30 Days with PlayStation 3 @ [H]

The best option is clearly the cable that comes with the 360 premium. It has standard RCA as well as composite all in one cable.
 
AIW Guru said:
The best option is clearly the cable that comes with the 360 premium. It has standard RCA as well as composite all in one cable.
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I think another factor for Sony was the fact that PS2 cables will work on the PS3, both I and my brother have PS2 component cables.

RCA is a type of connector, but typically RCA and composite are used interchangeably. I think you meant component. So it should be
The best option is clearly the cable that comes with the 360 premium. It has standard composite as well as component all in one cable.
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But I only see component listed under the 360 premium:
http://www.xbox.com/en-US/hardware/xbox360/xbox360customize.htm
 
mryerse said:
Interesting about the load times... would hope that a next gen console would get this down to nill. Oh well.

The main thing that impacts the console I choose is the games available on it, and right now there isn't a whole lot in the PS3 camp, which is a major reason why it's not as desired in my home as it used to be. Hopefully Sony can get some good games out like they did on the PS2. Unless they can do that, all these other features are near worthless to me and many many gamers.
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I thought that was the main reason behind all enthusiasts decision in buying a game console. I know Joe Consumer will buy based on marketing and brand name, but I figured a [H]ard review would cater to what's important to US! I think PS3 has some great hardware features; including the memory card reader, built in wifi and upgradeable hard drive. But the hardware that actually has to do with gaming; the Cell and RSX, well... those are very disappointing to me. Couple that with the fact that the PS3 has very few games worth owning currently (and probably 0 purchase-worthy exclusives) and a gloomy future for must-have exclusives and, to me at least, it's hard to call the PS3 a game console at all. I understand I may be WAY over on one end of the fence, and obviously game quality is subjective at best, but games are the core of a console. I just find it hard to call an article a "review" of a console without even mentioning its current or upcoming library of games. I DEMAND A RECOUNT! =)
 
desultadox said:
I thought that was the main reason behind all enthusiasts decision in buying a game console. I know Joe Consumer will buy based on marketing and brand name, but I figured a [H]ard review would cater to what's important to US! I think PS3 has some great hardware features; including the memory card reader, built in wifi and upgradeable hard drive. But the hardware that actually has to do with gaming; the Cell and RSX, well... those are very disappointing to me. Couple that with the fact that the PS3 has very few games worth owning currently (and probably 0 purchase-worthy exclusives) and a gloomy future for must-have exclusives and, to me at least, it's hard to call the PS3 a game console at all. I understand I may be WAY over on one end of the fence, and obviously game quality is subjective at best, but games are the core of a console. I just find it hard to call an article a "review" of a console without even mentioning its current or upcoming library of games. I DEMAND A RECOUNT! =)
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Sorry you think the hardware is dissapointing, how long have you been making games? I ask because other devs think the PS3 hardware is good:
In a recent interview with Gameinformer.com, Ninja Gaiden Sigma director, Yosuke Hayashi has stated amusingly that unlike DOA4's Itagaki who managed to blow up a few Xbox 360’s whilst developing, he was only able to make the PlayStation 3 "smoke".

"We’ve made a couple of devkits smoke, but we haven’t had any actually blow up yet [laughs]. As far as using the hardware to its fullest, there are a ton of examples, but it’s about approaching the process gradually. For instance, initially we didn’t think that we were going to be able to do as much as we have been able to, which is something good about the PS3, because we weren’t necessarily limited to what it says on paper."

As an example, he stated that they had originally planned to only include self-shadowing during the cut-scenes, but once they actually started coding, they found that we were able to have cut-scenes in real time, fully implemented throughout the entire game and while you’re in the middle of the action. It’s really a matter of having a certain goal and then you try to see what you can get the hardware to do to achieve that goal, and by the time you look around you have smoke throughout the entire R&D floor."

In the interview Hayashi also made comments directed at developers who say claim it is too hard to develop games for the PlayStation 3;

"I think all those developers who are saying, "We don’t want to do a PS3 game," or "It’s really difficult to do it," should shut up and make their games. If you have time to complain about it, then you should be spending your time working on getting the most from the hardware."

Hayashi also hinted that their upcoming Ninja game for the PlayStation 3 would use the SIXAXIS controller in a unique way.
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You can check out the full interview here:
http://www.gameinformer.com/News/Story/200704/N07.0406.1421.46109.htm?Page=1
As far as lack of exclusives, due to the high development cost of these next gen titles we can pretty much say good bye to 3rd party exclusives for either console and that leaves us with 1st party. As far as the exclusives they do have not appealing to you, well that's fine everybody is different and has different tastes. While the PS3 is good BR player and a media center doesn't mean it's not a good game console, there has been a lull in titles released, but that doesn't mean its not a game system.
 
deeznuts said:
Steve, I'm dissappointed, especially since Newegg offers great actual pics of their products! When I order elsewhere I go to Newegg to see their pictures to see what is actually included.
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Heh, yeah...I actually KNEW that the PS3 only came with composite, hell...I reported it in the news....but I had forgotten over time (when it was delayed). Serves me right for not looking at the preview pictures first! :)

I bought mine at NewEgg cause they always do [H]'ers right and they had a the PS3 for cost when everyone else was still charging a premium or forcing bundles on people.
 
