President Pushes For More Diversity In Tech

Hypergreatthing said:
I for one would LOVE to see more asians in NASCAR for fairly obvious reasons.
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Cool. It's just whenever this subject comes up invariably someone when mention the NBA but forget other sports that are just as white dominated at the player/sportsman level. Sports at these levels is so niche that these examples are nothing more than red herrings. The 99.999999% of folks regardless of the color of their skin will never be pros at these levels.

However almost everyone needs decent educational opportunities and jobs.
 
maverikv said:
I really don't understand the "I don't see feminists pushing for more women in X field" argument.

You aren't going to find a single feminist who thinks any field should be all men or male dominated. Just because you think a job is shitty doesn't mean you should project your thoughts about that on feminists. Its not a gotcha, I'm sorry. I know you think you had one, but you don't.
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What are you even trying to say here, it doesn't make any sense.
 
Maybe IT would be more attractive if they removed the IT overtime exception that makes no sense.
 
What is stopping women and minorities from joining STEM fields? There are none. At least that could be changed by a law. I'd love to see more women in IT. They can go to the same schools, the same interviews, etc.. It's just that they aren't trying to get into the field. They aren't hitting a barrier. They aren't even moving towards it.

If there was some block somewhere that women or other minorities were shunned from the field or something, I'd be concerned. The women I work with are pretty good. Some are great, some aren't. But, same with the guys.
 
Hypergreatthing said:
How is it not? Racism is preconceptions about humans that have a certain skin color.
Diversity is noticing that the skin colors in a certain area are too white or that the radio of penises to vaginas aren't 50/50 in well paid jobs.
Both focus on the skin color of people instead of realizing that everyone is an individual with their own personal thoughts and feelings.
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First, the fact that you would try to say your standard dictionary or thesaurus is wrong really does say it all. Second, everything you wrote here is an assumption. You assume that having a diverse workplace automatically means you are discriminating against someone else. When that's not the case. Let's take race or sex out of it. However, before we do that please stop with the individualism BS. Because if this country recognized the talents of people (regardless of race or sex) in the first place then we wouldn't have this problem now would we?

Now, let's say you have three androgynous people. All with different hair colors (brown, black, red). They come in for an interview. All three have the same qualifications. However, your make up of brown haired people far exceeds that of red haired people. So for diversity sake you pick a red head. Did we discriminate? If in this case we did discriminate how would we make a choice with discriminating if they all have the same qualifications?
 
Ur_Mom said:
What is stopping women and minorities from joining STEM fields? There are none. At least that could be changed by a law. I'd love to see more women in IT. They can go to the same schools, the same interviews, etc.. It's just that they aren't trying to get into the field. They aren't hitting a barrier. They aren't even moving towards it.

If there was some block somewhere that women or other minorities were shunned from the field or something, I'd be concerned. The women I work with are pretty good. Some are great, some aren't. But, same with the guys.
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Exactly, that's why this whole thing just feels tacked on and forced.
 
maverikv said:
I understand. Reading can be difficult sometimes.
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Posting in a more logical way would be nice, but I'll try to make sense of your post.

You are saying we shouldn't argue against feminists who are targeting specific fields (STEM) with other fields that are actually dominated by men (Garbage men as an example). So why is it OK for feminists to single out a specific field? Then you say feminists don't want any field to be dominated by men, which somehow makes it OK to ignore all the other male dominated jobs that aren't high paying.
 
AthlonXP said:
Also someone already in the article was spot on:

So what if only 30% of the workforce in tech are woman. This statistic is a lie and does not tell the whole truth. It fails to take into account the amount of woman studying the STEM fields. More importantly just because an industry does not have a 50/50 split does not make it racist or sexist, it just shows certain groups either favor or disfavor an industry. Men make up the vast majority of construction jobs and high risk work. Hence why 93% of all workplace deaths are men. Where is the outcry to make that number equal? Where is the outcry for more men to be in fields dominated by woman?
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Because some of us want women in tech. They bring different approaches and once you get past all the "she's a bitch" BS, they tend to be quite good. No they're not the same as a guy...that's the entire point of diversity.

Y'all act like CS is strictly science. It's not. Anyone who's looked at code knows that approaches vary. I've worked with plenty of women and minorities over the years and they all brought something valuable to the table.
 
