Windows 8 Video Preview

DO
NOT
WANT

Really Microsoft? Really? You want to turn my pc into a cell phone? Fuck that.
 
I welcome the Touch UI as long as it's a compliment to a traditional desktop UI. I think it's wise for Micrsoft to have one OS that can provide a different UI experience based on that devices function.
 
Hmm... the thing I see glossed over a lot, yes it works great with a tablet or touch screen... however Microsoft has something else that will also work great with it, and normal desktop PC's.

KINECT! :p The entire thing seems like the x-box dash board, and I kept waiting for the white hand to show up on the screen as stuff got dragged around.
 
rocky928 said:
God, there isn't much worse than reading people bitching about operating systems.
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Welcome to [H] where people bash before they try it. Apple doesn't have a chance in here for that very reason.
 
The reaction by some here to bash this new ui and MS itself in the most irrational way possible all over a single video of one aspect of Win 8 (an OS not due for at least a year), is exactly the kind of reaction MS will need to combat going forward.

Those same people really dont want MS doing anything radical to the base UI. Those people dont have any interest in the tablet model or anything touch-centric. They want the power user type access they are married to.

Unfortunately for MS, they will remain stagnated and relugated to the back of the line as far as consumer recognition if they listen to those people. Reality is that we are in a time where mobile devices (phones, tablets, laptops) are very popular and while there are still more desktops out there, the average consumer (which is the majority of buyers) isnt a power user and is not married to the current windows model, they just want easy access to their favorite tasks.

MS must find a way to bridge the gap between the growing demand for that ease of use model and the existing power user base. Thats a very hard nut to crack and in the end, there may be no way to bridge the gap. I think what Im seeing and hearing about Win 8 so far is a reflection of MS realizing that they cant simply develop one UI thats going to please everyone and work on every platform.

Some are under the impression that the tile ui will be present on every pc as default. I dont see any evidence to that at all. What Ive seen would point to the tile ui being pushed to touch-centric devices (tablets and touchscreen lcds). For the standard desktop, it looks like we will get a traditional ui similar to what win 7 already uses. To me, I dont see the reason to gripe at all. They arent taking away the precious power user ui model (which i agree is still a good thing to have), they are simply adding a new ui for appropriate applications. Think of it like windows media center. MC7 is its own UI, but you dont see MS push it as a defualt ui, its used when appropriate. I think Win 8 will be the same. Standard desktops get a ui we are familiar with, but you can still access the Tile UI if you want to (i bet that the tile ui on desktops also serves as the basis for a media center replacement). Touch based devices will get the ui that works best for them.
 
Instead of throwing everything in plus the kitchen sink, I would rather have a bare bones OS.
Secure, fast, stable, small footprint and cheap.
Strip it down and sell it as a core OS. Then you could buy plug-ins to add the features you want.
 
Ryokurin said:
It won't be the default interface, just available if you want it. While it hasn't had the same look as the windows mobile interface, there's been add-ons available since vista that have provided similar interfaces for touch devices they just haven't been widely used as the only touch device that's done decent in the market place is HPs and they use their own interface instead.
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You really didn't pay attention to the videos, and what was written.

It is not optional. This is the new windows8 interface everywhere, desktop/laptop/tablets will all get this. When you start you will get the tiles interface, you can't shut it off, it is the interface.

You can still see the old interface when you launch legacy apps, so it still exists but it is no longer the primary way to interact with the computer. But it is more like having a VM that runs old windows, than an alternate UI.



Some other links:
http://allthingsd.com/video/?video_id=20D08FE8-3928-43F3-AFE1-35DA78EB79FF
http://allthingsd.com/video/?video_id=20D08FE8-3928-43F3-AFE1-35DA78EB79FF
http://www.microsoft.com/presspass/features/2011/jun11/06-01corporatenews.aspx


This is the biggest change to the Windows UI ever. It is meant to be revolutionary. It isn't some optional touch layer. This the new windows interface for Desktops/Laptops/tablets.
 
cptnjarhead said:
Instead of throwing everything in plus the kitchen sink, I would rather have a bare bones OS.
Secure, fast, stable, small footprint and cheap.
Strip it down and sell it as a core OS. Then you could buy plug-ins to add the features you want.
Click to expand...

Ok, enjoy.
 
Yes, I did watch it all. You didn't catch the part around 17:40 where they stated that the old interface is still there for people who can't get used to the new interface or have hardware that can't take advantage of it. I think it's more an issue of people not understanding what an integrated interface means...
 
I'm withholding judgement. I didn't think I'd much like some of the changes from XP to 7 but I do. There wasn't enough in the video to go on in what it was running, but they're going to have to keep it very lean to work well on mobile devices.

