Boo Intel ($100 laptop project)

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tnu5

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I wasn't sure where to post this:

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/technology/6675833.stm

The guy behind this project is a saint. This could do a lot of good for the world. :)

I'm not sure why this article says the classmate will cost "over $200", last checked it was about $450 per, the OLPC will be $176 per at start (due to Microsoft not lowering it's cost to help the project).
 
First: No, he's not a saint, he's just at man...

Second: I fail to see the real issue here. If his goal is to bring cheap laptops to the masses in the poor countries, then the fact that Intel is now trying to do the same should mean that his mission have been succesful. Hopefully it doesn't matter for this man if the laptops are his or Intels...
 
tnu5 said:
I'm not sure why this article says the classmate will cost "over $200", last checked it was about $450 per, the OLPC will be $176 per at start (due to Microsoft not lowering it's cost to help the project).
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If the gap is that huge, $176 versus $450, he has nothing to worry about. That is a HUGE gap, and no amount of Intel propaganda will convince a 3rd-world country that they need to spend almost 3x as much so that they can have an Intel chip instead of an AMD chip.

Now, if Intel can get their laptops below $200 so that the gap is narrowed, I say good for them. Competition in the OLPC project will drive prices down and benefit the children of this world.

As for the AMD versus Intel mobile and embedded technologies argument, don't get me started. Intel is so far ahead of AMD in that field that there's not even a comparison between them; it's like comparing the stone age to modern planet earth.
 
Asus plans to sell a version of the Classmate for $249. http://arstechnica.com/news.ars/post/20070503-asustek-to-launch-249-classmate-pc-in-july.html

"Saint" Nick is just mad because he can't get countries to commit to Very Large Purchases for a product that is 75% more expensive than planned and is in a constantly changing form.

There is no MS software on OLPC (yet). Was MS supposed to help out on the free Linux OS cost? LOL :rolleyes:

I saw the segment about the OLPC on 60 Minutes last night. Negroponte was crying about Intel on there too. boo hoo hoo. The Classmate PC is more expensive, but also has better specifications and is significantly faster. India also has a OLPC competitor and more are coming. Any country that wants to buy the OLPC can, or they can choose from other PCs that are becoming available.
 
yeah Intel appears to be making a bad PR move here to me, of course they want to make profit, more power to them for that, though at the expense of children in 3rd-world nations, that is kind of pathetic if you ask me.
 
Tetrahedron said:
yeah Intel appears to be making a bad PR move here to me, of course they want to make profit, more power to them for that, though at the expense of children in 3rd-world nations, that is kind of pathetic if you ask me.
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Who says it's motivated by profit? Negroponte accused Intel of "dumping" laptops, when Intel is doing exactly what OLPC is doing: setting up evaluation labs in countries that expressed interest.

This whole mess is OLPC's fault to begin with. They invited companies to make cut-throat bids to get in on the project, and then had those same companies (especially AMD and Quantas) brag about what an honor it was to be chosen. It was completely unsurprising that Intel and others would make a rival to OLPC. This is nothing new. The Classmate PC was unveiled a while ago. What did Negroponte expect to happen?

IMO what Negroponte is really angry about how the Classmate and other options ruin the developed nations price structure for the OLPC. The idea was that developed nations would buy it for 2x the price in order to supply one to a developing country. At $100, even that pricing scheme was decent. But now that the OLPC is $176, $362 is over $100 more than the superior Classmate PC. Gee, which one would a developed country choose? It's not unreasonable to assume that 1/2 of the OLPC laptops would be sold to countries that could actually afford it (developed countries) and the competitors are "ruining" it for OLPC. :rolleyes:
 
pxc said:
Who says it's motivated by profit?

Gee, which one would a developed country choose? It's not unreasonable to assume that 1/2 of the OLPC laptops would be sold to countries that could actually afford it (developed countries) and the competitors are "ruining" it for OLPC. :rolleyes:
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ummm Linux is a free OS where as Classmates uses Windows, which they will have to pay for. I mean I use Windows, but that is because I dont mind paying for it, but developing countries might want a free OS to make it cheaper to purchase. So yes it is about profit.
 
The price of the OLPC is supposed to go down to $100, once he can sell the first batch of laptops. That first batch is what is funding the rest of the campaign.

I like Intel, but they really are fucking up a good thing on this one. Intel is such a powerful organization, that they their propganda is powerful enough to disuade countries from buying the OLPC.

