Intel Reportedly to Receive Heavy EU Fine

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According to a number of published reports, the European Commission is set to levy a huge fine on Intel this week for anti-competitive practices.

The European Union is expected to approve action formally against Intel at its weekly meeting of commissioners on Wednesday, the Financial Times reports. Reports say the fine could top the more than 1 billion pounds ($1.52 billion) in combined fines that have been levied against Microsoft.
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lol.

EU must be running short on operting cash...


EU trolls posting in 3...2...1...
 
If the charges are true and they have evidence, good for them. With Microsoft, the charges always seemed nebulous and the evidence non-existent.
 
Yknow, I've heard of killing the golden goose.

Intel netted a good 250 million dollars Profit this quarter. The EU's fucking dumb if this is true.
 
Arcygenical said:
Yknow, I've heard of killing the golden goose.

Intel netted a good 250 million dollars Profit this quarter. The EU's fucking dumb if this is true.
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How DARE they enfore the laws! It's not like Intel has already been found guilty of these exact crimes in other countries. :rolleyes::rolleyes:
 
Nemesis999 said:
How DARE they enfore the laws! It's not like Intel has already been found guilty of these exact crimes in other countries. :rolleyes::rolleyes:
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Touchy Touchy? It's like, the second someone says "EU" everyone gets all defensive. Nowhere did I say it was wrong of the EU to enforce their laws - nor did I say Intel was innocent of these charges.

The EU has every right to enforce their laws - and Intel has every right to stop selling products in the European Market, as I'm sure this 2 billion dollar fine is roughly approaching the net profits they earned over there in 2008 (which was only just under $6bn).
 
Arcygenical said:
Yknow, I've heard of killing the golden goose.

Intel netted a good 250 million dollars Profit this quarter. The EU's fucking dumb if this is true.
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So it doesn't matter how HONESTLY they make the money, only that they makes lots of it, right?
 
Nemesis999 said:
How DARE they enfore the laws! It's not like Intel has already been found guilty of these exact crimes in other countries. :rolleyes::rolleyes:
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Shoot the leg to spite the foot comes to mind.

They can enforce all they want, just like you as an individual can dig your own grave. Remember, you'd have to lay in it.
 
so... lets say i drink and drive.

i'm broke as hell, i got about 300$... if i get a 1000$ drinking and driving fine and tell htem... but i only made 300$ this quarter.. they tell you to f-off.

if you do illegal stuff, well you get punished even if you are a billionare that tries to snuff out competitors.

its just that us in america, we are pro-monopolies like we are commies... don't believe it... then try telling ATT and TW not to cap our isp service.... when they are cartelling into a oligopoly.
 
Nemesis999 said:
How DARE they enfore the laws! It's not like Intel has already been found guilty of these exact crimes in other countries. :rolleyes::rolleyes:
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Oh rubbish. The EU isn't after companies because they break the laws. They want a large share of the profit, nothing more.

Come back to me when the EU starts levying more reasonable fines and going after companies that doesn't have billions in their banks.

I don't think anyone's denying Intel's monopoly practice is shady. Hell, I'm an AMD fan and would love to see Intel put in it's place for all of the underhand deals they make with OEMs to keep AMD out of the market. The EU courts are no better than these businesses.
 
that may be true... but its better than the american do nothing support monopolies attitude.
 
Azhar said:
Oh rubbish. The EU isn't after companies because they break the laws. They want a large share of the profit, nothing more.
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Please, tell me, What the fuck is the point of a fine if it doesn't MORE then destroy the profits from the illegal practice? The funny part is that people also bitch every time the US gives a company a slap on the wrist for something like this.

Intel used illegal practices to maintain huge profits in a billion-dollar market over several years. This fine is perfectly reasonable, otherwise there is no reason not to continue breaking the law.
 
Nemesis999 said:
Please, tell me, What the fuck is the point of a fine if it doesn't MORE then destroy the profits from the illegal practice? The funny part is that people also bitch every time the US gives a company a slap on the wrist for something like this.

Intel used illegal practices to maintain huge profits in a billion-dollar market over several years. This fine is perfectly reasonable, otherwise there is no reason not to continue breaking the law.
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I agree with heavy fining, but dude we're talking $1.5 billion. BILLIONS of dollars. There's heavy fining, and there's EU being fucking ridiculous.
 
Ockie said:
Shoot the leg to spite the foot comes to mind.

They can enforce all they want, just like you as an individual can dig your own grave. Remember, you'd have to lay in it.
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I suppose you'd also think a $100,000 fine for a $10M fraud is acceptable too? The point of a punative fine is to PUNISH. If the fine doesn't exceed the profit of the crime then why bother to enforce your laws at all?

I'd like you to explain how this harms the EU whatsoever. Intel abused it's position to stifel competition and thereby innovation in both the short and long term.
 
Azhar said:
I agree with heavy fining, but dude we're talking $1.5 billion. BILLIONS of dollars. There's heavy fining, and there's EU being fucking ridiculous.
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So? That's roughly what they made in Q2 2007. A quater's profit for several years of illegal practices seems perfectly reasonable.
 
