[HOT] Brooks Brothers Peal and Co (C&J Handgrade) Shoes $100+ off

jkw said:
If my guys were two months behind on a seven week project, I'd take away their Brooks Brothers shoes.
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I LOL'd
aviat72 said:
And regarding care of good shoes, here is an interesting article from a store near by.
The last sentence is perhaps a good indication of what good shoes might need in terms of care (this is specific to Cordovan...)

http://www.alden-of-carmel.com/index.cfm/care_of_shell_cordovan.htm
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This...

I've had shoes that can be resoled, but by the time they need it the uppers are trashed because I don't care enough to take care of them to that extent. Certain things I can appreciate "the buy once and you'll have it forever", but I can also appreciate the "buy another for cheap when it wears out or breaks". Sorry if this is contributing to the ruination of society.
steal said:
You don't know shit about shit, dude. Fashoin "trends" in men's footwear do not change rapidly, in fact, they haven't changed much at all in the past 100 years. A pair of C&J or Alden shoes will last you quite literally a lifetime because formal and semi-formal styles have, and will remain mostly the same until you're an old man.

Dress like a manchild if you want, I don't give a fuck, but don't pretend that you have even the slightest bit of understanding when it comes to men's fashion, and especially not fine leather shoes like the ones the OP was kind enough to link us to. I won't be buying a pair (I'm partial towards Alden myself), but a pair of basic cap toe bluchers like the ones linked on the site could possibly be the last black or brown pair of semi-formal shoes you buy for the next 20 years.

There is a world of difference in not only quality, but looks. If you can't tell the difference between some shitty ECCO shoe like below, with ugly, plastic-looking leather:

http://i.imgur.com/4l4p7.jpg[/IM]

And a nice pair of Aldens:

[IMG]http://i.imgur.com/BKGQ8.jpg[/IG]

...then you're simply blind.[/QUOTE]
heh to shoes and clothes they might be, just as the majority are "blind" when it comes to computers. Different interest and different strokes; up until two years ago I was in that camp, then I met a girl that was/is very much in to fashion and I have an entirely different wardrobe. Before I met her I didn't think twice about the clothes I bought.
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ryken said:
So you admit you're trolling when posting these threads?
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No, the thread was quite serious, as is all the information I posted. I openly admit I was trolling those that thread crapped with the Macallan post.
 
I think you are misusing the term "understand" in place of "what you personally value in terms of added expense." I see differences, I've tried and used some expensive shit to compare the differences. I have also tried less expensive things that I was almost certain I wouldn't like, but after learning more the less expensive things were as good or better because the company was more about making the item with more options to be a better personalized fit instead of just slapping a higher price tag for the research that went into it. Same could be said for some of the higher priced items... some of them can charge higher because they make something unique. As I get older, I realize more and more that I dont find the added features (that are or arent noticable) and the resulting added expense to be what I consider valuable. However, I will find what is the best quality and personal comfort for me to give me the most satisfaction, then I will weigh out the value to decide if it is worth it to ME. What others think makes absolutely no difference, and I wish others thought the same when making their decisions or giving their opinions, whether they prefer more or less. That wont happen in my lifetime though.
Just wanted to throw in my opinion. Was an interesting read. Happy Holidays
 
computerpro3, can you offer some insight into the cost of resoling shoes like these and how often it might need to be done depending on usage? I suspect many of us have never had this done. Just curious.
 
TIGR said:
computerpro3, can you offer some insight into the cost of resoling shoes like these and how often it might need to be done depending on usage? I suspect many of us have never had this done. Just curious.
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The cost depends on whether you have a local cobbler or shoe repair shop that can do the job. Most cities (even small ones) will have a place that can properly replace a standard leather sole. If this is the case, it can range from $20 to $40 depending on the quality of the sole you choose. If you want the factory to do it, it costs substantially more since you have to ship them there and they will charge you higher labor costs.

If you wear the shoes everyday and walk to work on concrete, you'll need them done in just 2-3 years. But you really shouldn't wear any shoes - even gym shoes - everyday. The life of any shoe will be extended several times over if you rotate between two or three pairs and store them with shoe trees after each use. The shoe trees remove moisture and keep the shape of the shoe. They are extremely important to use. FWIW, shoe trees don't have to be fancy - just buy standard cedar ones as cheap as you can find. I like getting them at discount outlets like Nordstrom's Rack for around $9 a pair.

