Female Linux Dev Calls It Quits Over 'Toxic' Community

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My favorite part about this blog post? The owner of the blog is replacing negative / off-topic comments about her with "fart fart fart fart." :D

Here’s the deal: I’m not a Linux kernel developer any more. I quietly transferred the maintainership of the USB 3.0 host controller driver in May 2014. In January 2015, I stepped down from being the Linux kernel coordinator for the FOSS Outreach Program for Women (OPW), and moved up to help coordinate the overall Outreachy program. As of December 6 2014, I gave what I hope is my last presentation on Linux kernel development. I was asked to help coordinate the Linux Plumbers Conference in Seattle in August 2015, and I said no. My Linux Foundation Technical Advisory Board (TAB) term is soon over, and I will not be running for re-election.
 
To be honest, any negative comments would only help make her point. If nothing else, she definitely has the right to stop working on a project with a short statement about why she's doing it. We're free to ignore it (as I'm sure the linux community will).
 
This is what i hate about the tech community as a whole. When doing my computer degree i had 1 female on my course. The amount of shit she got from other students and lectures was insane, just because she was a girl.
 
I saw the headline and was expecting a big rant about sexism, yadda yadda.

Other than mentioning "allowed to get away with subtle sexist or homophobic jokes." It seems ot mostly be about the fact that the linux kernel dev community are just a bunch of assholes, and seems to imply they are a giant bunch of assholes to everyone.

Which is pretty much true. Where I work, we have (and have had) many significant OSS contributors to various projects. The vast majority of them seem to be socially.... uh... not right in a major way. With some it is more pleasant and tolerable, but it ranged to the point one of them had a heart attack under the age of 40, died, and was married to someone who had been a friend of mine and my reaction was "I wonder if she's relieved." Just an awful fucking person, but they contributed regularly and in quantity, and if you want people to work for free, that is the be-all, end-all of your performance metric.

If her gripe doesn't go beyond what she said, and she's simply voting with her feet rather than trying to pretend there'd be an army of people willing to replace the cave trolls as long as someone would ensure everyone was very pleasant to each other, then it's a perfectly valid piece.

OSS dev communities are very much a life is hard, wear a helmet, because fuck you that's why type of environment. that complaint is valid, and she will be FAR from the first one, male or female, who will decide they do not have time for that shit anymore. What she is griping about is definitely NOT a "just because she was a girl" issue. Some are better than others, and IMO the degree of stressed out assholishness is proportional to the size of the code base and/or the number of projects downstream of whatever you are working on.

Dunno if things have changed, I flirted with it years ago and punched out because while I'm thick skinned and can deal with abuse just fine. I figured out very quickly that I don't put up with it without either being paid, or without liking the person in question (which heavily implies you don't act like that even most of the time and have some redeeming/entertaining quality).
 
viscountalpha said:
Can't blame her. It's one of the major points against Linux.
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Men in general...not just Linux, computers, or anything else like that. It's the way things are and it gets worse when there's a higher percentage of men vs women. AAAAND...just so people don't freak out about it, in places where there's a higher percentage of girls (lower socio-economic types are the worst liek nursing homes were there's lots of low wage people) it's just as bad for the few men who are there.
 
Terrible neckbeard's continue to be terrible. The twist is that in 2015, some people don't outwardly appear to be a terrible neckbeard, but they are. They are on the inside. And they are the most terrible neckbeard's.

Don't be a terrible neckbeard.
 
Not surprising considering some of the Linux developers I've known. Most are both extremely arrogant and incompetent. They don't even realize how bad they are, but they think they're awesome. Yet, the Linux software I've had to use has been horribly illogical and extremely difficult to use. I think they actually do that intentionally to keep certain types of people away, but that just keeps the adoption to the fringe. It will never be used by the general public until they make it easier to use. They claim it is superior, but most couldn't even tell because it is too hard to use. Those of us who can tell know it's inferior to Windows in nearly every way. I doubt what she ran into was really sexism, and more than likely arrogant bullies trying to protect their egos any way they can.
 
nb14 said:
This is what i hate about the tech community as a whole. When doing my computer degree i had 1 female on my course. The amount of shit she got from other students and lectures was insane, just because she was a girl.
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Wow. People there are assholes.

When we had a girl in an IT class, she didn't get shit. She was hit on a lot (cute nerd, OMG!). But, she knew her shit and she was treated as an equal for the most part.

Linux is full of people with massive ego problems. They are better than you, you are wrong, they are more than an expert than you. More people are turned off of Linux because of the shit community than the actual OS.
 
mstersmith80 said:
White knight to the rescue!
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Oh please. Hardly. If you don't think these people exist, you be crazy. Unless...

