Is it time for Nvidia to support Freesync?

[euskalzabe]

Why's that hard to believe? We know most Freesync monitors are straight trash already. They mostly don't support variable overdrive, for example. Most of the supported monitors are TN, it's entirely possible that without variable overdrive, Nvidia considers the response time out of spec for many panels at certain refresh rates. How many don't support low framerate compensation, or only support it for a poor range?

There's lots of legitimate reasons to reject Freesync monitors as not good enough. Because most aren't.

My LG 29 WK600 begs to disagree. A nice IPS monitor with 40-75hz VRR range is good enough for regular 3rd person adventure gameplay, even better when you consider I only paid $200 for it. Far from garbage, and as for LFC... if you're playing at sub-30fps, well, you're doing it wrong. Show me a single Gsync monitor that comes even close to this value.

 

[Nebell]

Can someone explain this to me?
So I can run 4k at 40fps on my TV which support Freesync and still have smooth gameplay with 1080Ti?
Will it feel as smooth as 1440p/120hz?

 

[reaper12]

Maybe i got missunderstood...

You repeated everything i was agreeing to. I believe my original comment was you are not going to save much money trying to find a free sync that supports LFC and has the same quality panel, vs a gsync. I guess i was trying to make and apples to apples argument and failed.


On a ligher note, im running a viewsonic VX3258 via the igpu trick with a ryzen 2200g and a gtx 1070. It will be nice at the end of the month to not have to manually select each game exe and select performance in win10 in order to run the gtx and have free sync at the same time.

sorry if my last post was abrupt, I wrote it in a hurry.

And No, I am not agreeing with you at all. There are Freesync monitors that have full range that are way cheaper than any Gsync monitor. For example, you say that there is no Freesync equivalent of a 240Hz Gsync monitor. Well, there is. There is an Acer Predator 27 inch Gsync 240hz monitor and there is an Acer Predator 27 inch 240Hz Freesync monitor. It's the same monitor, same panel etc. Except there is over $300 between the two in price.

You can save a lot of money buying the Adaptive Sync version of a monitor over a Gsync one.

On that Lighter note, I am in the same boat as you. I have an Asus IPS Freesync monitor that's not on the list. I have a 1080ti so it would be great to have sync tech again. Just hope it works ok.

 

[reaper12]

Can someone explain this to me?
So I can run 4k at 40fps on my TV which support Freesync and still have smooth gameplay with 1080Ti?
Will it feel as smooth as 1440p/120hz?

As far as I am aware the 1080Ti does not support HDMI 2.1. So it won't work with VRR.

Also, as far as I am aware, Nvidia haven't mentioned anything about supporting VRR over HDMI. The current announcement only affects display port.

 

[Nebell]

As far as I am aware the 1080Ti does not support HDMI 2.1. So it won't work with VRR.

Also, as far as I am aware, Nvidia haven't mentioned anything about supporting VRR over HDMI. The current announcement only affects display port.

Why would you need HDMI 2.1 for Freesync/Gsync?

 

[nightanole]

My LG 29 WK600 begs to disagree. A nice IPS monitor with 40-75hz VRR range is good enough for regular 3rd person adventure gameplay, even better when you consider I only paid $200 for it. Far from garbage, and as for LFC... if you're playing at sub-30fps, well, you're doing it wrong. Show me a single Gsync monitor that comes even close to this value.

That sounds like an awsome monitor for $200. I wonder if you can force LFC so that you can stay in the freesync range. Here is the problem, if you drop below your 40hz, you will experience tearing and juddering. If you can force enable LFC, the video card will never feed the monitor anything below 40fps, so it will always stay in the freesync range.

https://www.amd.com/Documents/freesync-lfc.pdf

 

[nightanole]

As far as I am aware the 1080Ti does not support HDMI 2.1. So it won't work with VRR.

Also, as far as I am aware, Nvidia haven't mentioned anything about supporting VRR over HDMI. The current announcement only affects display port.

You are digging too deep. "VESA DisplayPort Adaptive-Sync protocol". This works over hdmi 2.0 monitors/tvs with freesync already. It is an add on. Im freesyncing over hdmi 2.0 right now on my amd.

