Square Enix Struggles To Calm Fans As “Final Fantasy VII Remake” Goes Episodic

[Megalith]

Are you guys ready for Final Fantasy VII-2, VII-3, and Sephiroth Returns: FFVII?

“One thing that we wanted to be clear about during this weekend to accompany the new trailer was the scale of this project. We wanted to tell you this now and not in the future so that you’d share our vision for what we want to deliver. The biggest reason why we haven’t done a remake until now is because it’s a massive undertaking to reconstruct Final Fantasy VII from the ground up with the current technology. Producing a proper HD remake of Final Fantasy VII that maintains the same feeling of density of the original would result in a volume of content that couldn’t possibly fit into one installment.”

 

[Savi]

is FF 7 really that big? played it somewhat back in the day never finished it so don't really remember it much,Hours wise is it more than Witcher 3, or Baldur's Gate?

 

[fantome2024]

FF7 took a while to complete but Witcher 3 to me was longer

 

[Terpfen]

is FF 7 really that big? played it somewhat back in the day never finished it so don't really remember it much,Hours wise is it more than Witcher 3, or Baldur's Gate?

It's big in terms of art assets, yes. Midgar looks different from Kalm looks different from Junon looks different from Wutai. That's the real issue, building out the areas in HD. The original FF7 was just prerendered backgrounds and a static camera angle. This is… much bigger. Valve and Remedy foresaw these issues a decade ago and tried to use the episodic model for HL2 Episodes and Alan Wake, but neither succeeded.

I really don't blame S-E for going episodic. As long as there aren't too many installments (7 sounds about right for symbolic reasons) and each episode costs about $10, I don't see an issue.

 

[Hornet]

In the original FF7, the background were mostly pre-rendered images, so I can understand that it takes a lot of work to recreate those levels in a modern 3D environment as everything has to be created from scratch. But I would rather they took their time to create the complete game rather than splitting it up. RPG games like this just isn't meant to be played half way through and then having to wait for the other parts later.

 

[Dekoth-E-]

Are you guys ready for Final Fantasy VII-2, VII-3, and Sephiroth Returns: FFVII?

“One thing that we wanted to be clear about during this weekend to accompany the new trailer was the scale of this project. We wanted to tell you this now and not in the future so that you’d share our vision for what we want to deliver. The biggest reason why we haven’t done a remake until now is because it’s a massive undertaking to reconstruct Final Fantasy VII from the ground up with the current technology. Producing a proper HD remake of Final Fantasy VII that maintains the same feeling of density of the original would result in a volume of content that couldn’t possibly fit into one installment.”

Bullshit pure and simple. The original game came on 3 discs. I know this quite well as I have the version that is difficult to find and is worth quite a bit of money as far as games go. There isn't a single fan out there that would complain for a single second if the remake came on 3+ blu-rays. If SE is seriously trying to convince us that they can't fit all of that across 3-4 Blu-ray discs, they are completely delusional. We aren't nearly as stupid as they are trying to act like. This is about money, pure and simple. I would be far less offended if they just came out and said they couldn't build a world to the scale of FFVII in modern technology for a single $60 sale. They however are instead trying to insult our intelligence and pretend that isn't what it is about.

I've wanted this remake and a remake of 8 especially for a very long time. I'm going to be pretty damn pissed if they try and sell it in 3 parts at $60 each. Quite honestly at that point, I'll watch youtube lets plays and just hold on to my original version. Fact is this is the one that is going to retain collectors value, not the remake.

 

[sonsonate]

People whining about the battle system, whining about the episodic nature, whining about the fact that it's got climbing and crawling (the original has it too, but it's so old and was so limited, people probably forgot) -- the fans of 7 are impossible to please.

SE should have left it alone and let people that want to play the game, play the original.

 

[Bigshrimp]

I think they are just making excuses because they want to try to nickel and dime their customers. Obviously it can be just as big as one game as the previous versions, they just want to try to make more money out of the episodes version instead.

 

[alxlwson]

People whining about the battle system, whining about the episodic nature, whining about the fact that it's got climbing and crawling (the original has it too, but it's so old and was so limited, people probably forgot) -- the fans of 7 are impossible to please.

SE should have left it alone and let people that want to play the game, play the original.

Well the fans said exactly what we wanted. FFVII the way it is, but updated to modern graphics and voice acting. They could have done that, and pleased the huge fan base, and been ok. Im still very excited for this, but I hate the battle system that new ff use. I enjoy the random swirly screen encounters, timers, etc... It makes for a more relaxing game. I like being able to plan my attacks and defense, rather than having to knee-jerk shit and speed through a menu before I end up getting one-shotted by a unicorn.
I absolutely hate the battle system we were shown on that shit "beta" for FFXV. It didn't feel like FF. Then again, I dont feel they have felt like FF games since X anyway.

