Global PC Sales Flat In 2Q

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Global PC sales are down by 0.1 percent and tablets and other gadgets are being blamed. You know, because this awesome global economy has nothing to do with it at all. :rolleyes:

The quarterly report from research firm Gartner showed PC shipments, excluding tablet computers, totaled 87.5 million units in the second quarter of 2012, a small drop year-over year. "In the second quarter of 2012, the PC market suffered through its seventh consecutive quarter of flat to single-digit growth," said Mikako Kitagawa, analyst at Gartner.
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heatlesssun said:
And this is the main driver behind Windows 8.
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You've got to give this up. I'm not sure what kind of money Microsoft is paying you to prop up a defensive wall in every win8 thread but I'm relatively certain it isn't worth the amount of ridicule about to head your way.

Also, where are the people who were shitting up that AMD thread with 'the sky is falling' crap? In early Q1 the projected sales figures for PCs was released and it showed a steadying off with laptops and tablet sales picking up. This has been the trend for the past several years, actually. Couple this with the poor outlook in China and Europe and you'd have to figure it'd be bad.
 
Looks like in the US Lenovo, Asus, and Apple are the only ways staying positive with growth.
 
SkribbelKat said:
Oh no! Don't turn this into another one of those Windows 8 threads of yours! We've had quite enough of those already thanks. :)
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I'm not turning anything into anything. I'm simply pointing out market forces, the same ones that pretty much any analyst points to as to why Microsoft is doing what it's doing with Windows 8.

If one refuses to look at what is in plain sight, I can't help if they trip.;)
 
heatlesssun said:
I'm not turning anything into anything. I'm simply pointing out market forces, the same ones that pretty much any analyst points to as to why Microsoft is doing what it's doing with Windows 8.

If one refuses to look at what is in plain sight, I can't help if they trip.;)
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Will it be a good trip or a bad trip?
 
Oh no .1%... Really that's such a small amount I don't see it being statistically significant. Flat lining sales is far better than massive plummets. Perhaps everyone is just satisfied with their current PC and there aren't enough new adopters in this day and age to show a real climb.
 
JosiahBradley said:
Oh no .1%... Really that's such a small amount I don't see it being statistically significant. Flat lining sales is far better than massive plummets. Perhaps everyone is just satisfied with their current PC and there aren't enough new adopters in this day and age to show a real climb.
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^This. There is no longer an incentive to purchase new hardware. PCs are fast enough that they satisfy the majority of computing needs for the average consumer. Improvements in processing power have also slowed, lessening the need to upgrade even further.
 
Meh, I got sick of upgrading to hardware that I'll never fully take advantage of. I'm sure at this rate, my i7 will last another 2-3 years with a simple RAM upgrade somewhere in there.
 
When I saw the title of this thread I knew that 'lightwithoutwarmth' :D would have one of the first posts in it. My existing customers are not buying or having me build a new PC because the ones they have still do everything they need with plenty power to spare. It's shocking, isn't it? Common sense prevails among them for some reason. No wonder MS wants to push their tablet-focused OS/storefront. People see that crap on a new PC and they will hang on to their old ones rather than buying a new one, further depressing PC sales.

I'm sure that will help to 'prove' that PC sales are really in the toilet! :rolleyes:
 
DrDoug said:
When I saw the title of this thread I knew that 'lightwithoutwarmth' :D would have one of the first posts in it. My existing customers are not buying or having me build a new PC because the ones they have still do everything they need with plenty power to spare. It's shocking, isn't it? Common sense prevails among them for some reason. No wonder MS wants to push their tablet-focused OS/storefront. People see that crap on a new PC and they will hang on to their old ones rather than buying a new one, further depressing PC sales.

I'm sure that will help to 'prove' that PC sales are really in the toilet! :rolleyes:
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The stuff about Windows 8 aside (because I fear another mega-thread about Metro), I pretty much agree with you. Current generation PCs or PCs a few years old are more than enough for the lightweight workloads people place on them. There's some small amount of compute power that's been necessary as video playback at progressively higher qualities becomes more commonplace, but for most other chores, a 766 MHz Celeron in a Compaq Presario will do just fine. :p
 
DrDoug said:
When I saw the title of this thread I knew that 'lightwithoutwarmth' :D would have one of the first posts in it. My existing customers are not buying or having me build a new PC because the ones they have still do everything they need with plenty power to spare. It's shocking, isn't it? Common sense prevails among them for some reason. No wonder MS wants to push their tablet-focused OS/storefront. People see that crap on a new PC and they will hang on to their old ones rather than buying a new one, further depressing PC sales.

