About to take the plunge. Input is appreciated

S

sackowitz

Limp Gawd
Joined
Mar 26, 2002
Messages
328
i've been band-aiding an athlon xp setup that's basically maxxed out on aircooling, and it's time to move on, especially considering the death of AGP. I was wondering if you all could be so kind as to advise me of a case and water setup reccomendation that has the following requirements. I've done some searching but as I have absolutely no experience watercooling, even though once upon a time I had done my research, with the recent introduction of all these kits and solutions out there, i figured I'd test the water and see what you all think.

All comments are welcome.

What I care about:
1. Must be a completely internal setup.
2. Must have provisions to cool an A64, system ram, and northbridge (on what will most likely be a DFI LP board, the 200 dollar SLI platinum whatever you call it board), with enough overhead to be able to add system ram and (optional) two video cards in the loop in the future. Obviously I'm going to need a northbridge block that won't interfere with the pci-e cards, and i understand that it's a PITA to change the configuration once it's been filled and operational.
3. I need decent performance. Not super excellent or whatever, just enough of an improvement above air so to justify the cost and time investments, and ultimately achieve a respectable overclock.
4. The pump must be based on 12v feeds, I don't want line voltage a/c going anywhere past the power supply.

What I don't care about it.
1. How it looks.
2. How much it costs (within reason of course, otherwise I'd be going with a refrigerant based solution)

I know an external radiator is optimal, but i need this box to remain completely portable as I would rather not have the risk of banging it up in transit, so I want it all inside. I understand that this will not alleviate the need for internal case fans, and I don't care about a reasonable amount of noise (ie like what i have now). I also understand that I'm going to need a pretty badass power supply (suggestions quite welcome). I'm also guessing that I'm going to have to use a server case, or at least a high tower. I don't need all that space for my peripherals, so if I can achieve my goals without buying a case like the great pyramids, that would be awesome.

The proposed system:
A64 san diego or venice, L2 cache shouldn't make much difference for what I do.
2gb Corsair xms 2-3-3-6 (2x 1gb dual channel pair)
Aforementioned DFI LP mobo
Tagon SLI power supply, not sure what kind of wattage I will need.
2x sata-2 7200rpm drives in hardware raid-0
Asus 7800gt (eventually to be two in SLI)
 
you will prolly not be able to watercool the chipset as its right under the vid card slot. The ram isnt worth watercooling and will kill your flow. A fan is all your ram needs to be plenty cool.
 
i appreciate the input. ok, so take the ram out of the picture, probably not going to be an issue... but not watercooling the northbridge scares me. i know all vid cards aren't created equal and such, and it's going to be tight no matter what. perhaps I can rephrase that part of my question: has anyone had success doing so? thanks!
 
you would have to order a special block from Germany i think. Just point a fan at it and that will be plenty. All i have is a 120mm fan pointing at my vidcard/chipset and temps never break 42C when OCing. If money is no object, i would look into building a custom setup.

My opinion:
Storm G4 CPU Block
MCP655 Pump
Tygon Tubing (supposed to be the best)
MCR220 Rad or DD Black Ice Xtreme 2 or any 120X2 for that matter
MCW55 or DD Maze 4 for the GPU
Res or T-Line is in user preference, i have a micro res from Swiftech and its great
Get yourself some worm clamps from Home Depot
MCT5
 
I remember there being a northbridge block made b a guy with the initials EK, search for it on the forum and youll find it. It has 1/2" fittings. Then just go with either a strom (swiftech) CPU block or a TDX (Danger Den). From there, BIP2 mounted in the top of the case. Pump, go with either the d5 (swiffy 655, Danger Den D5) or the laing DDC (swiffy 350, DD DDC-12v). For tubing, instead of 1/2" stuff, go to mcmaster.com and buy yourself so 7/16 tygon (expensive) or masterkleer (just as good but fanatics will scream no3s!!).


Then for the grpahics cards later on, you'll still have enoughcoooling ability and some options on what blocks to get.

have fun!

EDIT: budwise has pretty much the same thing stated as me except the tubing size and type, and radiator (i'd go Black Ice PRO not Extreme). And the fact that he's advocating MCT-5... which you dont need unless you dont trust yourself. I've personally never used the stuff and love my Anti-freeze / water combo.
 
thanks guys! i'm guessing that you're ultimately reccomending a 5-1/4 bay mounted radiator. i guess i'f it doesnt already come with one, i'll dremel out a hole to mount a 120mm and blow down from the top of hte case.

also, i'm going to now research all of those parts and see if it all starts making sense, i appreciate the insight.

which reminds me, any case suggestions? i currently have an antec chieftan, but would like something new. thanks again!
 
If you want to cool everything (RAM, HDD, Chipset, mosfet, CPU, GPU) and cost is not important, then consider going to Aquacomputer, Alphacool, Innovatek and Koolance.

These are companies that specialise is water cooling everything using smaller diameter tubing (8/6mm and 10/8mm refering to OD/ID).

These companies can alll supply everything you need to get started (pumps, rads, blocks etc) and you can stick with one company or you can mix and match components from different companies as they all follow the same philosophy.

There are also many other water cooling manufacturers that do different types of blocks as well, but are not as well known as the above from providing a total system setup.

1A Cooling
MIPS Computer
EK Waterblocks

And there are also so many e-tailers that resell these products... I usually buy direct from the manufacturer, but some of these e-tailers can supply a number of different brands under one banner.

IT-Trade
Leftclicks
PC Cooling
The Cooling Shop
Frozen CPU

And there are so many others that i can't remember (or even can't be bothered) to list them all.. but it gives you can idea of where to start.

