nothing to do with Metro. Steve Wozniak has actually give pretty high praise to Metro on Windows Phone and has even been pretty upbeat about Windows 8.
It is interesting though that the white space on the right of the Windows Phone home screen has been removed in 7.8/8 and there's been a number of complaints about it. I sort of like that space as I think it makes thumb control easier.
But I do wonder if this ruling will help Microsoft and Windows Phones. Really the only other company that's making money on smart phone hardware besides Apple is Samsung and if Apple can sustain the essence of this ruling throughout the appeals process I'd have to think that Apple is going to go after other folks, who don't have the pockets to fight this out in court.
DejaWiz
Fully [H]
- Joined
- Apr 15, 2005
- Messages
- 21,824
Yes, because the burglar that sued the homeowner for breaking a leg while stealing stuff was in the right.
Or the lady that sued McDonald's for burning herself with the hot coffee she was served was in the right.
Or the illegal alien with a stolen SSN that got to keep half of the rightful SSN owners 401K was in the right.
Sorry, but our court system is part of our government and is just as susceptible to corruption and stupidity as the rest of it.
Unknown-One
[H]F Junkie
- Joined
- Mar 5, 2005
- Messages
- 8,909
Well, Samsung picked Android for two reasons initially. First, It was free. Second, they could customize it like crazy and basically make "their own" smartphone OS out of it.
The more they have to spend on licensing / court fees, the more that first reason erodes. That makes Windows Phone attractive from a financial and legal standpoint. Microsoft has all the patent and licensing issues handled on their end, after all.
"Windows Phone" is one thing, though. The OS is the same no matter what phone you buy it on (extras produced by the OEM / carrier aside). Samsung would lose their ability to make "their own" smartphone OS. They'd have to differentiate on hardware and 1st-party OEM apps alone.
"Their Own" OS Touchwiz though is not liked by many, and played a large part in this verdict.
Will be interesting to see what happens a few months down the line.
Thing is... you don't want Samsung's support. Their TouchWiz version of ICS is a cluster*cuss*.
Unknown-One
[H]F Junkie
- Joined
- Mar 5, 2005
- Messages
- 8,909
True enough, the designs they want to use got them in trouble.
So if Android now costs them money, and they can't customize it the way they want (without being sued)... not much reason to stay loyal to Android in the long run.
Short-term, Android-based phones are still making them mountains of money. There's no way they're going to go all-in on Windows Phone like Nokia did. Samsung is going to have to mull it over a while ant test the waters.
Seeing as how their hardware looks like ass, and touchwiz is a copy of iOS. I'm not so certain they could differentiate themselves without copying. Look at HTC One X, that is a phone done right IMO without looking like an iPhone at all. Yes, sense sucks.. but the actual phone itself looks very well made.
heatlesssun
Extremely [H]
- Joined
- Nov 5, 2005
- Messages
- 44,154
I get called a Microsoft fanboy a lot around here but I have to admit that this looks like a protection racket between Apple and Microsoft. But this is Apple's game and I think Microsoft is playing this pretty smartly for the legal and business standpoint even though I do think that ultimately its bad for choice and consumers.
But if Apple is going to go around doing suing the bejesus out of Android device makers if you're Microsoft you really don't want to get into that fight when you're weak in the mobile market.
I love the look of Sense, but I have yet to use it. Is it really that bad? I've played around with my friends' HTC Evo back in the day and it was pretty nice, but I didn't have too much hands on time.
HTC actually tries to look unique, they need to be commended instead of following the iOS route.
I dont think it's that bad or bad at all I wrote I prefer it
I'm on jelly bean currently because I'm a flashaholic but as soon as there's a sense based jelly bean release I'll be all over that!
my htc one S is the best phone that I've ever owned. I get days of battery life with it too (with about an hour talk, hour browsing, and 40 hours of standby I get down to about 30%)
Godmachine
[H]F Junkie
- Joined
- Apr 7, 2003
- Messages
- 10,472
The question I have is will this effect the Galaxy Nexus and its support? I'm buying it next week but I really don't wish to purchase something that maybe taken off the market right afterwards ..
