AMD Radeon HD 6870 & HD 6850 Video Card Review @ [H]

It wasn't quite twice as fast and cost heaps more than the 4870 did at release. I'm not denying performance hasn't improved, price/performance hasn't improved all that much. The 6850 and 6870 are around what the 5850 and 5870 should have cost in the first place.

Heaps more? I paid $360 for my 5870, and I paid $299 for my 4870.

So you are trying to tell me $60 is heaps more, and not worth double the performance?

And yes the 5870 is switch as fast as 1 4870, cause the 5870 was beating/match a 4870x2 in benchmarks.
 
Explain how a 470 GTX is more future proof?

It has a very flexible and advanced compute engine - fermi was already far ahead of the 5 series in this department, and with the loss of compute power the 6 series is a step backwards. If a game comes out that requires it via more complex shaders the 470 won't struggle. It also has a much better tesselator that performs smoothly whatever the tessellation factor (if fermi is good across the board, the 6 series is basically ok with a tessellation factor of 8, and poor at all the higher settings).

The fermi design is more general and hence more adaptable to whatever comes in the future.

The 6 series is more focused and hence less flexible.
 
It has a very flexible and advanced compute engine - fermi was already far ahead of the 5 series in this department, and with the loss of compute power the 6 series is a step backwards. If a game comes out that requires it via more complex shaders the 470 won't struggle. It also has a much better tesselator that performs smoothly whatever the tessellation factor (if fermi is good across the board, the 6 series is basically ok with a tessellation factor of 8, and poor at all the higher settings).

The fermi design is more general and hence more adaptable to whatever comes in the future.

The 6 series is more focused and hence less flexible.

Basically everything you just said does not make it more future-proof over a 6870.

the 6870 has HDMI 1.4a the 470 GTX does not, the 6870 can run 6 monitors on 1 card, the 470 GTX cannot. The 6870 can play Blu-ray 3D movies, the 470 GTX cannot.

So again explain the REAL reason you think the 470 gtx is more futureproof?
 
So again explain the REAL reason you think the 470 gtx is more futureproof?

Because its soon winter and we all know the 470 is hot. As a bonus, should you miss the sound of a blizzard, you can always put your ear against the computer. :D

Give it up, sbuckler is doing damage control for Nvidia. :p
 
Because its soon winter and we all know the 470 is hot. As a bonus, should you miss the sound of a blizzard, you can always put your ear against the computer. :D

Give it up, sbuckler is doing damage control for Nvidia. :p

O I know, I just think him saying the 470 GTX is more future-proof over a 6870 makes him look that much more stupid.

Look at the difference's.....And he's going to try to say the 470 is more futureproof when the CLEAR cut evidence shows the 6870 is very much future proof lol.
 
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It has a very flexible and advanced compute engine - fermi was already far ahead of the 5 series in this department, and with the loss of compute power the 6 series is a step backwards. If a game comes out that requires it via more complex shaders the 470 won't struggle. It also has a much better tesselator that performs smoothly whatever the tessellation factor (if fermi is good across the board, the 6 series is basically ok with a tessellation factor of 8, and poor at all the higher settings).

The fermi design is more general and hence more adaptable to whatever comes in the future.

The 6 series is more focused and hence less flexible.

heck, 470 can't even play Metro 2033 smoothly.

future proof? the design is, but the card isn't...

or you mean.. use it as a heater :confused:.. which I am doing it now .... :D

PS: heck with these people stay up so late...
 
heck, 470 can't even play Metro 2033 smoothly.

future proof? the design is, but the card isn't...

or you mean.. use it as a heater :confused:.. which I am doing it now .... :D

PS: heck with these people stay up so late...

I work nightshift 8:30pm to 7am. This is why I always post at night.

hey at least I make $4 more an hour for nightshifts :)
 
I think the real story here is the price points these cards are released at. A 6870 costs less than a 5850 and offers better performance and new features. FINALLY, we're seeing some real cut-throat price wars that we've been missing for the past 12 months.

For those who have been painfully holding out on upgrading their 8800GT's or whatever, today is a GREAT day! For everyone else already running a 5870/5850/470 today is just an information day.

I'm going to hold onto my 5870 and probably upgrade to a 6990 later this year. And get a nice HPZR30w to make good use of the card. :D
 
LOL, none of them are future proof the 7800 or 7900s will be out and the 6800s will be underpower? same for nvidia side. 580s or 680s what ever is going to be is going to be the same.