Nemesis999 said:
So? That's roughly what they made in Q2 2007. A quater's profit for several years of illegal practices seems perfectly reasonable.
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Oh sure. Reasonable for the EU courts to swim in wealth.
 
Azhar said:
Oh sure. Reasonable for the EU courts to swim in wealth.
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:rolleyes:

Thanks for proving my point. This has nothing to do with the fines, it has to do with your pregidous against anything not American. Intel made $30B+ in profits over the period in which they were breaking the law.
 
Nemesis999 said:
I suppose you'd also think a $100,000 fine for a $10M fraud is acceptable too? The point of a punative fine is to PUNISH. If the fine doesn't exceed the profit of the crime then why bother to enforce your laws at all?

I'd like you to explain how this harms the EU whatsoever. Intel abused it's position to stifel competition and thereby innovation in both the short and long term.
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Punitive isn't for punishment, it's a windfall judgment IMO, its a way to fine with unlimited boundaries only limited by the jury discretion. Why not levy economic damages if Intel's business has harmed the EU economic system for its anti competitiveness? Compensatory? Oh wait, those are limited...

Nemesis999 said:
:rolleyes:

Thanks for proving my point. This has nothing to do with the fines, it has to do with your pregidous against anything not American. Intel made $30B+ in profits over the period in which they were breaking the law.
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Kettle, say hi to Pot.

You are a EU troll and always have been one, so please do not go calling others centric.


No one said what intel has done is right, you euro's are so happy to fine the shit out of a company that has done nothing but advance you into the future. Suppose if Microsoft and Intel pulled all their business out of EU states tomorrow, the EU would pretty much turn the way of the Soviet Union. You would be all torching cars and burning down buildings.

There is a saying that you bite the hand that feeds you? And secondly, please do not tell us about anti-competitive practices... I'd like to throw Airbus and other EU biased favoritism all day long at you.
 
Can we see the real charges and evidence please? Selling at a loss isn't illegal. It may be underhanded, but not illegal. Retailers do it all the time, it's called a loss-leader.

Until they actually produces charges and evidence, I'm going to keep my original stance: this is just a protective measure to keep poor little precious AMD (who also happens to be a European company) safe and sound. Hey, that's how it works isn't it? When you can't compete, go buy some legislators. :rolleyes:
 
Arcygenical said:
The EU has every right to enforce their laws - and Intel has every right to stop selling products in the European Market, as I'm sure this 2 billion dollar fine is roughly approaching the net profits they earned over there in 2008 (which was only just under $6bn).
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I'm sure AMD would be elated.
 
Ockie said:
Kettle, say hi to Pot.

You are a EU troll and always have been one, so please do not go calling others centric.
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How DARE I don't massively bias my judgements towards the US. :rolleyes: My response is exactly what it would have been if it had been a Us court fining Intel. About damn time. I love how not biasing something towards the US makes me a troll. I really need to stop viewing comments of blocked users, all you ever do is spew idiotic bullshit.
No one said what intel has done is right, you euro's are so happy to fine the shit out of a company that has done nothing but advance you into the future.
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I'm a Euro? Last time I checked I had never set foot outside of North America. :rolleyes:

Definie "fining the shit out of". Your inability to comprehend scales is your own failure, not theirs. Had this been a $1,300 fine on a company that made $30,000 you wouldn't be bitching. This fine represents a couple percent of their profits they made and a fraction of a percent of their revenue.

Should we all just bend over and take it up the ass because they do something good in the short run? Let's just ignore the fact that their GOAL was to destroy their only competition and thereby allow them to jack up prices and slash research budgets. :rolleyes:


Suppose if Microsoft and Intel pulled all their business out of EU states tomorrow, the EU would pretty much turn the way of the Soviet Union. You would be all torching cars and burning down buildings.
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No... I'm pretty sure they'd just buy from Apple and AMD. Believe it or not, the copies of Windows and CPUs they already have will continue to operate for a long time.

There is a saying that you bite the hand that feeds you? And secondly, please do not tell us about anti-competitive practices...
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Ok, you're right. Let's just ignore the law because it puts a couple bucks in our pockets in the short run. Maybe we should just let all the ISPs make themselves a nice non-compete agreement so we can all pay $100/month for dialup and $50/GB for bandwidth. :rolleyes: If you like taking it up the ass that's your businesss, I prefer a competitive market.
 
Nemesis999 said:
I really need to stop viewing comments of blocked users, all you ever do is spew idiotic bullshit.
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Touche

Nemesis999 said:
Last time I checked I had never set foot outside of North America.
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Takes note.

Nemesis999 said:
Should we all just bend over and take it up the ass because they do something good in the short run? Let's just ignore the fact that their GOAL was to destroy their only competition and thereby allow them to jack up prices and slash research budgets. :rolleyes:
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Did I miss the memo or wasn't this more or less about under selling (aka: loss leader).

Nemesis999 said:
No... I'm pretty sure they'd just buy from Apple and AMD. Believe it or not, the copies of Windows and CPUs they already have will continue to operate for a long time.
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I find it interesting that you mention Apple when they use Intel CPU's. lol.

