Night_Hawk-19
Gawd
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Sticking with fatality champion or may upgrade azuntech theater either way Creative no longer makes new cards with 7.1 in mind.
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Creative Sound Blaster Z Initial Impression
- Thread starter Nielo TM
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Noticed that too. My guess is they figure most people bitstream 7.1 via HDMI and use receivers these days.
This isn't all that surprising. SBX Surround and Dolby Headphone are both HRTFs, so they would probably sound similar.
The Zx always had the Nicheon gold caps, it just turns out that some of the Z cards have gold caps too. All three cards, the Z, Zx and Zxr come with a 600Ohm headphone amp.
I don't know what DAC is in the Zx, I would imagine it's the same that's in the Z, but, I haven't heard anything. But, I did read somewhere that the DAC is supplying all channels in the Zx, whereas the DAC in the Z only supplies the front channels.
I'm pretty sure the Z and the Zx are identical hardware except for the ACM module that is included with the Zx.
Ocellaris
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If that is the case, Creative needs to do a much better job explaining the differences to people. I went with a Z since the only difference I saw in the Zx was the ACM which I don't want. I am trying to reduce the number of cables around my stuff, not increase the number of cables.
Ocellaris
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Based on the sheets direct from Creative, the ZxR has a Burr Brown DAC + TI amp, while the Z and Zx have a Cirrus Logic DAC + Maxim amp:
ZxR
http://www.soundblaster.com/products/sound-blaster-zxr.aspx#specs
Z
http://www.soundblaster.com/products/sound-blaster-z.aspx#specs
Zx
http://www.soundblaster.com/products/sound-blaster-zx.aspx#specs
Tup3x
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I have to ask, does it mean that when using the headphone amp in Z and Zx the sound quality is worse than without amp? I also wonder how Zx compares to Forte.
Ocellaris
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Using HARX 700s for a headset, it sounds about the to me. The 700s are easy to drive though.
AKG 550 is a 32ohm headphone, just so you know.
I rather go with higher impedance drivers from Audio Technica, BeyerDynamics or Senns.
maverick0817
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Tup3x
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Th thing is that I'm not sure how this works. Does the headphone out use different DAC or something that makes the specs (SNR for example) different?
Farkle
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Adding gain into the equation always changes the signal (amplifies both the noise, and the audio signal), so often times when you implement a multi-channel system as such you cut costs by using a cheaper DAC that will match the noise floor of the primary channel DAC if it had gain (rather than putting two of the more expensive chips on your board.) The difference will be measurable, but I don't think you'll notice unless you're using super sensitive IEM louder than they should be. It's not like we're talking about a crossover causing a phase issue here... and you'll likely be using dynamic drivers for playback, so your 20-20 +/-3 should be fine. The difference will be on paper.
The sound quality isn't worse without the amp, but certain headphones need an amp depending on the ohm rating. Generally, most headphones sound much richer and fuller when connected to a headphone amp - using the titanium HD some cans had a pretty empty sound unless I hooked them up to an external headphone amp
Tup3x
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So, I assume that this has tiny bit higher quality headphone amp than Forte? I can't remember reading anywhere about what amp Forte has...
Farkle
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A proprietary non-discrete design on the Forte. The Z series is going to compare more to the Xonar STX.
are you lost in space?
Nope. Pretty sure I understand how this headphone thing works by now. Might try searching some of my threads here. I have been doing it for a while. An old example below.
http://hardforum.com/showthread.php?t=1234050
FrEaKy
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I still have an old Hercules Gametheatre XP, a ASUS Xonar DS.......
So far going to a Z doesnt seem like a bad idea.
Anyone get to play with the gnob device that runs externally for this unit as well? Looks like it has 2 5.5 jacks (mic and headset) and 2 3.5mm jacks (mic and headset), I wanna try it out.
So far going to a Z doesnt seem like a bad idea.
Anyone get to play with the gnob device that runs externally for this unit as well? Looks like it has 2 5.5 jacks (mic and headset) and 2 3.5mm jacks (mic and headset), I wanna try it out.
Tup3x
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So I guess it wouldn't to be a downgrade.
Farkle
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Side-step, really.
Is the forte an x-fi clone? Or were any special features added? There are tons of clone cards out so they all perform very similarly, which is to say very good 3d positional audio but not the best at other aspects. I can say for an absolute certainty that the Z blows away all of the "standard" x-fi cards, although I admit i'm not too familiar with the Forte. Which x-fi card does it most closely match?
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Farkle
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Titanium Fatal1ty edition cards are the closest match, but do not confuse the two. Forte 7.1 uses higher quality components, and different opamps. It is a redesign, not a clone.
I see, thanks for the clarification. If the forte is close to the titanium HD hardware wise, it's a tough call. I think the ZXR is better (than the titanium HD), but the ZX - that isn't quite as clear.
Tup3x
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That would be fine, I'd give this to my mother since she uses absolutely garbage onboard audio yet she has Sennheiser HD 598 headphones.
It's not as good as HD, I need to check but it may have same DAC than Zx. Or at least very comparable. Headphone amp in Forte is probably not as good quality wise.
Hmmm.... Forte has AKM AK4396VF for front channels, CS4382A for rest. I'm not actually that sure any more about which would be better. EDIT: Cirrus Logic CS4398 and AKM AK4396VF have pretty much identical specs. THD+N is better on CS4398 though.