Silentbob343 said:
Sorry you think the hardware is dissapointing, how long have you been making games? I ask because other devs think the PS3 hardware is good:

You can check out the full interview here:
http://www.gameinformer.com/News/Story/200704/N07.0406.1421.46109.htm?Page=1
As far as lack of exclusives, due to the high development cost of these next gen titles we can pretty much say good bye to 3rd party exclusives for either console and that leaves us with 1st party. As far as the exclusives they do have not appealing to you, well that's fine everybody is different and has different tastes. While the PS3 is good BR player and a media center doesn't mean it's not a good game console, there has been a lull in titles released, but that doesn't mean its not a game system.
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Sorry you think developers enjoy PS3's hardware. How long have you been reading English? I ask because the very article you referenced never mentioned anybody enjoying the PS3 hardware. In fact, the interviewee made it seem as if he was making a PS3 game as a favor to the people who bought a PS3. he even mentioned that there were many developers out there who do NOT like the PS3 hardware or developing for it.

Valiant effort though.
 
As of now the PS3's list of titles is very anemic and dissapointing. Especially to anyone who already owns a xbox 360. I can't think of any groundbreaking games that the PS3 has exclusively. It's like every game out is being released on both consoles. There are not many innovative features in the PS3. I mean what would make a person buy one at this point? Apart from Blu Ray I can't think of any other reason.

PS3 needs to start coming out with it's exclusives like the PS1/PS2 days. Also the controller feels flimsy and very light, also the annoying thing is that theres no rechargable battery pack. Personally, I would prefer a dock n' charge kit that I can place somewhere away form the console for the control itself or the battery like the 360. This way I don't have to connect the wire to the console and leave the controller lying around every time I want to charge it. I mean it defeats the purpose of wireless being that you'll have to get the wire from where ever it's stored and plug it in every night just for a charge.:rolleyes:

Also the interface seems dull and primative. It's very simple though, guess thats a plus. but it's so funny that after all this marketing of the PS3 being 1080p, real hi-def, etc, it doesn't even come with the cable to plug into a high def TV. lol. whats the irony of that.
 
Speaking about scailing I read a ton of things how when it comes to a PS3 playing back BR movies on a 720p display it ends up just scailing up the 480p playback. I have yet to read if this is fixed and the only reply I ever get from some really bored guys at Best Buy is, "Yeah we know about that problem but just get a 1080p tv, why would you watch BRs on something less?"
 
I just bought the PS3 last night, and heres some thoughts on it.

Steve, how pissed are you that our projectors (you're still using the 4805 SP right?) won't do 720p or 1080i like the 360 will? even if the 4805 gives a "fake" 720p, theres definatly an improvement over 480p. I just can't figure out why the 360 allows it, and PS3 dosen't? maybe I need to hit the overscan button? ill try when i get home.

I ended up ordering a HDMI to DVI cable for use with a Dell 2407WFP. I really hope i'll be able to view games and movies at 1080p through this method.

The L2 and R2 buttons are way weird. sometimes I think i'm going to bust them. For those who haven't held the controller, they feel very soft and spongy. I can't tell you if they are pressure sensitive yet though, but they sure feel like that was the intention.

My controller powered down while waiting to d/l the folding@home software. Must be the 1.6 patch.

Loading times, like on the Ps2, are horrible. Must be the 1 or 2x drive that causes it. my cousin was shocked at how long the loading times were for motorstorm. I doubt that anything can be done about it... but they should at least try to mask it with some kind of ingame movie (like previewing the racetrack or something) while loading the data in the background.

ps3 dashboard: I didnt spend much time in the dash, but I enabled ATRAC on accident, and so far there is no option to disable it. whats up with that? Same thing for WMA.

Overall I think [H] Console nailed it with the silver rating. As of now the PS3 to me, is a lack luster experience. No matter how limited or expensive the selections are, it will play games and movies, and thats worth something I guess... :p

After a few more updates, improvements to the store, games like NG sigma and heavenly sword, the addition of Home (possibly the new king of micro-transactions?), and whatever else will be free, it will be interesting to give the PS3 a second review to see how it will stack up to the 360 for the rest of this generation.
 
desultadox said:
Sorry you think developers enjoy PS3's hardware. How long have you been reading English? I ask because the very article you referenced never mentioned anybody enjoying the PS3 hardware. In fact, the interviewee made it seem as if he was making a PS3 game as a favor to the people who bought a PS3. he even mentioned that there were many developers out there who do NOT like the PS3 hardware or developing for it.

