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Burned out with IT?
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Mister Natural
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Like I said I know I'm lucky. I know some have high stress levels due to various situations. Not in my case.
I've been in the IT field for going on 13 years now. I started on the Help Desk for a fortune 100 company. Moved up the ladder there until I found a psudo Systems Developer position. Ended up doing desktop support for a power utility company and am now doing Desktop Engineering for a financial company. And I've found something I really like to do. I've felt burned out in the past but am now finding my sweet spot of dealing with working 30-40 hours a week and having a boss that understands I'm looking to leave after working here 3+ years. In the mean time I try to spend as much time with my family (I have a wife and an 11mo old daughter). We'll see what happens from here.
I ticked I love IT, it's a piece of cake AND in comparison to other jobs I make good money (50K+ a year in Kansas City with no degree, student loans or credit debt.
)
I ticked I love IT, it's a piece of cake AND in comparison to other jobs I make good money (50K+ a year in Kansas City with no degree, student loans or credit debt.
)well the MD had a meeting on Friday with a computer contractor for them to put ideas forward for the company network (my job!)
The MD invited the contracted electrician (doesn't actually work for the company) and a guy who worked in IT 10 years ago. Both these guys think they know it all but after many years of discussions with them they only really know how to use a home computer. I wasn't invited.
The contractors come up with a few ideas
1.Terminal services for the remote sites (I have this installed already)
2. Exchange mail server (I was turned down due to cost so we now use Mailsite fusion)
3. Remove dansguardian / squid because its 8 years old now (no idea why they came to that conclusion)
4. Use per device licensing for DC (this is already the case)
5. Use corp. license for Word and Excel on terminal services (this is already how its setup, I don't think there is any other way to do it, VLK eOpen licenses have to be used for Terminal Services)
The MD loved the ideas they came up with and raved about them after the meeting! Its a shame he never listened to me as this is how its already setup. I know he won't listen to me about that either.
The consultants also told him that they "can't believe 1 guy has done all this alone with 150 users to support and a MPLS network to setup from scratch. Most businesses don't have 1 member of IT staff"
The MD went round the business saying they said that "they can't believe they have a member of IT staff as most people don't have 1. " (once again bad mouthing me to other members of Staff)
I have no idea why he is like this with me, he simply refuses to listen to me in any way. I could say "that is black" and he would say "no its while" then a guy next to me could say "this is black" and he would say "yes its is, correct"
The MD simply listens to what is said then twists it to means whatever he wants at that given time, he only hears what he wants to hear. He simply doesn't like the fact that he doesn't have 100% control over my life at all times. He called me at 3am once and I made it clear I was not happy, he went to my manger and complained. He lies, twists my words or some times simply makes things up.
I just don't know what to do. No matter what happens the new consultants will get the praise for all my hard work over the past 18 months. A total ground up rebuild for the server room, MPLS site to site connectivity, I sorted out their total mess of Microsoft licensing (they where far from being 100% legal), re-cable of all the sites and proper patch panels (they had CAT5 with RJ45s on both ends, one end would go into the switch in the server room the other to the office where it plugged into the PC and we are talking about a building with 3 floors here!), bandwidth monitoring, internet usage filtering and logs, backup schedules, hardware upgrades for the end users, managed switches and routers, email server with webmail, Nagios network monitoring, VMWare test server, Antivirus (they had none!), and a proper GPO to cut down access.
When I first started they had a desk with 1 server on it, no UPS, a $40 24 port switch and as I said before, CAT5 with RJ45 on each end run from the server room to each office. No GPO, no AV, No backup ,no licensing for anything other than 2000 server, no site to site connectivity, people with 2GB roaming profiles, no folder redirection, the server didn't even have a RAID setup for the disks, some users where just using the local admin account on the PC, A lot of the PCs where old PIII 800s with dodgy XP and office, no internet filtering, no firewall and worst of all they had no plan or idea what the hell to do and for this I am on $28,900 year.
Oh yes and the dodgy XP / Office and admin account setup for users was the work of the contracted electrician (the guy who was invited to the meeting instead of me)
10 years in IT and 5 years running IT departments and I end up in a situation like this!
Work that out!