There should be one and only one criteria for hiring someone: Can this person do the job effectively?

The other problem with quotas besides forced hiring of unqualified people are that not everyone of every race or gender is going to apply for the same job. If your labor force is 80% white male, and only 1% of applicants are Hispanic females, and of that1% only 0.2% were hired for the job, while the population of the area is 5% Hispanic, then automatically claiming you have too few Hispanic females on your labor force because it "doesn't fit with the racial breakdown of the community" is missing the big picture. Not everyone wants to do the same jobs.
 
pothb said:
Or maybe they don't want to work with idiots, who got the job because they have a quota to fill.



I was planning to get a gun, sooner or later. I guess I should get it sooner.

..... >_> I'm on some sort of watch list now, aren't I?
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Oh puhleeze. The biggest idiot I worked with was a white male. He didn't do shit and slept all the time. It took us FOREVER to get rid of him. It wasn't even a close call. The least competent person on our team after him was several orders of magnitude better, and we had a lot of women and a lot of African Americans.

Honestly, if you work with a bunch of people who suck, then leave. If you can't, then maybe you're not that good either.
 
kac77 said:
....
how would we make a choice with discriminating if they all have the same qualifications?
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I love this hypothetical, sadly it doesn't exist and if you think otherwise you've clearly you've never interviewed for tech openings. I've interviewed hundreds of people and not once have I had a an opportunity to choose from equally qualified applicants. There have always been clear standouts and there have always been many WTF was this person thinking even applying for this job, much less make it past the phone screens.
 
Nicklebon said:
I love this hypothetical, sadly it doesn't exist and if you think otherwise you've clearly you've never interviewed for tech openings. I've interviewed hundreds of people and not once have I had a an opportunity to choose from equally qualified applicants. There have always been clear standouts and there have always been many WTF was this person thinking even applying for this job, much less make it past the phone screens.
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Diversity doesn't mean hiring those WTF candidates. The key is to actually recruit qualified minorities. If you get minorities (and women) into a field, others will eventually follow.
 
Nicklebon said:
I love this hypothetical, sadly it doesn't exist and if you think otherwise you've clearly you've never interviewed for tech openings. I've interviewed hundreds of people and not once have I had a an opportunity to choose from equally qualified applicants. There have always been clear standouts and there have always been many WTF was this person thinking even applying for this job, much less make it past the phone screens.
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^This. You won't ever see a group of people all equally qualified. Only way that could happen is with them having the same degrees from the same schools, worked the same jobs for the same duration and all being the same age. As said, most cases are "i like you and you seem like you would fit in here" versus "please stop talking before I absorb your dumb through osmosis".
 
Always fills my heart with joy to see our highest elected officials make efforts to right such a terrible wrong afflicting the country.
 
Ur_Mom said:
What is stopping women and minorities from joining STEM fields?
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Their parents pushing them toward more reliable lines of (education leading to) work, their environments social statuses and backgrounds, STEM and nerdy shit still being seen as nerdy shit in a negative way by too many, mathematics requirements turning peeps away, and many finding it's not interesting enough to continue working towards.

We'll have diversity in sewage treatment, teaching, midwives before it gets anywhere near 50/50 in STEM. The boosts we're seeing now are the result of what started 20some years ago, it's going to take generations but we are getting there.

People just need to stop listening to coloured hair SanFransiscoians.
 
HardUp4HardWare said:
I would like more diversity in Goverment.
It is after all 100% rich lying assholes.
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So vote for someone that's nervous and socially awkward instead. Bottom line is the people that people (in general) tend to like are those that are good liars.
 
gman said:
I believe Dr. King said it best.. "I look to a day when people will not be judged by the color of their skin, but by the content of their character."
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nekrosoft13 said:
His words have been turned around now.
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MLK would be disgusted by what his former followers and family did with the remnants of his movement. In his final days he was preparing to try to convert the movement into an even bigger, even more noble one, purely about justice for all people, instead of only justice for the oppressed blacks at the time.

When he was killed, the vultures came in and turned it into nothing but bigotry, greed, selfishness, and prejudice, and so now we have the current situation, where ultimately our entire society is going to implode in self-destruction as division grows daily, and more and more groups pop up demanding "more equality" than all the other groups.
 
nilepez said:
Because some of us want women in tech. They bring different approaches and once you get past all the "she's a bitch" BS, they tend to be quite good. No they're not the same as a guy...that's the entire point of diversity.