Valiant effort though.
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How long have you been writing English? I ask because the very post you wrote never mentioned anything about developer enjoyment in relation to making games on the PS3 hardware. You said you found the hardware disappointing, not unpleasant to work with/develop for. I linked to an article that says the hardware and capabilities of the PS3 are not disappointing and the hardware is more capable than they had originally thought. So what were you trying to say in your original statement? Are you disappointed with the hardware's performance capabilities or the learning curve to develop on it?

If you want you can also read over at Beyond3D and you'll see other devs that think the PS3 hardware is good and yes it takes some time to get used to it, but the results are great if you quit bitching about it and actually start making the game. Sony has also increased support and released new tools with access to new libraries.

That is essentially what the interview I linked had to say. You said the PS3 hardware was disappointing and I want to know from what angle you make that statement from. Now you say the hardware isn't enjoyable to develop for, which I never disputed.
Numan said:
Speaking about scailing I read a ton of things how when it comes to a PS3 playing back BR movies on a 720p display it ends up just scailing up the 480p playback. I have yet to read if this is fixed and the only reply I ever get from some really bored guys at Best Buy is, "Yeah we know about that problem but just get a 1080p tv, why would you watch BRs on something less?"
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It feeds your display 1080i and then your display scales to 720p. If your display can't accept a 1080i signal, then the PS3 will output a 480p signal. This will hopefully get fixed as the PS3 did output BR movies in 720p with an earlier firmware. The PS3 used to be 1080p->720p->1080i->408p, and then a whole bunch of people bitched and said that 1080i was above 720p. Sony released a new firmware that swapped 720p and 1080i and then seemingly disabled 720p BD playback. Really Sony needs to make a separate setting for BR movie playback.
JSC450 said:
The L2 and R2 buttons are way weird. sometimes I think i'm going to bust them. For those who haven't held the controller, they feel very soft and spongy. I can't tell you if they are pressure sensitive yet though, but they sure feel like that was the intention.

My controller powered down while waiting to d/l the folding@home software. Must be the 1.6 patch.

Loading times, like on the Ps2, are horrible. Must be the 1 or 2x drive that causes it. my cousin was shocked at how long the loading times were for motorstorm. I doubt that anything can be done about it... but they should at least try to mask it with some kind of ingame movie (like previewing the racetrack or something) while loading the data in the background.
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Yes they are pressure sensitive, they work like triggers. I don't have Motor Storm so I can't say anything about its load time, but as a whole though I don't think they are too excessive. Would love to get Motorstorm, I play the crap out of the demo, but not enough there for $60, maybe $40. The drive is 2x.

Perhaps we can get some drive benchmarks, SL BD vs DL DVD. They should be fairly close based on what I've read.
 
After reading 30 days with linux and 30 days with PS3, how about "30 days with PS3 on linux?"
 
Great review. I have to say so far that I'm enjoying every cent spent on this PS3.

For Easter my family came over to my new place and had dinner. My dad goes "I have my Digital Camera in the car if you guys want to check out some of these new pics, Justin is your PC on?" I thought, oh god, I'm not about to try to get behind my PC to plug in his camera and get the whole family crowded around my moniter to look at pics.

I asked him what kinda connection it took, he goes USB... I'm like OK grab it, lets try to hook it up to the PS3. Plugged it in, and downloaded all his pictures in seconds to the PS3 to show to my family on the 46' LCD HDTV. They were all pretty impressed what my "gaming console" was doing. Mind you, my parents are the ones that have financially helped me buy all of my other consoles growing up... NES, Genesis, N64, DreamCast... and were amazed as to what the PS3 was doing vs what all my other consoles used to do.
 
JSC450 said:
I just bought the PS3 last night, and heres some thoughts on it.

Steve, how pissed are you that our projectors (you're still using the 4805 SP right?) won't do 720p or 1080i like the 360 will? even if the 4805 gives a "fake" 720p, theres definatly an improvement over 480p. I just can't figure out why the 360 allows it, and PS3 dosen't? maybe I need to hit the overscan button? ill try when i get home.
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After I put like 60000000 hours on the 4805 the color wheel shattered (bulb was still running fine..lol!) so I bought a new 720p native projector with HDMI.
 
Silentbob343 said:
How long have you been writing English? I ask because the very post you wrote never mentioned anything about developer enjoyment in relation to making games on the PS3 hardware. You said you found the hardware disappointing, not unpleasant to work with/develop for. I linked to an article that says the hardware and capabilities of the PS3 are not disappointing and the hardware is more capable than they had originally thought. So what were you trying to say in your original statement? Are you disappointed with the hardware's performance capabilities or the learning curve to develop on it?