Or does this only effect the actually software? I'm still not getting a clear response to this after reading the reactions and or articles on the matter.
Or does this only effect the actually software? I'm still not getting a clear response to this after reading the reactions and or articles on the matter.
I dont think it's that bad or bad at all I wrote I prefer it
I'm on jelly bean currently because I'm a flashaholic but as soon as there's a sense based jelly bean release I'll be all over that!
my htc one S is the best phone that I've ever owned. I get days of battery life with it too (with about an hour talk, hour browsing, and 40 hours of standby I get down to about 30%)
Good to hear. I actually heard rumors that HTC is coming out with a One X+ and it will be Quad core, 2gb ram, LTE and the works.. that sounds pretty awesome... not sure if its true or not but it was supposed to come out this year sometime. The handset itself looks HOT!
Vermillion
Supreme [H]ardness
- Joined
- Apr 5, 2007
- Messages
- 4,416
I don't mind the new Sense 4. Sense 3.x all suck IMO. Too bloated and laggy. I still much prefer Stock Android over an OEM skin, but Sense 4 is done fairly well. I like the Motorola Blur on Droid RAZR. It's just enough to differentiate, but not enough to erase the Stock Android feel. TouchWiz has always sucked.
D
Deleted member 136890
Guest
the judge has proven ties to Apple as she used to work for the same law firm that handles all of crApple's BS patent lawsuits before she became a US District judge
robble
Supreme [H]ardness
- Joined
- Jun 6, 2004
- Messages
- 6,493
Link? sounds like a conflict of interest.
kbrickley
Supreme [H]ardness
- Joined
- May 13, 2012
- Messages
- 7,514
Android isn't free to any of the major licensees as Google violated Microsoft patents and all of the major companies, except for Google and Motorola have settled their lawsuits with MS and pay MS a license fee on Android. Google has pretty much left their OEM partners out to dry in all these lawsuits. They would do much better with MS since MS would support them and would be better for the consumer also since they are not trying to make all their money from advertising. And I think the desire to differentiate the hardware since all the software would be identical would be good for the market and the consumer
even if true there aren't a whole lot of attorneys that are qualified to handle these cases that haven't worked with the firms that have the tech companies as clients. if judges that didn't know anything about IP law and patent claims were sitting on these cases the forums would be in an uproar about that.
heatlesssun
Extremely [H]
- Joined
- Nov 5, 2005
- Messages
- 44,154
Surely Samsung would have known this and asked for her recusal if they thought there was a problem. Perhaps they may even use this in their appeal if its true. The legal system works in mysterious ways.
2 thoughts: jury selection and appeals process. Sorry, this is the game.
DejaWiz
Fully [H]
- Joined
- Apr 15, 2005
- Messages
- 21,824
You're absolutely right. It is a game. Nothing more to Apple. They feel they can patent the way a damn phone looks, and the judicial system is letting them get away with it. Never once have we heard about a court case over legitimate dinner plates, cars, televisions, houses, clothing, etc based on their basic appearance and functionality. These lawsuits are complete bullshit. Apple knows this. The companies they continuously sue know this. And the courts know this. The only effects these lawsuits have in the long run are higher priced goods and services for the consumers...the billions of dollars in court costs and fines has to come, and be made up for, from customers pocket books.
Guilty as charged...You're a complete dummy if you can't see that Samsung modeled it's early galaxy line from the first iphone.
People who love to hate on Apple would love to disagree.
one which they have clearly abused
Guilty as charged...You're a complete dummy if you can't see that Samsung modeled it's early galaxy line from the first iphone.
Apple cannot invent or author anything because they are a corporation, not a person. People author and people create; corporations do neither regardless of what the Supreme Clown Court and Bozo the Scalia says.
"Rounded corners" is neither a discovery nor does it have anything to do with science or being "useful".
For that matter, copyright on anything other than writings by authors is also unconstitutional. I do not see anything about copyright on pictures, music, or artwork.
defiant007
2[H]4U
- Joined
- Feb 27, 2006
- Messages
- 3,497
You never having heard of something doesn't mean it doesn't happen. I have posted several links to past and recent lawsuits over tires, cars, clothing, shoes, televisions etc but for whatever reasons the same group of people regularly repeat incorrect statement as fact.