Nemesis999 said:
Ok, you're right. Let's just ignore the law because it puts a couple bucks in our pockets in the short run.
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It puts more money in the pockets with a fine, look at the numbers. This is where the gray area comes in.

Nemesis999 said:
Maybe we should just let all the ISPs make themselves a nice non-compete agreement so we can all pay $100/month for dialup and $50/GB for bandwidth.
[/quote

Actually, it was becuase of this action similar to above why we pay so much for connectivity today at home. Read up a little about the Bell breakup and how it did impact us.

Nemesis999 said:
If you like taking it up the ass that's your businesss, I prefer a competitive market.
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You prefer higher prices and companies to markup instead of selling at or below cost. I don't know about you, but I can't imagine anything getting more competitive when dealing below cost sales.
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If the collected fine monies were then handed over to the alleged victim, such actions might be deemed noble. Lacking that outcome, one wonders: where is justice? :confused:
 
Ockie said:
Did I miss the memo or wasn't this more or less about under selling (aka: loss leader).
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You missed the memo. The other things they were doing include paying retailers not to sell AMD products, charging OEMs more if they sold AMD products, and threatening to withhold the newest products from OEMs that purchased from AMD.

Besides, underselling while in a monopoly position is illegal in both the US and the EU. The laws are in place specifically to prevent what Intel was doing, using it's size to crush competition out of the marketplace.


I find it interesting that you mention Apple when they use Intel CPU's. lol.
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I promise you, if there was suddenly a market the size of the US that had no supplier Apple would very quickly begin selling AMD-based systems in it... Or just selling Intel based systems since Intel has no legal grounds to prevent them from just shipping systems from the US.

The reality is that Intel couldn't stop their CPUs from reaching their market even if they wanted. It's pretty easy for any American to stick a few hundred thousand CPUs in a cargo container and send them off to Europe. There is no possible way for Intel or Microsoft to simply leave a market, neither of their products are hard to move across borders.
It puts more money in the pockets with a fine, look at the numbers. This is where the gray area comes in.
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Of course it does. If Intel didn't make more profit following the law then they did breaking it then they would just pay the fine and keep breaking the law. That is the entire point of a fine.


Actually, it was becuase of this action similar to above why we pay so much for connectivity today at home. Read up a little about the Bell breakup and how it did impact us.
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If there is actually collusion then the US governemnt needs to do exactly what the EU government does. Start handing down fines that make it less profitable to break the law. As long as breaking the law brings in more profits then following them they will continue to be broken.

You prefer higher prices and companies to markup instead of selling at or below cost. I don't know about you, but I can't imagine anything getting more competitive when dealing below cost sales.
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The only reason to sell a product below cost is to destroy your competition. Just because it may be cheaper for a few years doesn't mean it won't be a hell of a lot more expensive in the long run. When a company spends money to destroy their competition they're sure as hell not doing it because they want to keep low prices. They're doing it because they want to jack thier prices way up but can't because someone else is undercutting them.
 
AMD filed this back in 2000, it would be shameful if not a single eurocent goes towards them, and it would be weird if it ended up that way because AMD's got a bunch of European plants and more on the way and all and the big cheeses should love that.

And you pro-Intel anti-EU trolls should read up on the US Gov investigation of Intel that's going to go on for another few years, time to move to Canada or some place that doesn't hate big business huh?


But back to the topic, aw poor intel not allowed to use their moneyhats to fuck the competition over and limit the choices of the consumers and rape their wallets so they have to lower their prices and pay a little fine to compete in the business :(
 
jstnomega said:
If the collected fine monies were then handed over to the alleged victim, such actions might be deemed noble. Lacking that outcome, one wonders: where is justice? :confused:
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That's the core of the problem with all the EU fines. Who's getting the money? The victims? Who are the victims anyways? If the EU courts are set on protecting their citizens, why the hell are they keeping all of the money?

It's not just about punishment. It's about profiteering.
 
The reality is that Intel couldn't stop their CPUs from reaching their market even if they wanted. It's pretty easy for any American to stick a few hundred thousand CPUs in a cargo container and send them off to Europe. There is no possible way for Intel or Microsoft to simply leave a market, neither of their products are hard to move across borders.
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Do you have a fucking clue what export control is? Violating export control will send you to jail forever.
 
Azhar said:
That's the core of the problem with all the EU fines. Who's getting the money? The victims? Who are the victims anyways? If the EU courts are set on protecting their citizens, why the hell are they keeping all of the money?

It's not just about punishment. It's about profiteering.
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Do you have a link to show what the EU does with the fines?
 
Or, on a side note, they could also be shipped from Canada, Mexico, South America, China, Japan... So I guess if they only sold in the US, somehow convinced AMD to stop selling in a wide range a massively profitable markets, and convinced the US government to refuse all export licenses, then yes, they could stop the EU from getting CPUs.
 
Azhar said:
Okay, then you tell me, where does the money go?
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...

Ever stop to think that maybe, just maybe, he asked for a link to the information because he didn't know the answer? Generally when you start making claims people assume that you have information to back them up rather then having just pulled it out of your ass.

You claimed they kept all the money. He asked for the source of this information... You respond by asking where the money goes?
 
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