RX Vega Reportedly Offers “Insane Levels” of Mining Performance

The tech sites are jumping all over this but ignoring the actual quotes in question,

He initially said:


Seems the hash rate on VEGA is 70-100 per card, which is insanely good. :(

Trying to devise some kind of plan so gamers can get them at MSRP without the miners wiping all the stock out within 5 minutes of product going live.
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When asked where this info came from he then said

Guy internally from one of the AIB's, maybe he is smoking the BS pipe.
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Seems like all the websites are ignoring the second part about it possibly being bs and reporting the first part like it came direct from amd and is set in stone.
 
odditory said:
Nope.
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right!

people typically aren't going to sell the mining stuff - until it is no longer profitable to mine --- and right now - even with profits down 3x what they were a month ago - they are still 4x more than electricity cost. (using nice hash for example)

In June a 1080TI card would mine for $8.50 a day. In late July it was (and is now) about $2.50 a day. But it only takes 50 cents a day or so to power a 1080TI. I only use a 1080TI for reference because that's what I use and am familiar with, but the same principle applies to RX580s. It's still going to be about 3 or 5x more profitable to mine with it than it costs to power it -- so until the mining profit breaks even with the power consumption - they'll still use them. And I expect mining profits to go up from here, not down -- at least for a while. I think the only reason they are really down is confidence in coins is down right now.....temporarily --- and some of that confidence will be coming back and Eth value has been going up and bitcoins fork didn't hurt values, or cause volatility as was expected.
 
CSI_PC said:
To accept this one would then need to believe AMD has made the gaming Vega 2x better at mining than the prosumer compute Vega FE.
Below I link a miner has had the air and watercooled Vega FE now for 2 weeks, last update was yesterday and he managed 36Mh/s on air and 41Mh/s on water model; part of the limitation beyond initial drivers is the fact the air cooled FE is hitting its 300W TBP at 1450MHz (can see in the video this is the ceiling for core clocks achieved in the run) while the water cooled was sustaining around1600Mhz with drops to 1500ihs Mhz, the other point this was run from cold and once the air cooled card gets hot those clocks drop as shown by Toms to 1250MHz.

So how the F... did an AIB manage to get 75+MHz and 2x more performance considering they would be very limited on memory OC due to HBM2 (has very fine limits) and also the core clocks are already hitting their TBP spec 300W as shown in Vega FE reviews where accuratley measured.
The guy in the video has stated it is not just about drivers but also Claymore version, which he has the updated verison of to use with Vega and is very recent; note he does the run with the GPUs from cold (important when considering clocks).



Just to say I can see the figures improving further, but at best IMO would be around 50Mh/s sustained for the watercooled model when pushed.
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Kind of wondering, after watching that. He's using 17.1.1 drivers and says that voltage and power limits are locked in windows. However, GN posted a video two weeks ago about how undervolting stabilizes the powerdraw and overclocking on Vega FE, like the original power issues with Polaris. So if GN OC's an air vega to 1600 stable by dropping core voltage by .9V, how is voltage locked now in this video? Something doesn't add up.
 
[21CW]killerofall said:
I think that I can speak for the vast majority of people here:

Fuck you miners! Go back to using drills and explosives to mine, not video cards.
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Why the hostility? I don't understand, just buy a card if you want and stop complaining. The market is what it is, no one likes it.., including miners.
 
so if we to attempt to buy one day one (slim chance yes) where should we go? Best Buy / Microcenter, or order online? there's gotta be a short window of opportunity to get something.
 
If it's slower than Titan Xp, miners will not bother me beause it will be nvidia next release anyway.
 
shad0w4life said:
Because there may not be something in the drivers that was holding back performance, oh wait nvidia just pulled that stunt with the Titan


I do hope it's 70-100 though, that will give AMD a large revenue boost allowing more R&D, along with I game and mine, so either way it works for me, even have some Eth sitting idle if Vega is a mining beast so I can grab a card if possible. If I have to wait that's fine, lots of fun games on PS4 until PC gets something half decent.
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Why wouldn't AMD just put the cards to mining themselves? :)
 
SecretStash said:
so if we to attempt to buy one day one (slim chance yes) where should we go? Best Buy / Microcenter, or order online? there's gotta be a short window of opportunity to get something.
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If you have a local Microcenter buy it there since they price gouge the least. Otherwise set up NowInStock alerts and buy online when a fair price comes in stock.
 
