Bitcoin Approaches Year Low as Japan Cracks Down on Venues

DooKey

DooKey

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Bitcoin's value took a big hit today when Japan told six of the trading venues in the country to improve their business operations to help cut down on money laundering and other criminal activity. As a result some of the exchanges have quit taking new customers and are working to provide plans to the government by the 23 July deadline. This is much needed regulation in my opinion. Is regulation going to be bring on the demise of cryptocurrency or allow it to be a stable investment/currency instrument?

Some of the targets of Japan’s regulator were quick to react. Bitflyer Inc. said it would stop accepting new customers and also review identity verification for some existing users after it received an order from Japan’s Financial Services Agency. The FSA called for improved measures at all the exchanges against money laundering. The companies must submit their plans by July 23.
 
Glad I sold a lot of my Bitcoin when it was over $19K :eek: I only had a few hundred $, but still...
 
I couldn't resist (and apparently I have too much time on my hands this week) :whistle:
DirtyMiners.jpg
 
When it bottoms out to $100 I might buy some Bitcoin token to have as a Laugh.
Yeah it has some merit but I look at it as old bank exchange money. Worthless, unless you are a collector.
 
Remember when this was all about decentralization and the government not being involved? Remember how that was one of the things that supposedly made it valuable? How was it that crypto investors managed to deny the obvious for so long? The government would never allow this to continue without taking their cut. Japan was arguably one of the friendliest to the concept as well.
 
It would have survived fine regardless of the governments perception — if only absent all the scam coins and ICOs that separated the foolish or gullible from their money. Which of course piqued the curiosity of the authorities as that scamming mushroomed. All of this legitimately founded negativity tarnished Bitcoins namesake and the public’s crypto space goodwill (even if it wasn't associated with Bitcoin itself). I think it could take a lot longer to recover than I anticipated in say March or April of this year. :(

But then that was bound to happen and I have no idea how it could have been stopped - or how to stop it going forward short of education and regulation. Lots of people were/are being taken advantage of with crypto "also ran" coins that are nothing more than a cash grab.

At this point, I’ll regrettably agree that regulation is needed, certaintly as far as the exchanges go (to ensure proper security standards and compliance best practices are in place to secure from hackers) - and probably regulation of new ICO token offerings as well.

Frankly the exchanges defeat the original intent of Bitcoin as well. It wasn't created to trade like a stock, or pump and dump. It was created to be a easily transferable, distributed, decentralized store of value outside of the confines of one government or institution. It’s actually pretty freeing to pay for something with crypto and be your own bank. I enjoy it.
 
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It's hard to tell which way things are going to go. I have been thinking that there will be at least one rally before the end of the year but I could be wrong. The price has really been taking a beating. People holding the coins might need to weather the storm until Bitcoin is fully regulated. My own thought is to hold them until you can actually spend them on stuff at places like Amazon. That could well happen one day. Doesn't Newegg accept Bitcoin?
 
Archaea said:
It would have survived fine regardless of the governments perception — if only absent all the scam coins and ICOs that separated the foolish or gullible from their money. Which of course piqued the curiosity of the authorities as that scamming mushroomed. All of this legitimately founded negativity tarnished Bitcoins namesake and the public’s crypto space goodwill (even if it wasn't associated with Bitcoin itself). I think it could take a lot longer to recover than I anticipated in say March or April of this year. :(

But then that was bound to happen and I have no idea how it could have been stopped - or how to stop it going forward short of education and regulation. Lots of people were/are being taken advantage of with crypto "also ran" coins that are nothing more than a cash grab.

At this point, I’ll regrettably agree that regulation is needed, certaintly as far as the exchanges go - and probably the ICO's and coin offerings as well.

Frankly the exchanges defeat the original intent of Bitcoin as well. It wasn't created to trade like a stock, or pump and dump. It was created to be a easily transferable, distributed, decentralized store of value outside of the confines of one government or institution. It’s actually pretty freeing to pay for something with crypto and be your own bank. I enjoy it.
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I agree with you.
I really dislike ICOs and believe those are the projects that gave crypto the bad name.

Regulations are needed and I am happy that they are happening I've been saying this since mid 2017.
Bitcointalk.org is full of idiots trying to soothe themselves over lost money. I rarely even read those forums anymore.

People hoping for $100 and $300 and even $2500 are foolish. That is not going to happen.
And those "quasi analysts" who say Bitcoin will fall to $1800 are those who look at 2014 when bitcoin fell from $1000+ to below $100 and think they are smart by applying the same math with bitcoin going down to 10% of its all time high.
None of that is going to happen. Bitcoin is much stronger now and widespread. As much as people love to claim it's useless, there are quite a few big online stores here in Scandinavia where you can buy all kind of stuff (mostly electronics).
It has moved from being underground money and is getting more and more acceptance.
People need to understand that before making stupid predictions.

