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30 Days with Mac OS X @ [H]
- Thread starter Jason_Wall
- Start date
As I Lay Dying
Gawd
- Joined
- Aug 8, 2005
- Messages
- 975
Might be worth mentioning, seeing as how some of the complaints are lodged towards the perhipheral useage:
The HP LaserJet 1020 is indeed completely incompatible with Mac OS X. I can also say that this is entirely HP's fault rather than Apple's because practically every other HP printer is Mac OS X compatible, and HP's lack of support for this printer was completely inexplicable and unexplainable (I work on a university campus where we sell Mac and Windows machines, and I recall everyone saying, "Why would HP do that? All the other LaserJet's work with Mac..."). I can most certainly say, "This is one of the few."
I have noticed occasional issues with external hard drives with Mac OS, in spite of formatting (my Lacie D2 120GB is formatted for NTFS, and it works fine via FireWire on both my Mac and Windows machines). What I saw around the time of Mac OS 10.3 that many hard drives required a firmware update for better compatibility with Mac OS. I have no idea what change Apple made to the OS, but I did notice my external hard drive did disappear from the desktop for a while (though System Profiler still saw it) until I performed the firmware update.
As for the review itself:
Although I have been a Mac user since 1986 when my parents bought a Macintosh SE and I am very fond of the OS as it is these days, many of the caveats pointed out are quite true. It's tied to hardware that is not upgradeable unless you go whole hog and get a MacPro, and even there your choices are limited in some aspects (there are all of three graphics card options, for example, and very few people would see benefit from a Xeon-based computer in general). From an enthusiast-switcher's aspect, it's a hard pill to swallow when you consider you have to buy new hardware, new software, and, sometimes, new accessories just to get a similar set-up with Mac OS as you did with your Windows machine (Note: I emphasize the term 'enthusiast-switcher' because, as a retailer who has met his fair share of switchers, many non-enthusiast customers take the purchase of new accessories and software in stride with any computer purchase for various reasons, so this fact is not as much of a roadblock as it is to the hardcore PC enthusiast). Lastly, like the lack of viruses and malware, Mac's lack good games and freeware mostly because of the sole reason that there's are scant few large developers who see profit in developing for Mac.
The one great thing that I don't think came through very well in this article, though I did see it alluded to a few times, is that, at the very least, Apple customers get OS support. This cannot be said by any other PC manufactuer. If you call tech support for any other manufacturer, you may or may not reach someone who knows anything about Windows short of what they have been trained to know or something that is hardware specific to their product. Most Apple technicians know everything about the OS (again, I know this from experience as a reseller). Then again, a tech support call never really was part of the review, so I guess this aspect wasn't really tested.
Anyway, [H] gave Apple a fair shake. The Bottom Line is a little slanted towards the PC enthusiast, and I know many people who would probably benefit from having a Mac instead of a Windows PC, but, from the point of view from most who read this website, it's a pretty realistic view.
The HP LaserJet 1020 is indeed completely incompatible with Mac OS X. I can also say that this is entirely HP's fault rather than Apple's because practically every other HP printer is Mac OS X compatible, and HP's lack of support for this printer was completely inexplicable and unexplainable (I work on a university campus where we sell Mac and Windows machines, and I recall everyone saying, "Why would HP do that? All the other LaserJet's work with Mac..."). I can most certainly say, "This is one of the few."
I have noticed occasional issues with external hard drives with Mac OS, in spite of formatting (my Lacie D2 120GB is formatted for NTFS, and it works fine via FireWire on both my Mac and Windows machines). What I saw around the time of Mac OS 10.3 that many hard drives required a firmware update for better compatibility with Mac OS. I have no idea what change Apple made to the OS, but I did notice my external hard drive did disappear from the desktop for a while (though System Profiler still saw it) until I performed the firmware update.
As for the review itself:
Although I have been a Mac user since 1986 when my parents bought a Macintosh SE and I am very fond of the OS as it is these days, many of the caveats pointed out are quite true. It's tied to hardware that is not upgradeable unless you go whole hog and get a MacPro, and even there your choices are limited in some aspects (there are all of three graphics card options, for example, and very few people would see benefit from a Xeon-based computer in general). From an enthusiast-switcher's aspect, it's a hard pill to swallow when you consider you have to buy new hardware, new software, and, sometimes, new accessories just to get a similar set-up with Mac OS as you did with your Windows machine (Note: I emphasize the term 'enthusiast-switcher' because, as a retailer who has met his fair share of switchers, many non-enthusiast customers take the purchase of new accessories and software in stride with any computer purchase for various reasons, so this fact is not as much of a roadblock as it is to the hardcore PC enthusiast). Lastly, like the lack of viruses and malware, Mac's lack good games and freeware mostly because of the sole reason that there's are scant few large developers who see profit in developing for Mac.
The one great thing that I don't think came through very well in this article, though I did see it alluded to a few times, is that, at the very least, Apple customers get OS support. This cannot be said by any other PC manufactuer. If you call tech support for any other manufacturer, you may or may not reach someone who knows anything about Windows short of what they have been trained to know or something that is hardware specific to their product. Most Apple technicians know everything about the OS (again, I know this from experience as a reseller). Then again, a tech support call never really was part of the review, so I guess this aspect wasn't really tested.
Anyway, [H] gave Apple a fair shake. The Bottom Line is a little slanted towards the PC enthusiast, and I know many people who would probably benefit from having a Mac instead of a Windows PC, but, from the point of view from most who read this website, it's a pretty realistic view.
Brian Boyko
[H] Consumer Editor
- Joined
- Sep 27, 2005
- Messages
- 345
Mentioned on Page 5
H.264 will give you better results (provided you have a current Mac that can run it).
Sure it will. You have several options for doing this, ranging from sharing through iTunes to setting your music library to reside on a mapped drive.
Sure they do. For finding pictures at a glance choose the icon view -- it's the first button in the Finder window (aside from back/forward). Use column view and it'll give you a live preview of whatever you've clicked on, regardless of media type.
wouldnt that be a symbolic link and not a shortcut?