I'm sure that will help to 'prove' that PC sales are really in the toilet! :rolleyes:
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So if everyone is happy with their PC because they do all that they want and sales have flat lined then sounds like that's a good reason to do something new and different that existing PCs don't do. If sales are already in the toilet then you might as well try something different.
 
sleepeeg3 said:
^This. There is no longer an incentive to purchase new hardware. PCs are fast enough that they satisfy the majority of computing needs for the average consumer. Improvements in processing power have also slowed, lessening the need to upgrade even further.
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If we had applications that put more demand for processing power, then demand for faster PCs will go up. Even Tablets and smart phones are going through this now. What application needs the processing power of the latest ARM chip?
 
Ashbringer said:
If we had applications that put more demand for processing power, then demand for faster PCs will go up. Even Tablets and smart phones are going through this now. What application needs the processing power of the latest ARM chip?
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At some point one would expect some software breakthrough to push the boundaries of computing power for consumers but it just doesn't seem to be happening especially as the world goes smaller, mobile and to the cloud.
 
Soon, everything a tablet or smartphone can do will be miniaturized enough to fit into eyeglasses frames, and soon after that, will be moved into contact lenses. Much sooner than any of that, PCs as they exist today in the form of a box attached to a monitor, keyboard and mouse will be considered as quaint as a

IBM_Selectric.jpg
 
Oh noes, this can't be due to the fact that NOTHING big has released lately..nope must just be pc gaming dying AGAIN.

Also digital sales aren't included (steam will never be unless they become public, and they are one of the biggest distributors) so how fucking pointless is this.
 
I think they can count themselves fortunate that it's only 0.1 percent, in this economy.
 
Guys PC gaming is dieing again.

We better all just throw our PC's into a big ass pile and burn it and inhale all those deadly toxins and die. Looks like the media has one up'd us again with a numerical offering that could actually be discounted as a statistical anomaly....

Good bye PC gaming world :(
 
I wonder if they count complete PC sales only? I mean on that basis other than a laptop I haven't bought a PC for years. :eek:

Anyway, maintaining constant sales, even during an economic crisis isn't really a foreboding sign. It's still maintaining selling the same number of products, which sells more than any other consumer device... If anything it shows new junky form factors like tablet's sales have 0 effect, if ones sales figures don't effect the other.

Time for a car analogy:
It makes as much sense as going up to a car manufacturer who sold 500m last year, and pointing out they only sold 499m ...then pointing over to some new 3cc swamp gas powered car manufacturing plant and saying "they had sales increases of 500%!" (1 car to 5 cars) and going "ha you're fucked!"...
 
Oh god I read that completely wrong...well hurr durr...you can't have PC sales increasing every year when the general majority only buy one every 5 years..and if that year happens to have been last year..well then obviously it won't be as high this year.
 
This isn't 1999. The need for a new PC year after year is no longer needed. Hell, any decent 4-5 year old PC shouldn't have any problem doing anything most users need.

I look at my HTPC with its 2.6ghz Core2Duo and ATI 4850 that can still to this day play games at reasonable levels...and this is GAMING...not just surfing the web or playing movies which is what a vast majority use their PC's for.

Even my Playbook with its lowly 1Ghz dual core and 1GB of RAM can play YouTube at 1080p, surf the web perfectly, load webpages instantly, etc...so even with just a modern day tablet most computer users needs have been completely fulfilled with I'm sure a lot of people not even owning a Windows or OSX desktop/laptop.

My guess is that in a few more years new PC sales will simply be either because of a machine failing or people just wanting new shiny hardware...none of the sales will be for computers that have just gotten too slow for normal day to day use (people like gamers actually NEEDING the extra speed excluded). Even using my HTPC as an example I don't see any need to upgrade ANY time soon...video playback or websurfing won't become a chore for a few more years at least!

