160 Billion Planets in the Milky Way?

TheWeazmeister said:
From a mathematical perspective, intelligent life outside of ours (though some would debate said intelligence) is a virtual certainty.
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Considering there are approximately 125 billion galaxies in the universe, I'd be comfortable with that estimation.
 
It's possible there are other intelligent lifeforms out there and it's possible there are not. It's possible the Universe has always existed and it's possible "God" started everything . For that, nobody will ever know. So many unknowns here.
 
What makes any of you think that any intelligent life in the universe wants to communicate with you? What does the human race have to offer the universe? Humans are violent, intolerant of even minor differences in their own species, exploitative of every other species on the planet, and incapable of solving even the basic problems that have plagued mankind since the dawn of civilization. Anything given to the human race would be abused by the power hungry corrupt, and the human race has nothing to offer in return, so there's no reason for other forms of life to even want to talk to the earth, much less visit. In fact, it would be more likely that they would avoid sending any kind of signals this direction so as to not draw attention to themselves.
 
Lebowski said:
And something(one) had to create god.
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Ah, so you want to turn in into the "chicken or the egg" game.

Throw in this theory just for giggles:
jctusmc03 said:
The big bang theory states basically that everything that is came from an infinitely small, infinitely dense mass of "something" and gave birth to everything that is in all of space and time basically.
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If it was a "mass of something", where did that mass come from? To flip Lebowski's statement would say that it had to be created right?

let me know when scientists figure out how to create something out of nothing. With everything they have to work with (not starting with nothing), they still haven't been able to recreate the whole " random life from primordial ooze" thing in a controlled lab yet.
 
Phoenix333 said:
What makes any of you think that any intelligent life in the universe wants to communicate with you? What does the human race have to offer the universe? Humans are violent, intolerant of even minor differences in their own species, exploitative of every other species on the planet, and incapable of solving even the basic problems that have plagued mankind since the dawn of civilization. Anything given to the human race would be abused by the power hungry corrupt, and the human race has nothing to offer in return, so there's no reason for other forms of life to even want to talk to the earth, much less visit. In fact, it would be more likely that they would avoid sending any kind of signals this direction so as to not draw attention to themselves.
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That works both ways. If earths is used as an example. It's generally predatory species that are the most intelligent; because of the need to outsmart their prey. While there's no way to know for sure, based on what we know about evolution of species on earth, they're more likely than not, as or more bloodthirsty than we are as a species unless they've been around a lot longer, which is probable, and manages to breed those traits our of their species.
 
Aluisious said:
Please, we don't need obvious fallacy floating around here. What created god? Same question with a different name.
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Lebowski said:
And something(one) had to create god.
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Nope, no fallacy here.

If we take that the expansion of the Universe is correct, we can conclude that there was a point of creation (Big Bang). Something beyond our Universe, which we have absolutely zero knowledge of, created this world. Now, who's to say that our own set of rules govern this other world or Being? You can't say that. The whole concept of creation, beyond our world, might be completely different.

Again, you can't apply our own set of rules, which apply to this world, to something that we have absolutely zero knowledge of.
 
Isn't the current theory of universe-creation that two parallel universes collided, and the enormous energy input at the point of impact birthed this universe?
 
krogen said:
As for the mention of God, what does the Big Bang theory state? That there was a point of creation. Well, something must have spawned the point of creation, no? Think about it.
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Goty said:
No. Firstly, string theory is not a replacement for the big bang. Secondly, the big bang theory has made testable predictions, string theory has not.

Signed,
The Astrophysicist
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From my understanding, Big Bang is a theory of evolution. It doesn't say what bang or why bang. No one knows how the universe begin yet.

String theory is not a replacement for big bang of course as they are two very different thing. But its the best candidate currently available that may allow physicist to take the big bang theory further back where all 4 fundamental forces were united.

The current Standard Model is incomplete as it doesn't include gravity, and both quantum mechanics and general relativity doesn't work together, so in order to progress further back in time where all 4 fundamental forces were united, neither one of those two well establish theories works. Quantum mechanics have took us back to when electromagnetism and weak nuclear force were united as an electroweak force, and physicist believe if we look further back in time, electroweak and the strong nuclear force could be united, but that's where it ends. Quantum mechanics doesn't say anything about gravity.

As for God, who knows. I'm sure a scientist would be open to any possibilities including the work of a higher being if that's what took place at the beginning. But until something can be proven about how our universe begin, no one will know for sure.
 
krogen said:
we can conclude that there was a point of creation (Big Bang). Something beyond our Universe, which we have absolutely zero knowledge of, created this world.
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krogen said:
Again, you can't apply our own set of rules, which apply to this world, to something that we have absolutely zero knowledge of.
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Jesus Christ, buddy. Try thinking about your assumptions instead of just talking harder.
 