Not in that case, no. Unix symlinks are different, and are only created directly in shell. The finder uses a different system.
bigstusexy
2[H]4U
- Joined
- Jan 28, 2002
- Messages
- 3,194
I read this limitation and I have the following question.
Can you drop down the command line and mount something in your home folder path? I'm assuming mount points in os x are like mount points in Linux.
Can you drop down the command line and mount something in your home folder path? I'm assuming mount points in os x are like mount points in Linux.
As I Lay Dying
Gawd
- Joined
- Aug 8, 2005
- Messages
- 975
yes I believe you can mount to a folder just like in *nix. I maybe mistaken though.
It was a reasonable shake, but it was more focused on what might happen to the uninitiated who take Apple's cheapest non-upgraded entry-level system as a valid starting point (likewise accepting the touted PPC compatibility at face value, naiveté about Java and X11 apps, etc). Which is a fair enough thing to assess, but if the average [H] Enthusiast user can whip XP and Vista into shape, a more appropriate [H] article would display a similar level of expertise in exploiting the strengths and exposing the weaknesses of OSX. Anand did this well. This one dwelt too much on how crappy things can get if you don't know what you should have done (or weren't willing to pony up to do it), which, while useful, is a less relevant exercise for _this_ context. It reads like more of an [H] Consumer foray, with a focus on student-esque thrift requirements.
D
Deleted member 134608
Guest
Yes the HD Fantastic Four 2 trailer looked very nice. Too bad it won't play full screen for free....
I am a total MAC n00b, and having to find and change settings for some rudimentary functionality is ridiculous. I am sick of the "all you had to do is click here, here and here or why didn't you install blah blah..." comments.
Come on now! Why does the "easiest" OS make me feel like a complete moron?!! I mean I had to ask our shop's MAC geek how to find another computer on the network! There is no idiot "Network" icon on the desktop or dashboard and trying to be g33ky and typing "\\PCNAME\FOLDER" didn't work in finder either. I mean I seriously need a manual for this thing....wtf
bigstusexy
2[H]4U
- Joined
- Jan 28, 2002
- Messages
- 3,194
I'd like to know, for certain, would that allow front row more access to other storage. Not a pressing matter just would like to know.
idividebyzero
Gawd
- Joined
- Feb 5, 2007
- Messages
- 578
I think OS X is over rated by a lot of people. Ive used Macs for years and at home I use "osx86" on my PC, which I dual boot Vista and OS X on. I think the best comparison can be a luxury car vs a truck. OS X has a lot of nice luxury features, like dashboard and expose, I like them a lot and wished Windows had something that was remotely as smooth and fast. Windows on the other hand just does so much more stuff, both OS settings and software choice. OS X will get you to the furniture store in comfort but it wont let you take the couch home like Windows can.
For me iLife isnt a big deal, I messed around with Garage Band but the other programs I have never used other than opening them up to see what they are like. I have iPhoto installed since it may come in handy one day.
The biggest downside I think OS X has for home use is the lack of a good file sharing solution. Im far from a major file sharer, I might get something once a week, if that, but its enough to be really annoying if Im currently in OS X. Theres BT but BT just sucks so FREAKING bad on OSX, theres no good BT program available, not a single one. Azureus is ghetto on a mac, Transmission has a killer interface but is pretty much featureless and very slow, even Azureus manages to be extremely slow compared to its Windows counterpart (I rarely break 25k/s, I may hit 125k/s for about 10 seconds). A disturbing amount of mac BT clients are banned from many trackers as well, these programmers need to get their act together and stop using banned technology that hammers the server. For non BT file sharing your choices are even more limited, if you are lucky enough to have your favorite program be available for mac then chances are the app is a horrible piece of buggy crap that looks like something from OS 6.
OS X is good but so is Windows, they just manage to be good at different things. I think Mac users who make fun of Windows live in an idealogical world. OS X might actually be a lot better than Windows if it did the same amount of things since OS X usually does things better. But in the real world OS X simply doesnt do as much as Windows, so doing things better is a moot point. Theres a big difference between what could be possible and what really is possible.
Im not sure which OS I like better, they are both pretty even when you look at the big picture. Right now Im back in Vista, but the past 3 weeks have been just OS X.
For me iLife isnt a big deal, I messed around with Garage Band but the other programs I have never used other than opening them up to see what they are like. I have iPhoto installed since it may come in handy one day.
The biggest downside I think OS X has for home use is the lack of a good file sharing solution. Im far from a major file sharer, I might get something once a week, if that, but its enough to be really annoying if Im currently in OS X. Theres BT but BT just sucks so FREAKING bad on OSX, theres no good BT program available, not a single one. Azureus is ghetto on a mac, Transmission has a killer interface but is pretty much featureless and very slow, even Azureus manages to be extremely slow compared to its Windows counterpart (I rarely break 25k/s, I may hit 125k/s for about 10 seconds). A disturbing amount of mac BT clients are banned from many trackers as well, these programmers need to get their act together and stop using banned technology that hammers the server. For non BT file sharing your choices are even more limited, if you are lucky enough to have your favorite program be available for mac then chances are the app is a horrible piece of buggy crap that looks like something from OS 6.
OS X is good but so is Windows, they just manage to be good at different things. I think Mac users who make fun of Windows live in an idealogical world. OS X might actually be a lot better than Windows if it did the same amount of things since OS X usually does things better. But in the real world OS X simply doesnt do as much as Windows, so doing things better is a moot point. Theres a big difference between what could be possible and what really is possible.
Im not sure which OS I like better, they are both pretty even when you look at the big picture. Right now Im back in Vista, but the past 3 weeks have been just OS X.
I'm confused why people always talk about having to make a "choice", like you can have only one computer.
I'm an enthusiast, and I have about two dozen computers that span over 20 years of computing. My *main* computing is done on a heavily upgraded dual G4 and two custom built PCs running XP x64. I don't have to choose one or the other, and if they don't do what I need, I have an HP PA-RISC workstation running HP-UX and an SGI running IRIX. And all my TV shows get recorded by Ubuntu Linux.