The MD invited the contracted electrician (doesn't actually work for the company) and a guy who worked in IT 10 years ago. Both these guys think they know it all but after many years of discussions with them they only really know how to use a home computer. I wasn't invited.
The contractors come up with a few ideas
1.Terminal services for the remote sites (I have this installed already)
2. Exchange mail server (I was turned down due to cost so we now use Mailsite fusion)
3. Remove dansguardian / squid because its 8 years old now (no idea why they came to that conclusion)
4. Use per device licensing for DC (this is already the case)
5. Use corp. license for Word and Excel on terminal services (this is already how its setup, I don't think there is any other way to do it, VLK eOpen licenses have to be used for Terminal Services)
The MD loved the ideas they came up with and raved about them after the meeting! Its a shame he never listened to me as this is how its already setup. I know he won't listen to me about that either.
The consultants also told him that they "can't believe 1 guy has done all this alone with 150 users to support and a MPLS network to setup from scratch. Most businesses don't have 1 member of IT staff"
The MD went round the business saying they said that "they can't believe they have a member of IT staff as most people don't have 1. " (once again bad mouthing me to other members of Staff)
I have no idea why he is like this with me, he simply refuses to listen to me in any way. I could say "that is black" and he would say "no its while" then a guy next to me could say "this is black" and he would say "yes its is, correct"
The MD simply listens to what is said then twists it to means whatever he wants at that given time, he only hears what he wants to hear. He simply doesn't like the fact that he doesn't have 100% control over my life at all times. He called me at 3am once and I made it clear I was not happy, he went to my manger and complained. He lies, twists my words or some times simply makes things up.
I just don't know what to do. No matter what happens the new consultants will get the praise for all my hard work over the past 18 months. A total ground up rebuild for the server room, MPLS site to site connectivity, I sorted out their total mess of Microsoft licensing (they where far from being 100% legal), re-cable of all the sites and proper patch panels (they had CAT5 with RJ45s on both ends, one end would go into the switch in the server room the other to the office where it plugged into the PC and we are talking about a building with 3 floors here!), bandwidth monitoring, internet usage filtering and logs, backup schedules, hardware upgrades for the end users, managed switches and routers, email server with webmail, Nagios network monitoring, VMWare test server, Antivirus (they had none!), and a proper GPO to cut down access.
When I first started they had a desk with 1 server on it, no UPS, a $40 24 port switch and as I said before, CAT5 with RJ45 on each end run from the server room to each office. No GPO, no AV, No backup ,no licensing for anything other than 2000 server, no site to site connectivity, people with 2GB roaming profiles, no folder redirection, the server didn't even have a RAID setup for the disks, some users where just using the local admin account on the PC, A lot of the PCs where old PIII 800s with dodgy XP and office, no internet filtering, no firewall and worst of all they had no plan or idea what the hell to do and for this I am on $28,900 year.
Oh yes and the dodgy XP / Office and admin account setup for users was the work of the contracted electrician (the guy who was invited to the meeting instead of me)
10 years in IT and 5 years running IT departments and I end up in a situation like this!
Work that out!
Jay,
I really think it's time for you to polish your resume and find somewhere else. The work environment is similar to what I am experiencing currently as well. (Regardless of what I say, my boss checks with her outsourced networking guy, and makes it sound like it was HIS idea.)
You'll never get your MD to see it your way, best to just surrender & move on.
I really think it's time for you to polish your resume and find somewhere else. The work environment is similar to what I am experiencing currently as well. (Regardless of what I say, my boss checks with her outsourced networking guy, and makes it sound like it was HIS idea.)
You'll never get your MD to see it your way, best to just surrender & move on.
TechieSooner
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*Raises hand* I do that. Honestly never had a reason not to yet because I never physically move things around...
You've worked in IT for 10 years and making less than $30,000??? That stinks, honestly.
When you are running a 150 node network solo, taking 3AM calls, and the MD making your life as hard as possible, time to move on. Seriously.
Working conditions alone is grounds for leaving. Couple that with your terrible salary and you can easily find greener pastures.
TechieSooner
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Working for friends and family is always the biggest no-no you'll ever get in to.
