Problems with purchaser cyberkost

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w00tMkay

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Hello, I wanted to post to get outside opinion on a motherboard and processor I sold to cyberkost. Here we go.

I sold a Biostar TZ77XE4 and a Intel G630 to cyberkost, which were both pulled from a working configuration, and left my place in pristine condition.
Cyberkost received the board with 1 minor bent pin, and 2 foam pads on the back of the socket (protectors for closed loop water cooler mount).

I was told that somehow 2 foam blocks detracted from the value of the board, which i thought was silly, however since there was a minor bent pin on the board,
I offered a refund (reluctantly) provided that he sends back the board in the same manner i shipped it to him. I personally have never had a problem with anything here,
I shipped the board in the retail package with the socket cover properly in place, packaged in a newegg box with proper packing material.

Is it unreasonable to expect if I paid to ship the product to him, he pay for shipping for the return? I know for a fact that both parts left my house un damaged, and somehow
with a socket protector on arrived to him with 1 minor bent pin (I doubt a pin could be bent through the socket cover, whether or not it was because of shipping, I'm doubtful).

This is the picture that was sent to me. Quite frankly all it looks like is one of the pins is slightly pushed and could be EASILY placed back into place.

https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-4o-_cCPScc4/UBIBNwGV10I/AAAAAAAAKr0/WrmwiGiqh5k/s0/SDC12241a.JPG
https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/-MIVN5zitiQY/UBCpfw3uuOI/AAAAAAAAKrQ/Mj6iW5xrq1w/s800/SDC12242.JPG
https://lh5.googleusercontent.com/-m81E_ZxNT8A/UBIBNiuMubI/AAAAAAAAKr0/T22MFCf2CIA/s0/SDC12240a.JPG

Again. I offered a refund, but I don't think its fair for me to be out 2 shipping charges, would it not be fair if we each were equally responsible for shipping?
 
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it's a touchy issue, i have encountered this issue before as a seller of course you don't want to be out of shipping again and you would expect the buyer to pay the shipping cost back; however, the buyer would disagree because he would be out of money for no reason. I resolve the issue by offer to split the cost of the return shipping that way he won't be out too much money on shipping it back and likewise for me.
 
Buyer always pay return shipping, unless you packed the stuff like crap. Your not amazon or some big company that can eat the lost. That is the risk you take buying from here.

If you honestly packed good, I would not cover the return shipping.
 
I would not cover return shipping either,unless the package was completely destroyed in shipping and the contents were damaged.

If he bought it new and had to RMA they would also have him pay for the shipping the item back,why should this be any different?

edit*after reading the other thread,it seems this is not so cut and dry,the item was sold with a minor discrepancy,the foam on the back would not really be much of an issue to me if I was the buyer,but it was obviously not described and the buyer is not happy with it.Having gotten both sides of the story I would be inclined to pay the shipping back.If I had sold and Item that I did not describe accurately I would assume full responsibility for that.
 
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as a seller, you should have paid for insurance. At which case, they will reimburse you for the entire thing.

The excuse that "this isn't some big company..." is not an acceptable excuse. If selling a good product and giving garbage service is an expectation, then I can assure you nobody would do it. how many times do we excuse people for lack of communication? can we excuse the lack of communication because they person is busy with real life? And since, "this isn't some big company...." you don't have a call center staff to communicate with the customer?

We rarely excuse that, because if you have time to sell then you have time to respond to inquiries.

Now if you make the sale, then you are responsible for making sure it arrives to the buyer. Now I'm not saying you didn't package it well, nor did you fail to do your part to make sure it arrived as promised. But until it is at their hands, you are responsible for that item... no ands ifs or buts.
 
Just to clarify, we're not talking about in-transit damage. The board had two things (the foam on the back and an "interestingly looking pin") that I believe were known to the seller and as such should have been present in the description of the item. They were not and this leads me to interpreting the situation as "item not as described". There were a couple of other things (Exhibit A and Exhibit B in the thread I started on this: http://hardforum.com/showthread.php?t=1707681) that compounding with "item not as described" brought this to the worst of 640+ trades I was a party to.
 
cyberkost said:
Just to clarify, we're not talking about in-transit damage. The board had two things (the foam on the back and an "interestingly looking pin") that I believe were known to the seller and as such should have been present in the description of the item. They were not and this leads me to interpreting the situation as "item not as described". There were a couple of other things (Exhibit A and Exhibit B in the thread I started on this: http://hardforum.com/showthread.php?t=1707681) that compounding with "item not as described" brought this to the worst of 640+ trades I was a party to.
Click to expand...