No true computing enthusiast uses only one platform.
InorganicMatter
[H]F Junkie
- Joined
- Oct 19, 2004
- Messages
- 15,461
Exactly. It's just that Linux and Windows combined can do everything OSX can, and a lot cheaper.
I'm a bit disappointed that the desktop hardware tested was a Mac mini. The rest of Apple's hardware line is great, but the mini is admittedly crap. A few extra dollars gets you an iMac that is specced way better than the mini is. Poor value with its current CPU and half gig of RAM.
It is too bad that a better version of the mini doesn't exist. Why did you decide not to test out an iMac? Was it because it already has a monitor attached? It costs less than the Macbook tested and has higher specs at the same time.
I know for myself that I'm getting a 24" iMac with a second monitor to replace my ancient G4 for my editing workstation later this year. For my purposes it is all I need (a Mac Pro is way overkill, imo).
Anyway, just curious because the decisions you made struck me as odd.
It is too bad that a better version of the mini doesn't exist. Why did you decide not to test out an iMac? Was it because it already has a monitor attached? It costs less than the Macbook tested and has higher specs at the same time.
I know for myself that I'm getting a 24" iMac with a second monitor to replace my ancient G4 for my editing workstation later this year. For my purposes it is all I need (a Mac Pro is way overkill, imo).
Anyway, just curious because the decisions you made struck me as odd.
Great article. Some tips/pieces of info
-- All Intel Laptops from Apple support two finger scrolling and right clicking (without the use of the control key) Go to the System Preferences for these options (under Keyboard and Mouse)
-- I have an LIDE 30 scanner and it works fine. Cannon could use some help with their software page. The drivers add nothing but the ability of their app (and others) to recognize the scanner. You must download their scanning toolbox, the drivers, and the TWAIN drivers all separately. A nuisance, I know.. (Or, had you kept your CD, you would have found the installer on that)
-- The default install for the MacBook does not just include the OS, which takes about 40 minutes - but all the bundled apps, which take the extra hour. You can choose to just install the OS, which is what you would get with a boxed copy of the OS. Until 10.5 comes out, however, you cannot buy an OS that will run on Intel - you can only get that with a new computer.
-- I have used NeoOffice extensively, and have never had a problem with Italics. Not sure what problem you were having.
-- The extent of freeware for the Mac that IS quality blows me away. I have never found stuff half as good on Windows. I am a developer and am in both everyday... You talked about Adium - there is no better client on any platform for free. Period. How about Cyberduck, ffview for comic book files, Colloquy (which you mention), Transmission (you mention), Max, XAct (audio tools) etc. etc. Check out http://osx.hyperjeff.net/Apps/ for one of the most exhaustive lists of software for the mac (as of right now, 17,886 titles) listed by category, license, platform. You will find free apps of every type, INCLUDING word processing, and many of them with the fit and polish that Mac Apps have. You noted how nicely Adium's install works - so many Mac Apps pride themselves on that fit and polish in both iunstallation and ease of use - again, I have found the quality of freeware on the Mac to be as good if not better than any other platform...
-- iChat and Safari have a wealth of free/not free enhancements that add multiple great features. Check out "chax" for iChat, "Saft" for Safari (and AcidSearch)
-- MacPorts sucks, and unfortunately can screw up your files. Stick with Fink.
-- On that same note, when you install the Mac OS X11 is available as a custom install option.
-- while getting Flip4Mac is an option for saving the WMV files as MOV, so is QuickTime Player full license or any other FREE app that can SAVE QuickTime movies. Here is one: http://www.major-k.de/downloade.html
Flip4Mac figured they'd charge you $30 because Apple does (for QT Player). What their program does that other do not is encode INTO WMV, but from WMV is free You just need any quicktime app that saves QT files
-- Replacing the hard drive and RAM in a MacBook Pro is, I believe, the easiest on any laptop ever made. Search YouTube for a video tutorial. NONE can match it for simplicity, and I mean none....
-- Well written (and well behaved) applications should slink into practically NO memory nor CPU usage when all their documents are closed, negating the need to actually "quit" them. Unfortunately, not all apps are like this
-- NTFS can be read, but not written to. With free tools from Google, you can read and write NTFS. While the Mac can read NTFS and read and write FAT32, I wish Windows could at least natively read HFS+
-- USB Overdrive can be used to get most joysticks to work, and I would be surrised that the gamepad you used did not show up automatically in a game. One thing that makes the Mac different than PC is you get no message saying "You have just inserted a Joystick" and then "Wait while I search for drivers" and then "Your joystick is now ready to use". Usually, you plug it in, launch your game, and the joystick is available. Did you check to make sure it did not just appear in the games?
-- I agree with you on the price point wholeheartedly. I am hoping Apple does away with the Mini and replaces it with a compact box with desktop class components (hard drives, video cards) and creates an easier user upgradeable system. I think they would sell TONS of them
I hope you find this information useful. Thank you for the article.
-- All Intel Laptops from Apple support two finger scrolling and right clicking (without the use of the control key) Go to the System Preferences for these options (under Keyboard and Mouse)
-- I have an LIDE 30 scanner and it works fine. Cannon could use some help with their software page. The drivers add nothing but the ability of their app (and others) to recognize the scanner. You must download their scanning toolbox, the drivers, and the TWAIN drivers all separately. A nuisance, I know.. (Or, had you kept your CD, you would have found the installer on that)
-- The default install for the MacBook does not just include the OS, which takes about 40 minutes - but all the bundled apps, which take the extra hour. You can choose to just install the OS, which is what you would get with a boxed copy of the OS. Until 10.5 comes out, however, you cannot buy an OS that will run on Intel - you can only get that with a new computer.
-- I have used NeoOffice extensively, and have never had a problem with Italics. Not sure what problem you were having.