Looking as how software is becoming more streamlined and more efficient (because of slower machines like tablets and smartphones) I really don't see the need for computers to ever get MUCH faster than they are now unless some new tech comes along (like 3D holograms or augmented reality). Looks like we'll be riding this train of software and websites being just technically "enough" for a long long while. Think about it, how much processing power does your average user need for Facebook, HD video, and [H]ardforums? Very very little when considering the speed of top of the line PC's.
 
heatlesssun said:
And this is the main driver behind Windows 8.
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heatlesssun said:
I'm not turning anything into anything. I'm simply pointing out market forces, the same ones that pretty much any analyst points to as to why Microsoft is doing what it's doing with Windows 8.

If one refuses to look at what is in plain sight, I can't help if they trip.;)
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Seriously...you used to be one of the ones that posted sense..

1) Flat sales that are still outselling tablets.
2) Primary PC's don't require to be replaced as often as they can be upgraded.
3) Lets not forget that PC's have been out long enough to achieve a measure of market saturation, tablets have not.
4) Let us also not forget that the economy is hardly in good shape and if people have a device and it works, there is not a great deal of incentive to replace it.

The list can go on for quite a bit. Tired of all the doom and gloom hyperbole as justification for Win 8. Flat sales does not in any way equate to sales tanking. It just means there was no growth. There are loads of reasons for lack of growth and tablets aren't one of them.
 
I used to upgrade my machines religiously, but honestly since the Q6600 came out, overclocked to 3.4ghz, I've seen no need to replace any of my machines and have instead only done some upgrades (added USB3, better video card, some more RAM, and a SSD for the boot drive).

*shrugs*

I think most people are just reaching a point where they realize even five year old technology is still perfectly viable, and heck for the light users that just browse the web even decade old tech is fine.
 
Don't you think it's more so because the PC market is fairly mature at this point? I mean, who doesn't already have a desktop or laptop (that wants one)? What's wrong with single digit growth? It's irrational to think any industry can sustain double digit growth forever.
 
More high-level, inefficient coding + more market fracturing + reinventing the wheel = constant need for more and more computing power.
 
When I worked for Intel back in the 90's, one of their drivers was what they called the technology spiral ... the diagram looked kind of like a spring ... their rationale was that new hardware would drive new software technologies that required new hardware ... for a continuously growing market ... however, now the market is mature and saturated (as others have noted) ... Intel's tick-tock strategy has actually gotten them so far ahead of the current software technologies and consumer/enterprise normal uses that there is little need to upgrade on a recurring basis ... until some major new capability is released that requires new hardware to support it I doubt we will see the massive growth of the past, regardless of the economy
 
heatlesssun said:
I'm not turning anything into anything. I'm simply pointing out market forces, the same ones that pretty much any analyst points to as to why Microsoft is doing what it's doing with Windows 8.

If one refuses to look at what is in plain sight, I can't help if they trip.;)
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inspirational-quotes-10.jpg
 
Dekoth-E- said:
The list can go on for quite a bit. Tired of all the doom and gloom hyperbole as justification for Win 8. Flat sales does not in any way equate to sales tanking. It just means there was no growth. There are loads of reasons for lack of growth and tablets aren't one of them.
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These are all perfectly valid reasons but the underlying fact is NO GROWTH. And who is to say that this isn't a precursor to negative growth? There's simply a lot of issues in the PC industry these days and yes there's much concern for the future. I don't know any analyst that's looking at these numbers, seeing the rise in phones and tablets and the flat lining of the PC and saying "That's alright, the PC market is mature and PCs last longer these days. No worries." That certainly isn't anything that's going to impress stockholders.
 
kbrickley said:
When I worked for Intel back in the 90's, one of their drivers was what they called the technology spiral ... the diagram looked kind of like a spring ... their rationale was that new hardware would drive new software technologies that required new hardware ... for a continuously growing market ... however, now the market is mature and saturated (as others have noted) ... Intel's tick-tock strategy has actually gotten them so far ahead of the current software technologies and consumer/enterprise normal uses that there is little need to upgrade on a recurring basis ... until some major new capability is released that requires new hardware to support it I doubt we will see the massive growth of the past, regardless of the economy
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That's absolutely true. Most programs we use today aren't using FMA3/4 and AVX ISAs (you'd be lucky to run into SSE4) so it's become clear that programmers don't want to recompile for those of us with the better hardware either. They aim for the biggest market and because most consumers don't upgrade frequently it becomes a cycle of mediocrity with no real software that pushes the envelope. Gaming is the only one I can think of but even there you're fine with a Q6660 unless you're going to be running a multi-monitor setup.
 