This is a misrepresentation of what I JUST said in my post. All of the pins in the socket were flawless leaving my home, a socket protector was on it when it arrived. I'm willing to work with you, but don't put words in my mouth. I'm willing to split the shipping for the return out of fairness but not the full amount.
 
w00tMkay said:
This is a misrepresentation of what I JUST said in my post. All of the pins in the socket were flawless leaving my home, a socket protector was on it when it arrived. I'm willing to work with you, but don't put words in my mouth. I'm willing to split the shipping for the return out of fairness but not the full amount.
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@w00tMkay
I not sure which words I have misrepresented. I tend to preface things that I cannot reliably prove with "I think" and "I believe".

Now, in our PM exchange you mentioned that you knew about foam on the back and just did not think it was an issue for me. Well .. it was and is.

You have also suggested in your last PM and implicitly in the post above that *I* damaged the pin. I'm not sure how to react other than:
It would take some special skill, tools, time and determination to do something like this to the pin

(click for full size)
After having come from work (rather late, I must say) I was definitely not having time or determination .. My hypothesis is that it may have happened as thermal damage with high currents in the 5.1GHz overclock you mentioned .. but that's just a hypothesis.

I did lose quite a bit of trust in your statements after:
(A) you informed me that the package "went out" on 07/19, whereas the shipping label was only printed around 8:25pm (yes, PM) that day and the USPS has not accepted the package until 07/23
AND
(B) you used 2lb shipping label on 5lb+ package
 
w00tMkay said:
...
Is it unreasonable to expect if I paid to ship the product to him, he pay for shipping for the return?
Click to expand...

Well, here's a different take on this: we negotiated and agreed on $160 shipped. *I* paid $150 for the combo and *I* paid $10 for shipping. You then paid USPS $5.66 by misrepresenting the weight of the package (2lb, Priority Mail 48315 to 10512: http://postcalc.usps.com/MailServic...b=0&MailingDate=7/27/2012&MailingTime=8:00 AM) and pocketed the difference.
Is that not a valid perspective?
 
I guessed the weight of the package, USPS didn't seem to care as I dropped it off at a post office counter. All I am seeing here is measly ways you're trying to discredit me that have nothing to do with the motherboard or cpu. I offered you a refund, offered to split the shipping costs, this is more than required. Your perspective is not valid, the package was delivered in hand, to the post office clerk. The price was 160 shipped, nowhere did i specify any shipping amount, again, using large words and twisting the facts does nothing but make you look like a fool and manipulator.

You are welcome to open a paypal dispute in which you will be required to ship the items back for a refund, I'm trying to be reasonable but you obviously have some personal vendetta against me, This is my last response, your welcome to do what you need to.
 
cyberkost said:
Well, here's a different take on this: we negotiated and agreed on $160 shipped. *I* paid $150 for the combo and *I* paid $10 for shipping. You then paid USPS $5.66 by misrepresenting the weight of the package (2lb, Priority Mail 48315 to 10512: http://postcalc.usps.com/MailServic...b=0&MailingDate=7/27/2012&MailingTime=8:00 AM) and pocketed the difference.
Is that not a valid perspective?
Click to expand...

did you specifically agree on $150+$10 shipping or $160 for the combo out the door,if it was the former,then yes you have a valid point,if the later then no your point is not valid.
 
StewieTheGreat said:
did you specifically agree on $150+$10 shipping or $160 for the combo out the door,if it was the former,then yes you have a valid point,if the later then no your point is not valid.
Click to expand...

Please substantiate your judgement. We agreed on $160 shipped, not on $160 + free shipping as seem to be the interpretation you're taking.
 
I guess this is what happens when you are dealing with "crazy" people. what part of 160 Shipped do you not understand? I'm selling you the combo for 160 and taking a loss on the shipping, not giving you something for less.
 
cyberkost said:
After having come from work (rather late, I must say) I was definitely not having time or determination .. My hypothesis is that it may have happened as thermal damage with high currents in the 5.1GHz overclock you mentioned .. but that's just a hypothesis.

I did lose quite a bit of trust in your statements after:
(A) you informed me that the package "went out" on 07/19, whereas the shipping label was only printed around 8:25pm (yes, PM) that day and the USPS has not accepted the package until 07/23
AND
(B) you used 2lb shipping label on 5lb+ package
Click to expand...

1: I have never heard of or seen a single bent pin as a result of heat damage.

2: It is possible to print a label and drop the package off at USPS in the middle of the night, or to give it to someone at the counter and they let it sit before processing it. The 19th was a Thursday, it is possible that they did not scan the package on the Friday the 20th, USPS doesn't scan things in on Saturday or Sunday, Monday was the 23rd. The time story looks ok to me. It's unfortunate, but well within the window of understandable.

3: The underdeclared weight of the package is between the shipper and the carrier, not you. Bringing this up is picking at the little things, and is not becoming of a solid trader that I would want to do business with. Also, if you want to pick at the small things, be prepared for someone to point out the fact that you started your own thread one hour AFTER w00tMkay started his on this situation.
 
cyberkost said:
Please substantiate your judgement. We agreed on $160 shipped, not on $160 + free shipping as seem to be the interpretation you're taking.
Click to expand...