 

[USMCGrunt]

As was mentioned before, the original FF7 came on 3 discs, I distinctly remember coming to the end of a disc and seeing the splash screen telling the player to insert disc 2 (or 3). On top of being able to utilize multiple discs, they could make part (or all) of it downloadable. This is a pure money grab and they're trying to spin it into something different. I don't have a PS4 so I won't have access to initial release but if its half of what the original was, I'll still play it when it hits Xbox One or PC.

 

[Gorankar]

Ok. then I might consider a purchase after all of the episodes are out.
Valve and Ritual have shown me that Episodic means, may not finish, ever. Yes others have pulled it off, but can I really be blamed for being skeptical?

 

[charold]

Wasn't the primary reason that the original was 3 discs because of all the FMVs, not the scope of the game? I bet they could fit the entire original game on a single disc if they cut all the movies.

 

[Neurofreeze]

is FF 7 really that big? played it somewhat back in the day never finished it so don't really remember it much,Hours wise is it more than Witcher 3, or Baldur's Gate?

In terms of Japanese RPGs, it tended to be on the larger side. As other people have said, art assets, but also just gameplay length was quite long. A casual player tended to take around 60 hours to complete it, a more experienced player could take 40 hours.

Doing the bonus end-game content (especially the NA content) could also take a very long time, however it is the kind that doesn't require a whole lot of development (getting Master Materia, defeating the four weapons). A completionist run-through would take a ridiculous amount of time.

 

[alxlwson]

Ok. then I might consider a purchase after all of the episodes are out.
Valve and Ritual have shown me that Episodic means, may not finish, ever. Yes others have pulled it off, but can I really be blamed for being skeptical?

I would say that with the amount of money being put into this project, they'll have no choice but to finish it.

 

[alxlwson]

In terms of Japanese RPGs, it tended to be on the larger side. As other people have said, art assets, but also just gameplay length was quite long. A casual player tended to take around 60 hours to complete it, a more experienced player could take 40 hours.

Doing the bonus end-game content (especially the NA content) could also take a very long time, however it is the kind that doesn't require a whole lot of development (getting Master Materia, defeating the four weapons). A completionist run-through would take a ridiculous amount of time.

I remember back in middle school (7th grade) that I maxed out the in-game timer for 99:99:99 and never got to the end. I didn't have the strategy guide either. Last year I did a speed run for main story only and had it completed in 28 hours, following a walk-through.

 

[Dekoth-E-]

In terms of Japanese RPGs, it tended to be on the larger side. As other people have said, art assets, but also just gameplay length was quite long. A casual player tended to take around 60 hours to complete it, a more experienced player could take 40 hours.

Doing the bonus end-game content (especially the NA content) could also take a very long time, however it is the kind that doesn't require a whole lot of development (getting Master Materia, defeating the four weapons). A completionist run-through would take a ridiculous amount of time.

Completionist run-through's typically take me 150 hours to do absolutely every single thing. Pretty sure I could be done a little faster, but doubtful south of 110. Bear in mind this is original PS1 version, not "i'm using cheats on a PC" version.

 

[alxlwson]

Completionist run-through's typically take me 150 hours to do absolutely every single thing. Pretty sure I could be done a little faster, but doubtful south of 110. Bear in mind this is original PS1 version, not "i'm using cheats on a PC" version.

Completionist to me is also x99 of all consumables

 

[USMCGrunt]

Ok. then I might consider a purchase after all of the episodes are out.
Valve and Ritual have shown me that Episodic means, may not finish, ever. Yes others have pulled it off, but can I really be blamed for being skeptical?

One could argue that this mentality, if pervasive enough, would cause the game not get a green light for all the episodes.

 

[Exavior]

It's big in terms of art assets, yes. Midgar looks different from Kalm looks different from Junon looks different from Wutai. That's the real issue, building out the areas in HD. The original FF7 was just prerendered backgrounds and a static camera angle. This is… much bigger. Valve and Remedy foresaw these issues a decade ago and tried to use the episodic model for HL2 Episodes and Alan Wake, but neither succeeded.

I really don't blame S-E for going episodic. As long as there aren't too many installments (7 sounds about right for symbolic reasons) and each episode costs about $10, I don't see an issue.

I think $70 for the game is too much. Anything over the normal $60 price point of new games is too much.

Also 7 parts is way to much. You would only get about 5 - 10 hours of gameplay per part then have to wait another 3 - 6 months for the next part. Very quickly you would stop caring about the game.

 

[Dekoth-E-]

Completionist to me is also x99 of all consumables

I'm not 100% certain as I really have never used consumables much if any in any FF game, but I believe that isn't possible in 7. I think there is a very low limit of at least one of those in 7, elixers?

