Let's Kill the OS Upgrade Disc

Killing the operating system update disc? Subscribing to operating system upgrades as an ongoing service? I see what this guy is trying to say but would you guys even go for that?

Here's what I propose: no more OS upgrade pricing. Vendors, make your money for each new machine that runs your OS, either up front when the OS is installed on the machine (easy for Apple, which makes 99.99 percent of the machines that run the Apple OS), or by letting customers subscribe to operating system upgrades as an ongoing service.

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FUCK NO

If we subscribe there is no incentive for them to try very hard at fixing shit...

This is proven with cable tv companies and ISPs. They essentially say "fuck you we don't care, who else are you going to go to?"

So he's mad he had to pay the upgrade price for a full install of an OS?

I think he's forgetting that users are not required to upgrade their OSes (at least on PCs, I have no idea about Macs), and still get all the free necessary updates they're supposed to for years after the OS is released. He's trying to solve a problem that doesn't exist; besides, why is a yearly subscription fee better than either paying ~$50 every three years? Isn't it the same thing?

FTA said:

[...] I'm also peeved that I had to pay for this for this [sic] upgrade. Wasn't running Vista for two years payment enough? That OS was patched and upgraded numerous times while I was running it, at no cost to me.

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I stopped reading there.

In my case, I have 4 machines that are used heavily.

My older children like and need XP, basically because that's what the school uses.

I upgraded to Vista, but only used it for gaming.
Everybody will probably get W7, and the multiple upgrade package makes it a really cost effective solution.

If I get to choose when I want to upgrade, I can/did skip a cycle or two.AND wait to see if the new edition is a giant turd or not.
If Microsoft decides for me I really just go along for the ride and hope they don't unleash another Windows ME........like someone else said, the incentive for innovation is really gone at that point.

GushpinBob said:

I stopped reading there.

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Agreed. When I read about someone's problems with Vista, I stop. Sh!t I hear laymans talk badly about Vista, even though they themselves don't know what a "web browser" is or what "right click" means.

Wow, could he possibly bitch and whine anymore?

Microsoft has wanted to do this for years. They tried to work towards Software as a Service with Vista and failed. Remember Vista Ultimate Addons? Yeah, they where pretty crappy.

MorfiusX said:

Microsoft has wanted to do this for years. They tried to work towards Software as a Service with Vista and failed. Remember Vista Ultimate Addons? Yeah, they where pretty crappy.

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You remember how long it was between XP and Vista? If they were getting paid on a subscription basis you can bet every new OS release would take just as long. If people are paying you every year even if you don't release a new product there is no incentive to actually release a new product.

Mr Rafe's brain isn't firing on all cylinders. Within the first two paragraphs I was already saying STFU. I couldn't finish it, I stopped reading it after the seventh paragraph. What a whiney c'sucker. If I had to pay to read that article I'd ask for some of my money back.

Ualdayan said:

You remember how long it was between XP and Vista? If they were getting paid on a subscription basis you can bet every new OS release would take just as long. If people are paying you every year even if you don't release a new product there is no incentive to actually release a new product.

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I wasn't arguing for SaaS OSes. I agree it's a pretty crappy idea.

These are just a few ideas, and I'm aware they're far from perfect solutions. But upgrade discs cause consumers confusion. There are ways to give users and companies the same benefits in cleaner packages.

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What is confusing exactly?

You insert disk, upgrade, done, you keep all your settings and files and programs, many people arent smart enough to do a full format, reinstall their programs, backup their data, so with an upgrade they install, done and move on with their life!


You want a cleaner package, buy the full version, easy?

Why is it he is complaining, he got a FULL version of windows at the price of an upgrade?

CNET will publish anything these days!

The funny thing is that when MS suggested this exact same idea (OS subscriptions) a few years ago it was soundly rejected by the tech media.

.... anyone heard of software assurance? As a company we pay a yearly fee to allow "upgrades" between releases....

Ok, the guy's an idiot about the whole "why should I pay for Windows 7; it's just a Vista upgrade after all" business - Windows 7 is quite a bit more than that, and while yes, it's what Vista SHOULD have been, that's water under the bridge.

Nevertheless, I've always thought a subscription model to OS's (and in fact, Microsoft's entire software suite) isn't a bad idea depending on how they implement it. Say for example they charge you $10/month for a single install of the current version of Windows. No other fee - you just sign up, they send you a disk (or allow you to download an ISO image of) the latest version of Windows, you get dinged $10/month. That's 1/3rd the cost of an iPhone data plan, by comparison. For that $10/month, you get access to all OS patches, upgrades, new versions, etc.