I left IT it almost ruined my life. I had to put up with some of the worst people on earth. I love computers I love knowledge I just couldn't put up with the aholes. My job took me to some remote places I hated dealing with Red Neck ignorant bastards, speaking of which I certainly would gladly punch in the throat now. Just to pay the jerks back for all this stress, worries and general distress and anger they caused me. I hope they rot in hell, stew in their own hatred and racism.
Leave. I know it's easier said than done but that really seems like a crappy environment to work in, the pay alone is crappy, no offense. I left a gig a year ago where I was wearing fifteen different hats and my boss was in outer space, everyday was a nightmare. The pay was close to what you're making and I had it up to my ass with it. I gave them two weeks and left, I found another job making more money. I also started doing a lot more side work and am building that up currently because I would rather work for myself not far down the road.
TechieSooner
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Please, tell us how you feel
But seriously that's exactly the reason why I don't think I could do end-user desktop support for individuals anymore. Working inside my network at the company is controlled. I can control the environment and I know exactly what goes on.
But the second thing I hated is 90% of the job is just cleaning up the PC and installing Windows Updates. I realize you can charge for the time spent doing that but it's mind-numbingly boring work.
To the OP, If you can stand the end-users, definitely work for yourself.
Drawbacks is no company insurances, no steady paycheck, and PITA users.
Obviously the pluses you can refuse service to anyone, set your own hours and rate.
After doing this for about 3 years, its getting really repetitive. Scanning/removing malware, installing hardware, updating software - if the job market wasn't this bad, and I didn't need the money, then I'd look for another job or try various other jobs to see where I can get re-energized.
Plus its tiring when you come home from sitting infront of a computer(s) all day long, then sit infront of your personal computer(s).
Not to mention now that I'm working on a military base fixing computers, soldiers come up to me with the same stupid questions that civilians ask, but expect me to treat them with respect and give them my full attention when I'm in knee deep of trying to disassemble a laptop! (no offense to military people).
Plus its tiring when you come home from sitting infront of a computer(s) all day long, then sit infront of your personal computer(s).
Not to mention now that I'm working on a military base fixing computers, soldiers come up to me with the same stupid questions that civilians ask, but expect me to treat them with respect and give them my full attention when I'm in knee deep of trying to disassemble a laptop! (no offense to military people).
+1
I work as a contractor for IBM, and talk about red tape, wow nobody can't get any work done because of all the BS.
Now I realize why IBM sucks so bad, they have processes for going to the restroom that must follow! LOL it's stupid.
Oh and get this... IBM USES LOTUS NOTES for the email system! It sucks so bad, it never works.
TechieSooner
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I've said it in another thread lately too, I just dislike IBM.
It seems to me like they run on *old* hardware and software.
Yes it's technically "modern" but so little has changed through the years that it's hardly progression.
IMO IBM follows the "if it ain't broken, don't fix it" mentality to a strict rule. Why change your systems if you still have people to buy them as well as vendors that are (in hand) too lazy to write for a modern platform?
It seems to me like they run on *old* hardware and software.
Yes it's technically "modern" but so little has changed through the years that it's hardly progression.
IMO IBM follows the "if it ain't broken, don't fix it" mentality to a strict rule. Why change your systems if you still have people to buy them as well as vendors that are (in hand) too lazy to write for a modern platform?
The Spyder
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Jay_Oasis,
I am coming from almost an identical situation. I finally gave in last week and put in my 2 week notice. I could not do it any more. The owner of a small engineering firm was a friend of our family, my brother attended school with his son. For a short time my mother worked their as a office lady and every day I would get a ear full about how horrid the computer system was. I finally gave in and said just let me take a look. 3 years later at around $35k a yr part time and I am done. I turned down GOOD jobs to keep that place going. It was a great learning experience.
Days after I gave notice, a fellow employee found out and approached me for his recommendation to replace me. The owners idea was to train someone for daily stuff. He is not my ideal candidate or anyone you would want to have anything to do with IT. He couldn't install a heat sink properly on his new E8400... Apparently he talked to his boss and then the owner, convicing them he knows his stuff and took some basic networking classes and could easily do my job. One of the things he told me they talked about were offsite backups. He took 1 look at my server rack and asked if you just pull out the removable drives from the server and take them home... There is no money, no growth, and I for see this going very very badly.
