How many gamers would it take to "force" adoption of the PPU?

HOCP4ME

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Pretend that there is some sort of system where people commit to buy a PPU on a certain date, but only if the total number of people to make the commitment is above a certain number. How many gamers would have to do that to ensure that the PPU is adopted by developers?

Obviously, if every gamer were to go out and buy a PPU right now, we would see widespread usage of it in every new game produced from now on. But how many gamers would have to do that in order to get the developers interested?
 
HOCP4ME said:
Pretend that there is some sort of system where people commit to buy a PPU on a certain date, but only if the total number of people to make the commitment. How many gamers would have to do that to ensure that the PPU is adopted by developers?

Obviously, if every gamer were to go out and buy a PPU right now, we would see widespread usage of it in every new game produced from now on. But how many gamers would have to do that in order to get the developers interested?

Alomst the same situation back when the first 3D cards came about.
Not every one could see the benefit, wanted to pay for extra hardware ect.
But Quake made people change their minds.

/offtopic
Quake with Tenebrae mod actually looks damn good today, considering it's a old game:
http://tenebrae.sourceforge.net/index.php?page=screenshots.txt
(stencil shadows and per pixel lighting)
 
Its not going to be up to consumers to adopt hardware so game developers will take advantage of those things. When great games or even a great game comes out where a piece of hardware makes a significant difference in the games enjoyability factor then people will adopts that hardware. It is a slow change that can take months or even years to happen. Right now I think it is up to the physics companies like Aegia to prove to the software developers that this peice of hardware is something that can significantly boost the entertainment value of their games.
 
Terra said:
Alomst the same situation back when the first 3D cards came about.
Not every one could see the benefit, wanted to pay for extra hardware ect.
But Quake made people change their minds.

/offtopic
Quake with Tenebrae mod actually looks damn good today, considering it's a old game:
http://tenebrae.sourceforge.net/index.php?page=screenshots.txt
(stencil shadows and per pixel lighting)


You can't compare a PPU to a GPU as the only thing absolutely required is the GPU. It is up to Ageia to convince the developers to use their API. It is not like a PPU will allow higher resolution gaming, higher AA, higher AF, better sound effects, so it really is up to Ageia to convince the delevoper which will make the consumers want it (see the current poll for what the users who have voted think).
 
Before this turns into a PPU vs GPU argument:

I think we can all agree that, if everyone went out and bought a PPU, we could all be certain that our new PPUs would soon be fully exploited. The reason developers don't use it (much) is because no one has one. The reason no one has one is because developers don't use it. Usually, it's the developers who will break the ice and adopt a product first. Then, seeing developer support, everyone will buy a PPU. But, how many consumers would it take to turn that around? How many people would have to buy a PPU to convince the developers to start exploiting it?
 
R1ckCa1n said:
It is not like a PPU will allow higher resolution gaming, higher AA, higher AF, better sound effects, so it really is up to Ageia to convince the delevoper which will make the consumers want it (see the current poll for what the users who have voted think).
How do you figure? A good sound card does positional audio better ---> more immersive gaming.
A PPU has the potential to add a lot of realism to games ---> more immersive gaming
 
RavenD said:
How do you figure? A good sound card does positional audio better ---> more immersive gaming.
A PPU has the potential to add a lot of realism to games ---> more immersive gaming

Just wait untill (if?) GPU-physcis comes out, he will be prasing it(GPU-physcis) to the clouds then...
Not matter how few(none?) games it supports..as long as it made by ATI ;)
 
R1ckCa1n said:
You can't compare a PPU to a GPU as the only thing absolutely required is the GPU. It is up to Ageia to convince the developers to use their API. It is not like a PPU will allow higher resolution gaming, higher AA, higher AF, better sound effects, so it really is up to Ageia to convince the delevoper which will make the consumers want it (see the current poll for what the users who have voted think).

A) the more phycis in HL2 was one of the things gamers loved about that game.

B) I don't see any developers that have voted in that poll?
But lets take a look who is backing PhysX:


