The End of the Swipe-and-Sign Credit Card

CommanderFrank

CommanderFrank

Cat Can't Scratch It
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May 9, 2000
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A bastion of old-fashioned business practice will fall beginning in October 2015, as the US joins the majority of the world’s markets in ridding itself of the familiar swipe and sign style of credit card payment.

It’s a big reason why almost half the world’s credit card fraud happens in America, despite the country being home to about a quarter of all credit card transactions.
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cool. maybe checks are next. in no other country on the planet is this backwards method of payment still in use :p
 
Finally indeed. Only took 1/3rd of the US to have their information stolen... Little late then never I guess?
 
temujin987 said:
cool. maybe checks are next. in no other country on the planet is this backwards method of payment still in use :p
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nothing pisses me off more when I'm in checkout at a store and someone is paying their $4.79 total with a check.
 
AMD T-type said:
nothing pisses me off more when I'm in checkout at a store and someone is paying their $4.79 total with a check.
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This.

The only thing worse than that is when you're standing in line at the gas station and some ass in front of you decides to buy 5 of each type of lottery ticket.
 
Every time I see somebody on here bring up checks my first thought is you can still use checks at places.

I do know it differs in areas. Around me, no gas stations accept them, most smaller stores don't accept them, some grocery stores don't accept them. can't think of any fast food or restaurants in general that accept them. I know you can use them to make payments for bills as of course that is the only secure method of mailing a payment. but other than that and maybe a few larger stores. I can't think of anyone that takes them. On the flip side, most banks now charge you extra if you even want an account that you can write checks from. I don't know the last time I actually saw anyone try to use one in any store that would even allow it. So around me they are dead.
 
Out of curiosity how does the chip & pin method of CC's work for online purchases? Enter your CC# and then your PIN number? In which case is it simply slightly more secure since Target more likely than not is going to still keep CC#s as well as PINs too?
 
Interestingly, I had two credit cards contact me in the past week (one card each day over two days) saying they were going to issue me new cards. One card was actually used and the charge denied, the other card, as best I can tell, was some preventative thing. Of course they declined to say which merchant had the breach (not target, the hotels mentioned recently, or neiman marcus... I Mint transaction dump and comparison has about 30 vendors I've used both cards at in the past few years).

Interestingly, the Citi Mastercard was replaced with a chip and signature card (which still has a mag stripe) by default. I guess that's step 1, getting it in the hands of customers. Hopefully going full chip+pin will just be some (not yet implemented) PIN creation after that.
 
Ashbringer said:
Finally, the move to chip and PIN.
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Nope. Chip and signature. There's going to be very few Chip and Pin cards in the U.S.

Chase, Bank of America (and FIA), American Express all decided to implement Chip and Signature. With most other banks announcing Chip and Signature rollouts coming in the future.

It's really funny though. Most of the cards I have I applied for online without the bank ever having my signature. So I can sign whatever in the end. Not like anyone bothers to compare.
 
I write checks to my daughter's daycare, her piano teacher, her gymnastics school, utility companies, for my property taxes and a bunch of other things. I actually write more checks now than I did 5 years ago.

If I want to use a card for most of my bills, they want to charge me a "convenience" fee that is usually around 5+%. So yeah, I'll keep writing checks.
 
There is more going on here than people know. The credit card companies don't give a shit about you or your safety. The move to these systems and forcing it most likely has way more to do with the impending format wars for taxing you for transactions. For years the big 4 had a monopoly on credit cards and any money processing. For that they reaped a nice 3-5% tax on nearly any transaction. And the best part is they were able to dupe consumers into moving everything to that by giving them rewards. Well you all don't think those rewards came from nowhere do you? It was the retailers that were paying for those rewards.

Now for the first time things like google wallet, and cell phones etc... Are gaining huge power and could be a real threat to these guys. So my guess is hidden somewhere in this move to a new system is also a move to make it harder to use alternative technologies or a vain attempt to stem them off. Please do not be so naïve that you would actually fall for this the greatest credit using economy in the world is behind everyone else BS.
 
Ion Silverbolt said:
This.