-- The extent of freeware for the Mac that IS quality blows me away. I have never found stuff half as good on Windows. I am a developer and am in both everyday... You talked about Adium - there is no better client on any platform for free. Period. How about Cyberduck, ffview for comic book files, Colloquy (which you mention), Transmission (you mention), Max, XAct (audio tools) etc. etc. Check out http://osx.hyperjeff.net/Apps/ for one of the most exhaustive lists of software for the mac (as of right now, 17,886 titles) listed by category, license, platform. You will find free apps of every type, INCLUDING word processing, and many of them with the fit and polish that Mac Apps have. You noted how nicely Adium's install works - so many Mac Apps pride themselves on that fit and polish in both iunstallation and ease of use - again, I have found the quality of freeware on the Mac to be as good if not better than any other platform...
-- iChat and Safari have a wealth of free/not free enhancements that add multiple great features. Check out "chax" for iChat, "Saft" for Safari (and AcidSearch)
-- MacPorts sucks, and unfortunately can screw up your files. Stick with Fink.
-- On that same note, when you install the Mac OS X11 is available as a custom install option.
-- while getting Flip4Mac is an option for saving the WMV files as MOV, so is QuickTime Player full license or any other FREE app that can SAVE QuickTime movies. Here is one: http://www.major-k.de/downloade.html
Flip4Mac figured they'd charge you $30 because Apple does (for QT Player). What their program does that other do not is encode INTO WMV, but from WMV is free You just need any quicktime app that saves QT files
-- Replacing the hard drive and RAM in a MacBook Pro is, I believe, the easiest on any laptop ever made. Search YouTube for a video tutorial. NONE can match it for simplicity, and I mean none....
-- Well written (and well behaved) applications should slink into practically NO memory nor CPU usage when all their documents are closed, negating the need to actually "quit" them. Unfortunately, not all apps are like this
-- NTFS can be read, but not written to. With free tools from Google, you can read and write NTFS. While the Mac can read NTFS and read and write FAT32, I wish Windows could at least natively read HFS+
-- USB Overdrive can be used to get most joysticks to work, and I would be surrised that the gamepad you used did not show up automatically in a game. One thing that makes the Mac different than PC is you get no message saying "You have just inserted a Joystick" and then "Wait while I search for drivers" and then "Your joystick is now ready to use". Usually, you plug it in, launch your game, and the joystick is available. Did you check to make sure it did not just appear in the games?
-- I agree with you on the price point wholeheartedly. I am hoping Apple does away with the Mini and replaces it with a compact box with desktop class components (hard drives, video cards) and creates an easier user upgradeable system. I think they would sell TONS of them
I hope you find this information useful. Thank you for the article.
As I Lay Dying
Gawd
- Joined
- Aug 8, 2005
- Messages
- 975
not so I use all three.....as well right now my secondary computer is dual booting xubuntu and plan 9.......each OS has there perks, and uses. Seriously ultimately it boils down to personal preference, I can do 98% of the same in the other OS's. Somethings I can do in one I can't in the other two and vice versa.
I for one think this is a great article. I myself am quite comfortable in both Windows and Mac OS (even in 9.0), but as an operating system, my preference lies with Mac OS. What I find to be lacking in Mac OS, and some of the systems Apple sells, is what I'd call the middle-ground: the space between basic usage and professional usage that one might call "enthusiast usage". It is in this space that Brian calls his home, and it's an interesting gap in the Apple line in terms of both hardware and software.
That being said, I think evaluating on the Mac mini, given the perspective of the article, was a mistake. There is a place and a base suitable for the mini, but is not for those looking to really push the limits of their systems. It's a solid machine for basic productivity, given that it has a gig of RAM or more, but it's the hardware component that makes OS X fall short in achieving some of the tasks Brian set out to do, and I think OS X takes some of the blame for those shortcomings. I also feel that so much energy was focused into the "bad" and the "ugly" sections of the conclusion, while the pros were almost instantly dismissed, like a father trying very hard to dissuade his children from sighting at a petting zoo while he drives by on their way to a funeral. I suppose this is due to Brian's familiarity of the OS and what it entails, and that's a little unfortunate. A very large portion of the article itself speaks of many of the great aspects of OS X, but the conclusion just tries to skim the surface of those aspects, barely hinting at them, really, while focusing most of the attention toward the negatives.
I suppose that, having read the entire article, the conclusion is the only portion I find fault with, because it doesn't do an adequate job of summarizing Brian's experiences. There are a couple minor factual issues, but nothing that would impact a reader's decision, and so are not really worth concern.
That being said, I think evaluating on the Mac mini, given the perspective of the article, was a mistake. There is a place and a base suitable for the mini, but is not for those looking to really push the limits of their systems. It's a solid machine for basic productivity, given that it has a gig of RAM or more, but it's the hardware component that makes OS X fall short in achieving some of the tasks Brian set out to do, and I think OS X takes some of the blame for those shortcomings. I also feel that so much energy was focused into the "bad" and the "ugly" sections of the conclusion, while the pros were almost instantly dismissed, like a father trying very hard to dissuade his children from sighting at a petting zoo while he drives by on their way to a funeral. I suppose this is due to Brian's familiarity of the OS and what it entails, and that's a little unfortunate. A very large portion of the article itself speaks of many of the great aspects of OS X, but the conclusion just tries to skim the surface of those aspects, barely hinting at them, really, while focusing most of the attention toward the negatives.
I suppose that, having read the entire article, the conclusion is the only portion I find fault with, because it doesn't do an adequate job of summarizing Brian's experiences. There are a couple minor factual issues, but nothing that would impact a reader's decision, and so are not really worth concern.
if you buy ram directly from apple, you're just an idiot. since the hardware's the same as PC's, the ram's also the same, and consequently, so are the prices. I added 2 GB of ram to my macbook for $90. actual macbook ram priceA) upgrading to 1GB from Dell only costs $60 (try to get it that cheap from Apple
well, the putty knife thing IS annoying, but it does NOT void your warranty.
He also tested a Macbook. This is how easy it is to install RAM and an HD in a MacBook
YouTube Installation video
YouTube Installation video
I dunno, I find a lot to disagree with in this article.