Akella - Captain Blood
Airtight Games
Abyss Lights Studio - Abyss Lights: Frozen Systems
Artificial Studios / Immersion Games - CellFactor: Combat Training *
- LAN-only multiplayer
- Click here to download the CellFactor: Combat Training demo
Artificial Studios / Immersion Games - CellFactor: Revolution *
- LAN or broadband online multiplayer
Artificial Studios / Immersion Games - CellMark (?)
Artificial Studios - Monster Madness
ASCARON Entertainment - Sacred II (and other next-generation titles)
Atari - Dragonshard
Atomic Elbow - Switchball
Big Huge Games - Rise Of Nations: Rise Of Legends *
- Click here for demo
Black Element Software - Alpha Prime *
BlueTorch Studios - Open Fire (free game)
Boanerges Studios
Bongfish Interactive Entertainment - Stoked Rider featuring Tommy Brunner
- Click here for demo mirrors
ChessBase - FRITZ 9 (and other upcoming titles)
Composite Studios - Ancient Galaxy *
Crazy House - Tank Killer
Cryptic Studios - City Of Villains (and other next-generation titles) **
Cyanide Studios - Loki
Destineer Studios
DiezelPower Studios - Dogtag
DIOsoft - Pirates of the XXI Century
EGN Interactive
Epic Games - Unreal Tournament 2007 *
- Supposedly some levels require PhysX hardware
FAKT Software - Crazy Machines II
FAKT Software - Gunship Apocalypse
Frantic Games - 1944 D-Day: Operation Overlord
Frogwares Game Development Studio
Futuremark Corporation - 3DMark06
- No PhysX hardware support
Gaijin Entertainment
Game Consulting - Arena Online
GRIN - Tom Clancy's Ghost Recon: Advanced Warfighter *
- Click here for demo mirrors and here for the latest patches
GungHo Online Entertainment - Rondo Projects
Icarus Studios - Fallen Earth
IceHill - Empire Above All
Illusion Softworks
Kuju Entertainment - Rail Simulator
Kylotonn - Bet On Soldier: Blood Sport & Blood Of Sahara expansion pack *
- Click here to download Bet On Soldier v1.3 PhysX patch, 257MB
- Click here to download Blood Of Sahara demo
Larian Studios
Legendo Entertainment - Monster Truck Maniax
Meridian 93
Metropolis Software - INFERNAL (Diabolique)
MiST Land
Monte Cristo - Silverfall
Most Wanted Entertainment - Joint Task Force
Mythic Entertainment - Warhammer Online: Age Of Reckoning
Naked Sky Entertainment - RoboBlitz
NetDevil
Obsidian Entertainment
PerfectPlay Entertainment - Metathrone Project
Pandora Studios
Piranha Bytes - Gothic 3 **
Real Time Worlds
Shiny Entertainment Studio
Quantic Dream - KARMA & Heavy Rain
Ritual Entertainment
Secret Level
SEGA - GE2 Project (and other next-generation titles)
Sigil Games Online - Vanguard: Saga Of Heroes
Signature Devices
Spark Unlimited - New Pandora game ***
Treehouse (Games Academy) - Fragfist
Widescreen Games
XL Games
YAGER Development - Eye Of The Storm

Hardware physcics isn't going anywhere...AGEIA is on the court, ATI/NVIDIA/Havok is in the dressing room...wanting to get on the court...
Hardware physics is not going anywhere...and you know it.

Just wait untill ATI get its' (DX10?) solution out, you will be prasing it to the clouds... :rolleyes:
 
Terra said:
A) the more phycis in HL2 was one of the things gamers loved about that game.

B) I don't see any developers that have voted in that poll?
But lets take a look who is backing PhysX:




Hardware physcics isn't going anywhere...AGEIA is on the court, ATI/NVIDIA/Havok is in the dressing room...wanting to get on the court...
Hardware physics is not going anywhere...and you know it.

Just wait untill ATI get its' (DX10?) solution out, you will be prasing it to the clouds... :rolleyes:


Your attempt to justify the poll in a DIFFERENT thread should be moved.......

anyways, lets get back on topic. it would take 72 million gamers and two years.
 
I think it's more a question of which game or gameS it will take to force the adoption of the PPU.

Like it was established a long time ago, PhysX needs that 'killer app'...if it isn't the next Cell Factor game (Revolution), then it'll be UT2k7.

Gamers themselves are important, I agree, but I think it takes more than just gamers to force adoption of a certain piece of hardware...there needs to be a game or gameS that puts the new hardware to practical use.
 
R1ckCa1n said:
You can't compare a PPU to a GPU as the only thing absolutely required is the GPU.
Oh sure you can.
You forget. The PPU is the first hardware accelerated Physics device. So you compare it against the first hardware accelerated 3D G-card.
That SGSthompson Daimond 3d edge card. or Voodoo1 wenn it was just out.
Between Doom one and Quake one. Wenn for voodoo the first glide games came out.
GPU where not requiered then. But in years they are.
What will PPU do? It starting at that track. But takes time to unveil.
It is up to Ageia to convince the developers to use their API.
They are convinced its a good API and support for its hardware means it's free. Adoption asssured. Just waiting for the games then.
It is not like a PPU will allow higher resolution gaming, higher AA, higher AF, better sound effects,
No you need a high-end GPU for that and PPU add more stuff to that. effects physics and gameplay physics. Mo is better. That what a PPU is for.
so it really is up to Ageia to convince the delevoper which will make the consumers want it
No the devs are already convince for such small but growing target market they are very enthausiast. The difference between devs and you are. Dev's are very aware that is take time time time. And your short sighted to see only now now now. With over a year or two now means nothing. even if ageia fails. It will fail if those 100+ games are all crap.
The whole market forgot about 3DFX early days wenn VOODOO1 came out.
(see the current poll for what the users who have voted think).
Your Poll is means nothing. It's know that its still in a early stage. Come back with that crap after 2 years. when Ageia attemp of rolling out a new hardware market shows off it sucses or not.