The only thing worse than that is when you're standing in line at the gas station and some ass in front of you decides to buy 5 of each type of lottery ticket.
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Worse then that...
My 97 year old great grandmother stands in line in front of you at the gas station buying 5 of each type of ticket then refuses to move as she scratches them off!
 
Why do I get the feeling that someone, somewhere, is (again) laughing all the way to the bank and not actually giving a single shit about anyone's security?
 
lol crazy this is even a thing. I haven't swiped my bank card or cc in about 3 years now. Mind you im in Canada, but the new one is the tap and I love it. Places like my grocery store if the purchase is under $50 I can just tap the pad and it goes through, no pins or signature, also works great at McDonalds and Tim Horton's for my daily coffee. And my bank guarantees 100% coverage for this feature if I ever lose my card and don't cancel in time, but for those annoying places that don't have the tap feature have all had chip and pin for 2-3+ years now.
 
Ion Silverbolt said:
This.

The only thing worse than that is when you're standing in line at the gas station and some ass in front of you decides to buy 5 of each type of lottery ticket.
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No, the worst is the 2 bad kinds of folks at the post office..
...ones that wait in line and bring an item to the counter to ship...wasting everyones time because they cant rightly choose a box from the racks at the po
.......others that wait in line, just to buy 2 or 3 stamps, or get an envelope weighed....just put another 49c stamp on it and be done
 
Koolthulu said:
I write checks to my daughter's daycare, her piano teacher, her gymnastics school, utility companies, for my property taxes and a bunch of other things. I actually write more checks now than I did 5 years ago.

If I want to use a card for most of my bills, they want to charge me a "convenience" fee that is usually around 5+%. So yeah, I'll keep writing checks.
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Amen brother, I never use a card when I can use cash/check. If I read thru all of this correctly Europe has the highest CC fraud so were gonna adopt it?
 
Checks are necessary but seriously using them on something sub $50 is wack. I used to work at a store that required the purchase to be over $25 for checks.

I am all for Pins! but you know when they came out with chips on a card it will come with a subscription fee.
 
elzeus said:
Does this do anything for online purchases?
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Not sure exactly, but a lot of the online vendors I deal with won't deliver a good to what's not the cardholder's address (not sure if they blacklist by geographic zip code or have address verification). At least for the first time customers they seem to. Plus, they sort of have an address to investigate.
 
sfsuphysics said:
Out of curiosity how does the chip & pin method of CC's work for online purchases? Enter your CC# and then your PIN number? In which case is it simply slightly more secure since Target more likely than not is going to still keep CC#s as well as PINs too?
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MC and Visa have had a PIN feature for a while now. During an online purchase, you get redirected to your bank's website where you review your transaction details and enter a PIN or password. It then returns you to the vendor website to finish the purchase. The vendor never sees your PIN. I think at some point, though, they vetted the big name merchants (Newegg, Amazon, etc) so customers don't have to go through the extra security when they buy through them.
 
What gets me is the chips and PIN is much easier to crack and hack then the magnetic strip on the side. I find it so funny that they came out with these chip things and 2 months later the banks were selling metal wallets so your chip could not be scanned by wireless readers.

Most credit cards now have tap to pay that is soo easy to crack. The tap card thing has no security and the pin is on the boardcast all you need is a scanner from ebay and tap someones wallet and you have there info.

They need to come out with something better. DNA encoding or breath encoding from air vapor. With all the new tech that so easy to hack these days I kinda want to go back to CASH.
 
djsb said:
MC and Visa have had a PIN feature for a while now. During an online purchase, you get redirected to your bank's website where you review your transaction details and enter a PIN or password. It then returns you to the vendor website to finish the purchase. The vendor never sees your PIN. I think at some point, though, they vetted the big name merchants (Newegg, Amazon, etc) so customers don't have to go through the extra security when they buy through them.
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newegg used to have that for visa. did they remove it?
 
bigmac11 said:
Amen brother, I never use a card when I can use cash/check. If I read thru all of this correctly Europe has the highest CC fraud so were gonna adopt it?
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How can Europe has highest CC fraud rate when US has 33% of the cards and 50% of the frauds ? Rest of the world has 67% of the cards and the remaining 50% of the frauds. In other perspective - 316 million people in US has 50% of the frauds, while the remaining 6.9 billion people get the remaining 50% of the frauds. Sure, probably only 1 billion of them has credit cards, but that would be still 1/3rd of the US rate. And when a card info is stolen in Europe (usually via card readers and little cameras mounted to an ATM, to they scan your card and record your PIN when you enter it to ATM), in majority of the cases it is used you can guess where :). Yep, in USA.
 