If you rotate between multiple pairs of shoes, you can oftentimes go 5+ years between resoling on a good shoe.

But honestly, it all depends on factors like how heavy you are, how abrasive the surfaces you walk on are, and simply how far you walk.
 
Thanks for the post, these are some well made shoes. I appreciate your effort to educate the unwilling, but I think it's a lost cause for the most part.

On a related note, Valetmag.com has a page where they've linked to quite a few sites with after christmas sales here:

http://www.valetmag.com/personal-shopper/sales-deals/?index1_top_lead

You might find something useful there. Also, if you haven't checked out leffot, go here:

http://leffot.com/

If you want to see some people get pissed off about other people spending money on beautiful shoes, wait till they see a pair of $3,500 bespoke Berlutti's!
 
people with money dont need to buy sale items. OP is trying too hard to get in where he doesnt fit in. perpetrator :eek:
 
Damn I actually like those leather and tweed boots. Thanks for the link, but between moving, breaking engagement...ugh, better hold off.

And just to jump on the thread...even if they're not your every day work shoes/clothes, it's worth having a set just for interviews or important events. A good suit is an investment - I've been partial to Ermenegildo Zegna myself, and I know for a fact that showing up looking like you're ready for the role has played a part in getting some of my past positions. Plus going in front of the Board looking not like a supplicant or recent grad helps as well. Sure, perhaps it shouldn't matter, but it does.
 
Thanks for your reply computerpro3. Another question. You mentioned these will last 10+ years with resoling. It seems current products would go "out of style" long before then. Style is the last thing I consider when buying ... well, anything, but is this a legitimate concern for those who do care about fashion. or do their designs have good longevity in that regard?
 
cheapo said:
people with money dont need to buy sale items. OP is trying too hard to get in where he doesnt fit in. perpetrator :eek:
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Thats why people have money.

I have a buddy who makes a tad over $100k, broke as shit. Up to his neck in credit card bills, and has pretty much nothing to show for it except for some expensive t-shirts and jeans from Nordy's and some trips to Vegas with skanks that used him for the plane ticket and hotel room.

Versus my buddy who makes $70k, only buys stuff on sale or second hand, and is about to buy a house and his car is nearly paid off.

Thanks for the heads up on the sale comppro. I'm looking to get a new suit and shoes this fall for job interviews once I finish my anesthesia training. You can bet your ass I'm buying it on sale. Currently looking at some Abboud suits and Allen Edmonds shoes.
 
computerpro3 said:
Can you expound on the various shoe construction techniques, materials, and philosophies of last designs off the top of your head? Can you explain why one welt might be better for a particular application than another?

If not, than you probably are not informed enough to accurately judge value vs. price, or the law of diminishing returns. This is something that many in this thread do not understand.

I'm not saying this to be a dick; it's just reality check. I know nothing about lumberjacking, but you won't find me espousing on the value curve of different axes. And the difference between me and a lot of people here is that if a lumberjack enthusiast told me what makes a quality axe, I'd have the brains to fucking listen to him instead of telling him that my Home Depot Special is good as it gets.

The singular argument that is valid is simply if you don't often wear shoes. Great! If you wear dress shoes 3-4 times a year, get $100 ones. Buying $500 ones would be stupid. But if you wear them regularly, than yes - objectively it's pretty dumb not to get quality ones.

This is the way the dress shoe market works:

Every shoe between $30-75 is identical in quality and construction.

Every shoe between $75 and $175ish is identical in quality and construction. This is only marginally better than the $30-75 range. Sometimes there is no difference besides the design. Yes, there is literally no difference between $75 Bostonians and $175 Bostonians. Trust me, I made that mistake when I was younger. Occasionally you can find a shoe that has some high end features, but compromises in other areas. For instance, Johnston and Murphy makes a goodyear welted shoe, but it's in highly corrected grain leather. You can resole it just as well as $500 shoes, but it looks like shit due to the corrected grain leather creasing. Once again, this is another mistake I made when I was younger and didn't know anything.

Shoes around $200-250 begin to be Goodyear Welted and made of real non-corrected leather. This is the entry level for a quality shoe.

It doesn't really matter if you understand this or not; it's reality. You can call the sky purple polka-dotted all day long, but at the end of the day it's still blue.