If you want you can also read over at Beyond3D and you'll see other devs that think the PS3 hardware is good and yes it takes some time to get used to it, but the results are great if you quit bitching about it and actually start making the game. Sony has also increased support and released new tools with access to new libraries.

That is essentially what the interview I linked had to say. You said the PS3 hardware was disappointing and I want to know from what angle you make that statement from. Now you say the hardware isn't enjoyable to develop for, which I never disputed.
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Precisely my point. I originally mentioned nothing about the PS3's hardware for development, because I'm not an idiot and I know that the hardware has little to do with development. Development environments are software-based FYI. This is why I have yet to figure out how your rebuttal to my original statement makes any sense, regardless of what language you may or may not speak. You ASSumed I cared about the hardware from a developer's point of view (which doesn't even make much sense to begin with) when I rather explicitly stated that I was not pleased with PS3's hardware for gaming. Sony, as usual, has made some rather poor design decisions when it comes to Playstation hardware. For the record though (just to humor your made-up off-topic develpoer comments), very few developers enjoy developing on the PS3, and even less can afford to do so.
 
This review comes off way too nice. H has been !!!!!!s of blueray and Sony for some time now. It's sad to see a group like H getting on the tip of a company like Sony. I'm not sure why either as Sony continues to stifle technology by over charging, restricting use, and making proprietary products.

Why don’t you talk about the PSP and how the selection of movies for it are pathetic and has been almost completely abandoned? What about the DRM in blueray that hasn't been used yet? What about minidisc which nobody uses but the poor people who bought the players are stuck with? What about their proprietary memory sticks that cost more? How about the horrible quality of Vaio laptops? Or even the poor reviews of Sony TVs over the last 3 years? Let’s go back to Beta tapes and what a disaster that is? For all us blokes what about the plight of the porn industry who has to go to impossible lengths to get a company to process their material on blueray? How about all the comments made by their executives?

You can argue what console should be silver and gold but Sony is clearly Bronze or less. No, I don’t think the review was all peaches and cream but it certainly gave a lot of slack to Sony. Sony is as anti-consumer as they come and if you haven't realized that yet then there is no hope.

I’ve never posted anything on H forums before but I had to after reading this glossed over review. I’m sure many of the Sony !!!!!!s out there wished I didn’t post.
WAKE UP! Sony is not your friend but according to them you should be thankful they produce a product for you to purchase.
 
STREETxCOMMANDO said:
This review comes off way too nice. H has been !!!!!!s of blueray and Sony for some time now.

<snip> blah, blah, blah<snip>

I&#8217;ve never posted anything on H forums before but I had to after reading this glossed over review. I&#8217;m sure many of the Sony !!!!!!s out there wished I didn&#8217;t post.
WAKE UP! Sony is not your friend but according to them you should be thankful they produce a product for you to purchase.
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You must be new. :rolleyes:

Saying I am a Sony / Blu-ray cheerleader is comedy gold :D

If it wouldn't be too much to ask....could you please go to our [H]ard|OCP Front Page News forum and tell all them what a big Sony cheerleader I am. Please?

Thanks!
 
It is what it is. You surely aren't being as Hard as you should be on them.


Can't post in the requested forum or I would. I might even make a poll for them to guess what color skirt you wear and how short it is while you cheer........ Hardocp may be Hard but there&#8217;s no balls behind that H.

I&#8217;d hate to see what rating you would give a Sony product that actually delivered.

Dont think I dont like your site.
 
Steve is far from a Sony boy....Hell I call him a Sony hater/360 lover all the time. So shut up n00b, 'ya don't know nothin' . :D
 
Commando, you should do some research before calling someone out. If anything Steve is a 360 !!!!!! through and through.

His review of PS3 was very fair. The "dash board" is constantly being improved. The online is being improved upon. the damn thing can even Fold@home and boot to linux. The ONLY complaint ANYONE can have is the price and lack of software... and this is coming from another 360 !!!!!! (50+ xbox games, 30+ 360 games, 25000+ GS, and a HD-DVD drive owner).

Also, wtf does psp, minidisc, and betamax have to do with the PS3? and their memory cards have come down wayyyy in price. Their TVs suck? news to me. I always just thought they were too pricy.

H reviews are about being fair and NON BIASED, not going off on a new product because 10 or 20 years ago the same manufacturer had a media format that failed. wtf man?

steve, sucks to hear about the colorwheel, but trading up is always good =] mind sharing the model# so i can check it out?
 
JSC450 said:
Commando, you should do some research before calling someone out. If anything Steve is a 360 !!!!!! through and through.