But, if they Playskool up the server OS into "My First Unicorn Server" then it's time for a change.
 
My take is that I think it's great for tablets...but for a mouse based setup I don't really think it's all that great.
It's one of those things that Apple hasn't even tried to do - they've kept their touch interfaces and the desktop/laptop interfaces separate because they really are pretty different.
I admire MS's push in this direction, but I'm not sure an all-in-one interface is the best of ideas yet.
 
Well regarding whether the tile ui will be the default for a desktop that doesnt use a touchscreen, I could see why some are thinking it will be the forced, unavoidable, interface.

I think we just dont know enough to be jumping to that conclusion. I mean the entire demo is obviously using a touch enabled screen, so I want to hear them say directly that even on a desktop without a touchscreen that the tile ui is not optional and that you will not be able to launch into a standard desktop if you choose to. Until then, Im not going to jump off the bridge.

My feeling was that what would be mandatory even on desktops would be the new welcome/login screen. I just hope they allow us the option to then load into the standard ui after that screen. If not, then yeah, its going to be something pretty big to get use to and Ill have to wait and see if that is what I want to get use to.

I think one thing that helps me feel not so shocked about this is the fact that I have an htpc that is only running 7MC. Ive already been 'living' in that metro-like environment through media center and have come to really enjoy the interface. What Ive seen out of that demo doesnt scare me, it looks like they evolved the form from MC to integrate more general use functions. Now media center is no longer just about media, its about a whole host of uses.
 
Reading the thread has been entertaining at any rate.

The touch interface, while will work with desktops, will likely be an optional thing. The Windows 7 UI is clearly still there. The video shows it when they run Office. MS isn't going to alienate millions of businesses by getting rid of the current UI. I fully expect that you will be able to use it as the default.

Some posters seem to think that there will be no other new features as well. This is, of course, not the case. There have been several new featues posted around the web.
-Built in PDF reader
-History Vault (a new front end for Previous Versions)
-ISO Mounting

There will be a few other features as well.

Personally, I like what they are doing here. I have been a convertable tablet PC user for years and the new UI will be awesome for them. I expect I'll use the traditional Windows UI on my desktop and the new Metro Style UI on my Tablet. I already use 3rd party apps on my tablet to make it more touch friendly, but what they demoed today is pretty awesome. The way you manage multiple apps (Sorry, We've been calling windows applications apps for decades) running with a touch interface looked pretty good.
 
cptnjarhead said:
yeah i know.. would be great if could run all my games on linux. ;)
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You could always go the Windows Server 2008 R2 route which is essentially Windows 7 64-bit stripped down by default where services and features are added using the Server Management features and role installer.
 
trooper11 said:
I mean the entire demo is obviously using a touch enabled screen, so I want to hear them say directly that even on a desktop without a touchscreen that the tile ui is not optional and that you will not be able to launch into a standard desktop if you choose to. Until then, Im not going to jump off the bridge.
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In the All things digital demo I linked above, they also showed it on a regular laptop without touch as well and clearly said this is the new interface for all windows computers, not just tablets, but desktops/laptops as well.

This isn't an optional touch interface, this is THE new windows interface. The MS spin is that while the new interface is touch optimized it works just as well with KB/Mouse.

You can still get to the older interface but it is more like running a VM session on another OS. It is something you can get to, through the Metro/Cards interface, but it is not an alternative to the Metro interface.

It is like if you run a Windows VM on a Linux host. You could run the windows VM in full screen and thus have full access to the old interface, but it really isn't an alternate interface, it is just something you can access under linux. Likewise you can access the desktop under Metro, but it is not an alternative to Metro.
 
Looks like an upgrade to Windows Media Center to me. As long as the traditional interface is still their they can add in all the secondary touch interfaces they want.
 
I hate it.


I do not want that thing starting everytime I boot the damn pc
 
Soggy said:
Looks like an upgrade to Windows Media Center to me. As long as the traditional interface is still their they can add in all the secondary touch interfaces they want.
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Actually it's not. It comes from Zune's interface which this is basically Zune Interface 3.0. 2.0 is what we see for Windows Phone 7.
 
Azhar said:
You could always go the Windows Server 2008 R2 route which is essentially Windows 7 64-bit stripped down by default where services and features are added using the Server Management features and role installer.
Click to expand...

Hmmm that is interesting. I have Win 7 64 ultimate, using dual boot, one for games and the other for work. On the game side i stripped it down as much as i could. Is Server 08 stripped down even further?
 