Doesn't have to be tech, and multiple people have ordered from this very thread. And I recommend Glaser Designs for the man bag, Sferra Bros. for the bed sheets, and actually, I don't know anything about mens briefs. Strange, I know.



That is a valid argument, and one I can respect. I guess I overestimated the intelligence of some posters and just assumed it went without saying not to buy $300 shoes if you never wear them.

I do not own Bang and Olufsen - in my mind they are the same mass market crap as Bostonian, Cole Haan, etc. For audio, I prefer Grado headphones for the colored signature that I find pleasing, Elemental Designs EDC6 speakers for cinema, Seaton Submersive for subwoofer, Dantax (with peerless drivers) for 2 channel, and in the car I use JM Labs Focal K2P backed by Zapco amplification.
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We are all thoroughly impressed by your intimate knowledge of high end shoes. The leather type, the construction process, every single bit of effort that goes into the shoe from the cow being slaughtered for the leather to the shoe being shipped to your house.

And while you have clearly shown your superior knowledge in all areas of the elite shoe market, you can drop the incredible attitude that you are presenting. At that top of the section I quoted, you name off a bunch of stuff about shoes and asked if we understand it, then saying we shouldn't even be making decisions if we can't explain it all.

But guess what? This is not a shoe and clothing forum! This isn't a place to discuss the finer points of the $500 and up shoe market. So no one here is impressed when you show off your superior knowledge and intellect in these areas. This is a TECH forum. Why would you expect us to know as much about shoes as you do? So quit acting so special and thinking it is so impressive that you do. Good job.

What if everyone in this thread asked you some obscure, technical question about whatever field their career happens to be in? Would you know all those answers in intimate detail? Of course not. So then should we ridicule you and call you idiots and neckbearded-mouth breathers just because you don't know the answer? Of course not.

Why don't you go and try discussing these shoes on, oh I don't know, a SHOE AND CLOTHES forum? I'm sure you audience would be sufficiently more educated in the designer shoe department. You wouldn't have to suffer the intolerable boredom that you experiencing here with us mere "plebs." I think you might find a more sophisticated audience there. :rolleyes:
 
koomba said:
We are all thoroughly impressed by your intimate knowledge of high end shoes. The leather type, the construction process, every single bit of effort that goes into the shoe from the cow being slaughtered for the leather to the shoe being shipped to your house.

And while you have clearly shown your superior knowledge in all areas of the elite shoe market, you can drop the incredible attitude that you are presenting. At that top of the section I quoted, you name off a bunch of stuff about shoes and asked if we understand it, then saying we shouldn't even be making decisions if we can't explain it all.

But guess what? This is not a shoe and clothing forum! This isn't a place to discuss the finer points of the $500 and up shoe market. So no one here is impressed when you show off your superior knowledge and intellect in these areas. This is a TECH forum. Why would you expect us to know as much about shoes as you do? So quit acting so special and thinking it is so impressive that you do. Good job.

What if everyone in this thread asked you some obscure, technical question about whatever field their career happens to be in? Would you know all those answers in intimate detail? Of course not. So then should we ridicule you and call you idiots and neckbearded-mouth breathers just because you don't know the answer? Of course not.

Why don't you go and try discussing these shoes on, oh I don't know, a SHOE AND CLOTHES forum? I'm sure you audience would be sufficiently more educated in the designer shoe department. You wouldn't have to suffer the intolerable boredom that you experiencing here with us mere "plebs." I think you might find a more sophisticated audience there. :rolleyes:
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There was zero attitude in my original post. There is a very easy way to avoid my "attitude" - don't threadcrap.

I don't care if the average person knows anything about shoes. But if someone specifically comes into a thread - one which I was trying to help others with - and threadcraps both incorrectly and unprovoked, than why shouldn't I methodically expose their ignorance?

There was nothing about shoe construction methods or details in my OP. Simply a good deal.

If you can't take the heat, don't start an argument with someone that knows more than you do about a particular topic. I think you'll find that a valuable life lesson.
 
Interesting thread.. a kind I would not normally read, but is too intriguing to pass up.

CP3 -- All humans follow conditioning, whether nature or nurture, and none of us, you included, are immune-- and while I admittedly don't know leather shoes, I do know people, and I don't believe you're as unenlightened as to presume you are swaying anyone's existing conditioning-- which then begs the question, what do you think you are accomplishing by writing fact-polluted responses that I don't believe you're as unenlightened as to presume others won't take as self-bolstering, and defeat your repeatedly stated purpose of education, through what I doubt you can't see as antagonism? Step back, read your responses aloud, and ask yourself whom (objectification, idiom or person) was it that you imagined the author(s) was(er) to warrant those responses-- to see what I mean.

