AG Coating Paranoia - The Official Thread

A

albovin

[H]ard|Gawd
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Feb 16, 2008
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All the experts are invited to use this playground 24/7.

Accumulate your priceless contributions here.
You are doing a tremendous job helping others understand horrible, dirty looking AG coating on LCD monitors.

Write your AG coating saga in this thread.

Keep the rest of [H]ard|Forum clean.
 
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I don't like the sparkle/grain that heavy AG brings.

I have a glossy monitor, as well as a monitor with heavy AG, and prefer to deal with reflections.

There aren't a lot of good (or affordable) glossy monitors on the market so the level of AG coating a monitor has is important to me.

Not paranoia, just a matter of taste and preference.
 
I have a Dell 2209WA with the so called heavy AG coating and it really doesn't bother me. What does bother me is the glossy screen on my laptop. I connect the laptop to the 2209WA when I am at home and then I am good.
 
A few more "pearls" found just outside the jewelry factory.
Enjoy:

GuyClinch said:
It's remarkable how bad the so called 'professional' monitors with the AG coating look. They colors look less vibrant and the blacks look less black. All this in a monitor you are ALOT more for. The whole monitor looks dirty and like there is something wrong with it..
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NCX said:
Aggressive AG actually makes blacks look darker in brightly lit rooms due to the way they reduce reflections.

Pictures won't look more realistic, they will look dirty+grainy on the monitor compared to the actual photograph. Take a picture of a clear blue sky+white clouds and view it on a "professional" monitor, then wonder if your camera lens was dirty.
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i tested u2311hm und u2412m -> i returned both due to hard AG-coating
my eyes don´t like that crystal sparkling on white backgrounds ... especially reading texts causes eye exhaustion..

i prefer lighter coatings...
 
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You know, just because aggressive AG coatings don't bother you, you don't have to be a condescending d!&k and make fun of those of us it does bother. We have a different opinion, and have every right to that opinion, simple as that.
 
NCX said:
People should be warned should they not? After using a CRT for a few months this year I find the AG always visible and annoying. IPS glow/bleeding can vary quite a bit between units, especially this year. Look at some of the reviews and the differences between LG IPS panels can be massive (2001:1 PRAD.de vs 800:1 TFT Central contrast on the Asus ML239h) while the AG is always guaranteed to be aggressive.
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Good point.
 
People should be warned should they not?
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kevinsbane said:
Warned in the appropriate measure, perhaps? I've seen the U2711's AG coating, and it is indeed quite strong. I am guessing, however, that part of the reason I saw it was because I was LOOKING for it, and without having known about it, and given a week or so to adjust to the monitor, I never would have seen it, nor notice it. Previous to reading this forum, I never even imagined that this issue even existed.

Not to say a better AG coating isn't welcome. But to use it as a deal breaker is, in my opinion, absurd. All else being equal, a monitor with less graininess is preferable to one with more graininess. But when the trade-offs mean a sparkle that I notice for 5 seconds whenever focus on seeing it when I read an AG complaint vs much better picture quality compared to every other monitor I have (including all the PVA and CRT monitors we have at work), then I know what I prefer.

Currently using a pair of U2311h's at work, and despite the alledgedly very aggressive coating on all IPS panels, I don't notice it. The AG coating is no worse than the TN panel I use at home. It's more noticeable at work, definitely, but that's because my TN sucks so badly that the AG issue is a non-issue next to the other faults it has.
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Yall make me not even want to go 27 or 30" or ips at all with all this ag coating, hell i prob would of not even noticed it but after all the reading and bitching and moaning about it, if i do get one of these monitors i will be looking for it.
 
In the very recent past I went from an HP 2465 (S-PVA) to a Samsung S27A850D. Almost immediately after I got it I lost my job and had to return it. I got a new job, and was going to re-order the Samsung, but took a chance on the new HP ZR2740W. Huge mistake! I did not have any prior experience with heavy AG coated IPS monitors before this time. It's truly awful to my eyes. I returned the ZR2740W (it had manufacturing defects besides the AG coating), and my 2nd shot at the Samsung S27A850D will be here on Tuesday. :cool:
 
Bladestorm said:
In the very recent past I went from an HP 2465 (S-PVA) to a Samsung S27A850D. Almost immediately after I got it I lost my job and had to return it. I got a new job, and was going to re-order the Samsung, but took a chance on the new HP ZR2740W. Huge mistake! I did not have any prior experience with heavy AG coated IPS monitors before this time. It's truly awful to my eyes. I returned the ZR2740W (it had manufacturing defects besides the AG coating), and my 2nd shot at the Samsung S27A850D will be here on Tuesday. :cool:
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Wow thats terrible to hear, i wanted the zr30w, i am guessing they have the same coating as the new monitors? but i hear it they are not as bad as the dells. It feels like i will never upgrade to a new monitor at the rate i am going, i think i have considered every 27" and 30" monitor on the market and have talked my self out of all them multiple times.
 
