Diablo 3: Gamer Decisions In Actuality

Slachtbeest said:
For all those who've now claimed they're so angry and fed-up with actions such as what Blizzard are taking, that they're no longer going to be buying Diablo 3, how many are actually going to follow-through on their word? How many will just cave in the end?

I, my wife and my sister have all firmly decided to not buy it, and just play Torchlight 2. We all hope more people do the same. We don't go back on such decisions.
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Hey if the pain becomes too great, if the bullying for being different becomes unbearable...
You can install Diablo 3 on your office PC, and when u come home be all like

HAHAHA who needs that Diablo 3 fad anyway, right honey? Indie clones FTW
headbang.gif



Anywy this from the Escapist:

Argue all you want about DRM and the ethics of micro-transactions.
Just know that when the time comes for the Diablo III beta to kick off you're going to have way fewer people to preach to. Just like me they'll all be sucked in.
 
Daggah said:
Bullshit. How does online-only make the game better?

Remove head from ass and try to look at the big picture. The more we support games that do this kind of thing, the more often it's going to pop up. That's my concern, and why I am willing to try to make a point about being against this kind of anti-consumer practice.

If I'm going to be renting the damn game, then the price needs to reflect that.
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I share your point of view. Like I said in the other thread, it's all about instant gratification these days and less about 'the big picture' -- to use your words. People will accept these kind of practices now, and in the future it will evolve into something even more restrictive.

In that sense I choose to vote with my wallet and not support games using constant connection DRMs, be it Ubisoft or Blizzard, therefore not buying any games using it. I have never broken this rule.
 
Daggah said:
Exactly. The more we see stuff like this pop up in our games, the more we need to say, "Hey, wait a minute, this is not acceptable. This is an anti-consumer business practice." How much are we willing to tolerate before it becomes acceptable?
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I'm right there with you on this. I expect certian things from my games and I know that buying into practices like this will only encourage them more. Personally, I'd rather not see my favorite pasttime and hobby head this direction.

It's unfortunate that the ones willing to stand up for their beliefs are in the minority, I guess we'll see how many others join us once they feel that the games they're interested in have headed far enough in an undesirable direction. It'll be interesting to see how fast people switch sides when something they care about is being eroded away. Of course, there will always be the people that knowingly (and unknowingly) buy into the slop anyway...
 
FrozenLiquidity said:
I'm right there with you on this. I expect certian things from my games and I know that buying into practices like this will only encourage them more. Personally, I'd rather not see my favorite pasttime and hobby head this direction.

It's unfortunate that the ones willing to stand up for their beliefs are in the minority, I guess we'll see how many others join us once they feel that the games they're interested in have headed far enough in an undesirable direction. It'll be interesting to see how fast people switch sides when something they care about is being eroded away. Of course, there will always be the people that knowingly (and unknowingly) buy into the slop anyway...
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Even if every single member of [H] stood up and boycotted, we are only 150k people, not enough to make enough of a dent in a game that will sell millions.

We would need at least a million or 2 like minded people to make a sizeable impact.

And before you state it, YES, I am aware of how much money 150,000 x $60 is, 9 million dollars, but that's still a drop in the bucket for them.
 
Playing a game purely for finding finding items (teh phat lutes, heh) just isn't fun anymore.

It sounds like Diablo3 will be focused on dangling the bigger carrot in front of you. Once you get that, there will be an even bigger carrot to chase ad infinitum. It's addiction disguised as fun, though not necessarily real fun if that's all the game will deliver on.

I'm patient enough to wait to see if Blizzard will change things for the better, long after release (like removing some of those DRM restrictions). Until then, there just isn't enough draw. I'd be more worried about breaking my principles if Skyrim went always online. D3 is on the backburner for probably a few years.
 
Daggah said:
Riiight, because only developers can have opinions.

Remove head from ass, troll.
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I'm not trolling. I just think it's funny how people choose to pick these game development companies apart with limited ideas as to why they do what they do.

More power to all of you though...a good game is a good game...you can bitch your way out of enjoying anything in life if you try hard enough.
 
I won't lie, i DO want to play Diablo 3 at some point, you can't really call yourself a gamer and deny that, but at the same time, I do not want to support business practices that are detrimental to the overall big picture of gaming, specifically, PC gaming.

You've all heard me rail time and time again against the effect that consolitis has had on our favorite platform, the PC, so no need to rehash that old fable again.
 
erf said:
More power to all of you though...a good game is a good game regardless of whether it's good for PC gamers in the long run or not,...you can rationalize your reason for bending over for anything if you try hard enough . . . ...
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Fixed.