"when" hdmi 2.1 comes out, VRR will be part of the standard, not optional.

You do not need a hdmi 2.1 nvidia (no 2.1 video card exists) to get freesync over hdmi. Your old gtx 970 should be just fine.

 

[euskalzabe]

That sounds like an awsome monitor for $200. I wonder if you can force LFC so that you can stay in the freesync range. Here is the problem, if you drop below your 40hz, you will experience tearing and juddering. If you can force enable LFC, the video card will never feed the monitor anything below 40fps, so it will always stay in the freesync range.

https://www.amd.com/Documents/freesync-lfc.pdf

Well, playing at 30fps would be borderline acceptable for me, for that I have my PS4. If I'm in an extreme case where my 1060 can't manage much more than 30fps, it's not hard to lower some settings (shadows specially, maybe resolution) to get 40fps stable. 40fps is low enough to be easily achievable. If you can't even pull that off, it's probably time to consider getting a new GPU. Even if the monitor supported VRR at 30fps, I doubt I'd want it. It's too low an fps to feel as smooth as 60fps, even with VRR.

 

[reaper12]

You are digging too deep. "VESA DisplayPort Adaptive-Sync protocol". This works over hdmi 2.0 monitors/tvs with freesync already. It is an add on. Im freesyncing over hdmi 2.0 right now on my amd.

"when" hdmi 2.1 comes out, VRR will be part of the standard, not optional.

You do not need a hdmi 2.1 nvidia (no 2.1 video card exists) to get freesync over hdmi. Your old gtx 970 should be just fine.

No I am not.. The VESA display port Standard is different from the HDMI standard. It's two completely different organisations for a start.

VRR will be an optional standard on HDMI 2.1. Companies that use HDMI can opt to use VRR or not.

Most newer AMD cards support VRR through HDMI as they support HDMI 2.0 and had the needed hardware to update to HDMI 2.1 with a driver. That's why your AMD GPU works.

Nvidia GPU's don't support VRR through HDMI. People hope that Turing cards will get an update to support HDMI 2.1 down the line. But, no, Nebell's 1080ti will not work with VRR.

 

[reaper12]

Why would you need HDMI 2.1 for Freesync/Gsync?

For the same reason you need Display port 1.2a to use Adaptive sync.

Freesync and Gsync are two different things. Gsync is a self contained module. Freesync is what AMD calls their method to connect to an adaptive sync monitor. To connect to an adaptive sync monitor your GPU has to support the display port 1.2a specification. There are special hardware requirements.

If you want to connect your GPU to your TV and use VRR your GPU and TV will have to support certain requirements. Those are specified in HDMI 2.1. Some TV's that have HDMI 2.0 have the necessary hardware to support HDMI 2.1 so they just needed a firmware update. I believe some Samsung TV's were made HDMI 2.1 compliant this way.

The same with your GPU, AMD GPU's supported HDMI 2.0b and have the hardware needed to fully use HDMI 2.1 so they can be used to connect to your TV and use VRR(If the TV is VRR capable of course) But Nvidia's GPU's don't.

 

[nightanole]

No I am not.. The VESA display port Standard is different from the HDMI standard. It's two completely different organisations for a start.

VRR will be an optional standard on HDMI 2.1. Companies that use HDMI can opt to use VRR or not.

Most newer AMD cards support VRR through HDMI as they support HDMI 2.0 and had the needed hardware to update to HDMI 2.1 with a driver. That's why your AMD GPU works.

Nvidia GPU's don't support VRR through HDMI. People hope that Turing cards will get an update to support HDMI 2.1 down the line. But, no, Nebell's 1080ti will not work with VRR.

After further reading, its like you get a christmas gift wrapped like its a new bike, but its full of socks...

Yup Nvidia will only support "freesync" over DP. This sucks because runs over 6ft with DP have drop out when you start pushing 4k 60hz or 1080p 144hz. I have tried 3 3m cables, all have sparkles or droppouts.
And worse, VRR support is optional on HDMI 2.1, its not required. Since its not required, you will have to check every single time you buy something, you cant just assume its "VRR ready".