When i started there were 27 computers, 17 users, 5 CMM machines, 2 CNC machines. 1 Windows Server 2003 with a raid 10 that kept crashing and Exchange 5.5 on NT4.0 running their outlook. I gutted EVERYTHING inculding the dead apc's, qwest dsl, and $50 switches. New servers, new switches, new AV, UTM, VPN, SBS2003, new file structure, backup servers, new workstations, documentation for everything. Hours and hours of work, mostly weekends to keep downtime to a minimum. The only thing thats going to save this wanna be tech is I spent the last 3 months prepping for this. Everything is fully automated for updates, new system installs, ect. Easy job in the world now. Just point, click, and go. What really ticks me off is I bet in 6 months he will go tell the boss how easy this job is. I will be out of state with a new cell number by then and when it goes down, I wont save them.
Get out of it before it gets worse. Let those other tech friends of his run a muck and when he comes calling, tell him he should have listened in the first place.
Am I burnt out of IT? No, amazingly. I love IT, I love the technology, the ever changing field, and the fast pace. I am burnt out from that company, but I will find another. Consulting is fun until then.
I am coming from almost an identical situation. I finally gave in last week and put in my 2 week notice. I could not do it any more. The owner of a small engineering firm was a friend of our family, my brother attended school with his son. For a short time my mother worked their as a office lady and every day I would get a ear full about how horrid the computer system was. I finally gave in and said just let me take a look. 3 years later at around $35k a yr part time and I am done. I turned down GOOD jobs to keep that place going. It was a great learning experience.
Days after I gave notice, a fellow employee found out and approached me for his recommendation to replace me. The owners idea was to train someone for daily stuff. He is not my ideal candidate or anyone you would want to have anything to do with IT. He couldn't install a heat sink properly on his new E8400... Apparently he talked to his boss and then the owner, convicing them he knows his stuff and took some basic networking classes and could easily do my job. One of the things he told me they talked about were offsite backups. He took 1 look at my server rack and asked if you just pull out the removable drives from the server and take them home... There is no money, no growth, and I for see this going very very badly.
When i started there were 27 computers, 17 users, 5 CMM machines, 2 CNC machines. 1 Windows Server 2003 with a raid 10 that kept crashing and Exchange 5.5 on NT4.0 running their outlook. I gutted EVERYTHING inculding the dead apc's, qwest dsl, and $50 switches. New servers, new switches, new AV, UTM, VPN, SBS2003, new file structure, backup servers, new workstations, documentation for everything. Hours and hours of work, mostly weekends to keep downtime to a minimum. The only thing thats going to save this wanna be tech is I spent the last 3 months prepping for this. Everything is fully automated for updates, new system installs, ect. Easy job in the world now. Just point, click, and go. What really ticks me off is I bet in 6 months he will go tell the boss how easy this job is. I will be out of state with a new cell number by then and when it goes down, I wont save them.
Get out of it before it gets worse. Let those other tech friends of his run a muck and when he comes calling, tell him he should have listened in the first place.
Am I burnt out of IT? No, amazingly. I love IT, I love the technology, the ever changing field, and the fast pace. I am burnt out from that company, but I will find another. Consulting is fun until then
.TechieSooner
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dragontales
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It was kind of stressful for me when I worked at my last job as a on-site IT technician. I ran all over the Bay Area going to customer sites doing everything imaginable. It was virus/spyware removal. It was software installation and troubleshooting. It was setting up remote software and file sharing. It was Exchange server setup and maintenance. The traveling and deadlines were taking a toll. Some customers were completely asinine. There were some really nice customers as well.
The current agency that I am working for is pretty relax and chill. Now I support about 300 internal users at 3 different offices. The IT manager does not micro-manage and I love that. The department gets along nicely. We are on Server 2003, AD, and Exchange 2003. Pretty much all the settings are in the GPO and we just tweak it whenever we have to. My stress level has definitely dropped. Don't get me wrong, there are still those days where nothing goes right. And some users still drive me up the wall. I'll take a nice vacation if I start to feel overwhelmed.