Y'all act like CS is strictly science. It's not. Anyone who's looked at code knows that approaches vary. I've worked with plenty of women and minorities over the years and they all brought something valuable to the table.
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The first paragraph is such complete BS. Just because someone is a woman doesn't mean the thoughts and ideas can't be replicated in a man. I've worked with plenty of women and minorities and because they were exemplary coworkers and had sharp minds, they had plenty to bring to the table. It has nothing to do with their gonads or skin color or ethnicity.

It's like you want to see sex and race so bad that you can't get past the fact that they all have a mind and can think for themselves and come up with different ideas. You attribute these different ideas to things they have no control over.

Do you really believe that all white men are clones and cannot think outside the box for solutions? That it takes a woman to suggest something they they would have never thought? That kind of idea is the basis of sexism.
 
MrLonghair said:
Their parents pushing them toward more reliable lines of (education leading to) work, their environments social statuses and backgrounds, STEM and nerdy shit still being seen as nerdy shit in a negative way by too many, mathematics requirements turning peeps away, and many finding it's not interesting enough to continue working towards..
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This is wrong. Men & women are equal. /s

100% correct, though. More men CHOOSE to go into STEM fields than women do for a lot of reasons.Some like you've said above.
 
Hypergreatthing said:
The first paragraph is such complete BS. Just because someone is a woman doesn't mean the thoughts and ideas can't be replicated in a man. I've worked with plenty of women and minorities and because they were exemplary coworkers and had sharp minds, they had plenty to bring to the table. It has nothing to do with their gonads or skin color or ethnicity.

It's like you want to see sex and race so bad that you can't get past the fact that they all have a mind and can think for themselves and come up with different ideas. You attribute these different ideas to things they have no control over.

Do you really believe that all white men are clones and cannot think outside the box for solutions? That it takes a woman to suggest something they they would have never thought? That kind of idea is the basis of sexism.
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Do you really think women and men approach life and problems the same way? That's not been my experience (in or out of the workplace). That doesn't mean women were illogical or whatever, just their approach and skillsets were different and generally complimented mine and the other men I worked with.
 
If you are a White Male or non-H1B Asian Male, you have to be completely nuts to want to start a career in a STEM field, unless your sole plan is to immediately start your own business developing/selling your own products/services directly to consumers.
 
So basically he wants you to be racist?

I didn't get 3 jobs with the state of Texas because I wasn't a hispanic woman.
 
OEM said:
So basically he wants you to be racist?

I didn't get 3 jobs with the state of Texas because I wasn't a hispanic woman.
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Bilingual required at a lot of places here. Turns out you only need to know 2 words of English to qualify. Makes it difficult doing some things.
 
Bilingual was NOT a requirement. In fact, English was the only language listed as required. Spanish wasn't even listed as preferred. Not once was I asked if I spoke spanish.
 
yeah i wont 50% of my work force to ask for maturity every other year
 
GearChoices said:
MLK would be disgusted by what his former followers and family did with the remnants of his movement. In his final days he was preparing to try to convert the movement into an even bigger, even more noble one, purely about justice for all people, instead of only justice for the oppressed blacks at the time.

When he was killed, the vultures came in and turned it into nothing but bigotry, greed, selfishness, and prejudice, and so now we have the current situation, where ultimately our entire society is going to implode in self-destruction as division grows daily, and more and more groups pop up demanding "more equality" than all the other groups.
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Contemporary references to MLK, particularly from the right, are often interesting. He was almost with question the greatest social justice warrior in American history and outside of the black community, very unpopular south of the Mason-Dixon line in his day. There were countless accusations of him being a corrupt leftist who was a race baiter and agitator brining in outsiders to local communities and disturbing the peace.
 
Guys I have the solution. We get sex reassignment surgery and paint ourselves black. Job security confirmed. :)

018-body-paintings.jpg
 
OEM said:
So basically he wants you to be racist?

I didn't get 3 jobs with the state of Texas because I wasn't a hispanic woman.
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Making that kind of statement shows a lot of your character. I am very sure there were other factors that the decisions were based on. Unless they specifically told you that, then it really just sounds like you are bitter and not used to job seeking. There will be times you get jobs and others will feel that they were unfairly cut from the pick list as there will be moments you feel that way as in this particular case.