A hint: there is no reason a self-causing Universe is less likely than an eternal god creating the Universe. Either way you're stuck with an inscrutable starting condition. I'd rather take the simpler one that only requires something we already know exists.
 
The only thing that reminds me is that Human life have a deadline, if we cant advance past some problems and evolve as species we will perish.

We have only a fraction of time to enhance and travel to the beyond (stars), there our new chalenge will begin.

Actually, were fucked, i dont see we investing and researching enough resources (that arent eternal) for that.

I really think (but i hope not) that we will pass out, the earth will decay and nothing will be more than ash and dust.

Just like uncountables before and after us.
 
Unknown-One said:
Isn't the current theory of universe-creation that two parallel universes collided, and the enormous energy input at the point of impact birthed this universe?
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That's conjecture, that's known as brane cosmology - subset of M-theory. It's a interesting idea and works with other theories but doesn't have a whole ton of evidence.

Some physicists conjecture that when another membrane impacted our membrane the (consequential) transfer of matter and energy to our side at the point of contact (origin point of the big bang) was the impetus for the big bang to occur. The overriding opinion is that our universe cycles through big bangs and ours was not the first. The universe may at some point in time, for some reason, start contracting. The universe will continually contract until the outward force will eventually overcome the inward force and the big bang will occur again. Much the same way that a star exists as a constant battle between the energy release from fusion in the core pushing out (like an explosion) and the enormous gravity pulling the surface inward. Eventually the fuel for fusion runs out, the star contracts from very little force opposing gravity and becomes a dwarf star. The star stops contracting when the intermolecular forces find an equilibrium point where the outward force matches in inward pulling gravity. Contraction stops.
 
For the record, the current state of cosmology is that there will be no "big crunch." The universe is expanding and accelerating due to dark energy. Gravity will lose the battle.
 
Now if we can just put our differences aside and work toward some common goal of exploration (requiring some FTL form of travel) we'd be set. I feel the bickering of us over stupid shit ends up taking up way more resources than are really needed (think how efficient our government is at getting something done).

We have had civil wars over stuff as silly as the color of one's skin, or where one person was born, I feel the next big one will be over something equally as silly like whether we have a conservative or liberal view point.
 
sfsuphysics said:
Now if we can just put our differences aside and work toward some common goal of exploration (requiring some FTL form of travel) we'd be set. I feel the bickering of us over stupid shit ends up taking up way more resources than are really needed (think how efficient our government is at getting something done).

We have had civil wars over stuff as silly as the color of one's skin, or where one person was born, I feel the next big one will be over something equally as silly like whether we have a conservative or liberal view point.
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In other words, we need to evolve into true communism.
 
Phoenix333 said:
What makes any of you think that any intelligent life in the universe wants to communicate with you? What does the human race have to offer the universe? Humans are violent, intolerant of even minor differences in their own species, exploitative of every other species on the planet, and incapable of solving even the basic problems that have plagued mankind since the dawn of civilization. Anything given to the human race would be abused by the power hungry corrupt, and the human race has nothing to offer in return, so there's no reason for other forms of life to even want to talk to the earth, much less visit. In fact, it would be more likely that they would avoid sending any kind of signals this direction so as to not draw attention to themselves.
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All of what you say is true but, you left out the human ability to adapt and, have faith.
Sly said:
In other words, we need to evolve into true communism.
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If by that you mean enlightened self interest, you're correct. :D
 
Magnus said:
If by that you mean enlightened self interest, you're correct. :D
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Nope, i mean the mentality for the whole. Star Treks explanation of how man set aside their differences and set a unified goal for mankind is apparently because the human government shifted to Military Communism. Their entire mentality is about self sacrifice and dedication to their jobs no matter how menial. There is no concept of currency (except for trading with non-humans) and everyone gets treated equally regardless of status. In other words, mankind must blindly follow their leaders and lose the concept of ambition.

That's true communism. Unfortunately, humans are too selfish for it to actually work, so we resort to democracy and corporations.

Communism = Needs 100% (Face it. That's impossible)

Democracy = Only Needs 51% (49% can go to hell or will be dragging their feet)
 
Sly said:
Nope, i mean the mentality for the whole. Star Treks explanation of how man set aside their differences and set a unified goal for mankind is apparently because the human government shifted to Military Communism. Their entire mentality is about self sacrifice and dedication to their jobs no matter how menial. There is no concept of currency (except for trading with non-humans) and everyone gets treated equally regardless of status. In other words, mankind must blindly follow their leaders and lose the concept of ambition.

That's true communism. Unfortunately, humans are too selfish for it to actually work, so we resort to democracy and corporations.

Communism = Needs 100% (Face it. That's impossible)

Democracy = Only Needs 51% (49% can go to hell or will be dragging their feet)
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You do realize that Star Trek is fiction, right?
You also realize that there are more choices than Communism and Democracy, right?
 