Azhar said:
Welcome to [H] where people bash before they try it. Apple doesn't have a chance in here for that very reason.
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id say thats only a recentish thing wouldnt you? lets say, the last 4 years or so.

i think pretty much everyone from back when you saw posts from frgmaster before the forum handle was changed understands progression, remembers buying indeo accelerators, owned amigas, probably owned a powervr card, and drooled at the idea of 3d accelerated anything when the rendition verite came out has been dreaming of a touch based, 3d ui like LCARS.

this is mostly when all the little kids started to grow up that are now all in their 20's. never feared an ass whipping once. all those kids seem to express outrage at anything they dont fully understand (i.e. require them to actually learn something) at the drop of a hat. they also like to marginalize any dissenting opinion by calling it "trolling".

so i dont think the problem is the [H]. i think the problem is that the generation after us isnt disciplined, had it too easy, and their parents never kicked the shit out of them for running their mouth off.
 
This is EXACTLY what Microsoft needed to do and will quickly outsell even Windows 7 if the quality is there. There's going to be a WHOLE new generation of programs, apps, whatever you want to call them designed for this and an app store. This is a HUGE opportunity for Windows developers willing to take of the blinders and see the potential.

The nerds raging here would have never developed the iPad or a new UI for Windows that wasn't stuck at Windows 2000.

Now we need to see what's in store for ink as that's going to become more important in the tablet space and is the biggest technical advantage Microsoft currently has in tablets. Hopefully they are thinking about Courier.
 
christianw said:
id say thats only a recentish thing wouldnt you? lets say, the last 4 years or so.

i think pretty much everyone from back when you saw posts from frgmaster before the forum handle was changed understands progression, remembers buying indeo accelerators, owned amigas, probably owned a powervr card, and drooled at the idea of 3d accelerated anything when the rendition verite came out has been dreaming of a touch based, 3d ui like LCARS.

this is mostly when all the little kids started to grow up that are now all in their 20's. never feared an ass whipping once. all those kids seem to express outrage at anything they dont fully understand (i.e. require them to actually learn something) at the drop of a hat. they also like to marginalize any dissenting opinion by calling it "trolling".

so i dont think the problem is the [H]. i think the problem is that the generation after us isnt disciplined, had it too easy, and their parents never kicked the shit out of them for running their mouth off.
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You're probably right. As you can see, I've been around a long time and I remember a time where people were awed by even tiny incremental overclock results or flashy user interfaces. The newer generation aren't as easily impressed. I guess they're just jaded.
 
is still stuck with ntfs as the file system ?

its about time for winfs or something a bit more robust and cool .
 
Snowdog said:
In the All things digital demo I linked above, they also showed it on a regular laptop without touch as well and clearly said this is the new interface for all windows computers, not just tablets, but desktops/laptops as well.

This isn't an optional touch interface, this is THE new windows interface. The MS spin is that while the new interface is touch optimized it works just as well with KB/Mouse.

You can still get to the older interface but it is more like running a VM session on another OS. It is something you can get to, through the Metro/Cards interface, but it is not an alternative to the Metro interface.

It is like if you run a Windows VM on a Linux host. You could run the windows VM in full screen and thus have full access to the old interface, but it really isn't an alternate interface, it is just something you can access under linux. Likewise you can access the desktop under Metro, but it is not an alternative to Metro.
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Do you have proof of this, or just going by the video? Because someone who has never seen windows but seen windows media center and then that UI minimized to the normal desktop would say similar.

Again, the first link you posted of video, 17:40 in.

Mossberg: (paraphrasing)This doesn't look anything like previous versions of windows. Could someone uncomfortable with this run in the old way

Larson-Green: run in the old desktop? Yes, they can run in their desktop programs, have the start screen, then just go to the desktop and never start the new interface

Again, by Microsoft's logic, Windows Media Center is integrated into the normal Windows UI but you aren't forced to use it every day. Will Microsoft try to promote this new UI? Yes. but they aren't going to cheapen the current traditional way of doing things in the process, especially since touch screens are still rare and hundreds of dollars higher than normal monitors.
 
chaos4u said:
is still stuck with ntfs as the file system ?

its about time for winfs or something a bit more robust and cool .
Click to expand...
Don't hold your breath.

NTFS is very robust.

Windows search/indexer has gone through so many iterations over the last few generations of windows, it effectively gives you database like searching for files.
 
chaos4u said:
is still stuck with ntfs as the file system ?

its about time for winfs or something a bit more robust and cool .
Click to expand...

Seriously. While I can't say I have any real "problems" with ntfs - I could definitely use an updated file system that is more flexible and keeps things a bit cleaner by default.
 
There's absolutely nothing wrong with NTFS as a file system for Windows. Its worked fine for ages, and they continually update it with new features.

That said, anyone remember WinFS (Windows Future Storage)? It was a database layer meant to run on top of NTFS, that was unfortunately canned before Vista came out.