If you truly feel that this is how it was handled, please collect some evidence to support your opinion and you would have a great case to bring to a court. Otherwise please just take rejection like an adult and try a new place.
 
Darunion said:
Making that kind of statement shows a lot of your character. I am very sure there were other factors that the decisions were based on. Unless they specifically told you that, then it really just sounds like you are bitter and not used to job seeking. There will be times you get jobs and others will feel that they were unfairly cut from the pick list as there will be moments you feel that way as in this particular case.
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Sour grapes. I didn't get a job because of many reasons. Didn't fit their 'synergy', wasn't qualified enough in some technology, communication skills, wearing a skirt to the interview with your dick tucked....

:)
 
Ur_Mom said:
Sour grapes. I didn't get a job because of many reasons. Didn't fit their 'synergy', wasn't qualified enough in some technology, communication skills, wearing a skirt to the interview with your dick tucked....

:)
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Ive not hired someone despite them being ambitious, qualified, and well dressed. He was just annoying and didn't want to deal with it lol. Hired someone who had similar skills and also an exceptional personality. No regrets at all.
 
Darunion said:
Making that kind of statement shows a lot of your character. I am very sure there were other factors that the decisions were based on. Unless they specifically told you that, then it really just sounds like you are bitter and not used to job seeking. There will be times you get jobs and others will feel that they were unfairly cut from the pick list as there will be moments you feel that way as in this particular case.

If you truly feel that this is how it was handled, please collect some evidence to support your opinion and you would have a great case to bring to a court. Otherwise please just take rejection like an adult and try a new place.
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Maybe in the case of this guy it was the reason, maybe it wasn't, but the fact is, this kind of stuff happens all the time, so if it did not happen in these cases, it surely happened other times exactly because of these type of "initiatives." I have seen it happen multiple times myself. One of the biggest examples...

I knew a guy that had ZERO work ethic (because I directly worked with him in school), ZERO skill in his major's field (same major as me), ZERO general understanding of the field, and had ZERO positive personal/work attributes I could see from all the time I worked with him. He was put in my team because his previous team was the poorest performing of the entire graduating class of that major, both in terms of quality of work and grades, and so they were split up and put on different teams. He never paid attention in his classes, never did any work, and played around all the time.

He became a Team Leader in a Fortune 50 tech company. He was black. You cannot tell me that is not why he was hired as a Team Leader. I do not need to collect evidence for that. Are equally incompetent white people also hired? You bet. But they get hired for yet other corrupt reasons.

These anti-equality initiatives only serve to help raise the corrupt and keep the honest down.
 
Diversify in what way? I'm surrounded by the UN in my IT shop. Indians, Asians, Pacific Islanders, white folks, black folks, men and women. We can't get much more diverse.
 
GearChoices said:
Maybe in the case of this guy it was the reason, maybe it wasn't, but the fact is, this kind of stuff happens all the time, so if it did not happen in these cases, it surely happened other times exactly because of these type of "initiatives." I have seen it happen multiple times myself. One of the biggest examples...

I knew a guy that had ZERO work ethic (because I directly worked with him in school), ZERO skill in his major's field (same major as me), ZERO general understanding of the field, and had ZERO positive personal/work attributes I could see from all the time I worked with him. He was put in my team because his previous team was the poorest performing of the entire graduating class of that major, both in terms of quality of work and grades, and so they were split up and put on different teams. He never paid attention in his classes, never did any work, and played around all the time.

He became a Team Leader in a Fortune 50 tech company. He was black. You cannot tell me that is not why he was hired as a Team Leader. I do not need to collect evidence for that. Are equally incompetent white people also hired? You bet. But they get hired for yet other corrupt reasons.

These anti-equality initiatives only serve to help raise the corrupt and keep the honest down.
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I've seen similar things with white men, including a thesis that was arguably plagiarized. Now he's a CTO. What's your point? The best technical people I've known are WASTED in management. Management is rarely made up of the technical masters.

Sorry, but these stories remind me of all of the food stamp recipient drives a late model Cadillac stories. Incompetent people (of all races and both sexes) get hired and some of them get promoted.
 
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