Personally I love the technology going into these things. A laptop that lasts for 10-12 hours, and is recharged with a couple minutes of cranking. That is seriously cool.
 
Tetrahedron said:
ummm Linux is a free OS where as Classmates uses Windows, which they will have to pay for. I mean I use Windows, but that is because I dont mind paying for it, but developing countries might want a free OS to make it cheaper to purchase. So yes it is about profit.
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??? Classmate PC runs Linux or Windows. Developing countries can get Windows, Office and some other software for $3. http://www.eweek.com/article2/0,1895,2115695,00.asp

Quanta is making a profit off each OLPC it produces, but I guess OLPC is not about profit while the Classmate PC that is being "dumped below cost" is about profit? Try again.
 
swanysto said:
The price of the OLPC is supposed to go down to $100, once he can sell the first batch of laptops. That first batch is what is funding the rest of the campaign.
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Um, no. It will take years to get the price down. The $100 price is a goal, but it is definitely not something that is happening this year or next year.
 
pxc said:
Quanta is making a profit off each OLPC it produces, but I guess OLPC is not about profit while the Classmate PC that is being "dumped below cost" is about profit? Try again.
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hmmm.. I wonder, effectively offer better prices than OLPC, putting OLPC out of business, then once that is done, raise the prices back up to make a profit since there is no competetion left. = Profit. Profit isnt always something that happens overnight or in one year, it can take a long well planned strategy to turn a profit.
 
all it is doing is creating confusion.

the project should be a charity where a united front is presented to the countries involved. where the actual hardware/software is sourced from is totally irrelevant. what intel are doing is bypassing the charity aspect & just acting as dirty capitalists.

how about a 'one ballpen per child' or 'one a4 notepad per child' project - these things are just as important - I couldn't imagine bic, papermate, pentel etc doing such a thing and usurping the project.
 
Here's a good article on the situation: http://laptopmag.com/features/Intel-vs-OLPC-Battle-of-Good-Wills.htm

These different approaches have resulted in dissimilar devices. The Classmate PC has a powerful processor, support for unmodified Windows and Linux software, and costs about $250, although Intel expects the price to drop about $50 by the end of the year. OLPC's XO laptop offers a new Linux-based software platform called Sugar, as well as special features like a built-in video camera, high-resolution dual-mode screen, longer battery life, and innovative charging options for about $175. OLPC aims for this model, with these components, to be priced at $100 within three years.
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Just because "Saint" Nick complains doesn't automatically make him right. The others that pointed out the shortcomings of the OLPC didn't just complain, they did something about it. Unfortunately for OLPC, many of the potential customers are at least considering both approaches.

The OLPC still have several strengths over the Clasmate PC: interface design is more useful for novices, it probably has a much more rugged design, most likely has a much longer battery life, has a slightly lower cost and has a better screen for different viewing conditions. But several of those advantages don't mean much to some potential customers.

I buy AMD and Intel and I use Windows, Linux and OS X. The choice of different types of laptops for kids is a *good thing*, especially for richer countries. The mess OLPC is in is partially caused by itself as I explained above.
 
go to a kid in a brazilian favela & ask him/her if he wants an amd or an intel? a ms or a linux?

that is my point. :rolleyes:
 
The kid of course doesn't care, but that's the wrong person and the wrong question to ask. :rolleyes: There are many more differences than the CPU type.

You would need to ask the person(s) responsible for the government's purchase how he or she is evaluating the options and what he or she is looking for.

I can say one thing though: if my school district was going to buy laptops for all kids and did not look at the alternatives (either OLPC or Classmate) I would get very vocal about it. It's absolutely moronic not to consider the alternatives.
 
who the *&^% in 3rd world government is evaluating anything???

dude get some stamps on your passport & learn how people really live.
 
sovs said:
who the *&^% in 3rd world government is evaluating anything???
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The governments that are placing the orders are currently evaluating the laptops. Negroponte mentions that often.

dude get some stamps on your passport & learn how people really live.
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LOL, make some sense.
 
3rd world schools have computers. there a warehouses where you can buy a computer for $20. most school computers are funded by private philanthropy.are those evaluated?

2nd point - stop watching tv.
 
Yeah I'm glad this socialist punk is getting some competition.