The current agency that I am working for is pretty relax and chill. Now I support about 300 internal users at 3 different offices. The IT manager does not micro-manage and I love that. The department gets along nicely. We are on Server 2003, AD, and Exchange 2003. Pretty much all the settings are in the GPO and we just tweak it whenever we have to. My stress level has definitely dropped. Don't get me wrong, there are still those days where nothing goes right. And some users still drive me up the wall. I'll take a nice vacation if I start to feel overwhelmed.
Vermillion
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Right now I'm not burnt out and I love the IT field.
4 years ago though I was horribly burnt out. I was the lone sysadmin. 70-80+ hours a week. No overtime. Had no idea what a weekend was anymore, much less what a bed was. Normally made it to the couch after another 17 hour day and passed out. Trips into Washington, DC to deal with demos. Dealt with production issues on two separate systems for two different government agencies. Dealing with 107 end users who could code and chat on Yahoo messenger (which I finally got permission to ban after 14 months) but didn't know how to map a printer. 29 servers with a mix of Windows and Redhat Linux Advanced Server all with Apache and Oracle 8i or Oracle 9i. Citrix servers, hardware VPN's, Exchange, all the Domain Controllers. Oh and maintained the VoIP system.
Such a mess...and life was hell. Best day was putting in my resignation (only gave them a week's notice because I hated them so much) and watching management scramble around like a chicken with their head cut off because I sure as hell wasn't doing anymore work.
Never again will I do that. If I had been working like that when I met my fiance I wouldn't be engaged right now because I wouldn't have been able to even have a relationship.
4 years ago though I was horribly burnt out. I was the lone sysadmin. 70-80+ hours a week. No overtime. Had no idea what a weekend was anymore, much less what a bed was. Normally made it to the couch after another 17 hour day and passed out. Trips into Washington, DC to deal with demos. Dealt with production issues on two separate systems for two different government agencies. Dealing with 107 end users who could code and chat on Yahoo messenger (which I finally got permission to ban after 14 months) but didn't know how to map a printer. 29 servers with a mix of Windows and Redhat Linux Advanced Server all with Apache and Oracle 8i or Oracle 9i. Citrix servers, hardware VPN's, Exchange, all the Domain Controllers. Oh and maintained the VoIP system.
Such a mess...and life was hell. Best day was putting in my resignation (only gave them a week's notice because I hated them so much) and watching management scramble around like a chicken with their head cut off because I sure as hell wasn't doing anymore work.
Never again will I do that. If I had been working like that when I met my fiance I wouldn't be engaged right now because I wouldn't have been able to even have a relationship.
That's been my story so far
There's many variables in deciding that, like if you own a home, have bills, have a family. I managed to get into another place with a higher salary and I get to learn new things. I've seen some people stick with a low paying gig for several years to learn new things and got stuck there. Job market gets harder the older you get and anybody who says otherwise is full of shit, I don't care how much you know.
requiemnoise
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Not necessary. Many large companies have many legacy equipments from 20 years ago. If a budget is small, why would you hire a new grad who only knows XP/VISTA?
While I don't doubt the existence of age-ism, I'd expect you don't really run in to it until your 50s, and even then only if you aren't planning right.
I am far more useful to an organization now than I was 10 years ago. Not only in my technical skill, but also in my management skills as well as my people skills. In another 10 years, I expect the same to be true ( and my salary to reflect the 10 more years of experience I have ).
When I'm in my 50s, I will still have a place to go because I continually learn and adapt. Perhaps more importantly, I become better at working with people. That's probably the key.
requiemnoise
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I believe all the old techs need to focus on the assets you provide. Most of us seem to be part of the support organization, which is IT. We exist to support the functionality of the business. We also know how to balance the old and new technology. That is a great asset to many companies. Having the ability to have more clear views of the future and past will give you a step up advantage for budgeting. Look at the current economic crisis. If you are a hiring manager, who would you hire? Who is the better bang for the buck?
Vermillion
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Well Vermillion, this gives me hope.
How so?
requiemnoise
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The issue with current status of IT is we allowed ourselves to be based around Microsoft technology. If MS provides a faulty product, PC vendors profit margin drop. If the demand for PC drops, there are less need for consultants and contractors. If the resource and usage of LAN equipments are steady, there is no need to upgrade your Cisco and other LAN gears. The issue with behavior of the market place is we have been focused around one company to dictate the market place. The technology wasnt diversified enough to gain more projects that can clearly show and outline the ROI for the management. Most people assume a homogenous environment will save them money in a long run, but also it reduces the project ratio. Also, people are starting to get a habit of monotonous advancement in the technology, because we are so custom to seeing the same changes. We are no longer showing the valid reason to show that new technology will bring the better ROI.