For one, I had to laugh at you calling NeoOffice an X11 app... where the entire point of the NeoOffice port is to be independent of X11 (and indeed it requires nothing).
Also, the lack of quality freeware too I just don't subscribe to... ever hear of www.opensourcemac.org ?
I used Windows for about a decade before finally trying out the Mac side and I haven't looked back. IMO the freeware available blows Windows away in almost every aspect (mostly in that they all follow usual OS X user interface paradigms and don't try to do too much) but really... there are tons of freeware apps.
How much time did you spend on http://www.pure-mac.com/ ?
Editing documents in TextEdit? How about Bean?
Another thing... buying expensive software is NOT the only solution. In fact, I have yet to need anything like that. My favorite part of the Mac is the quality, fairly priced software. Go check out things like Lineform, CSSEdit, and the ultimate text editor TextMate and tell me they are all uber expensive.
Stuff like
Honestly, if you were going to get the "real" Mac experience I'd expect to hear a lot more about software like:
Burn
Audio Hijack
Burn
Chicken of the VNC
ChocoFlop
CocoaMySQL
CSSEdit
Delicious Library
HandBrake
iGTD
Lineform
LineIn
LiveQuartz
Max
NetNewsWire
Vienna
Nicecast
NicePlayer
Perian
OmniGraffle
PureFTPd Manager
Quicksilver (especially this)
svnX
Unison (the ultimate newsgroup app)
Transmit / Cyberduck / YummyFTP
Locomotive
MAMP
Honestly, these are some of the absolute best software apps I have ever used on any platform. I truly believe you are missing out on a ton of software that really makes a Mac so highly regarded by many people.
As for Windows and Linux doing it "cheaper"... well often times they also don't do it nearly as well, or as easily, or as stress-free. I find my Mac gets the hell out of my way when I'm doing work due to the many little things (like no popup windows that appear under other windows yet don't let you do anything without dismissing them...).
I'm not so sure you really "got it" though I appreciate the "try"
For one, I had to laugh at you calling NeoOffice an X11 app... where the entire point of the NeoOffice port is to be independent of X11 (and indeed it requires nothing).
Also, the lack of quality freeware too I just don't subscribe to... ever hear of www.opensourcemac.org ?
I used Windows for about a decade before finally trying out the Mac side and I haven't looked back. IMO the freeware available blows Windows away in almost every aspect (mostly in that they all follow usual OS X user interface paradigms and don't try to do too much) but really... there are tons of freeware apps.
How much time did you spend on http://www.pure-mac.com/ ?
Editing documents in TextEdit? How about Bean?
Another thing... buying expensive software is NOT the only solution. In fact, I have yet to need anything like that. My favorite part of the Mac is the quality, fairly priced software. Go check out things like Lineform, CSSEdit, and the ultimate text editor TextMate and tell me they are all uber expensive.
Stuff like
Is also completely factually incorrect. Flip4Mac will play WMV files just fine without conversion in QuickTime. I also heard no mention of Perian or NicePlayer.
Honestly, if you were going to get the "real" Mac experience I'd expect to hear a lot more about software like:
Burn
Audio Hijack
Burn
Chicken of the VNC
ChocoFlop
CocoaMySQL
CSSEdit
Delicious Library
HandBrake
iGTD
Lineform
LineIn
LiveQuartz
Max
NetNewsWire
Vienna
Nicecast
NicePlayer
Perian
OmniGraffle
PureFTPd Manager
Quicksilver (especially this)
svnX
Unison (the ultimate newsgroup app)
Transmit / Cyberduck / YummyFTP
Locomotive
MAMP
Honestly, these are some of the absolute best software apps I have ever used on any platform. I truly believe you are missing out on a ton of software that really makes a Mac so highly regarded by many people.
As for Windows and Linux doing it "cheaper"... well often times they also don't do it nearly as well, or as easily, or as stress-free. I find my Mac gets the hell out of my way when I'm doing work due to the many little things (like no popup windows that appear under other windows yet don't let you do anything without dismissing them...).
I'm not so sure you really "got it" though I appreciate the "try"
Good review. All you ever read is the "great" stuff about Apple. As a PC guy I love the ability to open the case and screw with the internals. Being held down by whatever Apple wants you to have would suck balls!
I LOVE to game. That fact alone will keep me from ever buying a Mac. Last but not least, the whole dang world runs on Windows.
I LOVE to game. That fact alone will keep me from ever buying a Mac. Last but not least, the whole dang world runs on Windows.
It makes you feel like a moron because you've never used it before and are trying to apply lessons learned in the windows GUI. Stop that. The mac GUI is different. Internalize that now, and stop expecting it to be windows with a skin. If you want to get comfortable, then spend some time with it, just like you'd need to do with ANY unfamiliar OS.Yes the HD Fantastic Four 2 trailer looked very nice. Too bad it won't play full screen for free....
I am a total MAC n00b, and having to find and change settings for some rudimentary functionality is ridiculous. I am sick of the "all you had to do is click here, here and here or why didn't you install blah blah..." comments.
Come on now! Why does the "easiest" OS make me feel like a complete moron?!! I mean I had to ask our shop's MAC geek how to find another computer on the network! There is no idiot "Network" icon on the desktop or dashboard and trying to be g33ky and typing "\\PCNAME\FOLDER" didn't work in finder either. I mean I seriously need a manual for this thing....wtf
Also, where quicktime pro licensing is concerned, google is your friend. Not going to say any more on that.
I still can't see straight when I think about apple trying to charge you to play a movie full screen. INSANITY!!![H]EMI_426
2[H]4U
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I took a job a year and a half ago that required me to administer OS X workstations and one OS X Server machine. I find the Server box to be frustrating and the root of some of the worst times I've had as a professional systems administrator. Apple's (lack of) support has been horrendous and being told (off the record, of course) that they "didn't really test things out like that" when asked about a problem just reinforces my belief that Apple only wants you to "think different" as long as your different overlaps with theirs.