From my experience of an entire computer rig, the vcards are the first ones that lose or there is a new shit out on the market. so to be honest future proof all of them are unless there is new products outside, is all about the hype because 6870 do not give you more or less than a 5870 few FPS perhaps, but is not going to change your gaming experience what so ever. (unless drivers really improve)

New technologies will come out, like eyefinity, or 3d, but you have to adopt the complete package in order to get the hole new experience otherwise is just bla bla bla saying that a vcards is going to be future proof at this point, cause is all about the new stuff that is on the market not the old stuff.

Everything is future proof, will it give you the same experience than the newest of the newest

Dont think so.
 
Basically everything you just said does not make it more future-proof over a 6870.

the 6870 has HDMI 1.4a the 470 GTX does not, the 6870 can run 6 monitors on 1 card, the 470 GTX cannot. The 6870 can play Blu-ray 3D movies, the 470 GTX cannot.

So again explain the REAL reason you think the 470 gtx is more futureproof?

Next gen games aren't going to require HDMI 1.4a or 6 monitors?
 
WOW 179 and 239?.....The 6850 just became the new card to buy.
Those are launch prices too. Wait a month and unless TSMC has more issues I bet you'll see the 6850/70 for ~$150/209. Solid bang for the buck.

Personally still rocking 2x 4890's. Have to wait and see until the 6970/5/whatever comes out (price is a big factor, what I've currently got runs almost everything around 60fps @ 1920x1080 with FSAA and such on) before I consider upgrading.
 
Some of you are pretty funny in the fact that you can't get your head around that this is a MAINSTEAM GPU launch. High end will come next.
 
Those are launch prices too. Wait a month and unless TSMC has more issues I bet you'll see the 6850/70 for ~$150/209. Solid bang for the buck.

I very much agree keeping in mind the potential TSMC issue, though its been stated that they will be abundantly available. I picked mine up today, as I would rather pay a little more and get one, than having to wait until the exact brand I want becomes available again.

I think the real story here is the price points these cards are released at. A 6870 costs less than a 5850 and offers better performance and new features. FINALLY, we're seeing some real cut-throat price wars that we've been missing for the past 12 months.

Couldnt agree more. This is exactly the essense of the story along with the abundance of features that is offered at this price point.

LOL, none of them are future proof the 7800 or 7900s will be out and the 6800s will be underpower? same for nvidia side. 580s or 680s what ever is going to be is going to be the same.

If I understand you correctly, I totally agree. The whole concept of futureproof is rather silly in this context. The 28 nm is due in 2011 and will be another good performance improvement.

The 470s average advantage over the 6870 @ 1920x in DX11 is 1.5%. It increases to 7% @ 2560x.

http://www.computerbase.de/artikel/...6850/23/#abschnitt_performancerating_nach_api

It's below the 6870 in DX9 and 10 @ the same res.

People interested in Crossfire really ought to look at the scaling 6870s are putting out in; BC2, FC2, Crysis, AvP and Battle Forge.

Thanks for linkage and ifno. Intersting stuff. More impressiveness from the 6870 :D

Tbh it's all a bit meh! Some things I like - the power usage, the price, which has caused a price war is good. Some things I hate - the name - even nvidia has never brought out a card with the same badge but a generation up that is slower. 6870 my ass - it's a 6770.

Still the price war is great - no ones forcing you to buy one of these - the GTX 470 for example is a much more future proof design and has just got cheap.

Cant relate to these opions at all. "meh". Really? Come on reread the reviews, look at what features and performance you get at such a good first day price point.

Its pretty hilarious that you care so much about a name, but hey I guess this is an important deal for you, funny focus to have :rolleyes:
 
4890 to XXXX? I just have to get on the DX11 bandwagon. Is there finally a card under $300 worth upgrading to? I was under the impression the 5870 was the next logical step but I just refuse to spend $300+ for a video card and as of right now the 5870 is still $340+.
 
At my resolution (1600x900), these new cards bring nothing noticeable to the table over my dirt-cheap, OC'd 460. Glad I bought something weeks ago instead of playing the waiting game. GLTA. Now bring on Cayman. Hopefully it wakes me up from the mainstream malaise the 4850 started in me.
 