If my Dell u2711 is next to my Hazro HZ27WD not many would pick the Dell since it looks dirty. Dell to the left Hazro to the right. The clear image that Hazro produce makes me feel sorry for everyone thats not aware how a good monitorcan look and should look, now not everyone can use a shiny monitor due to reflections I would not use one at my office but at the office I use MS Office and home I use it for anything not related to work and it is a huge difference between the two depending on what you use them for.
http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/707/dsc3145k.jpg/
http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/9/dsc3148f.jpg/
 
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Well my Acer H223HQEbmid has really aggressive AG coating, dirty, dull look and as far as I can tell it's way more aggressive than on Fujitsu P24W-6 IPS.
 
My Dell U2711 (which I sold) and Dell 3011 at work had a very similar AG coating. It was barely tolerable on the 30" because of the bigger dot pitch, but I just couldn't deal on the 27" with its smaller text. I use the monitors for coding, so I'm staring at text all the time... it was really unacceptable. Sparkles everywhere. I had a Dell 2407WFP, which I think is a PVA panel, and it was not nearly as bad... not bad at all actually. I'm not sure why companies "need" to put such aggressive coatings on these monitors.

I've switched to Apple Cinema Displays because they have extremely good color quality and response time and no horrendous coating. You just need to be a little careful how you position them because of the glare...
 
The funny thing thing is the OP is trying to make posters look bad. Probably has a monitor with the strong AG and is trying to make himself feel better. I found the AG very noticeable. It doesn't take a bit of moving around or careful inspection. It's quite obvious.

The screen looks dirty and hazy - compared to screens without it.. FWIW gamma shift and IPS glow are less noticeable. As is back light bleed - all of these problems are noticeable once you know what to look for. But AG coating is the worst of them all as far as being noticeable by a 'regular joe or jill' IMHO.
 
The OP cannot make posters look good or bad.
They look as they look.

Keep posting here.

All opinion are welcome.
 
John2000 said:
PC Pro magazine asked their readers what they prefer (matte vs glossy), here's the result:

http://www.pcpro.co.uk/blogs/2011/05/23/glossy-vs-matte-screens-why-the-pc-industrys-out-of-touch/

Looks like 75% prefer matte, 12.5% glossy, and 12.5% have no preference.
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90% of them or more dont know the difference, I didnt know until I put them next to eachother one with AG coating one without. The question is more like if they want reflections or not because reflections is what people in general connect to glossy but if you actually look at the image you will be utterly disappointed if you see the poor image from heavy AG coating.

For work of course matte is better I use it and I would not want glossy for work.

I do not buy office furnitures for my living room or kitchen and I would not, now sine I know the difference, buy an office monitor for my home where I do not use it for work and I can control lightning, sun etc.
 
Nobody seemed to make a big deal about this a few years ago. On the displays I had then the AG coating wasn't really any different from what is used now on most PVA/MVA/IPS displays. I wasn't bothered by it then, it doesn't bother me now.
 
kasakka said:
Nobody seemed to make a big deal about this a few years ago. On the displays I had then the AG coating wasn't really any different from what is used now on most PVA/MVA/IPS displays. I wasn't bothered by it then, it doesn't bother me now.
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Yes, which is why it is important to read feedback from users outside this forum. People here are obligated to have an opinion on the quite tendentious "Is IPS aggressive AG right for you?" question. I also dislike when review sites pick up talking points like these.
 
I love the lack of anti-glare on my NEC 20WGX2. My girlfriend has a U2211, great screen, apart from IMO, the anit-glare coating. The reflections that disturb me on my screen happen with less frequency than you spend looking at text, so all in all, pulling a blind down instead of having the annoying coating is the lesser of 2 evils. I wish more screens were like the Hazro/ ACD.
 
Bladestorm said:
In the very recent past I went from an HP 2465 (S-PVA) to a Samsung S27A850D. Almost immediately after I got it I lost my job and had to return it. I got a new job, and was going to re-order the Samsung, but took a chance on the new HP ZR2740W. Huge mistake! I did not have any prior experience with heavy AG coated IPS monitors before this time. It's truly awful to my eyes. I returned the ZR2740W (it had manufacturing defects besides the AG coating), and my 2nd shot at the Samsung S27A850D will be here on Tuesday. :cool:
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Look forward to your 2nd review.