Spec sheets:
http://www.cirrus.com/en/pubs/proDatasheet/CS4398_F1.pdf
http://www.asahi-kasei.co.jp/akm/en/product/ak4396/ak4396_f00e.pdf
Also I wonder if Creative is planning on releasing ASIO drivers for Z series
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does somebody know, which ADC is used on the zxr? not talking about the 123db on the db pro, but the one that should be on the zxr, which is used for the microphone input.
just wanna know how good can it record from the microphone.
i dont have experience in electronics and it's hard to see from the few pictures on the web.
just wanna know how good can it record from the microphone.
i dont have experience in electronics and it's hard to see from the few pictures on the web.
My Forte was great until it died. Best that it did, because Auzentech support is basically non-existent now and the driver support is terrible.
Got the new Sound Blaster Z. Happy so far.
Farkle
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PCM4220. Please keep in mind however, that all of these consumer cards are basically designed on the ADC side of things for nothing more than digitizing voice, and anything beyond that is usually not recommended, nor intended. Because of this, you can mostly ignore the specifications since you're dealing with a 3.5mm stereo jack and condenser mics. If you want to record instruments, you want something with a Hi-Z input. If you want to do a quality podcast or vox in general, you'll want something with a good pre.
Tup3x
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They just did release Window 8 drivers and they work great. Still, their support sucks (they just don't communicate). My Forte has heat sink and some other changes in layout compared to those review units I've seen. Some earlier revisions apparently died after certain point and had interference issues.
My Forte never had a heatsink.
Where is the support for Windows 7? The last driver was 09/09/2011 !
rene mauricio
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As mentioned before, the only Burr Brown DAC in the Z line is the ZXR, every other one uses a Cirrus Logic DAC. The TiHD uses a Burr Brown DAC (PCM1794) which is the same one most people claim are on the ZXR.
I was finally able to test for myself what a vanilla Z and TiHD sound like and have found the quality on the TiHD to be better. I really wish I could get my hands on the ZXR but I can wait - for now. Since sound is purely subjective I will not question the person who posted before me who said that he had a TiHD once, got rid of it but now has a Z and thinks the Z sounds better. I would love for review sites to take up the comparison so that we could get more opinions.
Worth mentioning is that the non-ZXR Z's may never get ASIO support. I suspect that Creative would use that as (one) selling point for the ZXR.
Tup3x
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My Forte never had a heatsink.
Where is the support for Windows 7? The last driver was 09/09/2011 !
Windows 8 driver is for 7 too.
Depending on what gear they use, the lack of amp on HD does make difference. For non-headphone use HD is better for sure.As mentioned before, the only Burr Brown DAC in the Z line is the ZXR, every other one uses a Cirrus Logic DAC. The TiHD uses a Burr Brown DAC (PCM1794) which is the same one most people claim are on the ZXR.
I was finally able to test for myself what a vanilla Z and TiHD sound like and have found the quality on the TiHD to be better. I really wish I could get my hands on the ZXR but I can wait - for now. Since sound is purely subjective I will not question the person who posted before me who said that he had a TiHD once, got rid of it but now has a Z and thinks the Z sounds better. I would love for review sites to take up the comparison so that we could get more opinions.
Worth mentioning is that the non-ZXR Z's may never get ASIO support. I suspect that Creative would use that as (one) selling point for the ZXR.
ZxR would be nice especially if the price is same as new HD but that probably is not going to be the case. Still, I want to see what's the price.
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thanks, do you have a picture or something? i checked all of the pictures i could find on google, but couldn't see pcm 4220
ZxR will be over $200. Probably $250+
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maverick0817
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If it ever releases.
InnervateD
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I wouldn't consider the TiHD anymore as an option.
Support on a card that's almost what? 2 years old now? I wouldn't buy it as it might be discontinued soon, and support may go down with it. I think it currently has no or poor Windows 8 support right now? correct me if I'm wrong.
Keep in mind the TiHD still bangs around for about $180 which isn't so far away from the ZxR, and I feel that the additional $70 is well worth the built in 600 Ohm amp, and the other newer features on the new card over the TiHD. Also the TiHD only supports 5.1 through RCA/optical out right? and it has no analog 5.1 which would be an option some would consider a deal breaker.
I actually just put down an order on the ZxR from my local canadacomputers store, and I can't wait to get my hands on the card, as I have a pair of DT990s that need to get burned in.
Support on a card that's almost what? 2 years old now? I wouldn't buy it as it might be discontinued soon, and support may go down with it. I think it currently has no or poor Windows 8 support right now? correct me if I'm wrong.
Keep in mind the TiHD still bangs around for about $180 which isn't so far away from the ZxR, and I feel that the additional $70 is well worth the built in 600 Ohm amp, and the other newer features on the new card over the TiHD. Also the TiHD only supports 5.1 through RCA/optical out right? and it has no analog 5.1 which would be an option some would consider a deal breaker.
I actually just put down an order on the ZxR from my local canadacomputers store, and I can't wait to get my hands on the card, as I have a pair of DT990s that need to get burned in.
Tup3x
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If it's less than 200 I would really think about it, if not... I don't think it's worth it over Zx. HD goes for around 170 (inc. 24% vat) here.
there was a video that was posted here not too long ago, ZxR was at least 4 inches longer than the Zx with so much stuff on the board.
i am sure the difference will be heard hard and clear with a much better DAC and headphone AMP from the Zxr model.
but you will be required to have a great headphone to go with the ZxR or speakers to hear the difference.