At any point, you can decide to cancel the subscription. You don't LOSE your OS at that point, you just no longer are allowed to get the latest patches, updates, etc. At some point you may decide "hey, I've spent the last 6 months off the teat, I think I want the latest security patches" so you reactivate, pay your $10 for that month, get all the latest stuff. Very similar (but cheaper) to how your average MMORPG works.

Say you're a house with multiple PCs - like mine is (I've got 5 of 'em, 3 of which are on 24x7); the cost of upgrading those to a new version of Windows is crippling. But say they offered multi-PC subscription discounts - such as $15-20/month total for up to 6 PCs in the same household. For right now, let's ignore their new "3 PC licenses plan" they've got going. How would that compare to what I have to spend now? Call it $110 per PC for Windows Home Premium - that means 6 PCs would run you $660 one time. As opposed to a $20/month subscription for all 6 PCs - it would take you nearly 3 years before you equaled your original outlay. And if things were tight, you could always stop your subscription for awhile - the PCs would still work, they just wouldn't be getting patched.

Obviously some people would leverage the "sign up for one month than cancel" situation - they'd probably have to have a "minimum contract" sort of thing like cell phones do of 12 months or so. I think I'd still prefer that. And how 'bout if they did the same thing with Office? Or their developer packages?

From Microsoft's perspective, they'd have an ongoing cashflow like Blizzard does with the WoW gamers as opposed to periodic boom/bust cycles when they roll out new OS's - but they'd still have incentive to come out with new versions, upgrades, features, etc just to keep the cashflow going. Most people (non powerusers for example - think "mom and pop") would simply sign up and leave the subscription going to ding their credit cards every month like they do with cable/satellite TV. People would have the advantage of not having a big outlay all at once, and of being able to manage things if money gets tight from the economy by turning off their subscriptions temporarily without losing the use of their PCs (just a little security - hey, it's their choice).

Just a thought...subscription models have worked for cell phones, cable, satellite, internet service, utilities, etc - why not software?

Costco is selling the Win7 HP 3 pack for a 125 bucks. Does not get any better than that. I also bought 2 Win7 Pro from Amazon when they were on special for 100 bucks each. Thought I might want virtual XP.

This is the only problem I found with Upgrade. If you are running Vista Ultra, like I was, you can not upgrade with a lower version of Win7. It tells you you have to boot off the install disk. No big deal, I wanted to reformat the HD anyway. The upgrade disk installed perfectly, and I finished installing all my other software. After that I activated, no problem. MS got it right.

1 Gateway Laptop
1 Asus P35 micro game server
2 Asus P6T i7

or by letting customers subscribe to operating system upgrades as an ongoing service.

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Brilliant idea. It was called XP.

The day this happens. I'm done with windows. I'll run ubuntu. In fact I'm probably half way to the point as of now.

One word - TechNet!

[QUOTE='[UPS]He's trying to solve a problem that doesn't exist....[/QUOTE]

This pretty much says it all.

Well there's a whole element to this that people are just not getting. If the OS upgrades went to a subscription service, the versioning of the software would be much more incremental. If they continued versioning windows as they do now, people would just subscribe to get the new version and the service packs, and cancel their subscription until there were new major updates. That model wouldn't work for any software house, so what they would have to do is make the license only active while the subscription was active. So the minute you don't pay your subscription fee, the OS locks you out until you pay. I'm sure 90% of consumers couldn't live in that world. I think the current market model is much better for consumers.

Subscription services is like gambling in Vegas. The house never actually loses. At least with buying a license at every new version, you as the consumer, can reject or accept the new version on a very concrete basis. With a subscription service, you're paying for the new version, whether you like it or not, so you're compelled to continue to subscribe or go to a different OS.

subscription already exists for corporate under software assurance:
http://www.microsoft.com/licensing/software-assurance/default.aspx

i foresee that being brought to the consumer level and through the internet as a delivery method. obviously not everyone will want it, but it's coming as a choice.

that's when i switch to *nix for my day2day usage lulz =). gaming though... still has to be on microsoft platform though =(.

re: gaming, actually that makes me consider consoles even more. i can't believe i'm admitting defeat but this really is another stab towards "death of PC gaming" as we know it as well, if we had to pay a subscription fee to maintain OS just so i can play PC games.

the-one1 said:

Agreed. When I read about someone's problems with Vista, I stop. Sh!t I hear laymans talk badly about Vista, even though they themselves don't know what a "web browser" is or what "right click" means.