Others -- try to live in your realities, most of you already know what shoes are worth to you, and what defines comfort, value, and affordability-- experiment at will but don't assume others' have or should come to the same conclusions. To want to force the same conclusion or value-judgement on others is really to undermine one's own conviction.

Lastly, on shoes, while I do own a pair of $200 Ecco leather shoes that I wear for a combined 1 month out of a year, between meetings, lunches, and special occasions-- I can honestly not tell the difference between them and a pair of $50 John Henrys from Sears. For 11 out of 12 months of the year I'm in Merrell trail runners (office+biking+travel), Merrell hiking boots, or Asics with more mileage on them than some peoples' tires -- and I can tell the difference between them and overpriced crap like Hi-Tec or the majority of torture devices that pass for sub-$100 running shoes out there. But I can feel the differences in them b/c I'm extremely intimate and critically functionally-dependent on my footwear. It is hard for me to picture how leather shoes made of the same simple/clasic construction material and stitching, can truly affect the discriminate public in a non-psychological manner whereby the effect could pass muster in a neutrality-enforced environment like a double-blind research study, should one ever be held-- to me it is an epitome of the idiom of perceived value.
 
OP is upset and thinks we are homophobic of him. Sorry buddy but not everyone watches Project Runway. Some of us have better things to occupy our time with like sports / computers / cars / girls ... and other hetero activities.
 
This thread reminds me of the one where someone here said people who don't use bidets are uncivilized.
 
Since people continue to bump this thread with nonsense, I may as well go ahead and ask a legitimate question: where can I purchase a pair of these shoes, or something of similar quality, for this price? I have been in need of a new pair for some time, yet missed the best deal on these. I am clearly too slovenly to perform this minuscule amount of research on my own.
 
precariousgray said:
Since people continue to bump this thread with nonsense, I may as well go ahead and ask a legitimate question: where can I purchase a pair of these shoes, or something of similar quality, for this price? I have been in need of a new pair for some time, yet missed the best deal on these. I am clearly too slovenly to perform this minuscule amount of research on my own.
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Well, you can't get the same quality until Brooks Brother's summer sale. The prices will be close.

If you are willing to take a slight step down in quality (but still quite good), Aldens can be found around $3-400. Aldens lack nice touches like channel soles, beveled waists, and have a slightly lower quality materials. But again, these are still top 2% of shoes in existence.

It actually really depends where you are; are you near a big city?
 
precariousgray said:
Since people continue to bump this thread with nonsense, I may as well go ahead and ask a legitimate question: where can I purchase a pair of these shoes, or something of similar quality, for this price? I have been in need of a new pair for some time, yet missed the best deal on these. I am clearly too slovenly to perform this minuscule amount of research on my own.
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any place that sells allen edmonds, like nordstrom, or nordstrom rack
 
Just as I was starting to feel stupid for spending 100 bucks on my Josef Seibel Sander Oxfords.

I must wear my shoes hard because even if I could resole my shoe in 6 years the rest of the shoe completely destroyed. Though my last pair of Josef Seibel shoes lasted me 6 years where normally shoe's only last me about a year before they are fubar so I give them props and my business.
 
computerpro3 said:
If you are willing to take a slight step down in quality (but still quite good), Aldens can be found around $3-400. Aldens lack nice touches like channel soles, beveled waists, and have a slightly lower quality materials.
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OH NOEZ :eek: What will I do without beveled waists....LMAO
 
runnin17 said:
OH NOEZ :eek: What will I do without beveled waists....LMAO
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Since you asked

http://www.askandyaboutclothes.com/forum/showthread.php?55207-Bevelled-Waist

Clearly the OP takes his shoes seriously. There used to be a time when I did too; when I was in my teens.

But I do admire his attention to detail and the nuances of the art of shoe-making. I have to confess I have learnt a lot from him. And thanks to him, I visited AskAndy after a long long time.

