Gabe Newell: Valve's Steam Machines Outperform Consoles At Same Price Point

Megalith

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Gabe talks a little bit about his intentions for bringing PC gaming into the living room and why he thinks Steam hardware should be a success.

“At console price points, we’re going to have machines like Alienware’s, which are faster than today’s consoles,” said Newell. “So the same price point as today, except you get better performance and you’re connected to everything you like about the PC and the internet.”
 
Can it play Crysis ?
no

can you after you uninstall steamOS and install windows ?
yes but it voids your warranty
 
Is the hardware faster on paper? Sure. But in reality, 3D performance under Linux is abysmal. And two years after Valve's big push to Linux, it hasn't gotten any better.

There is zero reason (beyond irrational hatred of MS) to buy a Steam Machine. And let's not forget, that irrational hatred of MS is what started Valve on this crusade in the first place. If "MS is evil" was a valid selling point that resonated with the masses, then Linux would have more than 1% market share.

Consumers want a large selection of games and high performance hardware. Steam Machines offer none of those. The only benefit Steam Machines offer is a sense of self-worth. The feeling that you're sticking it to Microsoft by buying one. Try convincing a garden variety consumer that he should sacrifice performance and a large game library in order to bring down the evil MS behemoth and you'll get nothing but blank stares.
 
Bullshit. Yes they are hire spec but the image quality is not as good, PC games aren't as optimized as console games. Everything you like about the PC you're on LINUX you're probably not running the name brand software you like on windows, it's about as connected and useful on the internet as a modern console is today.
 
I'm all for competition to DirectX, it had the PC gaming world in its grip for a long enough time now.

That being said converting Windows installation into an aftermarket mod may not be that bad thing for Microsoft. :)
 
I have yet to see a $350 steambox, most are twice that
 
yeah he has no clue what hes talking about, linux and pcgaming is such a joke.. i rather a have a console then a overpriced steambox honestly...
 
Less games, no console exclusives, runs linux, less games, no console exclusives.....
Gabe is grasping at straws.
 
Nobody knew where steam was going when it came out, and yet look where it is now. And again nobody knows the true future of these projects. A lot of you are saying shit that just isn't true.
 
It's not really a comparison that makes sense unless there are a bunch of companies making games specifically optimized for that specific Steam Box. That's the whole point of consoles, identical hardware is the easiest to support.
 
The whole Steam machine was just a bad idea. Why would anyone want to play Linux games on a lousy controller?
 
Less games, no console exclusives, runs linux, less games, no console exclusives.....
And touchpads. Don't forget touchpads.

The writing's been on the wall for quite some time in regards to Steam Machines. The much ballyhooed Linux revolution, some 20 years in the making, hasn't materialized. The claims that AAA developers will target Linux never happened - the library of Steam OS titles is still largely simplistic Indie games and poorly ported, poorly performing (in most cases, wrapped) games that came out two years ago. GPU driver performance is still shit - it's so bad that most titles on Linux don't even support AMD hardware. Steam Controller is being panned as impractical and flimsy.

At this point, the only people holding on to hope are those delusional Valve fanboys who somehow believe that in two days, Valve will release HL3 along with many other first-party titles for Steam OS.
A lot of you are saying shit that just isn't true.
Everything I am saying is objectively true. You can expect to see half the framerate under Linux that you see under Windows using the same hardware. The library of Linux games consists mainly of trendy Indie side-scrollers. Steam Controller is impractical. My God, I cannot believe I have to argue the uselessness of touchpads in a PC gaming-centric forum.

Steam Machines and Steam Controller are inferior to traditional gaming machines and input methods. Whether those be a PC and a mouse+KB, or a console and a dual-analog controller.
 
GNU/Linux is the only mainstream OS that can unleash the full power of your computer.
Current performance equals that of Windows. And given it is advancing with 100% open, libre standards, you know you won't be screwed. Vulkan is compatible with many platforms. Direct3D 12 only with Windows 10. Direct3D 11 only with 7-8-10.
 