 

[alxlwson]

I know you can get x99 megalixers! Select item, then cancel it. Magically you have another one. It was a bug that I dont think they ever took out of the game. I know it worked on my ps1, my psp, and my ps3. I hated the PC version, I couldnt get a controller that I liked back then.

 

[Terpfen]

I think $70 for the game is too much. Anything over the normal $60 price point of new games is too much.

Disagreed. The original PSX game cost $50. FF7R will have more content than the original, will cost more to develop, and the dollar is worth less now than it was in 1997. $70 is fine. Hell, I paid more for Chrono Trigger on the SNES.

Also 7 parts is way to much. You would only get about 5 - 10 hours of gameplay per part then have to wait another 3 - 6 months for the next part. Very quickly you would stop caring about the game.

These are completely arbitrary numbers and not worth discussing.

 

[silk186]

I don't have an issue with episodic as long as a) the episodes have enough content b) they are not released too far apart and c) they actually finish it.

 

[Damar]

The only way SE was ever going to do the remake was if they could turn a big enough profit to justify the time.

Doing it in "episodes" will make them a fortune, and they know it.

 

[alxlwson]

I remember a couple short years ago, SE said they couldnt do a FFVII remake because it would be an admission that they havent been able to produce a better game. They said that FFVII wouldnt happen until they did better. I dont think they have met those standards yet.
http://www.digitaltrends.com/gaming...ve-made-a-game-better-than-final-fantasy-vii/

 

[Dekoth-E-]

I remember a couple short years ago, SE said they couldnt do a FFVII remake because it would be an admission that they havent been able to produce a better game. They said that FFVII wouldnt happen until they did better. I dont think they have met those standards yet.
http://www.digitaltrends.com/gaming...ve-made-a-game-better-than-final-fantasy-vii/

Frankly 8 was better if you want to get down to it. Seven holds a special place in my heart because it was very good and the first of its generation. However was it the best FF? To me? no.

 

[cyclone3d]

Frankly 8 was better if you want to get down to it. Seven holds a special place in my heart because it was very good and the first of its generation. However was it the best FF? To me? no.

8 had good gameplay, but the graphics sucked. 9 was way better in the graphics department and the graphics for a game like that are a big part of the game enjoyment wise. I also like the gameplay for 9 better than 8.

I still have the PC version of VII that I pre-ordered - in the special shaped box.

 

[Kardonxt]

Well the fans said exactly what we wanted. FFVII the way it is, but updated to modern graphics and voice acting. They could have done that, and pleased the huge fan base, and been ok. Im still very excited for this, but I hate the battle system that new ff use..

This. ff10 was the last game I finished. I was really excited for 13 but it just wasn't right. Combat wasn't more fun, it was just more stressful. Gone are the days of eating my pizza and drinking beer while playing FF.

 

[sfsuphysics]

hmmm still have cds of ff 7,8,9 literally collecting dust, wonder if they still work. I'm sure some "collector" might pay a pretty penny if/when this bombs.

 

[alxlwson]

This. ff10 was the last game I finished. I was really excited for 13 but it just wasn't right. Combat wasn't more fun, it was just more stressful. Gone are the days of eating my pizza and drinking beer while playing FF.

Exactly. It's been many years since I've had a quality game that could be enjoyed in a relaxed position.

 

[MaZa]

Bullshit pure and simple. The original game came on 3 discs. I know this quite well as I have the version that is difficult to find and is worth quite a bit of money as far as games go. There isn't a single fan out there that would complain for a single second if the remake came on 3+ blu-rays. If SE is seriously trying to convince us that they can't fit all of that across 3-4 Blu-ray discs, they are completely delusional. We aren't nearly as stupid as they are trying to act like. This is about money, pure and simple. I would be far less offended if they just came out and said they couldn't build a world to the scale of FFVII in modern technology for a single $60 sale. They however are instead trying to insult our intelligence and pretend that isn't what it is about.

I've wanted this remake and a remake of 8 especially for a very long time. I'm going to be pretty damn pissed if they try and sell it in 3 parts at $60 each. Quite honestly at that point, I'll watch youtube lets plays and just hold on to my original version. Fact is this is the one that is going to retain collectors value, not the remake.

Of course its about the money but make no mistake, this is still a MASSIVE undertaking. FF7 was a huge game. But it was packed into small space by prerendered background art, no textures on models (just primitive shading) etc... and the biggest space wasters the FMV's were shitty quality. And yet it took 3 discs. You can argue that games like Witcher 3 are bigger but its artstyle is much simpler in those. In FF7 every place was special and unique, not much room for using repeatable assets.

But still, this about money. They COULD make it a one big game but to get more profits they want to try the episode route. I just hope its something sensible. NO MORE THAN 3 EPISODES PLEASE! Like the original game was in 3 parts.