He definitely is the Frazier of Shoes. And I think there are a lot more things which Dr. Cranes have in common with the OP.
 
aviat72 said:
Clearly the OP takes the design and quality of most products/things seriously. .
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FTFY. I'd be happy to discuss vacuums, washers and dryers, baseball, pianos, computers, chess boards, projectors, audio equipment, pens, pencils, bags, food, drink, bedsheets, furniture, cars, keyboards, architecture, art, classic literature, classical music, how the weather works, hardwoods, leather goods, pool tables, shavers, toothbrushes, towels, shower heads, tennis rackets, amplifiers, xenon flashbulbs, spectrographs, cameras and photography, and hundreds of other topics in exhaustive detail if you'd like.

I'm not saying I know everything - not by long shot. But for things that we use or experience frequently - like shoes, for example - I think it's pretty incredible for someone to not be curious about them. We live in an incredible time, where a 10 minute article on wikipedia can give you enough information to generally grasp something like shoe design that's taken 200 years to perfect. What kind of moron doesn't take advantage of that?
 
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The Red said:
Interesting thread.. a kind I would not normally read, but is too intriguing to pass up.

CP3 -- All humans follow conditioning, whether nature or nurture, and none of us, you included, are immune-- and while I admittedly don't know leather shoes, I do know people, and I don't believe you're as unenlightened as to presume you are swaying anyone's existing conditioning-- which then begs the question, what do you think you are accomplishing by writing fact-polluted responses that I don't believe you're as unenlightened as to presume others won't take as self-bolstering, and defeat your repeatedly stated purpose of education, through what I doubt you can't see as antagonism? Step back, read your responses aloud, and ask yourself whom (objectification, idiom or person) was it that you imagined the author(s) was(er) to warrant those responses-- to see what I mean.
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Two parts to it. First, I really do want to help. The world sucks. I'd rather make it a better place - I'm stuck living in it, after all. So why the attitude? Believe it or not, it makes no difference, so I'd rather just tell things how they are. Putting things nicely and sugarcoating them won't convince anyone who's not already convinced, because the root of the issue is not my attitude or behavior - it's desired ignorance on their part. We'd still get the same homophobic and sports jokes, and people criticizing what "the rich" do. Just as those people would not be convinced anyway, some people here have looked past the attitude and recognized legitimate knowledge to be learned. That's a very interesting phenomenon to me. I think that desire and ability are critical to succeed and life, and I'm just shocked by how many don't have it.

Second, it truly fascinates me to see people who desire to be ignorant. This thread is but one microcosm of the human condition. Sure, the topic is about shoes, but honestly it doesn't matter what it's about. The responses would be the same. I think that's sad, and I'm morbidly interested in why that is.

I mean, when you really look at it, there are only two camps here. One wants to improve themselves and their environments in any way possible, and the other is taking a proud stand against knowledge, intelligence, and yes, dressing well. Fuck yea, roll tide. White socks with sandals for LIFE! This forum is a giant example of why IT stereotypes exist for a reason. You'd think they'd want to disprove them, but obviously not.


Lastly, on shoes, while I do own a pair of $200 Ecco leather shoes that I wear for a combined 1 month out of a year, between meetings, lunches, and special occasions-- I can honestly not tell the difference between them and a pair of $50 John Henrys from Sears.
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Probably because they're both about the same quality.

For 11 out of 12 months of the year I'm in Merrell trail runners (office+biking+travel), Merrell hiking boots, or Asics with more mileage on them than some peoples' tires -- and I can tell the difference between them and overpriced crap like Hi-Tec or the majority of torture devices that pass for sub-$100 running shoes out there. But I can feel the differences in them b/c I'm extremely intimate and critically functionally-dependent on my footwear.
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Many working professionals are in dress shoes for 11 out of the 12 months in the year. Trust me. You can feel the difference between even Allen Edmonds and the majority of torture devices that pass for sub-$200 dress shoes.

It is hard for me to picture how leather shoes made of the same simple/clasic construction material and stitching, can truly affect the discriminate public in a non-psychological manner whereby the effect could pass muster in a neutrality-enforced environment like a double-blind research study, should one ever be held-- to me it is an epitome of the idiom of perceived value.
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But that's the thing - your ecco's and these Peal and Co shoes are made from entirely different materials, different constructions, different designs, and with different ends in mind. If you want to talk about the idiom of perceived value, it'd be much more appropriate to discuss why you purchased Ecco's instead of saving money and buying $75 Cole Hans that are made from the same fake leather and adhesive construction. Quite literally, you pissed away $100+ on them.
 
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