Truthfully, I'm sure NOBODY wants to miss out on a good game, but some of the business practices associated with those "good games" are not something we WANT to buy into.

THAT is the crux of the problem.

I feel like those of us in the minority are members of the Night Watch from the Song of Fire and Ice series in a way.

Here's the pledge of the Night Watch

Night gathers, and now my watch begins. It shall not end until my death. I shall take no wife, hold no lands, father no children. I shall wear no crowns and win no glory. I shall live and die at my post. I am the sword in the darkness. I am the watcher on the walls. I am the fire that burns against the cold, the light that brings the dawn, the horn that wakes the sleepers, the shield that guards the realms of men. I pledge my life and honor to the Night's Watch, for this night and all the nights to come.



Winter is coming.
 
I don't know why the hell you guys equate sodomy with just wanting to play a videogame.

They're videogames.
 
Fail said:
Fixed.

Truthfully, I'm sure NOBODY wants to miss out on a good game, but some of the business practices associated with those "good games" are not something we WANT to buy into.

THAT is the crux of the problem.

I feel like those of us in the minority are members of the Night Watch from the Song of Fire and Ice series in a way.

Here's the pledge of the Night Watch

Night gathers, and now my watch begins. It shall not end until my death. I shall take no wife, hold no lands, father no children. I shall wear no crowns and win no glory. I shall live and die at my post. I am the sword in the darkness. I am the watcher on the walls. I am the fire that burns against the cold, the light that brings the dawn, the horn that wakes the sleepers, the shield that guards the realms of men. I pledge my life and honor to the Night's Watch, for this night and all the nights to come.



Winter is coming.
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So you're basically playing Devil's advocate when it comes to the ideology behind the business/consumer relationship. Blizzard is only looking out for themselves. Can you blame them?

There is nothing I have seen when reading about what Blizzard is doing that would even come close to keep me from buying the game. I guess I could join this pact to defend the "consumer"...nah, I'll just understand why they're doing what they're doing and enjoy what will probably be a stellar game.

I remember I had reservations about using Steam when I realized that I would always have to have an internet connection...I got over it, started downloading games and am now a complete fan of their service.

The rationale behind what people like you think is admittedly a rationale that probably needs to exist, but accepting change is always going to be a part of living in a society that has become dominated by technology and greed...these two facets of life aren't going anywhere anytime soon.
 
AceCR42 said:
I don't know why the hell you guys equate sodomy with just wanting to play a videogame.

They're videogames.
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I don't know how the hell you guys buy games with all kinds of restrictive DRM and with features left out that have been standard for years, when all we really want is just to play a video game without all the hassles.
 
Maybe if people realized that issues which concern themselves to a certain degree may not concern others to the same degree there would be more understanding.

Everyone should feel free to weigh the merits and drawbacks of a game and decide for themselves whether to purchase it or not. Just because not everyone else might share your views, it does not mean the end of the world or that they are sheep.
 
AceCR42 said:
I don't know why the hell you guys equate sodomy with just wanting to play a videogame.

They're videogames.
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If they came free, then we shouldn't be complaining. But sometimes dollars are better spent elsewhere or saved for something else coming up. Activision knows that its business, and they will do their best to make business go the way they prefer it. Customers hopefully will try to balance business in their favor as well.
 
Fail said:
I don't know how the hell you guys buy games with all kinds of restrictive DRM and with features left out that have been standard for years, when all we really want is just to play a video game without all the hassles.
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Pretty soon you're either going to be developing your own games or playing no games at all. Is it so hard to understand that times are changing and that PC gaming as we know it will never be what it was 5, 10, or even 15 years ago?
 
erf said:
Pretty soon you're either going to be developing your own games or playing no games at all. Is it so hard to understand that times are changing and that PC gaming as we know it will never be what it was 5, 10, or even 15 years ago?
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You're saying we should go along with bad changes rather than rail against it, that works both ways man. If you support restrictive DRM, triple dip microtransactions, lack of Eyefinity support, $60 price tag, lack of LAN functionality, and God knows what else, then playa on, playa on.

Also, gaming wouldn't be the same whether these changes existed or not, gaming is always evolving, but we should speak out AGAINST the bad changes, otherwise they will become the norm, and we will all suffer for it.

Look, you're free to do whatever you like, nobody for or against these changes are saying otherwise, but we WILL have our say.