GNU/Linux is the only mainstream OS that can unleash the full power of your computer.
Current performance equals that of Windows. And given it is advancing with 100% open, libre standards, you know you won't be screwed. Vulkan is compatible with many platforms. Direct3D 12 only with Windows 10. Direct3D 11 only with 7-8-10.

Linux isn't anywhere remotely near mainstream. Also no, the current performance does not equal Windows.

People use Windows because it's intuitive, works with very few complications, has good support, and actual games they want to play. Basically the same reason people own a console. So they are everything Linux isn't.
 
And touchpads. Don't forget touchpads.

The writing's been on the wall for quite some time in regards to Steam Machines. The much ballyhooed Linux revolution, some 20 years in the making, hasn't materialized. The claims that AAA developers will target Linux never happened - the library of Steam OS titles is still largely simplistic Indie games and poorly ported, poorly performing (in most cases, wrapped) games that came out two years ago. GPU driver performance is still shit - it's so bad that most titles on Linux don't even support AMD hardware. Steam Controller is being panned as impractical and flimsy.

At this point, the only people holding on to hope are those delusional Valve fanboys who somehow believe that in two days, Valve will release HL3 along with many other first-party titles for Steam OS.Everything I am saying is objectively true. You can expect to see half the framerate under Linux that you see under Windows using the same hardware. The library of Linux games consists mainly of trendy Indie side-scrollers. Steam Controller is impractical. My God, I cannot believe I have to argue the uselessness of touchpads in a PC gaming-centric forum.

Steam Machines and Steam Controller are inferior to traditional gaming machines and input methods. Whether those be a PC and a mouse+KB, or a console and a dual-analog controller.

Try to keep your hands above the desk.
 
Is the hardware faster on paper? Sure. But in reality, 3D performance under Linux is abysmal. And two years after Valve's big push to Linux, it hasn't gotten any better.

There is zero reason (beyond irrational hatred of MS) to buy a Steam Machine. s.

And speaking of irrational hatred... (oh the irony) it took you 19 minutes to Pavlov-respond to a Steam Machine thread Bro, you're slipping.

Newsflash: SteamOS hasn't officially launched yet. Their "big push" begins now in conjunction with titles built on Vulkan including firstparty Source 2 games and a boatload of dev partners under NDA. Obviously it won't be an overnight success with millions of kiddies getting mom to buy 'em like Playstations and Xboxen, but a small tree is being planted.
 
Instead of investing so much money into SteamOS, SteamLink, SteamBox, and SteamController...Steam should have partnered up with hardware manufs to tag certain components with some kind of seal of approval, like maybe Levels 1-4, or Bronze-Platinum, or whatever. ...kind of like thinking along the lines of Fatal1ty or ROG stuff.
 
“At console price points, we’re going to have machines like Alienware’s, which are faster than today’s consoles,” said Newell. “So the same price point as today, except you get better performance and you’re connected to everything you like about the PC and the internet.”

Hardly.

Consoles are $350.

Entry level Alienware is $450 for an i3 with laptop GPU and 4GB of ram.
 
Instead of investing so much money into SteamOS, SteamLink, SteamBox, and SteamController...Steam should have partnered up with hardware manufs to tag certain components with some kind of seal of approval, like maybe Levels 1-4, or Bronze-Platinum, or whatever. ...kind of like thinking along the lines of Fatal1ty or ROG stuff.
Not the goal the idea was to carve out the market against windows in case windows started selling real games though the windows store. Valve seems to overestimate microsoft's ability to cater to the pc gaming community, their store is not well organized and not well for pushing AAA games.
 
Dell sells the Alienware for $449 (low end):
http://www.dell.com/us/p/alienware-steam-machine/pd
It's a Core i3, 4GB ram, 500 gb disk space, and same type of Nvidia GPU. They have a Core i5 and Core i7 model (for more $$$).

Anyone try the lower end? I'd think 4GB RAM would not be great with some of the newer games.