Enjoy.
 
thank you very much.

i agree that buying direct might be the best bet, but i can't speak german for the life of me.

i was thinking about settling for one of these kits, with the addition of a north bridge block
http://www.sharkacomputers.com/ev20co5drbay.html

http://www.sharkacomputers.com/inwatkitinfo.html

i'm pretty tired and drunk now so i'm going to have to research this kit later.... but again, it's been very helpful to get all the big names and sites in front of me so i can have an idea what's out there these days.
 
If you get those kits please don't cry about how bad they work. ;) Stick with the AC equipment at Sharka and you will be a much more happier camper in life.
 
hmm... in this particular respect, you get what you pay for i'm afraid. But if it's a simple setup you want with no pretensions, then it should serve you fine.
 
ok, i've been doing a bunch of searching at those sites you guys posted as well as here on the ocp. I think putting together my own kit would be the easiest thing. I'm sure I'll have some more questions as I progress, but I had a neat idea for utilizing some stuff I had laying around in my garage for water transport.

100_0296.JPG


We use tons of this stuff doing custom turbo kits for imports, the only thing is they only work with AN fittings, for which I'm not aware of any watercooling items which have these connectors as an option. I guess the only downfalls of using something like this would be that you would have to weld AN fittings to the ports on everything the loop hits (which i don't particularly mind doing), and that can't see any air bubbles, but if you know how to crimp these lines, and are properly installed with pipe dope, you'll never spring a leak. Stainless braided lines would probably look pretty cool too.

I have a feeling this is way more trouble than it's worth, no?
 
If you find kits that use NPT threads you can use the same stuff your using on your car. I know they make AN to NPT adapters.
 
Could you use a clear braided line with those fittings? That'd look pretty sweet and you'd be able to see air in the lines.
 
xhx said:
Could you use a clear braided line with those fittings? That'd look pretty sweet and you'd be able to see air in the lines.
Click to expand...
na, in order to use the fittings you see in the above pic, you need to be using lines like that with a steel braid. unless they make clear steel of course.... :D

seriously though, these lines are a pain to make, and the connectors won't work with any other type of conduit. you have to put them in a vice and crimp the connectors on and stuff, jegs.com has instructions online... but it is really tedious to learn how to do them right if you've never seen it done.

i'm going to see if they make npt fittings for these lines, i'm almost positive they do. if so, i think those lines would look pretty cool. i've used those lines for oil, coolant and fuel distribution, and especially with the latter, these lines stand up to really high pressure and don't fail (i've seen more than 4 bar through these lines, no problems).

awhile ago i had the idea of building a box that looked like a commercial grade electrical installation, mostly using greenfield steel flex as a chase for all the wiring. these lines would certainly make that concept more defined.

edit: and these lines and connectors are pretty damn expensive, so unless you have money to burn or have access to this stuff for cheap, i'm not sure how practical it would be seeing that you could buy clear plastic tubing and connectors for literally a fraction of the cost.
 
Ah, I was looking at the wrong lines in the picture :rolleyes: . Those braided lines would look cool. Do they only come in the raw steel color?
 
i'm going to have to search around, i'm not sure the come in any other color but i'm sure you could paint it whatever you like so long as you don't flex it much after you paint it. those lines can bend any way you like, and because it's braided, you might scrape off some paint or expose unpainted areas by bending them.

i'll do some looking around tomorrow for ya, but in general, i'd guess that for a totally minimal basic setup cooling just the cpu would cost around 60-80 bucks for all the parts from a reputable company like jegs.

i have to check around and see what i have as well as the npt sizes these kits are coming with, and if it makes any sense to do so, i'll gladly post a parts list
 
Steel bried line is expensive though man. Not to ention to get t with 1/2" ID you'd have to go to like, AN4 I think, and thats freakin huge!

To me the only way that it wouldn't get bulky is to go with a 1/4" setup, but that would still be like goin with a larger 3/8" setup.
 
yea, maybe this is just a pipe dream with the whole braided line thing....

but i'm definitely putting water in the new boxen. so many choices.... i need to do more homework.
 
ok i'm starting to get my bases here. I've decided to change over to an Asus A8n due to good reviews and particularly because dangerden makes a chipset block that works specifically with these mobos when utilizing sli... which is nice.

my water system so far is to be the newest dd block (tdx i think?), white plastic bay res from dd, and the aforementioned chipset block.

dd is sold out of the pump i'd really like to get, i've read alot of good things about this little thing http://www.dangerdenstore.com/product.php?productid=178&cat=0&page=1 what are your thoughts on this? is it skimping out or is it enough for what i need?

also, i was planning on using this rad: http://www.dangerdenstore.com/product.php?productid=5 , but now i'm unsure as to what case i should get. Optimally, I'd like to get a plain jane case with a side window that has space to fit the rad at the bottom front of the case... which basically means that the bottom bays need to be modular; ie be able to slide out and be removed. I'd really rather not hack apart the top of the case to mount it up high, as i'm really not that talented with a dremel. any suggestions?

thanks for all the interest / help here guys!

edit: i am currently using an antec (i think it was called the chief or chieftan) case, but it was given to me and has always been missing the hardware needed to mount 5-1/4 devices (i guess the slide rails or something?)... so i'd rather not gimp out and use this thing anymore, although for space and fitment, this is basically an ideal case.
 
Your gonna wanta bigger rad than that. I'd go with at least a singel 120mm rad, especially since most cases can be used to mount them at the low front (like you wanted).
 
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