We already know going in that we're like the 300 Spartans vs the 1 million Persians.
 
Take note of one thing, the whole premise of "vote with your wallet" works both ways. If you support the further erosion of PC gaming, please continue to vote with your wallet by purchasing games with onerous DRM schemes, keep buying games piecemeal in the form of Day 1 DLC, purchase games off EA's Origin service in order to further decentralize gaming by having all gamers have 17 different DD platform services open in their tray, continue to buy Generic FPS #140727402 whether it's called Call of Duty 92 or Battlefield 104, don't forget to buy all the consolized ports that are sent our way, table scraps.

Oh, and don't purchase any indie games, Lord knows we don't want no stinkin indie games on our PCs. Last, but not least, don't support game developers who do shit right.
 
Of course I'm going to buy. It's an online game that requires an internet connection, oh noez...
 
I'll play it because I'm not a whiny bitch and it looks badass.

OMG GOTTA USE INTERNETS
 
Fail said:
You're saying we should go along with bad changes rather than rail against it, that works both ways man. If you support restrictive DRM, triple dip microtransactions, lack of Eyefinity support, $60 price tag, lack of LAN functionality, and God knows what else, then playa on, playa on.

Also, gaming wouldn't be the same whether these changes existed or not, gaming is always evolving, but we should speak out AGAINST the bad changes, otherwise they will become the norm, and we will all suffer for it.

Look, you're free to do whatever you like, nobody for or against these changes are saying otherwise, but we WILL have our say.

We already know going in that we're like the 300 Spartans vs the 1 million Persians.
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You should just copy that first small paragraph and paste it into 75% of the gaming threads on this forum, because that is seriously all people are bitching about in many new gaming threads.

Personally I like the always-online DRM. This should mean that Blizzard has tabs on every piece of loot in the game, and can crack down on people trying to dupe and exploit much easier.

I think the micro transactions are great because I would rather spend $1.50 then farm a dungeon for hours trying to get one piece of gear to fill a hole on my character. Are some of you guys totally fucking poor to the point where you will hate on a game where people using an OPTIONAL microtransaction system will shit on your fun?

$60 price tag is nothing new. I paid $55 for Half Life 2 in 2004. 7 years later and the price of a AAA game went up $5?!? THE HORROR! Diablo 2 may have been over $50 as well, but I know it was at least $50 and that was 11 years ago. Seriously I with I still had my Diablo 2 box, because I think it was $60.

I have an Eyefinity setup, and I don't bitch when games don't support it because I know I am in a niche of a niche market.

And seriously people are still bitching about LAN support? It's not going to come back for most titles, you will need to get over it.
 
Blizzard games have ALWAYS been $60. I can't believe people are still bitching about that.

I have an Eyefinity setup, and I don't bitch when games don't support it because I know I am in a niche of a niche market.
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Thank god, I was beginning to think all Eyefinity users were entitled babies.
 
I am not happy with a lot of the decisions they have made with the new one. I am still buying it though because I am a fan of the series. I have decided that Im probably not going to use any of the new services they provide i.e. auction houses, they have no place in Diablo IMO.
 
I for one will most likely buy Diablo 3. I had a good time playing Diablo 2 and I cannot see this one not being better. As long as they stay away from the cookie cutter WoW builds for the classes.
 
What are the "actions" that Blizzard is taking, other than having to be online to play, that are bothering some people?
 
I'm buying it. Not ashamed of it either , Blizzard games have always been quality in my personal opinion. I may not agree with there overall platform ideas but I've yet to play a Blizzard game and declared "this just sucks..".

When a game sucks , it just sucks. The only real disappointment I've had so far with Diablo 3 is the complete lack of it being tailored for in any way for competitive gaming. I don't really understand why Blizzard simply has no interest in that for Diablo 3. Its been in development for 10 years its not as if there wasn't enough time to figure out a way. Warcraft RTS games , Starcraft and WoW all have or had a large competitive community behind them that always makes for more interesting content and play styles. I'm not personally a hugely competitive gamer but enjoy the content it generates. Also the complete lack of possible mods is a bummer but I don't require that option in a game in order to buy it.

I doubt that Torchlight 2 will make a good alternative choice (however I'm sure it'll be a good game on its own merits) , Diablo 3 just looks so fun.
 
The only reason I may buy Diablo 3 is due to me being able to recoup the costs by selling items/characters. Other then that, fuck Acti/Bliz.
 