While I don't have the alienware steam machine, I have the alienware alpha.. Which is basically same thing with windows on it. I got the low end one. I bought it about 6 months ago before they did some small upgrades (faster proc and hard dirve to base model).. its solid especially for its size.. like half an xbone. Theres numerous videos and reviews on it. Theres one even trying to compare games realeased on ps4/xbone to pc version. Most of the games it ran at same or higher graphics with same or better fps.
Short dirty answer: it seems to be about 10% faster than a ps4.
 
While I don't have the alienware steam machine, I have the alienware alpha.. Which is basically same thing with windows on it. I got the low end one. I bought it about 6 months ago before they did some small upgrades (faster proc and hard dirve to base model).. its solid especially for its size.. like half an xbone. Theres numerous videos and reviews on it. Theres one even trying to compare games realeased on ps4/xbone to pc version. Most of the games it ran at same or higher graphics with same or better fps.
Short dirty answer: it seems to be about 10% faster than a ps4.

Plus I got it for 399 at the time. which was the same as ps4/xbone.
 
Can it play Crysis ?
no

can you after you uninstall steamOS and install windows ?
yes but it voids your warranty

You do realize that Steam on Linux has 1600 games? Total games on the PS4 is 813. Total games on the Xbox One is 495. WTF really Xbox? If you really wanted to get Crysis on SteamOS you could always go Wine.

Is the hardware faster on paper? Sure. But in reality, 3D performance under Linux is abysmal. And two years after Valve's big push to Linux, it hasn't gotten any better.
And you've used Linux in the past year? Of course not, the question was rhetorical. These games are faster on Linux vs Windows.

DOTA 2 Reborn
Dirt Showdown
Team Fortress 2
Metro Last Light Redux

Though most games aren't faster than Windows due to bad ports and lots of games using eON which is kinda like a Wine Wrapper to play Windows games on Linux/Mac.

Consumers want a large selection of games and high performance hardware. Steam Machines offer none of those.
Compared to consoles the Steam Machines offer twice as many games. Some games aren't available on console.

I have yet to see a $350 steambox, most are twice that
Well a PC built from the same year as the PS4/XB1 was released can play games better for $350. Is it hard to believe that SteamBox for $350 couldn't? Though I haven't seen a $350 SteamBox as well, but if there was it would outperform a PS4.
 
Instead of investing so much money into SteamOS, SteamLink, SteamBox, and SteamController...Steam should have partnered up with hardware manufs to tag certain components with some kind of seal of approval, like maybe Levels 1-4, or Bronze-Platinum, or whatever. ...kind of like thinking along the lines of Fatal1ty or ROG stuff.

this is to me a pretty good idea.. it would be easier to kinda match components for some people. low end components would be rated 1 middle rated 2 or 3 and then top end 4..
 
Is the hardware faster on paper? Sure. But in reality, 3D performance under Linux is abysmal. And two years after Valve's big push to Linux, it hasn't gotten any better.

There is zero reason (beyond irrational hatred of MS) to buy a Steam Machine.

Steam Machine does have a reason to exist. The Alienware Alpha I bought for less than a PS4 is a wonderful SFF light gaming Windows system =)
 
I really want to see Steam Machines become a thing, But I don't really see valve pushing the OS as hard as he should be. The hardware is fine, but so few games support the OS, its really a gimped environment...
 
I really want to see Steam Machines become a thing, But I don't really see valve pushing the OS as hard as he should be. The hardware is fine, but so few games support the OS, its really a gimped environment...

There's only so hard anyone can push an OS. More than anything else Steam Machines/Steam OS/Linux needs users. And a lot of them. How that can that be achieved is the big question. It's got to be more than it's not Windows or is another alternative for PC gaming. The average consumer will never take these into consideration. One way to do it would be platform exclusives, but Valve has said that won't do that I believe and it simply isn't financially viable at this time to do AAA Steam Machine exclusives.
 