You could try google or whatever it doesn't really matter but certainly there's a reason you wouldn't hear about those cases if you mainly get your news from the front pages of [H]ardforums.
heatlesssun
Extremely [H]
- Joined
- Nov 5, 2005
- Messages
- 44,154
Guilty as charged...You're a complete dummy if you can't see that Samsung modeled it's early galaxy line from the first iphone.
I don't think the real question is if Samsung cloned Apple devices, it's beyond clear that they did and that's why Samsung lost this round. The question is are Apple's designs original works or not. That's a much more complex question and I think that as this thing works its way through the appeals process that Apple will probably not be able to demonstrate that to any conclusive end and Samsung will probably after a billion in legal fees be fined a $1.
Samsung will be fine. But almost no other Android device maker at this point can afford this legal process and I think that's all Apple is trying to do, is to get people to join the protection racket. And the fact that Microsoft with all of it's bullying and power bought into this coupled with this Apple victory indeed bodes well for Apple.
The jury foreman was a patent troll. If that isn't a blatant conflict of interest, I don't know what is.
Even if the 9th circus doesn't overturn the verdict, the Supreme Clown Court will just to spite the liberals in the 9th circus.
After reading the Groklaw article, I've come to the conclusion that both Judge Bonbon the Clown and Apple's shysters need to be disbarred.
A juror even admitted that they "knew the first day that Samsung had wronged Apple". The foreman was a patent troll. The jury somehow had a verdict before the jury instructions and it took the lawyers days to figure out what the jury instructions meant.
Apple should also be prosecuted under RICO because they essentially run a protection racket now.
This is a flimflam and a scam by a bunch of professional tyrants.
A juror even admitted that they "knew the first day that Samsung had wronged Apple". The foreman was a patent troll. The jury somehow had a verdict before the jury instructions and it took the lawyers days to figure out what the jury instructions meant.
Apple should also be prosecuted under RICO because they essentially run a protection racket now.
This is a flimflam and a scam by a bunch of professional tyrants.
Gorankar
[H]F Junkie
- Joined
- Jul 19, 2000
- Messages
- 11,107
You convinced me, I will make it a point to use neither iOS or Win mobile products.
Maplehamwich
[H]ard|Gawd
- Joined
- Aug 14, 2011
- Messages
- 1,539
Yep, still true, despite the continued bickering in this thread. This lawsuit is dumb.Here's the simplicity of this case. Apple wants control of the smartphone market. This lawsuit was a way to do that. This is bad for everyone.
Here is an example of how stupid this case is.
Competition is good for everyone. Apple just doesn't want competition.
no it's not still true. all of those companies pay one another for using their respective technology in their products. And when they don't, like he link I posted earlier about the current Nike v. Adidas/Reebok suit, or the cases from a few years ago when Nike sued Adidas over arch supports (read any of nike's "dumb" patents of arch support for kicks if you want to rail against ridiculous patents) or Adidas sued Nike over stripes on their clothing, they sue one another.
Rounded corners aren't a technology.
which patent are you referring to, specifically?
here is a list of them from the verdict
http://news.cnet.com/8301-13579_3-57500273-37/apple-v-samsung-the-infringing-device-scorecard/
find the one you think covers "rounded corners" from the patent office website so I can refer what you're talking about
here is a list of them from the verdict
http://news.cnet.com/8301-13579_3-57500273-37/apple-v-samsung-the-infringing-device-scorecard/
find the one you think covers "rounded corners" from the patent office website so I can refer what you're talking about
I think you would benefit from reading Nicholas Godici's explanation about design vs. ornamental patents. He was Samsung's expert witness and a patent examiner with over 39 years of patent experience:
http://docs.justia.com/cases/federa...5:2011cv01846/239768/940/10.pdf?ts=1337348061
http://docs.justia.com/cases/federa...5:2011cv01846/239768/940/10.pdf?ts=1337348061
http://www.scribd.com/doc/53425869/Electronic-device-US-patent-D618677
Only been linked in the thread a few times now.