4890 to XXXX? I just have to get on the DX11 bandwagon. Is there finally a card under $300 worth upgrading to? I was under the impression the 5870 was the next logical step but I just refuse to spend $300+ for a video card and as of right now the 5870 is still $340+.
Look at how your current card runs the games you play at the moment and the ones you plan to buy to act as a guide stick to decide when upgrading. DX11 is cool but pointless unless you use it. Sure, there are DX11 games out now, but none seem to really push DX11 much so the differences are more subtle over DX10 games, doesn't seem worth it for that alone to me.

Obviously that will change with time, but so will the cards and the prices for them. If the "gotta have it" DX11 game comes out late next year you'll have the 78xx cards and 6xx series cards to choose from and they'll probably run DX11 stuff a whole lot faster than the 5xxx or 6xxx cards so you'd get more bang for your buck.

If what you've currently got is fast enough hold off. If nothing else you'll get 68xx card or 470/460/whatever for less by waiting a bit.
 
AMD has given nvidia a taste of its own medicine.

It seems like yesterday when we praised the 460 for giving us great performance at a great price. It forced AMD to lower its 5830 and 5850 prices. and even made them fix crossfire performance.

It was clearly the card to get.

Until today.

The 6850 blows the 4601gb at a lower price, lower power and less heat.

Its kind of ironic that AMD used the same "less is more" approach as nvidia did with the 460. The GF104 is a cost reduced and optimized version of the GF100, but AMD did better at cost reducing and optimizing for BARTS.

The results pretty much speak for themselves. Almost 5870 performance for less then 5830 price.

The king is dead, long life to the new King.
 
Glad I waited on picking up a Radeon HD 5850. Upgrading from a 8800 GT so I should see good enough performance gains. Not expecting a big increase because of my processor since I'm waiting on Sandy Bridge though.

Can't wait for the beginning of next year to finish off my new rig.
 
Great review but I will have to wait it out longer. They seem to perform well but not well enough for me to move from my GTX 470. I am eagerly waiting to see what the HD 69XX cards can do.
 
So being that the 6850 is $60 cheaper in some cases and being close in performance, what advantages would the 6870 offer over a slightly overclocked 6850? Other then possibly running cooler.
 
Remember that the 5850s price point was $399.00 at one point. At least it was here in Canada. By comparison, the 6870s price point is $240. So yes, the performance is quite similar but same performance at 60% the cost is impressive and possibly gold star worthy.

Its like if Hyundai put out a BMW quality car with all the features/performance of the BMW plus a few new features(better UVD/HD3D, HDMI 1.4a, etc) for the cost of the current elantra instead of the cost of a entry model BMW.

True, and the 460GTX launched a lot higher price then $150 but [H] doesn't review off of Launch price, they review based on current price. They want you to get the most for the amount you are wanting to spend. They always have, always will I'm sure.


That's because the 5850 came down in price due to the performance of the 6870. The 6870 drove down the 5850s price to what its currently sitting at. If you had tried to buy it a month ago, you'd find another $100 dollars on the 5850 price.

Actually no, it's been floating around $200 with MIR/CB to $250 without for a few months now, Granted they were "Deals" but still they were there.

I think the name thing is at work here (thanks AMD, good job). this is now AMD MIDRANGE cards. the 6800 are taking the place of the 5700 in this generation. if you think in this in terms of the new 6700 matching the 5800 it makes sense. so its actually a hell of a card.

and yes, you can excepted lots of deals on the 5850 / 5870 coming down the line. they have to clear out the older inventory. I would not be the least supposed to see the 5850 retail for less then the 6850 at some point. (thinking rebates here) Out with the old in with the new.

It maybe that this is a Midrange card, but you can call it whatever you want, it's still comes down to price and performances. See above about 5850 pricing. I can provide links if you wish for previous deals I've seen if needed.


really.. not gold?

hmm lets see

6870:
HDMI 1.4 support for 3D blu-ray playback
native 4 display eyefinity
6w less power usage at full load 5w less at idle.. do the math..
6wx24x365 = 52,560w less power used if the card was at full load 24/7
5wx24x365 = 43800w less power used if the card sat idle 24/7 compare that to what you pay in your electricity bill then you will see the big picture..
higher resolution and AA support
priced to compete from day 1

5850
no 3d bluray playback support
no native 4 display eyefinity
uses more power under load..
uses more power under idle
runs lower res/AA
and was never priced to compete even a year later thanks to price gouging e-tailers and B&M stores..


so please tell me where it doesnt deserve the gold status?