Not the goal the idea was to carve out the market against windows in case windows started selling real games though the windows store. Valve seems to overestimate microsoft's ability to cater to the pc gaming community, their store is not well organized and not well for pushing AAA games.

Except that's not really what happened. People like to repeat the "Gabe just hates Microsoft" line because they totally heard it on IGN in the comments, but the reality was a little more nuanced. It wasn't just about a fear that Metro on Windows 8 looked like the beginning of a move toward an eventual Xbox-like closed system. And it's not like it was an illogical conclusion - everything else Microsoft does since Windows is closed and locked down. Look at their mobile devices and consoles. Of course its easy to say NOW in retrospect after Metro flopped that "well, there was never any danger".

As I've heard it explained in interviews, Windows 8 was simply the spark that led to the conversation internally about the need to diversify anyway, and to get into the living room console market. Gabe's just a business guy who doesn't want his golden goose tied to an OS he has no control over, run by a corporation with their own separate interests that don't really include PC gaming.

But it's definitely amusing how defensive and bent out of shape some people get over what really just amounts to one more way to play games on a PC. Transfixing watching them overreact.
 
You do realize that Steam on Linux has 1600 games? Total games on the PS4 is 813. Total games on the Xbox One is 495. WTF really Xbox? If you really wanted to get Crysis on SteamOS you could always go Wine.


And you've used Linux in the past year? Of course not, the question was rhetorical. These games are faster on Linux vs Windows.

DOTA 2 Reborn
Dirt Showdown
Team Fortress 2
Metro Last Light Redux

Though most games aren't faster than Windows due to bad ports and lots of games using eON which is kinda like a Wine Wrapper to play Windows games on Linux/Mac.


Compared to consoles the Steam Machines offer twice as many games. Some games aren't available on console.


Well a PC built from the same year as the PS4/XB1 was released can play games better for $350. Is it hard to believe that SteamBox for $350 couldn't? Though I haven't seen a $350 SteamBox as well, but if there was it would outperform a PS4.

hmm..... I get what they were doing. That's a lot of luck, looking, and trust to get it that low. Plus hes using a win 7 license he already had laying around.. LOL. Overall ill give the video a B-. Brand new picking your own parts is much harder to do it.
 
I believe and it simply isn't financially viable at this time to do AAA Steam Machine exclusives.

Its not for lack of finances that Valve isn't going down the lame ass platform exclusives route. I'm sure the first Halo on the original Xbox would've looked financially unviable to a short-sighted bean counter too, but there was the long game.

Valve is always playing the long game.
 
Technically the Alpha isn't a Steam Machine since it runs Windows.

yeah.. but the idea behind the alpha is practically identical to what the steam machine is trying to accomplish, so his point stands. Basically when Valve delayed the steam machines because of the controller, alienware decided to release the exact same box/spec as an alpha. It even has the usb port underneath and cover where the steam controller wireless adapter was suppose to fit. Its reason for existing is identical to steam machine and thus his point stands. I honestly prefer this over the "official" steam machine. You get the couch ui, with full steam catalog, and a full fledge pc to boot. Awesome!
 
Its not for lack of finances that Valve isn't going down the lame ass platform exclusives route. I'm sure the first Halo on the original Xbox would've looked financially unviable to a short-sighted bean counter too, but there was the long game.

Valve is always playing the long game.

If Steam is platform agnostic then from Valve's perspective what's the point of making an exclusive that caters to about 1% of your customers to push a platform that doesn't make you a dime directly? Valve makes the same money regardless if the game is running on Windows, Linux/Steam OS or OS X. That's what I mean by financial unviable.

As you indicated earlier, the point of Steam OS and Steam Machines was to give Valve its own platform to distribute games as a hedge against Windows and the possibility, however remote, of Microsoft locking down desktop Windows from 3rd parties. I've always said that Steam OS/Steam Machines made perfect business sense. However they currently don't make a lot of customer sense.
 
90% of those 1600 games look like they should be on Google play, not on another PC wanabe
 
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