Thanks,
 
Whoisthisreally said:
People here are obligated to have an opinion on the quite tendentious "Is IPS aggressive AG right for you?" question.
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Yes, that is what a few thread crappers insert in every thread here. Not to mention "dirty colors" delirium.

The real story is that static massive white (whitish) backgrounds may look a bit "sparkly" on matte screens (MS Word, reading online), and some users may be sensitive to that.
That's understandable.
 
The delirium comes from the IPS owners who are stuck with what they have, so they try to play down the effect of the AG coating so they can cope and feel good about their purchase.
 
"Keep the rest of [H] clean" lol.. its a pro or con just like a lot of other pro's or cons in imperfect display technologies and models. And like other pros and cons, it is something people should be made aware of before they make a purchase.

You can make a TN con's thread , and an IPS cons thread .. and a 60hz/120hz cons thread.. crt cons thread.... TFT general cons thread.. monitors with scalers~input lag cons thread.. etc.

--- suggesting that people never mention any specific pro/cons outside of a single thread again is a beyond ridiculous, arrogant tact and laughable.
 
I have gone from a glossy TN screen to a new matte IPS monitor, I wanted a glossy IPS screen for photo editing but there wasn't many choices out there.
I don't mind it on the Dell U2412, hated it on the U2711 but I find when editing a lot of photos that a glossy screen makes the photo look heaps better, on a matte screen they look lifeless. But I guess if you are using a CP for general web surfing and office type jobs matte wouldn't bother you but for video and photo editing glossy to me is better.
 
Someone has to finally say it - the IBM Model M is an excellent keyboard.
 
Meh. I can see the aggressive AG but for me it isn't a problem since I have to stare at a white screen to notice it. Still I wonder why they keep producing panels with it if so many people hate the aggressive AG. It'd be nice if there was an easy way to remove it without risking destroying your screen.
 
swift77 said:
90% of them or more dont know the difference.
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Ok, so everyone who didn't vote according to you preferences didn't know the difference? Seriously, if they didn't know the difference it's more likely that they would have voted "no preference", which was an option as well and received 12.5% of the votes. Why would they vote "matte" if they didn't know the difference between matte and glossy - they might as well have voted "glossy" then?

You know there are disadvantages with glossy screens, most notably the reflections that can be highly annoying and under some conditions can render the screen more or less unusable. Also, I don't find the image becomes that much better with glossy screens. Overall, there are more disadvantages than advantages with glossy screens, so for me and most people I know they are a deal breaker.
 
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John2000 said:
Ok, so everyone who didn't vote according to you preferences didn't know the difference? Seriously, if they din't know the difference it's more likely that they would have voted "no preference", which was an option as well and received 12.5% of the votes.
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Im not that they dont know the difference I am saying that they do not know WHAT kind of difference they judging/choosing meaning that 95% or more has no clue what AG coating does to a monitor but they do know difference btw matte and glossy. All of them are aware of matte and glossy but hardly anyone know about AG coating like ppl in this forum.
 
NCX said:
The delirium comes from the IPS owners who are stuck with what they have, so they try to play down the effect of the AG coating so they can cope and feel good about their purchase.
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Thank you for being the hidden voice of all IPS owners who secretly hate their monitors because of the (allegedly) extreme anti-glare coating. I'm sure you've actually gone out and done surveys that are statistically significant concerning the topic at hand. Because somehow it doesn't square with my experience, so you must have some kind of statistically significant data to back it up. I'd appreciate that you not infer that I am delirious simply because I prefer my AG coated IPS monitor over every other monitor I've seen and had.

The furor over IPS monitors are due to some users not being able to handle the AG coating. The concern is (for them), a real issue that prevents their use of most IPS monitors, seeing as how (most) IPS monitors have this (allegedly) overly harsh AG coating. Though it is true that certain monitors suffer from overly harsh AG coating (U2711, I'm looking at you), AG coating was never an issue to me until it was brought up by people who hate complain about AG coatings. The only time I ever notice my IPS monitors' (allegedly overly aggressive) antiglare is when someone mentions it. I wonder at it for 3 seconds. Then I dismiss it because it takes more effort to see it than to tune it out (zero effort, happens naturally after 2 seconds of using the monitor as opposed to looking at the monitor itself).

Im not that they dont know the difference I am saying that they do not know WHAT kind of difference they judging/choosing meaning that 95% or more has no clue what AG coating does to a monitor but they do know difference btw matte and glossy. All of them are aware of matte and glossy but hardly anyone know about AG coating like ppl in this forum.
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So, basically, since 95% of people are bothered more by reflections than by antiglare coatings (of any type), we need to dismiss their opinion because (according to you) they don't know any better and only those that have been "enlightened" by the knowledge of anti-glare coatings count? The only thing I ever got out of the anti-anti-glare furor is the ability to be bothered by anti-glare coatings, should I choose to be.
 
kevinsbane said:
The only time I ever notice my IPS monitors' (allegedly overly aggressive) antiglare is when someone mentions it. I wonder at it for 3 seconds.
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NCX said:
The people saying the coating is fine are stuck with what they have or don't notice (ignorance is bliss)
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My delirum comment was not addressed at you it was @Albovin for trying to imply that people are delerious for noticing the differences between AG coatings.