Well, it looks like it might be back, actually rolled INTO its own file system this time. Meet Protogon FS.
 
Ryokurin said:
Larson-Green: run in the old desktop? Yes, they can run in their desktop programs, have the start screen, then just go to the desktop and never start the new interface
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What she actually says:

"Yes, they could have all their desktop programs in the Start Screen, and then just go to the desktop and never go into..." she is cut off at that point.

While she says this, she is indicating the Tiles as where they would have their desktop programs. The Start Screen is the name for your Tile launchpad. You still need tiles to get to the desktop. They showed this functionality by launching a few windows programs from the Start Screen. The Desktop is not an alternative to the Tile Start Screen, it is something you access from the Tile Start Screen.

Theoretically you could then spend the rest of the day in their without leaving, but you don't start at a desktop, you start at the new Tile based Start screen. The windows key now takes you to the Start Screen.

At some point either some will likely have a launch desktop startup script so you see very little of Tiles, but they are still the new Windows interface.
 
Snowdog said:
What she actually says:

"Yes, they could have all their desktop programs in the Start Screen, and then just go to the desktop and never go into..." she is cut off at that point.

While she says this, she is indicating the Tiles as where they would have their desktop programs. The Start Screen is the name for your Tile launchpad. You still need tiles to get to the desktop. They showed this functionality by launching a few windows programs from the Start Screen. The Desktop is not an alternative to the Tile Start Screen, it is something you access from the Tile Start Screen.

Theoretically you could then spend the rest of the day in their without leaving, but you don't start at a desktop, you start at the new Tile based Start screen. The windows key now takes you to the Start Screen.

At some point either some will likely have a launch desktop startup script so you see very little of Tiles, but they are still the new Windows interface.
Click to expand...


So basically, we dont really know what options will be there or how that type of scenario would work since she got cut off in mid thought. You can try and make assumptions based on that part said, but I still want to see that demoed or here them really explain it.
 
She got cut off at the end, but she clearly said they would put their desktop apps in the Start Screen. This would be completely pointless if you were going to bypass the tile based Start Screen and just start in the desktop instead.
 
There is literally ZERO chance of MS just killing off the Windows 7 desktop. Businesses are not going to fuck around with Sally Secretary's start screen loaded with cat pictures and what not, and MS knows that. MS is not going to throw money out the door just to axe a product they already have fully functional. At the end of the day, there will be a choice of moving between these two systems. They can say "lol it's not a layer," but that's exactly what it is, as you can see the classic desktop everytime you need to run a legitimate program. There will be a version or setting that allows for the classic desktop nonstop.

They will not spend years and millions developing Windows 7 to just get rid of it for no reason. MS might want to push people into using this so they can sell more "apps" (ugh) but killing off the classic interface would be the most idiotic business decision ever.
 
No one can tell me, except Microsoft, that MS will not have a way for the Win7 style UI to be UI users see if configured to be so. The new UI will be the default, but you can probably bank on it that there will be a way for users (especially corporate users) to go directly to the traditional UI.
 
Snowdog said:
She got cut off at the end, but she clearly said they would put their desktop apps in the Start Screen. This would be completely pointless if you were going to bypass the tile based Start Screen and just start in the desktop instead.
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yes she did, im just wondering what else she was going to say and what the answer would be to a direct question if one could set the system to boot to the standard ui by default after you click through the welcome/login screen.
 
ROFL at how fail Windows 8 will be. No one will upgrade to 8 from 7 just like no one upgraded from XP to Vista.
 
christianw said:
so i dont think the problem is the [H]. i think the problem is that the generation after us isnt disciplined, had it too easy, and their parents never kicked the shit out of them for running their mouth off.
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The generation before yours probably said the same thing, as shall the current about the next...:rolleyes: It's called human nature and "us and them".

You seem very very angry about some silly useless feature, and should perhaps think about why you want to resort to beating and violence because people don't agree with your point of view.

People "in their 20s" would remember computers "before 3d" maybe not 15 year olds, but thats not what we're talking about. I'm in my 20s and owned amigas and my first 3 computers didn't have sound or color. Yet the 40 and 50 year old couple in the house I am in, have either only owned a computer for the last 3 years, or never. If I went on to them about a touch UI for a non touch device they would equally not give a crap. Being old or young does not automatically give or deny experience. What I did have lots of experience of was violence from the older generation, yet, I still don't get this crappy "feature". Maybe I need more beatings...:p
 
DeathPrincess said:
I'm in my 20s and owned amigas and my first 3 computers didn't have sound or color.
Click to expand...

Odd, I got my first computer thirty years ago and it had sound and color and so did each one since.

You must have been about Negative 8 years old when you got your first computers.
 
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