Japan is still friendly towards crypto. They are focusing on the exchanges because they want a stable crypto system. No one likes being hacked.

Crypto is still decentralized. These centralized exchanges will be usable in the future.
But the real future are decentralized exchanges like Waves DEX.
 
Nebell said:
I agree with you.
I really dislike ICOs and believe those are the projects that gave crypto the bad name.

Regulations are needed and I am happy that they are happening I've been saying this since mid 2017.
Bitcointalk.org is full of idiots trying to soothe themselves over lost money. I rarely even read those forums anymore.

People hoping for $100 and $300 and even $2500 are foolish. That is not going to happen.
And those "quasi analysts" who say Bitcoin will fall to $1800 are those who look at 2014 when bitcoin fell from $1000+ to below $100 and think they are smart by applying the same math with bitcoin going down to 10% of its all time high.
None of that is going to happen. Bitcoin is much stronger now and widespread. As much as people love to claim it's useless, there are quite a few big online stores here in Scandinavia where you can buy all kind of stuff (mostly electronics).
It has moved from being underground money and is getting more and more acceptance.
People need to understand that before making stupid predictions.

Japan is still friendly towards crypto. They are focusing on the exchanges because they want a stable crypto system. No one likes being hacked.

Crypto is still decentralized. These centralized exchanges will be usable in the future.
But the real future are decentralized exchanges like Waves DEX.
Click to expand...
I am for crypto, and I think it has a future with humanity, I think it is an important development.. but this is its first experiment, and its first historic 'go at it' .
It will crash, completely, to zero.
I sincerely tell you, sell now if you have a profit.
 
Eh. I stopped selling my mined coins every week about a month a go. Just to hold some and see what happens.

Im long past needing to immediately sell to try to reach break even point. As a multipurpose machine, anything I sell for USD is gravy.

I'd like it to go back up again, but hard to say if that's likely.

Ideally, we'd reach a balanced point where there is plenty of competitively priced GPUS for miners and gamers alike.
 
Nebell said:
I agree with you.
I really dislike ICOs and believe those are the projects that gave crypto the bad name.

Regulations are needed and I am happy that they are happening I've been saying this since mid 2017.
Bitcointalk.org is full of idiots trying to soothe themselves over lost money. I rarely even read those forums anymore.

People hoping for $100 and $300 and even $2500 are foolish. That is not going to happen.
And those "quasi analysts" who say Bitcoin will fall to $1800 are those who look at 2014 when bitcoin fell from $1000+ to below $100 and think they are smart by applying the same math with bitcoin going down to 10% of its all time high.
None of that is going to happen. Bitcoin is much stronger now and widespread. As much as people love to claim it's useless, there are quite a few big online stores here in Scandinavia where you can buy all kind of stuff (mostly electronics).
It has moved from being underground money and is getting more and more acceptance.
People need to understand that before making stupid predictions.

Japan is still friendly towards crypto. They are focusing on the exchanges because they want a stable crypto system. No one likes being hacked.

Crypto is still decentralized. These centralized exchanges will be usable in the future.
But the real future are decentralized exchanges like Waves DEX.
Click to expand...

You are mixing ideas and concepts here.

Just because a shop accepts it doesn't mean that it isn't fake money. A shop can accept BTC if:

a) They get a sale that they wouldn't get otherwise
b) They can transform the BTC into their local currency as soon as the transaction clears

Otherwise, cryptos are a scam. They have no inherent value, nor they have any backing, nor they do anything than normal currencies don't do already.
 
Decentralization is a concept scoped to the impact of pools, not exchanges, on the blockchains.

Exchanges are not pools, nor do they do anything pools do. Completely separate entities, in form, function or whatever.

Any discussions of government oversight has everything to do with the exchanges, and by extension, nothing to do with "decentralization".


Also, some of you play the buzzword bingo game well. Keep tossing out vague references like "this" or "that" backloaded by FUD. Only serves to certify the validity of the blockchain concept as a whole.
 
Uvaman2 said:
I am for crypto, and I think it has a future with humanity, I think it is an important development.. but this is its first experiment, and its first historic 'go at it' .
It will crash, completely, to zero.
I sincerely tell you, sell now if you have a profit.
Click to expand...
prava said:
You are mixing ideas and concepts here.

Just because a shop accepts it doesn't mean that it isn't fake money. A shop can accept BTC if:

a) They get a sale that they wouldn't get otherwise
b) They can transform the BTC into their local currency as soon as the transaction clears

Otherwise, cryptos are a scam. They have no inherent value, nor they have any backing, nor they do anything than normal currencies don't do already.
Click to expand...


