Knight_of_BAAWA
Gawd
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Windows 10 Will Be An Automatic Recommended Update
- Thread starter HardOCP News
- Start date
It sounds to me like the Win10 upgrade will be downloaded (all 10GB of it) before you get asked if you actually want it. Is that right? Because I'd have a problem with that.
I reserved it a while back, but have since decided that I don't want it. How do I keep it from silently slurping by bandwidth, and from using my internet connection to spread it around?
I reserved it a while back, but have since decided that I don't want it. How do I keep it from silently slurping by bandwidth, and from using my internet connection to spread it around?
Zarathustra[H];1041940887 said:
Exactly. Where's the fire? By the time Windows 7 goes EOL, whatever MS marketing is calling the latest version of Windows at that point in time would theoretically be much more developed than the half baked mess it is now, and perhaps they'll have also pulled their heads out on the spying and let you disable 100% because of enough backlash.
Until such time as enough DX12 games appear, there is no killer, must-have feature in 10 for people happily running 7 or 8.
mynamehere
[H]ard|Gawd
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It's pretty much a no-brainer to upgrade from W8/8.1, but W7 is still a better choice for some (especially some older machines).I like windows 10
Just sucks that we've gotta get W10 locked down for a modicum of privacy.
The irony lies in how many complainers own Google gadgets. I wonder how many will switch to Chrome OS.
I'm not exactly happy about all the crap MS is pushing with W10 either though.
dragonstongue
2[H]4U
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Come on Vulkan(not Linux OS but a version for use on good old Win7) release so don't have to deal with the extremely poor design/oversight of what win10 has turned into which seems to have been
performance boost for cruddy forced updates no 100% way to disable "spying" instability as some drivers DO NOT work on systems they are forced upon, and the UI/interface which is VERY clunky compared to the base Windows from years ago.
While something like Classic Shell helps in many ways is still remains un-intuitive layout and operaton. So it ends up being in my mind exactly that, performance boost for a whole crud load of nasty side effects for no real reason then they are MSFT that punches everyone in the throat for the "pleasure" of using their products.
performance boost for cruddy forced updates no 100% way to disable "spying" instability as some drivers DO NOT work on systems they are forced upon, and the UI/interface which is VERY clunky compared to the base Windows from years ago.
While something like Classic Shell helps in many ways is still remains un-intuitive layout and operaton. So it ends up being in my mind exactly that, performance boost for a whole crud load of nasty side effects for no real reason then they are MSFT that punches everyone in the throat for the "pleasure" of using their products.
Ur_Mom
Fully [H]
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Don't buy the new car, then. Just say "No, thanks" and be done with it. It's not FORCED. It's recommended (they are in the business to sell you their OS and keep you in their upgrade cycle). Sure, the tactics are getting a bit more strong handed, but it's still not a required update.
Except there isn't a "No thanks" option. Theres only "Upgrade" and "postpone upgrade".
And every time you start your car, you get an automated phonecall from the dealer "Ready to get the 2015?" press 1 for yes, 2 for Call again tomorrow.
I cannot fathom that there are people actually defending this bullshit.
Windows 7 users can't buy apps from the Store. Most Windows 8 users are on the desktop and don't buy apps since they do nothing in desktop mode on 8.
I like Win10, but my upgrade experience wasn't so great at all. If my wife was by herself she would have ended up with a broken computer. I suspect this will happen to a lot of people who are not too tech savvy.
We'll have to see if there is an outrage over this, or if Microsoft has it all figured out by the time this required update kicks off.
We'll have to see if there is an outrage over this, or if Microsoft has it all figured out by the time this required update kicks off.
Also, 'telemetry data' sent home to MS that they can sell.
bloodhawke83
I Strike Fear into the Hearts of the Masses
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waiting for the enterprise version to come out so i can disable everything.
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Zarathustra[H]
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Plenty of reasons, in no specific order:
- Windows 10 funnels users into Microsoft freemium services, being Groove music, Windows App store, One Drive, etc. etc. They start our free, but if you want more, it costs money. Sure you can get most of these without Windows 10, and even in Windows 10, you can use other competing services, but if you are on a system, and this is your default, you are more likely to use that service, and when you do, Microsoft makes more money. They REALLY want you in their ecosystem, so it increases the chances on average that you'll spend money in their ecosystem.