It certanly don't work like this. As in the wizard of oz or any magical story: "Some dwafs grow 65 games on a tree. and in the next field there grows PPU. in one week. So they can deliver 65 games and shit load of PPU in a fantasy land. To flood the realworld with it"Then you can expect a fast sucses or flop. :)
 
Get dell to start shipping the things as stock (no option to remove it) and I will buy in after a year or so.
 
terra said:
A) the more phycis in HL2 was one of the things gamers loved about that game.

B) I don't see any developers that have voted in that poll?
But lets take a look who is backing PhysX:

/snip/ annoyingly large list


Hardware physcics isn't going anywhere...AGEIA is on the court, ATI/NVIDIA/Havok is in the dressing room...wanting to get on the court...
Hardware physics is not going anywhere...and you know it.

About 4-5 of those games actually listed next to developers are out and only one of them was good (rise of legends). That list actually makes me want to buy a ppu less since nothing i want is on it. when that changes i'll sure as heck be ordering one.

i believe that a majority of gamers are taking the same approach, so it'll have to be the developers to iniate the buying spree. Making up a random number won't really prove anything so i won't.

I said i'd get a ppu and not another gpu so don't make yourself look bad by misquoting me.


maybe try and stay with the topic of the thread, just an idea. :rolleyes:
 
Ver1tas said:
maybe try and stay with the topic of the thread, just an idea.

So listing developers that have adopted the PhysX is off-topic? :rolleyes:
 
Terra said:
So listing developers that have adopted the PhysX is off-topic? :rolleyes:

Yes considering the title of this thread:

Thread: How many gamers would it take to "force" adoption of the PPU?

In your logic the thread title should have been:

Thread: How many developers would it take to "force" adoption of the PPU?
 
R1ckCa1n said:
Yes considering the title of this thread:

Thread: How many gamers would it take to "force" adoption of the PPU?

Fore the adoptaion of who?
(Hint : developers)

In your logic the thread title should have been:

Thread: How many developers would it take to "force" adoption of the PPU?

Let me see.
For anything to get supported (like the 3D GPU) the "story" goes like this:

A) Hardware + drivers need to be on the market...check
B) Games need to support the hardware(developers)...check(list keeps growing for the PhysX)
C) Then gamers will either adopt or not.

If we use logic(wich isn't a induvidual thing, you're quite good at fallacies, to bad they are useless) then we can say that the number of gamers dosn't have to be very large, since developers are already apodting it.
No matter og big, bold letters can change that fact :p
 
Terra said:
Fore the adoptaion of who?
(Hint : developers)



Let me see.
For anything to get supported (like the 3D GPU) the "story" goes like this:

A) Hardware + drivers need to be on the market...check
B) Games need to support the hardware(developers)...check(list keeps growing for the PhysX)
C) Then gamers will either adopt or not.

If we use logic(wich isn't a induvidual thing, you're quite good at fallacies, to bad they are useless) then we can say that the number of gamers dosn't have to be very large, since developers are already apodting it.
No matter og big, bold letters can change that fact :p

You missed the point but that is nothing new. Continue on your maketing campaign regardless of user opinions as long as it fits your agenda.
 
R1ckCa1n said:
You missed the point but that is nothing new.

Then point it out for me.
That the OP's question is "flawed" dosn't validate the continued walking donw a false path?

Gamedevelopers(wich have (fortunally) a good deal more that say that you) are adopting the PhysX.
No trolling/viral marketing can change that...sorry.
Fact of life.
 
Terra said:
Then point it out for me.
That the OP's question is "flawed" dosn't validate the continued walking donw a false path?

Gamedevelopers(wich have (fortunally) a good deal more that say that you) are adopting the PhysX.
No trolling/viral marketing can change that...sorry.
Fact of life.

Two threads in one day you call flawed because you don't like the results; I see another trend starting here. The USERS on this forum has spoken.

Terra said:
You forgot users(like yourself) who voted more than one time...again..poll flawed(or your poll-logic)
 
R1ckCa1n said:
Two threads in one day you call flawed because you don't like the results; I see another trend starting here. The USERS on this forum has spoken.



rargh, you disagree??, VIRAL MARKETINGS!!!1!

All jokes aside, the poll isn't a good representation since the sample size isn't large enough.
 
Terra said:
Can I borrow your crystal ball? :)

Apparently you need it. Terra, go ahead and fight and argue for something you really like, but your just not making sense. Do you honestly believe the PPU is going to get a lot of attention from gamers? Not everyone pisses there money away just because they can. Like I keep saying, maybe...in time the PPU will be worthy of my hard earned dollars, until then, its useless for your average or even your extreme gamer.
 
How many people own an X-Fi?

For that matter, how many people own a sound card that cost over $20???
over $50? over $75? hell over $150?

I love sound blaster sound cards, but I find it hard to justify a $200 X-Fi. But obviusly there are enough people out there who buy them, because there are games that support their proprietary API.

so, I suppose, whatever percentage of gamer has an X-Fi would be the number it takes to convince developers.
 
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