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That's not the point which made me stop reading. It was the fact that he complains about all those "terrible" and "awful", free updates to Vista (including the service packs which, I dunno, seemed to make Vista a WHOLE LOT better than its RTM) and having to pay for Windows 7 (which he downplays as a mere update), yet he bitches about upgrade pricing and would rather see only full editions of Windows released, hence bending over and paying the "full" price for an OS upgrade. He makes less sense than a ranting and raving homeless man in downtown Santa Monica.

rodsfree said:

One word - TechNet!

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Silly Rabbit, Technet's for non-production environments.

doesn't anytime upgrade offer the ability to upgrade from vista to 7 at like the same price?? that would be logical, but overall the guy is really not taking the time to think. Buy the base OS, upgrade when available for minimal cost, updates are always free. The system in place already sounds more practical to me.

All I can say is don't name your kids after a species of beings from Stargate Atlantis.

DeChache said:

The day this happens. I'm done with windows. I'll run ubuntu. In fact I'm probably half way to the point as of now.

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Well Ubuntu is pretty much already doing this. The difference is the OS is priced right for this type of distribution.

"hey, I've spent the last 6 months off the teat, I think I want the latest security patches" so you reactivate, pay your $10 for that month, get all the latest stuff.

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One major flaw there, why pay $10 every month, when i can pay, stop paying the next month, wait for 6 months, then pay $10 and get everything updated, instead of paying $60 for that time..............

MrGuvernment said:

One major flaw there, why pay $10 every month, when i can pay, stop paying the next month, wait for 6 months, then pay $10 and get everything updated, instead of paying $60 for that time..............

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Its simple. On a subscription based license, they'd have to tie your license status to the subscription status. So when you stop paying, the license stops working. The only problem with that is, no consumer would want that.

So we're left with the realization that a subscription based license for an OS, wouldn't work for the average home or business consumer.

GushpinBob said:

Silly Rabbit, Technet's for non-production environments.

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And what does that matter to this guy??? He's obviously talking about his personal pc. "He bought the upgrade" the company he works for would have purchased the disk if it was for a work/production pc.
And I'd have to say that in his case, even his work pc shouldn't be considered a production pc.

this writer seriously needs to buy a HUGE butt-plug, cause he's clearly just talking out of his ass.....

klingonscum said:

At any point, you can decide to cancel the subscription. You don't LOSE your OS at that point, you just no longer are allowed to get the latest patches, updates, etc. At some point you may decide "hey, I've spent the last 6 months off the teat, I think I want the latest security patches" so you reactivate, pay your $10 for that month, get all the latest stuff. Very similar (but cheaper) to how your average MMORPG works.

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worst idea ever.

while that type of model may work fine for MMO's, it's not so good for something as important as an operating system. the problem with this model for an OS is that if the updates cost money each month, fewer people are going to be paying on a continuous monthly basis. fewer people paying for their monthly subscription = security flaws being out in the wild for longer = a MUCH larger problem with people's PC's getting taken over by botnets & the like. it would be completely irresponsible of MS to implement such a plan, knowing full well that people will do exactly this.

free updates/patches mean that people have far less to lose by upgrading, which means that more often than not, they will update when an update becomes available....which means that people's computers are more secure.

for anyone that has multiple computers, they don't HAVE to upgrade all of them to a newer OS all at once.....upgrade one when you have the money, then save again for a while until you have the money for upgrading the next computer, and so on & so forth. it's not exactly rocket science.

rodsfree said:

And what does that matter to this guy??? He's obviously talking about his personal pc. "He bought the upgrade" the company he works for would have purchased the disk if it was for a work/production pc.
And I'd have to say that in his case, even his work pc shouldn't be considered a production pc.

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TechNet can't be used in a personal environment. Only for "evaluation purposes".

This is bad because it effectively takes control out of the users hands and places the trust to the distributor. How do you stop the injection of malicious code? How do you stop false positives where the distributor thinks you may be pirating the OS when you really aren't. How does the distributor stop pirates from finding ways to consolidate the updates into executables and then just distribute them to the rest of the users that want them? This is going to be plagued with problems.