H reviews are about being fair and NON BIASED, not going off on a new product because 10 or 20 years ago the same manufacturer had a media format that failed. wtf man?

steve, sucks to hear about the colorwheel, but trading up is always good =] mind sharing the model# so i can check it out?
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Ummm, hello!?!?! I was a 360 fanz0r last year... I am a Wii-tard this year...and most currently...a PS3 Phan.

With that said, with all of our reviews, we try to leave the baggage at the door and look at things as objectively as possible and judge things on their technical merits.

I bought the InFocus IN76. The InFocus SP777 was a little out of my price range ;)
 
JSC450: The reason to reference Sony’s past is that history is a good prediction of the future. Sony has a consistent track record that allows for future prediction without much speculation. Why I had to explain that I’m not sure.

I knew that by posting I would get a lot of responses like this. I just don’t think the original review gave Sony an honest score. The forum herd seems to think Steve is a 360 “cheerleader” so maybe when he gave the silver award he had guilt from being accused of preference towards the 360? I don’t know, only thing I know is that the review was SISSY.

P.S. I know the forum herd feels the need to defend Steve in hopes one day he might wear a skirt for them too but I think he’s a big boy and can handle himself. Although, since I’m a noob, maybe you’re right to defend him.

P.S.S. I hope any teasing that was in my posts was taken as just that. However, I do feel that the review lacked balls. There are three next gen consoles on the market and clearly at this time the PS3 does not deserve anything above bronze. I said what I feel needed to be said so I won’t disrupt the forum herd on this topic anymore.

Sincerely, thanks for reading and I hope the score for the PS3 is reconsidered.
 
Dueces, have a good one.

And please refrain from posting, since you think anybody that actually likes somethings on the PS3 is a Sony fanny... :rolleyes:
 
I have to admit, I was surprised by the Silver Award. However, the review took an objective look at the console and did not include what the reviewer thinks of Sony as a company. If it did, it would come across as biased and as such I would not view it as a decent review. Anyone that reads the review will be able to come to their own conclusions about whether or not this system is right for them and that's all a review should be.
 
STREETxCOMMANDO said:
JSC450: The reason to reference Sony&#8217;s past is that history is a good prediction of the future. Sony has a consistent track record that allows for future prediction without much speculation. Why I had to explain that I&#8217;m not sure.

I knew that by posting I would get a lot of responses like this. I just don&#8217;t think the original review gave Sony an honest score. The forum herd seems to think Steve is a 360 &#8220;cheerleader&#8221; so maybe when he gave the silver award he had guilt from being accused of preference towards the 360? I don&#8217;t know, only thing I know is that the review was SISSY.

P.S. I know the forum herd feels the need to defend Steve in hopes one day he might wear a skirt for them too but I think he&#8217;s a big boy and can handle himself. Although, since I&#8217;m a noob, maybe you&#8217;re right to defend him.

P.S.S. I hope any teasing that was in my posts was taken as just that. However, I do feel that the review lacked balls. There are three next gen consoles on the market and clearly at this time the PS3 does not deserve anything above bronze. I said what I feel needed to be said so I won&#8217;t disrupt the forum herd on this topic anymore.

Sincerely, thanks for reading and I hope the score for the PS3 is reconsidered.
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That is a wonderful conspiracy theory. However do you own a PS3? The review was as fair as can be.

Instead of asking if the final score was influenced in being higher, you should ask if your influenced because you want it lower so badly. People will often hate companies for past wrong doings, hell I hated Sony for the root kit thing like no one else, that does not mean they aren&#8217;t capable a of making a good product.

End the hate, and embrace the media/graphical/audio rich features that all 3 consoles have to offer, you will be much happier. :)
 
Commando, a silver score is 3rd in line. I believe the ratings go Plat, gold, silver, bronze, tin foil wrapped around a chocolate coin. Bronze is something you give to UMD. PS3 is far from UMD.

lets not forget what the PS2 did for DVD, and i dont hear anyone complaining about that format.

As i said before, the PS3 is a lack luster system right now, and i think the silver award says the same thing.

If anything you should be attacking Steve over being a Wii-tard and actually considering that thing a gaming system. how does a system actually get WORSE graphics than the previous one is mind boggling to me.

NOw please stop so i dont have defend the PS3 anymore... it really makes me sick to my tummy, but fair is fair no matter how much i dislike it.
 
As a hardware review I think this was a great review. But the bottom line for me, and I would think many others out there, the main point for buying a gaming system is to play games. I know Sony markets it as more than a gaming system, but wouldn't you agree that it's main function is gaming, not all the other features/funtions? And still, eveluating games is a subjective thing based on what people like. You can't simply say one is better than the other because different people like different things. But I can say that I personally am very dissapointed in the PS3 game line-up, and as a result would not buy one right now unless I was buying it for the blue-ray functionality. For now I am hanging out in hopes that the game lineup improves enough to justify purchasing it, or perhaps one day there will be enough fundage to justify owning a PS3 for it's blue-ray functionality and some other gaming system for the games. It's just dissapointing to me that it doesn't appear that I can own one thing that I am happy with in both camps... gaming and other functionality. Oh well.
 