The clients are liveable for most things. I find Adium to be the best IM client I've ever used, and Apple Remote Desktop Admin is actually pretty nifty. I still spend the vast majority of my time on my OS X workstation at work working in Terminal.app, mostly cause I do a lot of programming and vim is still my editor of choice.
I'm not an "OMG OSS" guy. I'm not a WIndows guy. I'm a "right tool for the job" guy, and honestly I haven't yet found a job that OS X would be the right tool for. At least I haven't found a job where OS X would be at least as good a tool as any other for.
The clients are liveable for most things. I find Adium to be the best IM client I've ever used, and Apple Remote Desktop Admin is actually pretty nifty. I still spend the vast majority of my time on my OS X workstation at work working in Terminal.app, mostly cause I do a lot of programming and vim is still my editor of choice.
I'm not an "OMG OSS" guy. I'm not a WIndows guy. I'm a "right tool for the job" guy, and honestly I haven't yet found a job that OS X would be the right tool for. At least I haven't found a job where OS X would be at least as good a tool as any other for.
BladeVenom
Supreme [H]ardness
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I don't think their software matters. The biggest problem is that the starting price for a regular desktop box is $2,499.00 and with that you only get a NVIDIA GeForce 7300 GT video card. So your choice is a couple of pathetic little toy computers or something insanely priced. Unless you're totally in love with Steve Jobs, those just aren't acceptable choices for most people.
this seriously is the equivalent of saying "OMG, it's NOT windows?! that SUX!" I've never heard someone say that drag and drop installation was 'confusing'. hilarious.
no, you thought it would be windows with a pretty skin on top.
now, THERE you have a very good point, my friend. the Finder does not like it when a mounted network share goes away. Does not like it at ALL. Spinning beachball of death for minutes at a time. People have been complaining about this behavior for years now, and apple hasn't fixed it.
On the other hand, the Finder doesn't drop shares on it's own, so as long as your server stays up reliably, you shouldn't run into this very often.
The most common case is you've got your mac laptop at work, and you mount a share. 5pm comes, and you close the laptop to put it to sleep, but you haven't un-mount the network share. then when you get home, you open the laptop, and get the spinning beachball of death for a loooooooooooooong time.
So, yeah, you've got apple there.
[H]EMI_426
2[H]4U
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Hah, thanks for reminding me...I've manged to hose our server a few times at work by trying to connect to two different network shares at the same time. There's an entry in the logs about the AFP server crashing, then the box refuses to accept any more connections whatsoever as well as stops responding to mouse/keyboard input. It's great when your OS can take a dive like that.
Another nicety I've seen from OS X over the years is if you're doing any sort of remote authentication (basically LDAP or OpenDirectory, which is Apple's wrapper for their LDAP management stuff) and the LDAP server(s) drop off the network, the Macs never recover. They either refuse to accept any more input from the keyboard or refuse to notice when the LDAP server comes back.
I've got a long-standing bug that they've never bothered to address...I was doing several things that were supported, but in combination they result in unexpected behavior, yet they don't seem to care to fix it.
My boss is a True Believer. He swears by Apple. I just swear at them. One of these days I'll get to move our public stuff off the damned OS X Server box on to a nice, cheap FreeBSD machine and life will be so much easier.
Another nicety I've seen from OS X over the years is if you're doing any sort of remote authentication (basically LDAP or OpenDirectory, which is Apple's wrapper for their LDAP management stuff) and the LDAP server(s) drop off the network, the Macs never recover. They either refuse to accept any more input from the keyboard or refuse to notice when the LDAP server comes back.
I've got a long-standing bug that they've never bothered to address...I was doing several things that were supported, but in combination they result in unexpected behavior, yet they don't seem to care to fix it.
My boss is a True Believer. He swears by Apple. I just swear at them. One of these days I'll get to move our public stuff off the damned OS X Server box on to a nice, cheap FreeBSD machine and life will be so much easier.
Brian, thank you for looking at Mac Mini. As a typical PC user looking to make a switch, the Mac Mini works on so many levels. I already own a Monitor, Keyboard, and Mouse. I buy a Mac Mini, cast the 'inferior' PC aside and waited to be bowled over. This is how the Mac Mini is agressively marketed by Apple and I bet many people making the switch decide to do it that way. Why do I want an iMac, I already have a monitor?
Now, I borrowed a Mac Mini from a friend to try out, and I was left with the same impression. It's only after you try things out that everyone comes out of the woodwork with 'you should have known better' condescending attitudes.
As I read the article, the beginning didn't look to promising. I remember the 30 days with Vista article, so it seemed to me that Brian was poised to jump into apple's arms.
Any reasonable person just wants this technology to just work. Just plug it in and work, regardless of the platform. No one advocates or cheers for something to fail.
My observations is that after reading all 3 of the '30 day's' articles is that they are all well balanced. Needless to say, people who have lived in an Apple/Linux/XP/Vista Environment for years are well versed in the tricks and tips, and one cannot possible gain years of knowledge in 30 days.
I also feel that 30 days should be enough to decide whether to make a switch, whether the new methodology and changes are changes for the better for you, your productivity.
Thanks Brian and HardOCP
Cordially,
Glenn
Now, I borrowed a Mac Mini from a friend to try out, and I was left with the same impression. It's only after you try things out that everyone comes out of the woodwork with 'you should have known better' condescending attitudes.
As I read the article, the beginning didn't look to promising. I remember the 30 days with Vista article, so it seemed to me that Brian was poised to jump into apple's arms.
Any reasonable person just wants this technology to just work. Just plug it in and work, regardless of the platform. No one advocates or cheers for something to fail.
My observations is that after reading all 3 of the '30 day's' articles is that they are all well balanced. Needless to say, people who have lived in an Apple/Linux/XP/Vista Environment for years are well versed in the tricks and tips, and one cannot possible gain years of knowledge in 30 days.
I also feel that 30 days should be enough to decide whether to make a switch, whether the new methodology and changes are changes for the better for you, your productivity.
Thanks Brian and HardOCP
Cordially,
Glenn
Brian, to be completely fair in your review of switching to a Mac for 30 days you really should have installed every app ever written for OS X.