3D Blu-Ray support is a whole other arguement by itself which is not worth discussing in a review about gaming performance.

really... are you arguing 6w as being gold worthy?

Native 4 Display Eyefinity does not make sense to me, I've got 3x24" at the house right now and love it, so I'm not argueing against Eyefinity, but 4 screens does nothing for gaming unless you're able to take that 4th screen out of the group and make a 3x1 + 1 setup. Then I could see a great gift from God in that. I miss having a spare screen, but not enough to turn off my 3x1 setup.

As far as price gouging 8months ago goes, take that up with Fermi. Again, I'm not talking about launch prices, I'm talking about current/recent prices.
 
Morph AA alone might make me consider upgrading to a 68xx or 69xx flavor from my 5850. I don't really need the extra performance but the ability to banish ALL jaggies once and for all would be absolutely fantastic. Very much look forward to [H] testing of this feature.
 
My question for the HardOCP staff is, and im sure there are time constraints for why its not covered, how well does eyefinity perform compared to the previous generation? I LOVE eyefinity, whether full screen BFBC2 across 3 monitors or running multiple MMO clients, it was an absolute game changer...for the entusiast.

Problem is, maxed out the bfbc2 struggles a bit at eyefinity resolution. Has the scaling improved between CF'ed cards? Should we anticipate 2gb+ vram on the higher end products? Or, because of NDAs, will all my wishes come true?
 
MorphAA, Eyefinity, GTX 470, CrossFireX.......RomeOCP was not built in a day gentlemen. ;) We would rather do it right than fast.
 
Just waiting for some Crossfire tests by the [H] now. I can easily see a pair of 6870s replacing my 4870s so I can move to an Eyefinity setup. :D
 
Brent has got the day off. We will be doing a quickie 470 vs 6870 follow-up so you guys have a solid basis for gameplay and purchasing. Then we will likely do a tech piece on MorphAA....CFX after that possibly then Eyefinity.
 
It's looking like my best bet will be to wait for the 69xx series to power my eyefinity setup. Was planning to go with two GTX 460's with the price drop but I think I can hold out with my aging 4870's for a couple more months. A single 69xx card should run triple screens fine and I always have the option to crossfire down the road for even more performance. :cool:
 
I know I'm stepping into the lions den here, but...

son, I am disappoint.

what's the fuss about? The only great thing seems to be morphAA. The 6870 is closer to the 5850 in most tests apples to apples, costs about the same, uses almost the same amount of power as the 5850, and runs at similar temperatures. I know these chips are making way for the 69 series, but right now it seems like it's a waste of time...

What I'm trying to say is, I have a GTX260 and would LOVE to upgrade my video card. I was holding out for these, but it seems like at ~200, the 5850 is still the best deal unless morphAA is only on the 6 series.
 
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I know I'm stepping into the lions den here, but...

son, I am disappoint.

what's the fuss about? The only great thing seems to be morphAA. The 6870 is closer to the 5850 in most tests, costs about the same, uses almost the same amount of power as the 5850, and runs at similar temperatures. I know these chips are making way for the 69 series, but right now it seems like it's a waste of time...


Well, the 6870 beats the 5850 in CFX (substantially in some cases), is still cheaper, 5-6% faster; has the potential to be cooler and quieter as more models appear, and it also has the potential to be a better O'C.

http://www.techpowerup.com/reviews/HIS/Radeon_HD_6870/32.html
 
b1m2x3 said:
What I'm trying to say is, I have a GTX260 and would LOVE to upgrade my video card. I was holding out for these, but it seems like at ~200, the 5850 is still the best deal unless morphAA is only on the 6 series.

If you had a GTX260, you clearly shouldn't be expecting the Mainstream cards to meet your expectations for an upgrade. The 260 wasn't a mainstream card, it was enthusiast.

What AMD has done here is blur the line between mainstream and enthusiast because these cards now perform as well as previous-gen enthusiast (5850-level). For ~$200 these cards offer an amazing amount of performance, and lets face it, if thats your budget, its the best you'll be able to get.

Not sure why you think the 5850 is a better deal than the 6870, all signs point the other way. From what I've read, morphAA will only be on 6xxx.
 
You guys with GTX 460 cards: Your cards sucks now.

You should sell it quick on the FS\FT section. And cheaply.

Of course this has nothing to do with me wanting to SLI my 460 :D
 
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