In other words, no one is ever going to be able to buy them, at least never even close to MSRP.

Seriously, fuck miners.
 
Zarathustra[H] said:
In other words, no one is ever going to be able to buy them, at least never even close to MSRP.

Seriously, fuck miners.
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You got it. At this point I don't even look at them as graphics cards anymore, which is sad. I look at them more as a resource or commodity.

Times, they be a changin'.
 
CSI_PC said:
To accept this one would then need to believe AMD has made the gaming Vega 2x better at mining than the prosumer compute Vega FE.
Below I link a miner has had the air and watercooled Vega FE now for 2 weeks, last update was yesterday and he managed 36Mh/s on air and 41Mh/s on water model; part of the limitation beyond initial drivers is the fact the air cooled FE is hitting its 300W TBP at 1450MHz (can see in the video this is the ceiling for core clocks achieved in the run) while the water cooled was sustaining around1600Mhz with drops to 1500ihs Mhz, the other point this was run from cold and once the air cooled card gets hot those clocks drop as shown by Toms to 1250MHz.

So how the F... did an AIB manage to get 75+MHz and 2x more performance considering they would be very limited on memory OC due to HBM2 (has very fine limits) and also the core clocks are already hitting their TBP spec 300W as shown in Vega FE reviews where accuratley measured.
The guy in the video has stated it is not just about drivers but also Claymore version, which he has the updated verison of to use with Vega and is very recent; note he does the run with the GPUs from cold (important when considering clocks).



Just to say I can see the figures improving further, but at best IMO would be around 50Mh/s sustained for the watercooled model when pushed.
Click to expand...



You are almost certainly right but just the rumor will cause the supply to dry up which really sucks for anyone who wants a GPU to game on. Right now 1070's and rx 580's cost more than 1080's and 1080's sometimes approach $600 on a given day I mean sat that point just spend the extra $100 and get a 1080ti.
Vega will be no exception slightly over 1080 gaming performance for 1080ti price once it actually hits the street.

That being said there is not much the AMD (or Nvidia) can really do about it, people are buying the chips as fast as they can make them, and they don't own the fabs so it's not like they can just up production.
 
Well, by the time I am ready in upgrade in early 2019, mining will be a thing of the past, at least for the time being.
 
Krenum said:
You got it. At this point I don't even look at them as graphics cards anymore, which is sad. I look at them more as a resource or commodity.

Times, they be a changin'.
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And Etherium mining will change to ans the market will go back to normal, so just a bump in the road. You can still walk in to stores and by mid tear graphics cards. I have seen them in Best Buy and Frys just in the last week. They are definately sparce, but they can be found.
 
[21CW]killerofall said:
I think that I can speak for the vast majority of people here:

Fuck you miners! Go back to using drills and explosives to mine, not video cards.
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Miners are just jealous of people that live in a decaying apartment complex, work in a cubicle wearing short-sleeve buttondowns and then immerse themselves in gay videogames with aliens every night.
 
kinjo said:
You are almost certainly right but just the rumor will cause the supply to dry up which really sucks for anyone who wants a GPU to game on. Right now 1070's and rx 580's cost more than 1080's and 1080's sometimes approach $600 on a given day I mean sat that point just spend the extra $100 and get a 1080ti.
Vega will be no exception slightly over 1080 gaming performance for 1080ti price once it actually hits the street.

That being said there is not much the AMD (or Nvidia) can really do about it, people are buying the chips as fast as they can make them, and they don't own the fabs so it's not like they can just up production.
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Yeah its crazy. It's like we're in some kind of free market economy.
 
AMD should force sellers to sell limited quantities 1 per household per month or something to that effect. One could still acquire a lot of cards, it'll just take them a lot longer to do so.
 
odditory said:
Yeah its crazy. It's like we're in some kind of free market economy.
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I know its like people seem to think AMD or NV should care whos money they are taking or something. A miner money is the same colour as a gamers money.

When they release specific miner designed cards... it isn't to protect stock or something. Gamer, miner, 3d artist, computer science lab... why do people think AMD/NV care which market segment buys more outside of knowing which products to focus on next cycle. When they release "mining" specific cards its to attract purchases from miners not protect stock on "game" cards. :)
 
ChadD said:
I know its like people seem to think AMD or NV should care whos money they are taking or something. A miner money is the same colour as a gamers money.