 

[Terpfen]

I remember a couple short years ago, SE said they couldnt do a FFVII remake because it would be an admission that they havent been able to produce a better game. They said that FFVII wouldnt happen until they did better. I dont think they have met those standards yet.
http://www.digitaltrends.com/gaming...ve-made-a-game-better-than-final-fantasy-vii/

Yoichi Wada is no longer CEO, so his comments don't apply. And frankly, his decision making was awful, so good riddance.

 

[Semantics]

FFVII was a bad FF no classes no real character building.

 

[Exavior]

Disagreed. The original PSX game cost $50. FF7R will have more content than the original, will cost more to develop, and the dollar is worth less now than it was in 1997. $70 is fine. Hell, I paid more for Chrono Trigger on the SNES.



These are completely arbitrary numbers and not worth discussing.

You shouldn't compare to the old game but current games. If FF15 will cost $60 then FF7 should be $60. Every game now takes longer to make than games 20 years ago so your logic is flawed right there.

And yes my numbers were guesses / made up. But they are also logical guesses. If all parts were to come out in the span of a few weeks or even one a month there is zero reason to break it up, just move the release date back a few months. So you are looking at the very least a few months between each piece. So that gives you 2 or 3 months min. Given that this was their first attempt at something like this I was pushing that back and assuming at least 3 months between releases, but at the same time it could be longer. As for the content length. While you can make it take longer on average you are looking at something between say 40-60 hours to complete the story of most average RPG games without searching for everything. So broken up on average that would give you 5-10 hours. Which you could stretch out more. So you get a part, play for one or two days then have to wait for the next part to come out. That is why I didn't buy Kings Quest yet. Part 1 is out, think 2 hits soon, think there is a few months between parts with the last part not being out till end of 2016. Each part taking a few hours to play through from what I hear. So get a part olay for 3-5 hours then wait a few months. Which is normal to most of the episodic games out there. And the complaint I hear from people about things like tell tell games is they hate waiting so they wait till all parts are out to play the games as they are great games but you forget what you were doing between parts with a few months gap. Would have the same problem with a large RPG. Wouldn't remember what you were doing. Guess you could work on leveling the hell out of your characters during the waits.

 

[alxlwson]

FFVII was a bad FF no classes no real character building.

It was story driven, both the characters themselves and the world in which they exist.
To me, it was like "playing" a book. I felt involved in the story and the characters. Ive never felt attachment to characters before like in ffvii.
Who the hell didnt get watery eyes and rage when Aeris was killed by Sephiroth? ! Nobody that I have ever met just shrugged at that. Even to this day, it is still one of the most emotional moments in video game history.

 

[Exavior]

It was story driven, both the characters themselves and the world in which they exist.
To me, it was like "playing" a book. I felt involved in the story and the characters. Ive never felt attachment to characters before like in ffvii.
Who the hell didnt get watery eyes and rage when Aeris was killed by Sephiroth? ! Nobody that I have ever met just shrugged at that. Even to this day, it is still one of the most emotional moments in video game history.

dude, you just spoiled the story.

 

[Terpfen]

You shouldn't compare to the old game but current games.

I will compare games within the same franchise. It's particularly relevant to compare and contrast a remake to its original.

But they are also logical guesses.

Not particularly, no. Nowhere do you outline a foundational basis for why development will take approximately X amount of time and why Y should happen in response. You just speculate based on an arbitrary time frame of how you would approach the release of the episodes and what you are willing to pay and play at this particular moment. It's worthless.

Given that this was their first attempt at something like this

False.

Would have the same problem with a large RPG. Wouldn't remember what you were doing.

This is not a problem at all. The "previously in this story" video feature has been a thing in video gaming for over a decade, and in TV for multiple decades. People are accustomed to a quick reminder of what they experienced in the previous episode. Game of Thrones will show clips from 5 seasons ago when the content is relevant to that particular episode.

This is not nearly the problem, issue, or obstacle you imagine it to be. Stop.

 

[Bigbacon]

SE should have left it alone and let people that want to play the game, play the original.

this right here...they should have NEVER called it a remake in the first place.

They should have left it alone or called in FF7-2 and had a new story, location, etc.

 

[Bigbacon]

and I do agree also that FF7 wasn't really that great. It was good, especially for its time. I think it holds a place only because it was the first 3d FF.

I'd rather play 8 or 9, least those had character development.

 

[Terpfen]

this right here...they should have NEVER called it a remake in the first place.

They should have left it alone or called in FF7-2 and had a new story, location, etc.

FF7-2 is Advent Children. FF7-3 is Dirge of Cerberus. So FF7-4 just happens to be the same story as FF7-1? Yeah, that would fly.

There are some weird ass things posted on this board.