JSC450 said:
If anything you should be attacking Steve over being a Wii-tard and actually considering that thing a gaming system. how does a system actually get WORSE graphics than the previous one is mind boggling to me.
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I agree, the Wii disappoints me greatly with their outlook on importance of graphics although I wouldn't say the graphics have gotten worse... what do you mean by that? I am sure that Twilight princess would be a very fun game to play. Not for the graphics, but for the ingenuity that went into the system.

My biggest dissapointment with this next-gen gaming is not the PS3 or the Wii, or even the Xbox 360, it's the whole gen as a whole. I want matter transfer in a box that only costs $50. Well not really, but seriously, I want the best of all of them in one and I know this can be possible, they've done it before. It normally ends up in the other company going out of business.

Something that speaks for itself is sales. We can argue all day (I hope you don't think I'm trying to argue, I like to think of it as a discussion), but knowing that the Wii has outsold the PS3 tells me that more people feel the same way I do. I used to hate that Ipods were so popular because I was not an apple fan. But now I own an Ipod... funny how things work.

However, an important thing to remember about all these different consoles is that while Nintendo is trying to open up a new market place with new types of games, the truth is that all entertainment companies are competing for the same percentage of our income. It doesn't matter what it does or what it is. Mountain bike, gaming system, or night at the bar, we all (well normal people at least) have a limited income and are limited in what we choose to buy. So you can all argue that the PS3 and the Wii are not comparable, but I would say that a mountain bike and a Wii are comparable because I only have so much money to spend on entertainment.
 
For the record...there is no need or desire from anyone here to see me in a skirt.....








.....the bra pictures took care of that.

*sigh* n00bs, you can't live with them and we just keep getting new ones.
 
Silentbob343 said:
Sorry you think the hardware is dissapointing, how long have you been making games? I ask because other devs think the PS3 hardware is good
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I've spoken with a couple of friends in the industry about this, the general consensus from them is that it's tough to coax the same level of performance out of the PS3 to match the 360. (They're both currently working on PS3/Xbox 360 titles that have yet to be announced.) I asked one of them if this was just because the 360 has been out longer. He said that it was part of the reason, but that 6 months after development started on their title the progress they were making on the PS3 was very poor indeed.
 
desultadox said:
Precisely my point. I originally mentioned nothing about the PS3's hardware for development, because I'm not an idiot and I know that the hardware has little to do with development. Development environments are software-based FYI. This is why I have yet to figure out how your rebuttal to my original statement makes any sense, regardless of what language you may or may not speak. You ASSumed I cared about the hardware from a developer's point of view (which doesn't even make much sense to begin with) when I rather explicitly stated that I was not pleased with PS3's hardware for gaming. Sony, as usual, has made some rather poor design decisions when it comes to Playstation hardware. For the record though (just to humor your made-up off-topic develpoer comments), very few developers enjoy developing on the PS3, and even less can afford to do so.
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You ASSumed too much about my, admittedly, smart ass comment. I never assumed you cared from a developers&#8217; standpoint because you are not a developer and that was my point. When somebody says they are disappointed with the hardware I assume he/she feels it lacks processing power or some other capability. I also feel you are not the correct person to be making such a statement since you are not a dev and don't have a complete picture of the PS3's hardware capabilities. Unless of course you are in some way educated that you can give a worthy opinion of the technical merits of the PS3&#8217;s hardware. If so I apologize, but this being the internet I can't innately know your level of hardware expertise. Perhaps it&#8217;s my fault for trying to be a smart ass. I should have simply said; &#8220;what is your qualification to make such a statement&#8221; and could have avoided all of this. That aside, the interview had somebody that does have the knowledge to give such an opinion on the hardware and he seemed rather favorable towards it. You then responded back about the PS3 being difficult to program for, etc&#8230;.To say, at this stage in the game, you&#8217;re disappointed is a bit premature. The PS3 is a game console and I&#8217;m sorry if you feel it isn&#8217;t or that the hardware isn&#8217;t for gaming.

Thank you misinterpreting my comment and humoring me. My point was never about difficulty, ease, etc of programming for the PS3. It was about having first hand experience and knowledge to comment on the hardware in the machine.
John said:
I've spoken with a couple of friends in the industry about this, the general consensus from them is that it's tough to coax the same level of performance out of the PS3 to match the 360. (They're both currently working on PS3/Xbox 360 titles that have yet to be announced.) I asked one of them if this was just because the 360 has been out longer. He said that it was part of the reason, but that 6 months after development started on their title the progress they were making on the PS3 was very poor indeed.
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The PS2 was also a difficult system to develop for and some really great looking games have been developed for it.