YeOldeStonecat
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Why do you make it sound like there's a drop, or bad thing?
Regardless of if MS provided a faulty product or not.....
There are life cycles for computers, replacement cycles
Maintaining/expanding networks, servers
Maintaining security
Product upgrades for line of business software (a big one)
Supporting staff, remote users
In SMB consulting...I'm beyond balls to the wall..this year has gotten me past the comfort level. There's not enough of us around here..the demand is huge.
Recession? Maybe for those working for big fortune 500/enterprise..but I sure don't see a drop in the needs for consultants around my area.
requiemnoise
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Very true, but the corporations that require large amount licenses tend to utilize their licenses until they are close to their expiration. Unless, there is a significant increase in the new products that will bring a better ROI.
I can't say the same thing for mid to large corporations.
Maybe, I should refocus my plans, but the current market is changing fast in other industries.
You shoudn't bash people in your sig for doing the same shit you do...*wink-*wink*
Vermillion
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http://www.hardforum.com/showthread.php?t=1386511&page=12
Claimed I was a pretender and a teen, because he didn't like my views...the same shit klob did.
Too bad many large companies aren't hiring but laying people off.
Also, with a small to medium business you can either hire the guy with 20 years experience and pay him out the ass. The other option is hire a guy with 5 years experience who knows what you need him to know and pay him a lot less. Not saying I agree with this plan but it happens often.
The direction i'm leaning in, i've already decided my own consulting business is the way I want to go and have been working toward it.
requiemnoise
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So what is your plan to get the clients for the small business market? Mid to large firms, you can always start as a contractor and once the contract expires, renegotiated the contract as independent. It is an easy process.
I don't see how Microsoft has anything to do with the drop off in the IT job sector. I would wonder if you just don't like Microsoft software, but then again that isn' t the point of this thread.
I'm surprised to see that so many SMB are looking for services. I can't find a job anywhere, granted I live in Michigan, so its probably the worst for me. In regards to ageism I would argue its the opposite, everyone I've interview with seems upset that I'm 23 and don't have 10 years experience managing AD and Citrix for a simple low level tech support job. Everyone seems to want a 15 year veteran and is willing to offer little pay, so I can't imagine why you'd have an issue with ageism, if anything I'd imagine lowballing would be the bigger deal.
Where is the SMB market booming? I might have to pack my bags and hitchhike there.
I'm surprised to see that so many SMB are looking for services. I can't find a job anywhere, granted I live in Michigan, so its probably the worst for me. In regards to ageism I would argue its the opposite, everyone I've interview with seems upset that I'm 23 and don't have 10 years experience managing AD and Citrix for a simple low level tech support job. Everyone seems to want a 15 year veteran and is willing to offer little pay, so I can't imagine why you'd have an issue with ageism, if anything I'd imagine lowballing would be the bigger deal.
Where is the SMB market booming? I might have to pack my bags and hitchhike there.
YeOldeStonecat
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I'm in New England....southeast Connecticut specifically.
TechieSooner
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Join the hundreds that have added the guy to their iggy lists... Seriously though, ignoring the trolls has actually made it more enjoyable around here.
You hit the nail on the head on both counts actually...
As far as I know Microsoft didn't make VoIP systems, routers, switches, patch panels, etc.
Microsoft is just the darn OS and maybe a few peripherals.
The problem I've seen about hiring someone that's 50 or 60+ is lack of staying on top of the latest technology. It seems to me most older sysadmins start learning about technology through the media, because 90% of them just regurgitate all the crap we've heard about Vista.
That and what may have been viable solutions in the past don't work so well nowadays.
IMO I prefer younger types
I will say most of those don't hang around places like this. So most anyone on here would be exceptions to the rule.
The Spyder
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I just got a full tuition to attend a Private University up in WA, im going to do it. Hopefully their hiring freeze will be gone shortly and I will also have a job .
.