"experts"
 
prava said:
Otherwise, cryptos are a scam. They have no inherent value, nor they have any backing, nor they do anything than normal currencies don't do already.
Click to expand...

Tell me how to transfer value to a totalitarian country instantly in an untaxable and untraceable way.
 
thebufenator said:
Tell me how to transfer value to a totalitarian country instantly in an untaxable and untraceable way.
Click to expand...

You win that one hands down.

Yes, it is the best method if you plan to do stuff ilegally. Which is why sooner than later there will be a huge crackdown on it from pretty much every single country. Nobody wants a currency that not only can't be taxed, but it can't also be followed and thus could be used for anything without trace.

Anybody that believes that such a thing will be kept alive is naive at best. No country will allow them if they ever get big enough. Which is why its inherent value is 0. Long term they are worth $0.
 
prava said:
Please tell me why are cryptos good, why they have value and why they will go up in time.
Click to expand...

Nah, you talk out of your ass, just another "crypto is a scam" person. I am done discussing with you.
You're no expert, you don't understand shit. I am not going to justify anything to some random dude.
 
prava said:
Please tell me why are cryptos good, why they have value and why they will go up in time.
Click to expand...
It's a currency like any other. Why does money have value? It's just a piece of paper after all. Currencies have value because we assign value to them. Crypto has inherent advantages over fiat currency.
 
prava said:
Please tell me why are cryptos good, why they have value and why they will go up in time.
Click to expand...

You’re still at it I see.

Cryptos have various pros and cons. But the most important one is instant transfer of funds anywhere in the world, verified by the clock chain.

It kills hundreds of banks and businesses and drastically increases speed and efficiency around the world.

You keep harping about the illegal aspect of it. No real money is used for criminal activity, (ok maybe fraud) it happens but your talking small time. The drug kingpins and other big players still use the good ole American dollar.

You have no idea what you’re talking about, I suggest you try watching a video or 10.

The market crashing or skyrocketing is irrelevant to the technology being developed. You’re children are going to be using blockchain. Like it or not.
 
Nebell said:
Nah, you talk out of your ass, just another "crypto is a scam" person. I am done discussing with you.
You're no expert, you don't understand shit. I am not going to justify anything to some random dude.
Click to expand...

You never discussed anything with me, and you probably have no idea about economy to begin with.

SickBeast said:
It's a currency like any other. Why does money have value? It's just a piece of paper after all. Currencies have value because we assign value to them. Crypto has inherent advantages over fiat currency.
Click to expand...

?

No, it isnt a currency like any other. It is a deflationist currency without any bank behind it that relies on mining to secure the transactions.

Also, it is so volatile that nobody uses it as currency but as a commodity.

next-Jin said:
You’re still at it I see.

Cryptos have various pros and cons. But the most important one is instant transfer of funds anywhere in the world, verified by the clock chain.

It kills hundreds of banks and businesses and drastically increases speed and efficiency around the world.

You keep harping about the illegal aspect of it. No real money is used for criminal activity, (ok maybe fraud) it happens but your talking small time. The drug kingpins and other big players still use the good ole American dollar.

You have no idea what you’re talking about, I suggest you try watching a video or 10.

The market crashing or skyrocketing is irrelevant to the technology being developed. You’re children are going to be using blockchain. Like it or not.
Click to expand...

My children using blockchain is a possibility, but current cryptos surviving isnt.
 
next-Jin said:
You’re still at it I see.

Cryptos have various pros and cons. But the most important one is instant transfer of funds anywhere in the world, verified by the clock chain.

It kills hundreds of banks and businesses and drastically increases speed and efficiency around the world.

You keep harping about the illegal aspect of it. No real money is used for criminal activity, (ok maybe fraud) it happens but your talking small time. The drug kingpins and other big players still use the good ole American dollar.

You have no idea what you’re talking about, I suggest you try watching a video or 10.

The market crashing or skyrocketing is irrelevant to the technology being developed. You’re children are going to be using blockchain. Like it or not.
Click to expand...

bit coin is not faster then any bank.
 
opfreak said:
bit coin is not faster then any bank.
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Well it kinda is

I sent $1050 bucks to someone last weeek through PayPal via friends and family (via money in my PayPal balance). (To help them out of an overdraft jam with their Bank). I figured they would get it in one day. It took them five days to get it cleared at their Bank from PayPal. They refunded it and it took me several days to get it back, even just to PayPal’s balance. Even a Bank to Bank check won’t fully clear your funds until the next day. To do value transfer immediately requires cash and a trip into the Bank. You can wire it, but it’ll cost you $30 and you’ll still have to go to the Bank in person, wait in line, and the Bank will have to be open, during business hours.