Slachtbeest said:
1) Yes, you will stand by your word and absolutely not be buying Diablo 3.
2) No, you will probably end-up caving in the end and going against all the ranting you did on these boards.
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3) You never ranted against Diablo 3 and will make up your mind about it after playing it. After all, it's just video game, for Christ sakes. Go get upset and take a stand on something that actually matters. :rolleyes:

I'll go with number 3.
 
Mr. Wolf said:
3) You never ranted against Diablo 3 and will make up your mind about it after playing it. After all, it's just video game, for Christ sakes. Go get upset and take a stand on something that actually matters. :rolleyes:

I'll go with number 3.
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I already addressed this attitude. Why does it keep getting trotted out again and again? Just because I have an opinion on this and I am willing to voice it in a subforum related to this topic doesn't mean I value this as more important than world hunger or orphans. I think the only reason this whole "go get upset about something that ACTUALLY matters" argument even gets brought up is when people have nothing else useful to say, so they think they can belittle one side by acting like a jackass.

Which is what you've done.

So if you have nothing useful to add..
 
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ocellaris said:
Personally I like the always-online DRM. This should mean that Blizzard has tabs on every piece of loot in the game, and can crack down on people trying to dupe and exploit much easier.
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Yep, alot of people may not be aware of this because they don't play WoW or other online-only games out there. Requiring internet isn't just about protecting the use of their game, but it's literally integral to how item generation and tracking will function. I have yet to hear about large-scale corruption of the WoW economy due to duping.

Botting/Chinese farming on the other hand is a constant worry for me and affects everyone. I don't think anything can be done to nullify it and the most effective options will probably cost absurd amounts of money (active monitoring with real people).

I have yet to see a red flag that will tell me not to buy D3. The always online thing has been with me since I started WoW 5-6 years ago and its totally a non-issue even in SC2. The RLM AH made me a little uncomfortable in first 1-2 minutes of reading about it but now I find it more exciting.
 
I'm buying it because I love Diablo, and I don't give a shit about the AH. Considering how seedy the banking industry is, Blizzard doing something like this isn't even a blip on the radar of bad business practices. You really want to have convictions? Move your money to a local bank, quit buying Nike. We inevitably support crude and cruel business practices, but yet gamers hop on their high horse over a video game company doing something that they may not agree with. It's picking and choosing which evil you decide to pay attention to, our convictions for products are inevitably hypocritical.
 
erf said:
I'm not trolling. I just think it's funny how people choose to pick these game development companies apart with limited ideas as to why they do what they do.

More power to all of you though...a good game is a good game...you can bitch your way out of enjoying anything in life if you try hard enough.
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I know why they do what they do. Media companies nowadays (and I'm including Blizzard here) have adopted prima donna attitudes and collectively decided that their shit doesn't stink, and that piracy is best fought by punishing and hassling their legitimate customers. Open your eyes, man. Anti-consumer DRM practices don't do anything to stop piracy. It only needs to be cracked or worked around once and then all anyone has to do is create a .torrent. In the end, with stuff like this, the only ones enduring any kind of hassle are the legitimate consumers.

I see a world where my fair use rights aren't eroded to shit, where I *legally* buy my media (books, movies, music, video games, TV shows, what have you) and then subsequently can legally use it the way I want for my own personal consumption and use. I believe that when I buy a movie, I have the right to choose whether I want to watch it on my big TV at home, my mobile phone on the go, or my tablet on a plane. I believe that when I buy a music album, I have the same right to listen to it through my stereo, in my car, or through my music player while working out. I believe these are all reasonable expectations on my part as a consumer legally purchasing media, and I challenge ANYONE here to explain to me why I am wrong here.

Similarly, when I buy a computer game, I expect to be able to play it whether I'm at home or on the road. I expect to be able to play it even after the company that made it decides it's no longer worth their money to support the activation server or authentication server, should I choose to play it for that long. I expect to be able to play it in my off time in a deployed location (I've personally deployed 3 times already in my USAF career, and expect to deploy again before I get out.) Once again, these are all reasonable expectations on my part as a legitimate customer.

I will not apologize to anyone here for being adamant about my fair use rights as a consumer. I am not a pirate. I am not looking to steal this content. I am against measures taken by media corporations to hassle me for my hobby. I am against copyright law being wielded as a weapon to protect profits instead of content.
 