- With windows updates, patches and upgrade downloads now handled peer to peer within Windows 10 (unless you opt out, which Microsoft hopes you won't) their server, bandwidth, electricity and IT costs go down, the more people adopt Windows 10.
- The more unified the the user environment is, the more they can focus on just one OS, and not have to support many different ones. (well, they will still need to work on Windows server and Windows phone, but yeah) The less fragmented, the lower the costs.
- The more people get used to the Windows ecosystem, the more likely you are to opt for a Windows Phone (soon Windows 10 Mobile) when you get your next phone. Microsoft has felt very hurt by the mobile explosion, and they are ABSOLUTELY DESPERATE to gain a bigger foothold in this market. Having more people in their ecosystem, and offering more special features that help sync and unify the desktop and phone - they hope - will help further this agenda.
- Personal data collection and advertising, in increasingly new and devious ways, added to your Microsoft advertising ID, in your Microsoft account.
There are probably more, but these are the ones that come to mind right now.
The thing is, Microsoft has everything to gain, and nothing to lose by people adopting Windows 10. That is why they are giving away all these upgrades for free. They are betting on that getting a user into the windows 10 ecosystem will earn them more money, than a upgrade license would on average. I'm surprised they didn't offer the upgrades to Vista users as well. (maybe there just aren't that many of them left out there). In fact, I'm surprised they are charging for Windows 10 at all. At least for home users it would be in their interest to just give it away for free to anyone who wants to use it. or maybe they just figure that if you heavy-handedly upgrade everyone on 7 and 8.1, there won't be many alternatives left out there anyway, so you'll pay for it, AND earn them money in these new ways as well.
For years we have heard about how screwed Microsoft was because they missed the mobile bandwagon, and didn't have significant revenue streams beyond traditional software licenses. Well Windows 10 changes all that. It is likely they view it as the transition that will save Microsoft, and because of that will try to make you upgrade by any means necessary.
To them it's not "your computer". it's a device running "their operating system". It belongs to them, and they feel they should be able to do with it as they please in order to maximize their revenue streams. The surprising part is that most people are OK with this.
As much as I hate it all, I run Linux as my primary operating system, I dual boot to Windows only for games, and when I do, I have all the extra P2P upgrade and distribution services, data collection, Cortana, etc. disabled. I also don't use any "apps". I use local user accounts only, and don't have a Microsoft account. I have never bought anything in the Microsoft store, and never will. I will also never sign up for any of their freemium built in services, and will never buy a Windows Mobile device. I had no interest in these things before, but now that Microsoft have gotten heavy handed about it, they have put me into "stubborn mode". I won't adopt their ecosystem any more than I absolutely have to.
So I guess, the only problem for me is the annoyance of having a bunch of Microsoft junk I don't want, and will never use, installed on my computer.
They probably counted on there being people like me, pissed off enough about this new approach that they would be completely turned off from Microsoft. They also (probably correctly) counted on that there would be few enough of us that it wouldn't significantly affect their plans, because the dumb masses go along with anything, as long as it is convenient, regardless of how much freedom of choice and privacy is lost.
It is what it is.
Haven't heard anything about MS selling the data. Do you have a source for that one? They're certainly using it for something but I don't think it's being sold off.
If the datamining isn't about monetizing, why don't they allow it to be completely disabled?
Because it's about monetizing.
BloodyIron
2[H]4U
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Been running Ubuntu as my main for 1.5 months now. Only had to switch back to w7 for one or two games. Have all the games I generally care about working in Linux, plus more keep natively working every day. Feral just ported Allen isolation, which is super rad. Now I get the control I want over my system, and who here isn't a power user?
The selling of data was a flippant remark.
I believe that when something is free then the consumer product! They have to be monetizing this somehow.
It seems reasonable that they will integrate this into bing ads or other some other advertising.
Mikko Hypponen was talking about how Twitter is able to figure out a lot about you by requiring a phone number to sign up on the Security Weekly Podcast (10th Anniversary episode). A lot could be learned by how you use a computer.