Sly said:
Democracy = Only Needs 51% (49% can go to hell or will be dragging their feet)
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Eh, if it were only that simple, and without getting into all the corruption/lobbying/etc that goes on, 51% want one thing, i.e. they "hire" people to be public servants ... even though they often don't act like it, and 49% doesn't like it (or much higher/lower percentages), then they can protest, sue, filibuster, etc and prevent progress.

If we had a true democracy (almost as fairytale like as your true communism) then things probably would get done, even if some people don't like it. The "liberal" way would work, the "conservative" way would work, until most people thought it didn't and change their leaders. Unfortunately that doesn't happen either.

Maybe as a happy medium we can work towards a true democracy where "we the people" vote, and live with our choices knowing we have the ability to change them, rather than fighting tooth and nail to stall any sort of progress because your minority doesn't think that's the way things should be, so nothing ever gets done... but hey the new iPhone 11 is out and American Idol Survive Mega Challenge 8 is set to start!!!!
 
Magnus said:
You do realize that Star Trek is fiction, right?
You also realize that there are more choices than Communism and Democracy, right?
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Such as? Monarchy/Aristocracy is about tending to the needs of a handful (Only need 5% to make a decision), not the species as a whole. Communism is the only one i'm aware of where the requirement to succeed is that the people be in it 100% (unification of mankind).

And the fact that the ideal scenario is fiction is why it's not gonna work. The only way you'll get people into space with the current system is if there's a big paycheck at the end. You can see where Democracy got us so far, we got people on the moon and then... nothing... the R&D is being piecemealed to the corporations which are motivated by short term profit... which is barely anything.
 
Sly said:
Such as? Monarchy/Aristocracy is about tending to the needs of a handful (Only need 5% to make a decision), not the species as a whole. Communism is the only one i'm aware of where the requirement to succeed is that the people be in it 100% (unification of mankind).

And the fact that the ideal scenario is fiction is why it's not gonna work. The only way you'll get people into space with the current system is if there's a big paycheck at the end. You can see where Democracy got us so far, we got people on the moon and then... nothing... the R&D is being piecemealed to the corporations which are motivated by short term profit... which is barely anything.
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You seem to be hung up on everyone being in agreement. A decision made by all the people isn't better than a decision made by one and no more palatable if you disagree.

Greed is a powerful motivator but, not the only one. It's convenient to blame the form of government for lack of progress but, the responsibility lays a little closer to home. The beauty of the principles of enlightened self interest is that they can be practiced regardless of the type of government we have. Democracy just makes it easier. Of course, Democracy also makes corruption easier.
 
The Cosmic mystery, the singularity that created all matter and time, the event that hurled more matter that our minds can possibly conceive across distances incomprehensible to imagine. Science and religion have clashed over creation for centuries. If some omnipotent being created all matter and time who created the creator. Everything that is has a beginning.
 
Aluisious said:
Jesus Christ, buddy. Try thinking about your assumptions instead of just talking harder.
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Then please point the fallacy in my assumptions.

Not too long ago our own set of beliefs stated that the world just "is". There might / might not have been a point of creation - nobody knew. However, with the discovery of expansion of the Universe, that whole ideology changed.

You can't state that our recent discovery applies beyond the scope of our Universe. This we do not know.

Since our world has been created, this means that the Being had to be created? This is your fallacy.
 
Hornet said:
its the best candidate currently available that may allow physicist to take the big bang theory further back where all 4 fundamental forces were united.
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There's no taking the Big Bang "further back". The Big Bang is the beginning, string theory just provides us with a single representation for describing the universe now and immediately after the Big Bang.
 
mynamehere said:
they still haven't been able to recreate the whole " random life from primordial ooze" thing in a controlled lab yet.
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They have created the building blocks of life ... the problem is we don't have billions of years to wait around and see what happens from there.
 
this number is wrong I just counted the planets there are only 158,7 billion planets, how can you call yourself inteligent with this inaccuracy sheesh really people !
 
Magnus said:
All of what you say is true but, you left out the human ability to adapt and, have faith.
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I was remarking only on the current conditions of planet Earth and its inhabitants. There's always hope for the future, no?
 
quimby999 said:
this number is wrong I just counted the planets there are only 158,7 billion planets, how can you call yourself inteligent with this inaccuracy sheesh really people !
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This is astronomy; getting withing a factor of ten is acceptable, within a factor of two is amazing.
 
160 Billion . . . wow, that's like almost as many porn videos there are on the internet.
 
Bad ConNecTioN said:
If there are intelligent beings out there more advanced then us, I hope we never meet them. Think of all the nasty shit we've done to "primitives" on this planet....now imagine what would happen if our galactic big brother stopped by for a visit.
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If there are intelligent beings advanced enough to travel to earth, they're likely to have gone through similar processes that occurred on earth when it comes to evolution. Any alien civilizations are likely to have a history of their own which includes conflict and a struggle to resolve it, so I'm guessing they'd be sympathetic with our struggle to overcome our own issues.