If you agreed on $160 shipped it should not matter how much he paid for the shipping since you agreed to a total price of $160 for the items,delivered to you.

Now if you agreed on $150 for the items + $10 for shipping then yes,he should have given you the difference for the shipping charge since you were specifically paying for items to be delivered to you separate of the agreed upon price for the items.

I was not taking sides I was asking you how the price was agreed upon and giving you my thoughts of how it should be viewed.
 
Man I think you guys should just split the shipping and get done with this matter. It's at most 10 dollars if you guys split the delivery fee. JEEZ LOUIE.
 
Is the motherboard working? If so, I tend to believe seller just overlooked the bent pin because it's hard to be damaged during shipping with a cover. It also explains why he claimed it to be in working condition.

For the shipping cost, since I do believe no party is trying to screw the other one, splitting the return cost sounds MORE than reasonable to me.
 
mhenley said:
1: I have never heard of or seen a single bent pin as a result of heat damage.

2: It is possible to print a label and drop the package off at USPS in the middle of the night, or to give it to someone at the counter and they let it sit before processing it. The 19th was a Thursday, it is possible that they did not scan the package on the Friday the 20th, USPS doesn't scan things in on Saturday or Sunday, Monday was the 23rd. The time story looks ok to me. It's unfortunate, but well within the window of understandable.
Click to expand...
Check my heat, you'll see that I've shipped about 600 packages .. all but one of them trough USPS, vast majority of them with tracking. It has been my experience with all of them that tracking says "acceptance" on the day USPS gets the package. USPS does process packages on Fri and Sat.

mhenley said:
3: The underdeclared weight of the package is between the shipper and the carrier, not you. Bringing this up is picking at the little things, and is not becoming of a solid trader that I would want to do business with. Also, if you want to pick at the small things, be prepared for someone to point out the fact that you started your own thread one hour AFTER w00tMkay started his on this situation.
Click to expand...
It may be between the seller and USPS, but it does detract from credibility of the seller, as is the story with the shipping, as is the fact the foam has never been mentioned .. and finally the flawed pin ... and as such IS material to discussion here.
 
kalvin37 said:
Is the motherboard working? If so, I tend to believe seller just overlooked the bent pin because it's hard to be damaged during shipping with a cover. It also explains why he claimed it to be in working condition.

For the shipping cost, since I do believe no party is trying to screw the other one, splitting the return cost sounds MORE than reasonable to me.
Click to expand...

And your comment on the foam glued to the back of the mobo?
 
kalvin37 said:
Is the motherboard working? If so, I tend to believe seller just overlooked the bent pin because it's hard to be damaged during shipping with a cover. It also explains why he claimed it to be in working condition.

For the shipping cost, since I do believe no party is trying to screw the other one, splitting the return cost sounds MORE than reasonable to me.
Click to expand...

I just received an ASUS P8Z77-I motherboard from a third party seller on Amazon and a couple of the pins were bent. There was even a cover which was suppose prevent the pins from bending. So to answer your question. Maybe, the manufacture accidentally bent it and overlooked it. Or it could have been bent during the third party's possession. Man, it could have been even USED and the seller was trying to cheat me. Who will ever know. But I sure as well didn't do it.
 
This is completely out of control, It's obvious that cyberkost does not want to be reasonable. I tryed
my damnist to be civilized but I guess you run into all sorts of people on the net.I've been receiving
pm's from people to the tone of "this guys crazy" to "don't cover return shipping, its not your
responsibility". In any case, 2 minor problems are being amplified to a crazy extent and there is
no convincing the purchaser otherwise.

1) The foam blocks are not glued to the back of the board, they are double sided taped in place for a
corsair h series/antec kuhler series cpu and affect the board in no way.

2) The bent pin was not bent leaving my home, I inspected the socket after i removed my cpu, and placed the
socket cover on the board.'

3) The shipping charges... again, the board was 160 shipped with the cpu, meaning you did not pay for
the shipping, so you should just be thankful i didnt send it first class mail, as you would not even have
the board in your possession yet, I went the extra mile and used priority mail.

4) My refund offer stands for today, If you are not willing to work with me, I'm just going to let paypal
handle this as they will make you pay shipping for you to get your return, if your silly enough to not
be reasonable and fair, I'm not wasting my time with this back and forth with you.
 
seller is, by far, in the right. the best i would do is a refund with the buyer paying full shipping and only issue the refund on confirmation that the items are returned exactly as they were originally sent and fully functional.
 
What have either of you accomplished now that you both have threads open?

If your goal was to publicly try and discredit each other, congrats..you both win....

seeing as how I dont see a majority opinion here,it seems like your both right and your both wrong... and both of these threads are now pointless.
 
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