You can send bitcoin (in any amount) in less than 10 minutes with all confirmation, for a few pennies equivalent of cost - at any time - night or day. (the transaction fees pay the miners not some fat cat Banker’s wallet.)

It currently doesn’t scale to high transaction counts as well as something like Visas network, but that’s being addressed with the lightning network.

Here’s a good site to keep track of the live transaction que for bitcoin. You can see what IP geolocation is making all the transactions too on a world map. (Just zoom out)
https://blockchain.info/unconfirmed-transactions?show_adv=true
 
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Archaea said:
Well it kinda is

I sent $1050 bucks to someone last weeek through PayPal via friends and family (via money in my PayPal balance). (To help them out of an overdraft jam with their Bank). I figured they would get it in one day. It took them five days to get it cleared at their Bank from PayPal. They refunded it and it took me several days to get it back, even just to PayPal’s balance. Even a Bank to Bank check won’t fully clear your funds until the next day. To do value transfer immediately requires cash and a trip into the Bank. You can wire it, but it’ll cost you $30 and you’ll still have to go to the Bank in person, wait in line, and the Bank will have to be open, during business hours.

You can send bitcoin (in any amount) in less than 10 minutes with all confirmation, for a few pennies equivalent of cost - at any time - night or day. (the transaction fees pay the miners not some fat cat Banker’s wallet.)

It currently doesn’t scale to high transaction counts as well as something like Visas network, but that’s being addressed with the lightning network.

Here’s a good site to keep track of the live transaction que for bitcoin. You can see what IP geolocation is making all the transactions too on a world map. (Just zoom out)
https://blockchain.info/unconfirmed-transactions?show_adv=true
Click to expand...

7.5 transactions per second

yes there are edge cases where bit coin might be faster,

but you friend still needs to take that bitcoin, sell it on an exchange and then have that exchange transfer that cash into their bank account. At the end of the day you are still dealing with a "bank" to bank transfer for your friend to get the cash. So how much time did bitcoin save?
 
next-Jin said:
......You’re children are going to be using blockchain. Like it or not.
Click to expand...


I don't mine or use Crypto, don't really plan to, it's obviously in a "Tulip mania" phase. as you say, the underlying technology behind Crypto currencies has obvious applications in secure transactions. but how will it be implemented? This "everyone is going to dump fiat currencies and be using Crypto" mantra is just silly. but I don't see Block Chain disappearing.

By stating the next generation is going to be using Blockchain, that's a painting with a broad brush. exactly how would this work, is everyone going to carry Fiat based Blockchain EBT cards to eliminate fraud? is the "Man" going to embrace it and mandate the current banking system use Blockchain for transfers?
 
opfreak said:
7.5 transactions per second

yes there are edge cases where bit coin might be faster,

but you friend still needs to take that bitcoin, sell it on an exchange and then have that exchange transfer that cash into their bank account. At the end of the day you are still dealing with a "bank" to bank transfer for your friend to get the cash. So how much time did bitcoin save?
Click to expand...

Big picture — fast forward a few years. Crypto eliminates counterfeit, bad checks, and unreasonable delays.

My renter sent me a bad check this month. Me unknowingly cashing it cost me $30 in a bad check fee and frustration. That wouldn’t happen with crypto, because you can’t sent what you don’t have and confirmations would have confirmed the transactions integrity in less than 10 minutes.

My friend today told me about a CC chargeback notification from an eBay sale where the buyer said (1.5 months later) he didn’t receive the video card. PayPal will sort it out, but has already frozen that amount of money in his account until they do. (That wouldn’t happen in crypto because there are no chargebacks)

BTC could replace the need to use traditional Banks, or simply become a widespread parallel option when the use case is appropriate.

It’s still a fledging tech with minimal early adoption at this time. So your rebuttal is true for now, but traditional infrastructure and Banking has had 100’s of year to figure this out. BTC is less than 10 and has resolved many concerns of traditional banking.

As I said above - it’s somewhat freeing to be your own Bank, but I’m not yet willing to be my own Bank in full —- just in small part.
 
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The idea of unique hashes tracing the flow of money is quite logical. To the point where one needs to ask why you would not do that, provided fungibility is maintained.
 
next-Jin said:
You’re children are going to be using blockchain. Like it or not.
Click to expand...

motomonkey said:
as you say, the underlying technology behind Crypto currencies has obvious applications in secure transactions. but how will it be implemented? This "everyone is going to dump fiat currencies and be using Crypto" mantra is just silly. but I don't see Block Chain disappearing.
Click to expand...

Can we please stop pretending that 'the blockchain' is something magical? Blockchain technobabble is a big part of why so many people bought into this scam.

Turns out that public blockchains have pretty huge security, energy, and performance issues, and there seem to be few (any?) scenarios where a private blockchain actually makes more sense than a traditional database.
 
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