My point was this. He stated that he was disappointed with the hardware in the PS3. What basis did he have for that comment? As Joe gamer pretty much none, because we haven't seen and don&#8217;t have firsthand knowledge of what the hardware can do. Hence my smart comment about being a dev. If he was a programmer with knowledge of the PS3 hardware I would take his comment more to heart, but the reality is many of us can't comment on the hardware being disappointing. Disappointing hardware capabilities/power and the learning curve for new hardware are different things. I agree the PS3 is more difficult to program for, but I also hear that it has very capable hardware, which is the point I was refuting.

Anyway I don't want to go any further OT, this thread is about HardOCP's review of the PS3.
 
John said:
I've spoken with a couple of friends in the industry about this, the general consensus from them is that it's tough to coax the same level of performance out of the PS3 to match the 360. (They're both currently working on PS3/Xbox 360 titles that have yet to be announced.) I asked one of them if this was just because the 360 has been out longer. He said that it was part of the reason, but that 6 months after development started on their title the progress they were making on the PS3 was very poor indeed.
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PC software and also xbox360 coding + xna were similar and using a GPU centric methode were always more industry friendly. With the playstation 2 and 3 a developer needs to really really dig CPUs to get the method out.

Multiplatform devs or devs that work on ports usually hate the ps3. Its really evident in the crappy ps3 ports that used the 360 as the main plat for development. However PS3 exclusive devlopers as per the nature of only working in that enviroment find it different.

ninja theory devs give really good insight into this on other forums, great discussions always stem from a certain multiplat developer and NT with NT giving them different point of view.
 
Silentbob - Just so you know, I was specifically referring to the quote you posted from the Ninja Gaiden Sigma developer regarding ease of development on the PS3. (Not so much what you wrote above it.) Didn't want to quote the huge block of text .;)
 
John said:
Silentbob - Just so you know, I was specifically referring to the quote you posted from the Ninja Gaiden Sigma developer regarding ease of development on the PS3. (Not so much what you wrote above it.) Didn't want to quote the huge block of text .;)
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I don&#8217;t recall saying ease? Anyway, that's wasn't my point. My point was the hardware is indeed capable for video games and who better to illustrate that then somebody who creates video games. I have edited my response and hopefully is will help explain why I made the initial comment and what I was driving at when taking contention to"dissapointing hardware".

Oh and I too held the same feeling as desultadox. I felt Sony had mucked up when they choose the hardware for the PS3, especially after reading some of the articles and forum threads that were floating around comparing the PS3 to the 360. That was until I was pointed over to Beyond3D where some developers were laughing at those same articles and threads, commenting on how inaccurate they were and clearly the people who wrote them didn't have first hand knowledge of the system

LOL looks like I started a dev war, I should've just bolded the part that I felt was relevant. Oh well I think I'm done.
 
Replying to you is proving pointless because you make little sense and change your mind about what you mean and think every other post. Furthermore, you should not be concerned with my credentials when clearly you know at least as little as the average Joe. It would be safe for you to assume that anybody else's opinion is at least as valid as yours and most likely more so. I don't mind being questioned, but you did so in a condescending way and now you prove that your level of expertise on the topic is such that you should look down on nobody.

You claim that the PS2 had some great-looking games even with its processor-centric architecture. That was DESPITE the design, not because of it. The PS2 design was largely a copy of the Sega Saturn hardware, and look where that went. Console hardware should drive developers forward, not hold them back.

When I first heard details and rumors and rumblings of the PS3, I was excited by the power, and with nVidia in the mix, I thought Sony had finally learned that a game system needs killer discrete graphics, at least on par with its processor. As PS3 neared launch, the real specs became available and disappointed me (this is in many ways a repeat of the PS2 launch).

My gripe is that the PS3, like the PS2 is too much processor and not enough video acceleration (although its a lot better than the PS2 design). Furthermore, the Cell just does not belong in a gaming system, at least not today. You've got guys like John Carmack complaining about 2- and 4-threaded games, imagine programming for multiple Special Purpose Processors! I could care less how difficult it is for developers, but the part that gets me is longer development times mean the consumer must wait longer for the product and it also drives prices up. Then you can wind up with lackluster ports and top it all off with less innovation in games due to developer time/expenses on just getting a game to run. I love games and anything that prevents my MAXIMUM enjoyment of video games or inhibits the potential of video games is no friend of mine.

If you'd like to disagree with me, at least be civil about it. If you actually have a valid argument, that'd be nice too.
 
Wow Steve, no luv on the misleading HDMI info from the article???