I don't see a general malaise about the OS being the stagnating force behind stagnant desktop sales. Unless Windows 8 requires 2 year old or newer hardware to even run it will not push more desktop sales. Hardware has really gotten to the point that any PC in the last 5 years really can run anything as fast as needed to do general desktop stuff. That and market saturation has likely set in.
 
pelo said:
That's absolutely true. Most programs we use today aren't using FMA3/4 and AVX ISAs (you'd be lucky to run into SSE4) so it's become clear that programmers don't want to recompile for those of us with the better hardware either. They aim for the biggest market and because most consumers don't upgrade frequently it becomes a cycle of mediocrity with no real software that pushes the envelope. Gaming is the only one I can think of but even there you're fine with a Q6660 unless you're going to be running a multi-monitor setup.
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I think even with gaming and some professional applications that the CPU and graphics technologies have become so fast that they are now gated by other physical elements of the PC (storage and web speeds). I think with the tablet and phone mobility form factors pushing the RAM based storage models I think we will need to see some sort of seemless RAM drive technologies make it into the main stream (maybe some sort of hybrid storage of on board/on chip storage combined with SSDs as their prices drop to push growth. Also, some sort of paradigm shift in interface speeds where buses are so fast you could gain exponential speed increases in the CPU and GPU and actually see exponential benefits might help. I think right now we are basically waiting for the next tipping point in computer technology to facilitate high velocity growth. It might be multi-display technologies, or 3D technology, or voice technology, or something else, but until there is something that totally invalidates most of the existing form factors of PCs there will be little need for consumers or enterprise to upgrade (except when things actually fail). Heck, my laptop at work is still using Office 2003 and Windows XP (not my preference btw; I would prefer newer versions of both ;) ). Using 10 year old software in the early 2000's would be unthinkable but it is perfectly acceptable right now.
 
Cruiza said:
Don't you think it's more so because the PC market is fairly mature at this point? I mean, who doesn't already have a desktop or laptop (that wants one)? What's wrong with single digit growth? It's irrational to think any industry can sustain double digit growth forever.
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This
 
JayteeBates said:
I don't see a general malaise about the OS being the stagnating force behind stagnant desktop sales. Unless Windows 8 requires 2 year old or newer hardware to even run it will not push more desktop sales. Hardware has really gotten to the point that any PC in the last 5 years really can run anything as fast as needed to do general desktop stuff. That and market saturation has likely set in.
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Non-enterprise consumers buy primarily laptops and tablets, not desktops. Windows 8 will push new PC sales because there will be a wave of new and unique devices being released.
 
chinesepiratefood said:
Non-enterprise consumers buy primarily laptops and tablets, not desktops. Windows 8 will push new PC sales because there will be a wave of new and unique devices being released.
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Why you Windows 8 fanatic!;)

“The announcement of a Windows 8 launch date, as well as broader communication of new features in the OS, are key steps that would help to address uncertainty about new product availability and help consumers and channels plan their purchases,” IDC’s Jay Chou noted.
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http://www.winsupersite.com/article...o/pc-sales-flat-market-waits-windows-8-143674

As many have already noted, why buy a new PC, the one most people have is good enough right? On the mobile side especially, few people have PC devices like many of the ones coming out this fall. I certainly wouldn't by a laptop right now unless I had to and no doubt people waiting for Windows 8 and new devices is having some wait and see effect on PC sales at the moment.

And don't count the desktop out just yet with consumers. Millions of them will be sold for years to come but they will become more niche, gamers, individuals with need of powerful hardware, older and less mobile folks.
 
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