When they release specific miner designed cards... it isn't to protect stock or something. Gamer, miner, 3d artist, computer science lab... why do people think AMD/NV care which market segment buys more outside of knowing which products to focus on next cycle. When they release "mining" specific cards its to attract purchases from miners not protect stock on "game" cards. :)
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Especially considering the cards aren't the limiting factor in production, it's the GPU itself.
 
Its highly doubtful that this card will do above 70mhash. These are clearly rumors.
 
odditory said:
Yeah its crazy. It's like we're in some kind of free market economy.
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Any system however is susceptible to perversion. The love of money being the root of all evil is the fundamental flaw of free markets.
 
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Wow, a lot people angry with the mining craze. Here's a thought: instead of buying Vega or a 1070 or 1060, buy some AMD stock? What with the split, things just might get interesting.
 
This is good tactic by AMD. Vega can barely compete with 1080 this late, so to make sure they sell everything, they are upping hashing rate.

HOWEVER, this is Ethhash performance. Ethereum won't be mineable for very long and it already has insane difficulty. I'm a miner and I would not buy Vega unless I knew how it performs in other algorithms, like Equilhash.
 
Cant sell it as a gaming card, now trying mining?

Hype is never in short supply.
 
jbc029 said:
Kind of wondering, after watching that. He's using 17.1.1 drivers and says that voltage and power limits are locked in windows. However, GN posted a video two weeks ago about how undervolting stabilizes the powerdraw and overclocking on Vega FE, like the original power issues with Polaris. So if GN OC's an air vega to 1600 stable by dropping core voltage by .9V, how is voltage locked now in this video? Something doesn't add up.
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Yeah good point regarding 17.1.2 but I have not seen anything online/experience yet with people using that driver.
Possibly reluctant to use the software as even GN mention it is buggy, and the miner was having issues to get Vega stable with performance using Claymore.
One aspect GN did not touch upon is that the actual current draw is higher in their analysis for the undervolt, so the stock setting actually draws less current according to their measurements.....

Ignore the stock+50% because we are interested in power equal and we can see current is more with undervolt and therefore would draw more power, something still not right with the software.

vega-undervolt-current_3.png




Worth noting GN also mention undervolting was not consistently stable game to game, nor can one always expect a performance upturn as shown with identical performance between stock+50% power and undervolt+50% in the Firestrike Ultra benchmark.
I would like to see more articles with accurate isolated power measurement to clarify what is going on there (could be a mistake by Steve but cannot assume anything) before taking for granted the AMD utility is running 100% fine.

Cheers
 
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Here is probably the only use case where I wouldn't mind seeing the government add a mining tax. :p Ridiculous waste of energy for relatively small self gains and drives up costs for non-miners, sounds like made for a taxing scenario, I'm not suprised if it happens sooner or later in europe depending how the mining continue to develop. I'd be all for it!
 
Case in point this is the clock characteristics measured by PCPer for FE Liquid at both settings (300 and 350W) and air Vega.

vegafewcclocks.png



So this is not alll about thermals/undervolting when looking at the behaviour of Liquid FE in 300W mode; context related to my previous post and additional consideration that current draw went up according to Steve at GN when undervolting.
That said I agree both manufacturers do benefit from each user undervolting their GPU and especially mining, but it does have its own caveats doing so generally.
Cheers
 
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Nebell said:
This is good tactic by AMD. Vega can barely compete with 1080 this late, so to make sure they sell everything, they are upping hashing rate.

HOWEVER, this is Ethhash performance. Ethereum won't be mineable for very long and it already has insane difficulty. I'm a miner and I would not buy Vega unless I knew how it performs in other algorithms, like Equilhash.
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Maybe you are mining with the wrong cards. There are several cards that are completely unaffected by the difficulty jumps.

https://www.techspot.com/article/1438-ethereum-mining-gpu-benchmark/

IMG_0430.PNG
 
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my question is where are these mining specific cards that were talked about a month or so back?
 
Archaea said:
Maybe you are mining with the wrong cards. There are several cards that are completely unaffected by the difficulty jumps.

https://www.techspot.com/article/1438-ethereum-mining-gpu-benchmark/

View attachment 32394
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No, Ethereum won't be mineable forever. Somewhere late this year or early next year Ethereum will switch to Proof of Stake and you won't be able to mine it with GPU's anymore.
What you linked to is DAG size which is basically memory size requirement.
 
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