The amount of applications, both freeware and pay for, that some people wanted you to install and try out is crazy!
The amount of applications, both freeware and pay for, that some people wanted you to install and try out is crazy!
No free-ware for the Mac OS X OS? You got to be kidding? In the 30-day evaluation period did you not even do a basic search for OSX free apps? There's not only tons of free apps, but there are MAC ONLY open-source apps that are totally awesome and have no equivalents on Linux or Windows, such as Quick Silver for MAC!
I'm shocked that you never bothered to look closer to what's offered on versiontracker or macupdate.com, etc. Sun is not only doing a native Aqua version of Open Office, but Apple just hired Window's expert, Paul Thurrot. Why? Simple: So many Window developers are coming to Apple for help in developing OS X programs that Apple decided to hire Paul to address some specially planned OS X conventions for Window developers to help contain the huge numbers.
There are lots of great open-sourced apps for the Mac, and, like Window's, also ton's of great OSX commercial apps too! Word Wright, Bean and many more are just some of the word processors for the Mac. Can't figure out how you could only mention a few?
Remember, OSX is the OS that inspired Beryl, Complz, XGL, and Vista, etc. Your article appears to too be that of a Linux Geek, trying hard to put OS X down, inorder to build up Linux. I could be wrong, but that's my impression based on the wording, etc. After all, PC World magazine is a PC magazine, but for the third year in a row they named OS X the best OS in the world. That should tell you something?
As for costs, did you know that you can buy a Mac Pro's with a much more powerful Xeons, cpu's that you can't buy on any other system. The editor-in-chief of www.techgage.com told me that he was surprised that a Mac Pro system actually sells for less then the cost of the processors alone! Nice subsidy on Apple and Intel's part.
I use all three OS'S, but clearly, OS X is by far the best. Next week at WWDC Apple will reveal Leopard and you can bet that Linux and Windows will be bending over backwards trying to copy it too. You just wait and see!
I'm shocked that you never bothered to look closer to what's offered on versiontracker or macupdate.com, etc. Sun is not only doing a native Aqua version of Open Office, but Apple just hired Window's expert, Paul Thurrot. Why? Simple: So many Window developers are coming to Apple for help in developing OS X programs that Apple decided to hire Paul to address some specially planned OS X conventions for Window developers to help contain the huge numbers.
There are lots of great open-sourced apps for the Mac, and, like Window's, also ton's of great OSX commercial apps too! Word Wright, Bean and many more are just some of the word processors for the Mac. Can't figure out how you could only mention a few?
Remember, OSX is the OS that inspired Beryl, Complz, XGL, and Vista, etc. Your article appears to too be that of a Linux Geek, trying hard to put OS X down, inorder to build up Linux. I could be wrong, but that's my impression based on the wording, etc. After all, PC World magazine is a PC magazine, but for the third year in a row they named OS X the best OS in the world. That should tell you something?
As for costs, did you know that you can buy a Mac Pro's with a much more powerful Xeons, cpu's that you can't buy on any other system. The editor-in-chief of www.techgage.com told me that he was surprised that a Mac Pro system actually sells for less then the cost of the processors alone! Nice subsidy on Apple and Intel's part.
I use all three OS'S, but clearly, OS X is by far the best. Next week at WWDC Apple will reveal Leopard and you can bet that Linux and Windows will be bending over backwards trying to copy it too. You just wait and see!
Now here's a post full of odd logic.
Firstly, I think you should define "regular desktop". The Mac Pro is not the $399 Dell Dimension Father's Day special, nor is it in any way akin to what others offer at lower prices. The name itself is actually quite fitting of its primary intended use: pro. The baseline Mac Pro configuration is a two dual core procs and fully buffered memory, with the option for two quad core procs. For most professionals (those being the intended target for the Mac Pro), the video card factor isn't terribly relevant. An 8800 GTX won't give me more tracks in Pro Tools, won't speed up rendering in Final Cut, and won't improve Photoshop, Illustrator or Dreamweaver performance one iota. These are the applications intended to be used on the Mac Pro -- not STALKER, Oblivion, or whatever else you may be into.
Secondly, the software does matter, because there are thousands upon thousands of applications that cannot be run on anything but a Mac (unless you like taking illegal routes). When you buy a Mac, you get Mac OS: no ifs, ands or buts. Try running Final Cut Studio 2, Logic, Bias, GarageBand and dozens of other Mac-only applications on a PC running Windows. Then, use BootCamp to easily and legally install Windows on your Mac, and run all of those Windows applications you love too. Or, grab a copy of Parallels, and run Windows and Mac OS (and Linux, if you wish) at the same time. Can any other "regular desktop" achieve such a feat? Certainly, there are comparable applications on the Windows side, but you can't take the "the software doesn't matter" stance, because that's an irrevocable factor. Your computer is useless without software.
The Mac mini is a bit of a toy, no doubt, but the iMac, MacBook and MacBook Pro are certainly not. What exactly is toyish about Core 2 procs across the board? Does a slow video card instantly make an otherwise powerful computer into a toy? Aren't purpose-built gaming PCs more of a toy than say, an iMac, given their intended usage (playing games)?
A computer purpose-built for gaming is my idea of a toy computer.
[H]EMI_426
2[H]4U
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I just love this line of thinking. What parts are they trying to copy? It most certainly isn't the underpinnings of the OS. Hell, most of the underpinnings came from FreeBSD and a few bits from Mach. I seriously doubt anyone needs to copy any of those parts, particularly since they're already freely available. The parts that Apple's done on their own (launchd, etc.) are (IMHO) fixes for already-solved problems.
The GUI stuff? Yeah, okay, whatever. My WindowMaker/X11 FreeBSD box works better for me than my Mac does at work. I have zero desire for anyone to "copy" OS X.
Brian, to be completely fair in your review of switching to a Mac for 30 days you really should have installed every app ever written for OS X.
The amount of applications, both freeware and pay for, that some people wanted you to install and try out is crazy!