I was all behind this project until he pulled the whole project climaxing at the part where I heard that he was finally smart enough to allow developed nations to buy the pc, then he says that we have to pay twice as much just because Saint Nick decides thats what people have to pay to touch his holy world saving item. Also the total removal of the hand crank ability took away one of the major neat pieces of the item. I'm glad that the free market is coming in and showing him how in a free market you can't just decide that some people have to pay twice as much and like it. Also, from my first hand observation as a programmer a LOT of the new outsourcing projects are in .NET C#/VB, in particular the type of projects that used to be php or java, so having skills with windows would be a huge plus.

What exactly did this guy do that gave him a patent on selling to all third world countries? Thats not very "open source" of him.
 
I don't think Negroponte's humanitarianism makes him a socialist in the way you use it. But I think he bet on much more leverage than he actually had. Countries that had expressed passive interest at a very low price are not translating into sales at a much higher price (duh). Big surprise that even though the Classmate PC has very low orders (in the "thousands", and Intel is taking orders that OLPC won't touch as far as minimum orders go), Negroponte hasn't even reached the minimum order he needs yet. It's a bitter blame game on a plan that isn't working out.

Contrast this when the outlook was sunny:
But even if Negroponte doesn't succeed, he is already pushing computer access forward. Intel has promised Nigeria software worth $10 million and 3,000 "fully functional" (in Intel's words) desktop PCs. Negroponte says, "It makes my day" when OLPC motivates others to get poor kids computers faster. And giving them a PC that even rich people will want is bound to do something good.
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with the frustrated Nick of today.
 
Illustrating a point here:

Two economists, one with a liberal viewpoint and the other with a conservative, debating on how to solve the economic problems of poverty in Kenya (i think it was, forgetting here but any poverish African nation will illustrate the same purpose); after debating it they then ask the leader of Kenya what he thought, which way sounded more viable. The leader said, "You all didnt same a damn thing! You just dont get it, poverty is not living in low income situations, real poverty is when you whole nation is dying from starvation and how you are going to fix that? Niether of you understand that do you? You just sit there and talk about how to fix something you have no experience in"

See these third world nations have bigger concerns than evaluting computers, of course they want computers, of course they need food too. They just want to get their people fed and educated and the least expensive way possible. Picking Intel over OLPC is trivial.

Intel is just making matters worse by trying to use their influence to disrupt a good and nobel cause so they can reap the benefits long term. That is why I think it is sad and a bad PR move by Intel. Intel has enough money and power, they dont need to start going in and messing around with organizations that are trying their hardest to help these poorer nations out. Intel is corporation, they dont care about me or you, all they care about is the bottom line. Where charities and organizations trying to help people have a better life DO care about you, me and those they are trying to help.
 
Gee, I wonder how Negroponte will decide who gets the laptops and who doesn't? Does Santa Clause leave bags of goodies for governments of undeveloped countries to give out?

Can you say philantro pnwd?
 
Tetrahedron said:
Illustrating a point here:

Two economists, one with a liberal viewpoint and the other with a conservative, debating on how to solve the economic problems of poverty in Kenya (i think it was, forgetting here but any poverish African nation will illustrate the same purpose); after debating it they then ask the leader of Kenya what he thought, which way sounded more viable. The leader said, "You all didnt same a damn thing! You just dont get it, poverty is not living in low income situations, real poverty is when you whole nation is dying from starvation and how you are going to fix that? Niether of you understand that do you? You just sit there and talk about how to fix something you have no experience in"

See these third world nations have bigger concerns than evaluting computers, of course they want computers, of course they need food too. They just want to get their people fed and educated and the least expensive way possible. Picking Intel over OLPC is trivial.

Intel is just making matters worse by trying to use their influence to disrupt a good and nobel cause so they can reap the benefits long term. That is why I think it is sad and a bad PR move by Intel. Intel has enough money and power, they dont need to start going in and messing around with organizations that are trying their hardest to help these poorer nations out. Intel is corporation, they dont care about me or you, all they care about is the bottom line. Where charities and organizations trying to help people have a better life DO care about you, me and those they are trying to help.
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Intel is just operating a business. That is all.

IMO the whole thing was always a bit silly. I don't live in these countries so I could very well be wrong, but I would think - just following the hierarchy of needs - that if I was an everyday citizen living in a third world country I could find much better uses for $176.
 
I would rather the effort by all involved was devoted to giving every hungry child in the world something to eat.
 
BillParrish said:
I would rather the effort by all involved was devoted to giving every hungry child in the world something to eat.
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I'd say that particular issue gets 10,000% more effort,people and money than the laptop project...
 
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