All this should have been handled when DP first came out, it was suppose to solve all our DVI problems...


I guess i should feel luck that my x470 board only has hdmi out, and it supports freesync to my viewsonic, which supports hdmi freesync in.

 

[Nebell]

For the same reason you need Display port 1.2a to use Adaptive sync.

Freesync and Gsync are two different things. Gsync is a self contained module. Freesync is what AMD calls their method to connect to an adaptive sync monitor. To connect to an adaptive sync monitor your GPU has to support the display port 1.2a specification. There are special hardware requirements.

If you want to connect your GPU to your TV and use VRR your GPU and TV will have to support certain requirements. Those are specified in HDMI 2.1. Some TV's that have HDMI 2.0 have the necessary hardware to support HDMI 2.1 so they just needed a firmware update. I believe some Samsung TV's were made HDMI 2.1 compliant this way.

The same with your GPU, AMD GPU's supported HDMI 2.0b and have the hardware needed to fully use HDMI 2.1 so they can be used to connect to your TV and use VRR(If the TV is VRR capable of course) But Nvidia's GPU's don't.

It should work on my TV (Samsung Q7FN) via HDMI. It supports Freesync and it doesn't have a DisplayPort.
Maybe if I get a DP - HDMI cable.

 

[nightanole]

It should work on my TV (Samsung Q7FN) via HDMI. It supports Freesync and it doesn't have a DisplayPort.
Maybe if I get a DP - HDMI cable.

That will be interesting. A DP 1.4 to HDMI 2.0B conversion. last time i checked it only worked for DP to HDMI 2.0A, because DP has 4 lanes, and hdmi 2.0A has 3 lanes, but HDMI 2.0B has 6 lanes.

 

[OFaceSIG]

This latest move by Nvidia to support "some" freesync monitors is a step in the correct direction. Eff proprietary standards. Gsync, is just one of many reason I try not to buy Nvidia products. Too many shenanigans from team Green.

 

[RamboZombie]

For the same reason you need Display port 1.2a to use Adaptive sync.

Freesync and Gsync are two different things. Gsync is a self contained module. Freesync is what AMD calls their method to connect to an adaptive sync monitor. To connect to an adaptive sync monitor your GPU has to support the display port 1.2a specification. There are special hardware requirements.

If you want to connect your GPU to your TV and use VRR your GPU and TV will have to support certain requirements. Those are specified in HDMI 2.1. Some TV's that have HDMI 2.0 have the necessary hardware to support HDMI 2.1 so they just needed a firmware update. I believe some Samsung TV's were made HDMI 2.1 compliant this way.

The same with your GPU, AMD GPU's supported HDMI 2.0b and have the hardware needed to fully use HDMI 2.1 so they can be used to connect to your TV and use VRR(If the TV is VRR capable of course) But Nvidia's GPU's don't.

aww, snap - i do believe that you are absolutely right here..

But if nV dosent support VRR over HDMI people will start looking at those rumored new Ati cards again..

all i know is that - next purchase will be determined by hdmi standard and VRR for me.

So no freesync/VRR - no buy - no way in hell i'll get a BFGD with those specs and prices..

 

[reaper12]

It should work on my TV (Samsung Q7FN) via HDMI. It supports Freesync and it doesn't have a DisplayPort.
Maybe if I get a DP - HDMI cable.

Did you even read my post? Nvidia's GPUs don't support VRR over HDMI at present.

And I don't think there are any display port to HDMI cables or Adaptors that support the HDMI 2.1 standard. IF there are, they will be very expensive.

 

[reaper12]

All this should have been handled when DP first came out, it was suppose to solve all our DVI problems....

It did solve all our DVI problems. But technology advances. Nvidia decided to go one route to VRR, AMD went a different route. Now they are slowly coming back together with Nvidia announcing support for Adaptive Sync monitors.

 

[sethk]

Freesync is not officially part of the HDMI 2.0 protocol, but AMD cards pass the displayport spec signaling for freesync over HDMI 2.0 today (which is great). GeForce cards do not do this yet. Sounds like they are looking into it