You wouldn't happen to sport a distinctive type of facial hair, would you?

I'm just joking around. You know your older brothers friend Jerry, who liked comics and Amiga more than anyone else? He wasn't around much and as you got older you just didn't see him anymore. You probably forgot about him until now. Well Dave's still out there man, and he's a fuckin Linux maintainer.
 
CreepyUncleGoogle said:
Men in general...not just Linux, computers, or anything else like that. It's the way things are and it gets worse when there's a higher percentage of men vs women. AAAAND...just so people don't freak out about it, in places where there's a higher percentage of girls (lower socio-economic types are the worst liek nursing homes were there's lots of low wage people) it's just as bad for the few men who are there.
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I meant even without gender stupidity. Linux is full of elitist nerdy schmucks.
 
Heh. From her blog: http://sarah.thesharps.us/2015/10/06/what-makes-a-good-community/

"Signs of a level 4 welcoming community:

Equally values developers, bug reporters, and non-code contributors"

Define non code contributors. Of course without any devs you have no bug reporters or non code contributors. Not everyone is equal in a company.

Even better:
"Signs of a level 5 welcoming community:
Community participates in diversity programs
Diversity is not just a PR campaign – developers truly seek out different perspectives and try to understand their own privilege
Gender presentation is treated as a non-issue at conferences
Conferences include child care, clearly labeled veggie and non-veggie foods, and a clear event policy
Alcoholic drinks policy encourages participants to have fun, rather than get smashed
Code of conduct explicitly protects diverse developers, acknowledging the spectrum of privilege
Committee handling enforcement of the code of conduct includes diverse leaders from the community"

I know that when I go to a conference I'm always worried about veggie and non veggie foods. This is a top priority in any business.
 
Ur_Mom said:
Wow. People there are assholes.

When we had a girl in an IT class, she didn't get shit. She was hit on a lot (cute nerd, OMG!). But, she knew her shit and she was treated as an equal for the most part.

Linux is full of people with massive ego problems. They are better than you, you are wrong, they are more than an expert than you. More people are turned off of Linux because of the shit community than the actual OS.
Click to expand...

The user community is nice, supportive, and helpful.

Linus goes off on kernel developers when they break user space. That is rule 1 to 1000 of Linux kernel development. How many times does he need to say it and argue with people over it? It is not surprising he flips out once and a while over it. Here is some context Guy got what he deserved.
 
Well didn't you know? You need the diversity of vegetarians in software development because... diversity!
 
Ur_Mom said:
Wow. People there are assholes.

When we had a girl in an IT class, she didn't get shit. She was hit on a lot (cute nerd, OMG!). But, she knew her shit and she was treated as an equal for the most part.

Linux is full of people with massive ego problems. They are better than you, you are wrong, they are more than an expert than you. More people are turned off of Linux because of the shit community than the actual OS.
Click to expand...
I see this still has not changed. I read her blog and that was exactly why she quit. Linux community is the least helpful of all and that is why it is still stuck in the enterprise level. And here we have people continue to want to push Linux as the alternative solution to Windows. It will never happen unless the typical response of "Why are you so stupid?" or "Let me Google that for you." attitude changes.
 
viscountalpha said:
I meant even without gender stupidity. Linux is full of elitist nerdy schmucks.
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Well, yeah that's true too. I think it's changed a little since I started because I'm a wonderful, amazing person who, despite being better by far than everyone else on the planet, I'm very humble about it and I would never rub it in the faces of all those stupid Windows and Apple people out there. :D
 
Ah yes, the keys to any decent software development operation: acknowledging the spectrum of privilege, protection of diverse voices and clearly labeled vegetarian foods.

It's delightful seeing arrogant Linux neckbeards collide with loopy Tumblrinas. I love watching the sparks fly. Fight fight fight!

Blue hairs vs. neckhairs, who will emerge victorious?
 
I love some of the criticisms though.

Go work at a construction site and let me know if you hear talk of microaggressions, privilege (with a negative connotation), codes of conduct and level 5 welcoming communities. Then come back and tell me all about "neckbeards".
 
Ur_Mom said:
Wow. People there are assholes.

When we had a girl in an IT class, she didn't get shit. She was hit on a lot (cute nerd, OMG!). But, she knew her shit and she was treated as an equal for the most part.

Linux is full of people with massive ego problems. They are better than you, you are wrong, they are more than an expert than you. More people are turned off of Linux because of the shit community than the actual OS.
Click to expand...