Try using a monitor with less AG, a CRT or glossy display side by side, look at some photos like this http://interfacelift.com/wallpaper/details/2706/ferie.html then come back and tell me it is not a problem. Most IPS panels use the same coating as the 2711.....

Again it just seems like the defenders have not done a proper comparison or don't notice. I've put all types of coatings side by side, aggressive AG (IPS+LG TN's) is the worst offender. The coating Samsung uses on their TN panels (medium AG) also looks very grainy when viewing whites+light colors.
 
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kevinsbane said:
Thank you for being the hidden voice of all IPS owners who secretly hate their monitors because of the (allegedly) extreme anti-glare coating.
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I just wanted to say that as a former DELL U3011 owner, I was very dissatisfied with the quality of the display. Thanks to posters like NCX, I was redirected to another display that I found much more satisfactory. I am thankful for all the dissenting opinions on this forum, without them I doubt I would have ever found the monitor I was looking for. :)
 
NCX said:
Try using a monitor with less AG, a CRT or glossy display side by side, look at some photos like this http://interfacelift.com/wallpaper/details/2706/ferie.html then come back and tell me it is not a problem.
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Which panels have "less" AG? Got a few models numbers that I can tell with? My IPS side-by-side comparison experience has been with Dell PVA's, some random TN's (Acer, Dell, etc.) and none of them has had noticeable AG sparkle to the point where I noticed them without purposely looking for it. There was one glossy monitor that I used, but I didn't get a chance to compare it to my U2311's. I do remember that I noticed the reflections a lot more than I notice AG coatings in general.

What if I do not find there is a problem? Would that be acceptable as an answer?

Again it just seems like the defenders have not done a proper comparison or don't notice.
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I'm not sure, but I hope you realise that this is ridiculous position to take. Are you saying that only people who notice AG coating should defend IPS technology? It seems like you're saying defenders must do a "proper" comparison first and should notice IPS' AG sparkle. The first condition is definitely required, but the second is absurd. In the context of this discussion, it's almost like saying "Anyone who doesn't see what I see isn't allowed to argue against my position."

Most IPS panels use the same coating as the 2711.
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Interesting. I wonder why my U2311's look so much better than the U2711's in terms of AG sparkle. When I went into my local ++++ and checked out their U2711 on display, I could see the difference right away. I didn't even need a side-by-side comparison, they were that different.
 
kevinsbane said:
Which panels have "less" AG? Got a few models numbers that I can tell with?
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Any Samsung TN will use medium AG, same with the PVA panels. You should be able to see a clear difference, but it also depends on how far away you are sitting. On another forum people were baffled when I posted that the sub-hd Call of Duty games looked horrible on consoles. Turned out they were sitting 15 feet away from their TV's:. So, how far away are you sitting from your monitor?

kevinsbane said:
What if I do not find there is a problem? Would that be acceptable as an answer?
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If you can't see the difference even after comparing the 2 different kinds of coating I would think you are sitting to far away, are lucky, or that you have poor eyesight:D.

kevinsbane said:
I'm not sure, but I hope you realise that this is ridiculous position to take. Are you saying that only people who notice AG coating should defend IPS technology?
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I meant that the defenders can't tell because they don't have experience with with lighter AG coating, so they don't notice (hence saying ignorance is bliss) and come in here to defend their purchase.

It has nothing to do with IPS panels, LG uses this coating on all their current TN's as well and I'd wager that companies like Acer/Asus who sometimes use LG panels probably use the same coating. HP's none glossy TN's all use aggressive AG coating, but no one on [H] is talking about them. The Samsung (medium AG) coating is nearly as bad, however given that most people on [H] talk about IPS panels Samsung/HP TN's don't become subject to the [H]atred.

kevinsbane said:
Interesting. I wonder why my U2311's look so much better than the U2711's in terms of AG sparkle
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The 2711 has a much tighter pixel pitch and text so the effect is more obvious. I first started noticing the AG coating on my Samsung 2233rz after put my C-PVA panel next to it. When I got a glossy TN I started to notice it on my C-PVA as well, especially in games like Bad Company 2 during the desert and snow levels. With all the pro photographers switching from CRT's to IPS I'm surprised there was not an outcry during the change over "back in the day."
 
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