It's about monetization for sure, I just don't think it's being sold to any 3rd parties. There's so much MS can use it for internally right now that's all about monetizing themselves. They need the telemetry data in order to improve their existing products more than they need a small cash flow from selling it to someone else. This early in the game, I think the data is far more valuable to MS if it's kept proprietary. They've only been collecting it for a couple months now and are likely still getting a handle on what exactly the uses for such a huge dataset are. You can see they're paying attention to it though if you're still running the Win 10 Technical Preview on the Fast Ring.
If you have a source regarding telemetry data being sold, definitely post it up.
Well, f-ed that one up:
I believe that when something is free then the consumer is product!
No worries, I knew what you meant. And I agree with you on the potential for use in Bing and Cortana ads for sure. I just don't think the data is reaching 3rd parties at this time.
Yakk
Supreme [H]ardness
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Riiiiight... M$ should just call it a Windows 7 service pack instead of Windows 10 then.
I'm finally, on my way out of the Windows Ecosystem, good timing apparently. Keeping windows dual boot on one rig for some games for now I guess.
I'm finally, on my way out of the Windows Ecosystem, good timing apparently. Keeping windows dual boot on one rig for some games for now I guess.
sliverjazz
Gawd
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It is a brave new world. People are stepping on each others toes for the small economic pie left, and a quick race to intergrate all people and economies into the global force.
Agreed, as far as I can tell, it's not being outright sold to third parties.
Red Falcon
[H]ard DCOTM December 2023
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I guarantee you they will take this away after a month.
It's obvious what Microsoft is doing and it is very invasive and wrong of them to do so.
Where are you moving to? Just curious.
The worst nagware I've ever dealt with in my life came from not wanting to update my phone from Android 4.4.4 to the buggy 5.0. Multiple alerts every single day that I had to root the phone to prevent. What Microsoft is doing here isn't any more invasive than what their competitors are doing.
Zarathustra[H]
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Uhm. Android by default just displays a popup that an update is available. I ahve never seen one come back once I dismiss it.
sliverjazz
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So in the next stock report they can say everyone reserved win 10 and the stock price goes up.
On the same lines as "OId Arkham Knight Reviews Flagged As Pre-release", can we get them to flag Windows 10 as prerelease? I had hoped the Threshold 2 update would bring it up to the status of a traditional Microsoft RTM release, but it sounds like it won't be until Redstone. The simplest example is that Microsoft Edge was clearly not fully baked as released.
M76
[H]F Junkie
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They probably won't sell the data outright, but they'll sell ad spaces trough windows and connected services, and use the data to enable targeted ads. It's not too far away when your computer will show you an unskippable ad during boot
I hope that never happens, but I'm expecting it to come any day.Don't care about phone problems, because my PC is not a phone.
Zarathustra[H];1041941418 said:
My Moto X had invasive popups every single day, multiple times per day. I had to root the phone and kill a daemon in order to get them to stop. At least on Windows I can dismiss the notification, block the KB and usually be done. Having to root the OS in order to dismiss the update is significantly worse than what Microsoft is doing right now and doesn't really have an analogue on Windows.
Just upgrade already you know you will one day, and if you don't do it now you will whinge and complain that you have to pay for it when you do.
People that will try Linux in protest will go back to windows simply because its better. If Linux was so great it would have a much bigger market share then the current 2%. Hell even after 2 months more people run Windows 10 then run all Mac OS's.
People that will try Linux in protest will go back to windows simply because its better. If Linux was so great it would have a much bigger market share then the current 2%. Hell even after 2 months more people run Windows 10 then run all Mac OS's.
sliverjazz
Gawd
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Windows 10 uploads every single key press on your keyboard and stores it permanently on Microsoft's cloud, freely shared with their "trusted partners", which includes (but may not be limited to) the NSA. There's still a big difference between passive monitoring of data, and using Windows 10, which actively collects EVERYTHING about you and sends it directly to the authorities!
Yakk
Supreme [H]ardness
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Right now I'm getting enough demand for OS X / iOS work to actually consider moving over. Better? Worst? Who knows, it's a change that's for sure. I'm as surprised as anybody, but it is what it is. I originally was thinking it would be Linux, but well... go figure.
Source for this please. If someone has confirmed there's a full keylogger they had to open up the encrypted telemetry packets.