Daggah said:
I already addressed this attitude. Why does it keep getting trotted out again and again? Just because I have an opinion on this and I am willing to voice it in a subforum related to this topic doesn't mean I value this as more important than world hunger or orphans. I think the only reason this whole "go get upset about something that ACTUALLY matters" argument even gets brought up is when people have nothing else useful to say, so they think they can belittle one side by acting like a jackass.

Which is what you've done.

So if you have nothing useful to add...how about go fuck yourself?
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I was addressing a statement made by the OP, not anything stupid you had written. However, you've proven remarkably adept at writing stupid things so I look forward to commenting on the stupid things you'll write in the future.
 
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For those who are taking issue with the persistent online access, would you still have an issue with this if Diablo 3 were marketed and presented as a purely multiplayer game? Do consider this to also be an issue with more traditional MMOs, such as WoW? Do you consider this to be an issue with Guild Wars, and likely the upcoming Guild Wars 2?
 
Fail said:
Not when it costs $60 and is one of the biggest games to come out in gaming history.

If you're a consumer and you don't like a product, why would you ever stand there and not do nothing? You NEED to be heard and speak loudly by voting with your wallet and participating in forums such as this to see if others share your views.

That's called being an informed consumer.
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Do people actually think that a few ranters on a message board means anything if they don't buy a game like Diablo 3? Another great example would be the CoD series. Even if every single ranter on every single message board ended up not buying the game, I doubt these titles or the companies would even notice the impact, especially not enough to change anything.

Not to mention, most of the people who rant/rave on message boards are doing it either to troll or as a means to let off some steam. After a little bit of time the anger fades and people buy the game anyways.
 
Wizardhawk said:
Do people actually think that a few ranters on a message board means anything if they don't buy a game like Diablo 3? Another great example would be the CoD series. Even if every single ranter on every single message board ended up not buying the game, I doubt these titles or the companies would even notice the impact, especially not enough to change anything.

Not to mention, most of the people who rant/rave on message boards are doing it either to troll or as a means to let off some steam. After a little bit of time the anger fades and people buy the game anyways.
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You would be wrong

I have not bought a Call of Duddy game since CoD 4.

Plus, it's funny how you label people with a contrary opinion a troll, that's just wrong.

I'm remarkably consistent with my beliefs, nobody can legitimately call me a troll.
 
I've been watching this soap-opera of a thread all day, and it has been fantastic.

Props to those of you defending your belief's/honor/firstborn or whatever the hell your rally cry is.

I'll certainly be purchasing Diablo 3, likely day one. Others have already made most of the arguments I've agreed with. This is 2011, my desktop doesn't move much. It's tough moving an eyefinity setup anywhere (and I'm not even offended that they are choosing not to support eyefinity), and my internet is "always on," but in the case that it is not, I can find something else to do with my time. Furthermore, sixty dollars is a bargain in my eyes. I know I'll get more than three or four hours of gameplay out of it, and that easily pays for itself in the dollars/hour sense. Not to mention I'll be able to co-op with my close friends, from the comfort of our own desks.

Anyway, that's my outlook. Sorry for "bending over and taking it" when in fact I appreciate the decisions the company has made, because I see how those changes benefit ME as a gamer.
 
Boycotted MW2 onwards, and if you check my Steam games list, you won't find a Call of Duty title there.

Boycotted Starcraft 2, you'll only find WC3 in my Blizzard account profile. Diablo 3 is still a wait and see, may likely pass it for Torchlight 2 if Runic gets the game addictive enough. The online only mode isn't an issue since I would most likely be playing it MP, but if they sell the game at the same price as SC2 in this corner of the world (250 MYR, which would now be an ridiculous 85 USD), Craptivision and Blizzard can go F themselves.
 
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Fail said:
You would be wrong

I have not bought a Call of Duddy game since CoD 4.

Plus, it's funny how you label people with a contrary opinion a troll, that's just wrong.

I'm remarkably consistent with my beliefs, nobody can legitimately call me a troll.
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I wasn't labeling anyone with an opinion a troll, and I wasn't trying to say you specifically were a troll (or anyone else in this thread). I said that most people are either trolls or simply doing it as a means of letting off some steam. Do you seriously believe that message boards (even this one) don't have trolls? Do you think that some of the people who rant about something aren't just temporarily angry about it, or even something else?

And that's exactly my point, you haven't bought a CoD game since CoD 4, and i'm sure there are a bunch of others too. I personally won't buy another one after Black Ops due to the disaster that PC multiplayer was for weeks after it came out. I'm not foolish enough to think that the next CoD game that comes out won't sell millions of copies regardless.
 
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