I think the point many people here make is it does not appear as if he actually went looking. He mentions it as an afterthought, that he found places later, but he did not use Mac specific sites other than the one from Apple which has lousy navigation. He used LifeHacker which is mostly Windows/Unix.
Yes, it is true, it would have taken a little digging to find Mac specific free file resources, but he went to the Apple Boards (which is a freakin' SUPPORT board, not a user board) instead of checking in the multitude of USER forums. Would he go to the Microsoft support boards to find apps for Windows? NO! So why does he think people can help him here?
He could have googled for "Top 10 Mac apps" that everyone seems to make a list of and found cool stuff, etc.
Good review. All you ever read is the "great" stuff about Apple. As a PC guy I love the ability to open the case and screw with the internals. Being held down by whatever Apple wants you to have would suck balls!
I LOVE to game. That fact alone will keep me from ever buying a Mac. Last but not least, the whole dang world runs on Windows.
Did you not know that the Mac Pro not only allows you to swap different parts like a PC, but a whole lot nicer and easier. Like a peice of Lego you can simply pop drives, memory, etc., in-and-out.
And here's a real kicker.... Mac Pros not only come with a Xeon cpu that PC'ers' can't even buy, its faster and more powerful than any 'mere' Core 2 Duo or AMD chip!
But wait, if and when you are ever allowed to buy the Xeon's inside the Mac Pro, the same Xeon's alone will cost you more than what Apple charges for the entire MacPro system! With my MacPro I can buy the same stuff you can, drives, memory, etc. and at the exact same stores and prizes!
Talk about a subsidy, Apple and Intel gives you a deal you can't match in the PC World.
Oh, for games, you can easily dual boot into Window's, etc. and you can do ANYTHING a PCer can, be it games or what not?
Hell, you can even do something you can't when running virualization in PC's or Linux... you can actually run X games at more than acceptable speeds! Check out Window's Quake running in a virtual mode! Remember, not only can you run your pc games in a virtual mode, and or, in a dual-boot mode, but most of these Window games have native OS X versions as well.
Check out the movie of Quake running on OS X at:
http://www.tuaw.com/2007/06/04/found-footage-quake-4-running-in-parallels-3-0/
QFT.
I've recommended Apples to a number of family members, and while I understand that Apple is really a software company, it's their hardware design which generally impresses me.
Two fingered right click and scrolling make the touchpad on MBs and MBPs a dream to use- far better than the frustrating touchpads we see on many designed by other companies. Let's not even begin to get started on the power cord- the thing my customers seem to break more on PCs than any other component. Other aspects like the TINY form factor of the mac mini make it a decent living room pc for hooking up to a flat panel or entertainment center- especially when you throw in the multimedia apps that come in iLife. And with the exception of the Sony LS series desktops or HP's IQ770, how many integrated monitor/desktops do you see out there? Design is clearly one of the most appealing aspects of Apples, even if the hardware configurations on the inside often leave more to be desired...
That said, I do agree in general with the overall suggestion that OSX is an "ok" operating system not without its faults. I wouldn't call it overrated, nor would I call it the ultimate artist's PC (unless you're delving into video). Certain things are a dream to use, though I would argue that Vista's desktop search is faster than Apples (though Apple's is older code), and Linux of course took advantage of multiple desktops LONG before Apple is bringing it to Leopard. Let's not forget Volume Shadow Copy being passed off as a revolutionary feature in Leopard either.
I will throw in Expose is the best application switching feature I've ever used. Nuff said.
To be entirely honest, that's all I can really say about the platform. Half the PCs in my house (2 of 4) are Apples, but were it not for the damn cord on my Toshiba, I think I'd use my other systems more often.
Two fingered right click and scrolling make the touchpad on MBs and MBPs a dream to use- far better than the frustrating touchpads we see on many designed by other companies. Let's not even begin to get started on the power cord- the thing my customers seem to break more on PCs than any other component. Other aspects like the TINY form factor of the mac mini make it a decent living room pc for hooking up to a flat panel or entertainment center- especially when you throw in the multimedia apps that come in iLife. And with the exception of the Sony LS series desktops or HP's IQ770, how many integrated monitor/desktops do you see out there? Design is clearly one of the most appealing aspects of Apples, even if the hardware configurations on the inside often leave more to be desired...
That said, I do agree in general with the overall suggestion that OSX is an "ok" operating system not without its faults. I wouldn't call it overrated, nor would I call it the ultimate artist's PC (unless you're delving into video). Certain things are a dream to use, though I would argue that Vista's desktop search is faster than Apples (though Apple's is older code), and Linux of course took advantage of multiple desktops LONG before Apple is bringing it to Leopard. Let's not forget Volume Shadow Copy being passed off as a revolutionary feature in Leopard either.
I will throw in Expose is the best application switching feature I've ever used. Nuff said.
To be entirely honest, that's all I can really say about the platform. Half the PCs in my house (2 of 4) are Apples, but were it not for the damn cord on my Toshiba, I think I'd use my other systems more often.
I really hope you weren't talking about comparing it to other workstations, because I just gave you more memory, more hard drive space on two seperate hard drives which can be raided, and a three year onsite warranty for almost 100 less.
Oh yeah, and it happens to have the same processor as well. Throw in an online-bought 7300 and you're paying the same for more on the HP workstation.
And unless I'm mistaken, 713+713 doesn't equal 2500. But it sure as hell looks like I'm allowed to buy it.
For the Mac Pro you get:
Dual Gigabit ethernet vs single
FireWire 800 X2
FireWire 400 X 2
Easy access drives
Larger, yet single hard drive
Optical Audio in and Out (Toslink and MiniTos)
etc. Bottom line is, the machines are super comparable and about the same price point (and cheaper similarly configured)....
The poster was referring to the 3 GhZ 8 core which would cost more than the Mac Pro at that price point. I am not sure if Intel has made the ship available yet for genearl purchase.
At the High End, Apple competes VERY well on price/performance. This is not in dispute. At the low end, Apple SUCKS for Price/Performance.