If an alien race has learned to travel the vast distances of space I doubt they'd be interested in anything earth has to offer, apart from maybe an interest in us as a species, certainly not resources which are abundant in the universe in other places which are not defended by 7 billion people.
 
PrincessFrosty said:
If there are intelligent beings advanced enough to travel to earth, they're likely to have gone through similar processes that occurred on earth when it comes to evolution. Any alien civilizations are likely to have a history of their own which includes conflict and a struggle to resolve it, so I'm guessing they'd be sympathetic with our struggle to overcome our own issues.

If an alien race has learned to travel the vast distances of space I doubt they'd be interested in anything earth has to offer, apart from maybe an interest in us as a species, certainly not resources which are abundant in the universe in other places which are not defended by 7 billion people.
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Could very easily break either way. It's difficult to know, isn't it? Like saying someone who sailed across an ocean wouldn't be interested in resources. Maybe their whole civilization doesn't care, but one alien thinks he could make a living strip mining the planet.

Defended by 7 billion people might not matter. The Amazon is defended by all sorts of hostile creepy crawlies, but you set fire to it and off they go.

I wouldn't be real enthusiastic to try to find aliens. I try avoid bets where one outcome is extinction.
 
It is all just guessing on a grand scale.
Nothing more.
But if one we are invaded by an alien species, I hope they are Simians. If that happens I can say "Take you stinking paws off of me you damn dirty ape!" and mean it. :D
 
Uvaman said:
I blame Einstein, assuming his theories hold, and are 'the truth' then in a sense, we are screwed, unless we find neighbors real, real close, (and I think the closest things are quite far) even communication with light would have a 'ping' measured in years, hundreds, thousands.
A visit is out of the question, unless its a flying city, capable of traveling thousands of years.
I mean we really need to change a lot has a society to become space explorers, not saying we can't, but it would be a totally different outlook for humanity that would have to last thousands upon thousands of years.
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Actually, as I understand it, general relativity does not impose a "speed limit" on the expansion or contraction of spacetime.

So..... now I just gotta figure our how to get enough energy in order to contract the space in front of me and expand it behind me.... yeah I'll get right back to you on that.
 
I think, even if we discover millions of planets with liquid H2O, and other necessary elements for life, and the proper distance from a suitable star, we won't find any life whatsoever. None. Nada.

The discovery of other planets is exciting, but as far as life goes, I think we are it.

....but I am always open to good evidence to the contrary. :)
 
AbsintheGuy said:
I think, even if we discover millions of planets with liquid H2O, and other necessary elements for life, and the proper distance from a suitable star, we won't find any life whatsoever. None. Nada.

The discovery of other planets is exciting, but as far as life goes, I think we are it.

....but I am always open to good evidence to the contrary. :)
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What's your reasoning? Just because you want to believe we're alone? Chemistry works the same there as it does here, setup survivable parameters and life will evolve to excel in it.
 
Intelligent life is probably out there - whether they could make it here, or are interested in coming here is an entirely different question. Most of us are going to have to live alot longer to find out..

This is why a vastly longer human lifespan should be our immediate goal - along with draconian population controls of course... :p Like if you have kids no life extension for you..
 
L0s7 4 Lyf3 said:
What's your reasoning? Just because you want to believe we're alone? Chemistry works the same there as it does here, setup survivable parameters and life will evolve to excel in it.
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People seem to state that there is probably life out there. There is zero good evidence that there is intelligent life in the universe. They state, "probably this...." "probably that..." never realizing there is no evidence for it yet. Drake's equation is a psychological example of this. Even though there is zero evidence yet, people plug in ridiculous parameters into it because they want to believe. Sort of like how religious folk "want to believe".
 
we assume that life out there must have the basics we need in order to be alive don't they?

perhaps other life forms don't need water or oxygen or other things like that in order to exist, with there being so much out there, i think it is narrow to think all life must be like us, or require the same base we need to live and grow.
 
DouglasteR said:
The only thing that reminds me is that Human life have a deadline, if we cant advance past some problems and evolve as species we will perish.

We have only a fraction of time to enhance and travel to the beyond (stars), there our new chalenge will begin.

Actually, were fucked, i dont see we investing and researching enough resources (that arent eternal) for that.

I really think (but i hope not) that we will pass out, the earth will decay and nothing will be more than ash and dust.

Just like uncountables before and after us.
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Imagine if the U.S put all that money from the "war on terror" into the space program......heck, even if they put it into fixing their own poverty issues first... sure things would be ALOT further along.
 
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