Exavior said:
newegg used to have that for visa. did they remove it?
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AFAIK it is still there the problem is that not all merchants are forced to ask for it. And I think this is part of what will change. It wont be a choice anymore for you to implement things like pin or 2 step security. It will be something every person has to do, every retailer must support.

And most of it probably just has to do with the proliferation of mobile phones. Not for customers but for retailers. For a long time a retailer could use a knuckle buster to manually accept credit cards. This was needed, say you do art shows, or take sales as a mobile vendor you had to have a way to take cards offline then process them. Now that smartphones are ubiquitous and cheap and national coverage is pretty good. I think they are saying time to force the move. This wasn't important in other countries because I have never been to a country that uses credit cards nearly as much as the USA. So you could count on customers using cash or having it. Not at all the same in the USA. Everyone everywhere has to take credit cards, even the fast food chains finally caved some years ago.
 
shade91 said:
The Banks should honestly be ashamed at letting such an article get posted. There's nothing more pitiful when Europe is doing things better than you.
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Europe is hardly better it wasn't too long ago that tons of credit and debit card theft and fraud was rampant in europe, esp in eastern counties which pushed forward legislation to replace the old strip cards with something better. It just took longer for US problems to become so evident that the same deal would happen.
 
I work in a pizza restaurant. People call in their orders on the phone, read us their credit card number over the phone, we type it into a terminal. I don't see how a card with a chip in it is going to have any effect on anything for us.
 
The uk has had chip and pin for years. We also have contactless payments as well.
 
About time.


Wolf_Tech said:
What gets me is the chips and PIN is much easier to crack and hack then the magnetic strip on the side. I find it so funny that they came out with these chip things and 2 months later the banks were selling metal wallets so your chip could not be scanned by wireless readers.

Most credit cards now have tap to pay that is soo easy to crack. The tap card thing has no security and the pin is on the boardcast all you need is a scanner from ebay and tap someones wallet and you have there info.

They need to come out with something better. DNA encoding or breath encoding from air vapor. With all the new tech that so easy to hack these days I kinda want to go back to CASH.
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How so? Have you checked and tried one? Afaik the easiest one to crack are the magnetic stripe. With chip and pin you really need to crack those embedded security as well. And afaik no you can't just scan them on thin air, "The Chips" are more likely like those used in your phones (sim cards).
 
Huh, and here I was we are the ones doing things backwards.

I've only seen "checks" and swipe-to-pay in movies.
 
Yeah paying with check is stupid, only use a check if you need to post it to somebody, otherwise their are plenty of better methods like card, cash or bank transfer.
 
sfsuphysics said:
Out of curiosity how does the chip & pin method of CC's work for online purchases? Enter your CC# and then your PIN number? In which case is it simply slightly more secure since Target more likely than not is going to still keep CC#s as well as PINs too?
Click to expand...
The PIN is only used for transactions where the cardholder is present and the merchant has an approved pin pad. Online transactions and phone transactions are not affected.

There is a seperate system used by some online merchants where you are redirected to your bank to authenticate the transaction (the exact method of authentication varies by bank but AFAIK it never involves the pin used for cardholder present transactions) but afaict it is not mandatory
 
Only your bank ever sees your pin, the place you are paying at and online stores never see your pin.

Online payments don't change.
 
temujin987 said:
cool. maybe checks are next. in no other country on the planet is this backwards method of payment still in use :p
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Yeah, I was flabbergasted when I first moved to the US and someone asked me to pay them with a cheque. I had never written a cheque in my life and never had a chequing account, I remember my Dad closed his last chequing account about 15 years ago because he was never using it and it was costing him fees.

I found it hilarious that to pay my landlord I was going online and telling my bank to mail him a cheque in my name instead of just transferring the money directly, lol.
 
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