I mean she was better than most the guys in there but they were too arrogant to notice. She was hot and belive this made alot of the guys feel threatened. The acted like dicks and she has the best job out of the whole class now.
 
dgingeri said:
It will never be used by the general public until they make it easier to use.
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Have you ever heard of this thing called... ohh, I don't know... Android? Because the last time I checked that was built around the work of these kernel developers.
 
I get it. I used to be shy, emotionally sensitive, and think people who were blunt were just straight up assholes, but some are. Some are blunt to be intentional hurtful dicks. Then I grew up. More specifically, I joined the military and learned that there is a type of respect for brutal honesty that you just can't replicate any other way.

If you can't control your emotions and learn to see when someone is telling you the hard truth and when someone is intentionally trying to get under your skin, then you obviously don't belong no matter who you are. Notice how she specifically mentioned

One thing that sticks out that I often see from softies (but mostly women in general) is this belief:

What that means is they are privileging the emotional needs of other Linux kernel developers (to release their frustrations on others, to be blunt, rude, or curse to blow off steam) over my own emotional needs (the need to be respected as a person, to not receive verbal or emotional abuse).
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Do not confuse privilege with emotional needs. Nobody is "privileged" to have their emotional needs catered to. That isn't your job or an organizations job. Emotions are specific to the individual and if you can't control them that is ON YOU.

Do not confuse being blunt, rude, or cursing with emotions either. None of those are emotions. They may provoke emotion from someone else. They may be a form of releasing emotions, but they are NOT emotional traits whatsoever. Verbal abuse, based on your previous use probably refers to the same things. Cursing and being blunt. You can classify that as abuse if you want, but here in the real world that's just a way of life in a cut throat environment.

Stop with the human rights angle. You're treating like a human, you're just not being catered to because you're a woman or a talented individual. You're one in a sea of hundreds of thousands, millions even in the Tech world. You deserve no special privilege because you're a human or talented. Entitled to ZERO.
 
jwcalla said:
She's a long-standing SJW. The community is better off without her.
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Because not wanting to be harassed by a bunch of immature men who can't focus on anything but someone else's gender makes someone worthy of an invented label (SJW) that you think carries a negative connotation.
 
Oh hey look it's another one of these threads. Steve, you must throw a bag of popcorn in the microwave before you post.
 
CreepyUncleGoogle said:
Because not wanting to be harassed by a bunch of immature men who can't focus on anything but someone else's gender makes someone worthy of an invented label (SJW) that you think carries a negative connotation.
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That's her narrative, but not reality.
 
jwcalla said:
That's her narrative, but not reality.
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Has anyone come forward with the other side yet? There usually are three versions of the story (one for each side and the actual one) and it'd be interesting to hear it. I admit I'm kinda biased based on what I've seen already about how people treat women in technical fields, but if I take off my troll hat for a moment, I wouldn't totally rule out the possibility of there being some valid claim on the other side.
 
jwcalla said:
She's a long-standing SJW. The community is better off without her.
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This was pointed out in the LWN article comments with links to some of her postings. I wouldn't waste time worrying about this one. Even though LKML is a tough place, reportedly. Then there's that guy trying to fan the fans with a kernel fork. Bigs news buddy, there are tons of out of mainline branches -- that fork isn't going to affect squat.
 
Situations like this is why they should downsize the “assault and battery” charges here in the states, some people just need a good ass kicking! Had did a 3 month stint once but when I got back all I had to do was ask him “you have anything you want to say to me?” and he would re-evaluate his denier ;)
 
marzzez said:
Situations like this is why they should downsize the “assault and battery” charges here in the states, some people just need a good ass kicking! Had did a 3 month stint once but when I got back all I had to do was ask him “you have anything you want to say to me?” and he would re-evaluate his denier ;)
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Ahh yes good old violence instead of intelligence, that really helps progress society.
 
Some industries require brutal honesty, assholes and insensitivity in order to operate at an acceptable level. If you're skin isn't thick enough, leave. Get out.

No hatred for this woman, she realized her emotional state was too fragile for that kind of environment and made a conscious decision to leave before it ruined her.

Good for her.

That doesn't mean there is anything wrong with the environment she left. it just wasn't the right fit for her.

The world isn't a hug-box. Not everything is meant to feel good. Sometimes in order to get things done you have to be an asshole.
 
jwcalla said:
Have you ever heard of this thing called... ohh, I don't know... Android? Because the last time I checked that was built around the work of these kernel developers.
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The fact that it's Linux underneath is almost immaterial. Android is Android because of Google's closed-source apps running on top of it. They could move off a Linux base and most people would never notice.
 
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