If you are truly the 360 f4nboy everyone thinks you are, I would have thought the Elite's poor hdmi showing would have disappointed you as much as I was, at least enough to correct the article....
Heck it may be the biggest advantage the PS3 has over the 360 right now.
 
desultadox said:
If you'd like to disagree with me, at least be civil about it. If you actually have a valid argument, that'd be nice too.
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lol, you misunderstood my facetious comment which was questioning your technical credentials in reagrds to your realization that the hardware was a dissapointment. Anything after that was on you, I have never changed my intents or thoughts. Perhaps I should have reeled you in and clarified my point, but I didn't. I will take responsibility for that and for using a "smart" comment.

I realize my shortcomings in the area of hardware architecture and thus posted a link from somebody who is technically versed to offer a legitimate opinion on the PS3's hardware, a developer. I'm glad you think you have more knowledge in that area than I, but we'll never know.

You are correct we'll have to disagree, but I do believe we'll see multiple processing units being good for games. It has to start somewhere, and Sony went out on a limb by using it in the PS3. We do agree, I wish like hell Sony would have used a more advanced GPU, but what were their options? ATi was working with MS; my understanding was that NVIDIA wasn't far enough along with their G80 GPU. I guess they could've gone with the updated G71. I agree that hardware should assist programmers, but sometimes a new way of thinking or breakthrough is needed. Perhaps the PS2 is a bad example, but I was just trying to point out developers can do amazing things when forced to, but your point is they shouldn't be forced to and that's a valid argument. It was not supporting the EE from a technical standpoint.

Anyway I think we've finished this and I don't want to drag this thread down any longer.

On a seperate note:
Ran a benchmark on DVD read speeds for a DL DVD; avg was 6x, getting up to 7.22x towards the end. Don&#8217;t have a BD-ROM to run with BR.
 
adonn78 said:
I got some more "strikes agaisnt the PS3.

No "Must Have" games. Grand Theft Auto 4 is coming out on both the 360 and PS3. As are most other games. including the WWE games. And Halo 3 is exlusive to the xbox 360. What does Sony have to offer? Metal Gear Solid 4? A game that one can beat in a day and has no real multiplayer or replay value. Sony Needs a fun must have game with exclusive rights. something high profile. For instance a new Twisted Metal game. Or a PS3 version of Crysis. The Xbox 360 has got it all and is $200 cheaper than the Sony.

The Games for both systems cost $60+ This si why I am glad to be a PC Gamer who only plays console games when I go to friend's houses. As soon as I got an alienware I had no reason to play my PS2 and I gave it away to my little brother. We need more games with co-op mode and multiplayers LAN for the PC.
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Well, Sony has; lair, warhawk, killzone, heavenly sword, and MGS4. I don't care for the Halo series, I know it's shocking and there are others out there that feel the same way. I can't speak on the MP aspect in regards to MGS4, but they did a good job with r the MGS title on the PSP and MP. Heck, with 3rd party exclusives out of the way the decision is even easier, go with the console that has the 1st party exclusives you want.

I also want to say I think the 360 is a great system and was very close to purchasing one.
 
Silentbob343 said:
Well, Sony has; lair, warhawk, killzone, heavenly sword, and MGS4. I don't care for the Halo series, I know it's shocking and there are others out there that feel the same way. I can't speak on the MP aspect in regards to MGS4, but they did a good job with r the MGS title on the PSP and MP. Heck, with 3rd party exclusives out of the way the decision is even easier, go with the console that has the 1st party exclusives you want.
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The only problem is that the only one of those games that i want and is out is Killzone, and that's not enough for me to justify the system until I buy an HDTV at which point it would be a decent blue-ray player albeit an expensive one. The dilema I am in is that I want the power/hardware/features of the PS3 with great games to go with it. Yes, there are a few great games available, but most of them are also available on lesser expensieve systems, and since I don't have an HDTV yet (am I the only one? I don't think so), that is a problem.

Hoping that by the time I have cash for an HDTV there will be better games available on the PS3, if not chances are there will be blue-ray players out there for less that might be a better solution for me, not to Sony's advantage.
 
mryerse said:
The only problem is that the only one of those games that i want and is out is Killzone, and that's not enough for me to justify the system until I buy an HDTV at which point it would be a decent blue-ray player albeit an expensive one. The dilema I am in is that I want the power/hardware/features of the PS3 with great games to go with it. Yes, there are a few great games available, but most of them are also available on lesser expensieve systems, and since I don't have an HDTV yet (am I the only one? I don't think so), that is a problem.

Hoping that by the time I have cash for an HDTV there will be better games available on the PS3, if not chances are there will be blue-ray players out there for less that might be a better solution for me, not to Sony's advantage.
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I agree if you don't see value, don't buy it, but the same could be said for the 360. If you don't like the exclusives for the 360, it doesn't have value for you. In summary the individual will have to decide.

It's not an expensive BR player, it's one of the least expensive and one of the better BR players available. But who knows, by the time you're ready to buy a BD player there will most likely be a better standalone option.
 
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