HP LP2475w (Possible new IPS)

Biosphere said:
To say the text issues is a result of wide gamut is bullshit. You can just desaturate the colors in ATI control panel. It has no effect on the text
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I'm not convinced by the "wide gamut" explanation either - there's no problem with the text on my 2707WFP (wide gamut), and I don't recall a problem with the 3007WFP-HC (also wide gamut).

My own suspicion (and it is just a suspicion, nothing more) is that it's more likely to be something to do with the H-IPS pixel structure, and even then it's something certain people's eyes/brain pick up on more than others. Maybe if you're accustomed to using a particular type of panel, your eyes sometimes need a "training period" before they're completely happy with a different type (if anyone knows better, feel free to call BS on this one).

I had another look at my friend's LP2475W this morning, and to be honest the text seemed perfectly OK without another monitor to directly compare it with. The colour shift was still there, and doesn't seem to have changed either for the better or worse.
 
rezolution said:
they are supposed to line up exactly upon each other (and on Green) to reproduce white
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Err, no LCD ever does that. All panel formats lay out the subpixels in a physical order on the same plane, usually of RGB. To get convergence as you're describing it would require three separate LCD layers and only introduces more possible manufacturing errors. Jam your face up against those other two monitors and you'll notice the same exact effect.
 
HotdogStorm said:
In addition if you look closely enough the far right edge is actually blue. I have to get really close to see this effect though (my eyes barely focus at that distance), and it's no more separated than any other LCD I've seen. It may be exaggerated because the wide gamut makes red stand out more from black, but I don't see it on text after tuning ClearType.
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Ok, do you guys wear glasses, because a red fringe on one side and blue on the other is chromatic aberration, it comes from your glasses. Repeat with contact lenses. :D

My NEC 2490 with H-IPS has zero fringing. Cleartype can sometimes do some fringing on text, but you guys are even talking about test patterns and you have to get insanely close to cause an issue there (I am talking 2" from the screen if you can focus that close, you can make out the subpixels). So you are close enough to your screen to have it look like this? (the closest macro I can make).
macrocropmr6.png


IMO if you are seeing this and it bothers you, you are sitting too damn close. This is the same on every panel I have seen (I have owned IPS/VA/TN). Text is identical to my TN panel sitting next to it.

Also if anything the green pixels tend to dominate one the white background, it is only when they have black next to them that you really notice the Red or Blue ones.

Look at the end of the "a" and beginning of the "n", it forms a perfect row of pixels and you can see the RGB are all balanced. But the edge of the "a" is red, the edge of the "n" is blue. Or look a the Equal sign "=" red edge on one end blue on the other.

That is the nature of subpixels and ALL LCDs HAVE THEM. Edges will alway be red or blue as each pixel is arranged RGB, RGB. There are no white pixels. They are all created with this pattern and they will all have Red/Blue edges at the micro view. But at a normal viewing distance you should not see them.
 
Snowdog said:
Ok, do you guys wear glasses, because a red fringe on one side and blue on the other is chromatic aberration, it comes from your glasses. Repeat with contact lenses. :D

My NEC 2490 with H-IPS has zero fringing. Cleartype can sometimes do some fringing on text, but you guys are even talking about test patterns and you have to get insanely close to cause an issue there (I am talking 2" from the screen if you can focus that close, you can make out the subpixels).
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Not while at the computer, no, and there's a distinct difference between that effect and what's described. We're definitely talking about the subpixels here, and I agree they're not visible unless you're within a foot.
 
kmetek said:
so you people are doubting this LCD is good for money?
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Not at all. Having seen the monitor, I'm thinking of getting one myself, in spite of the issues mentioned here, and passing on the Dell to my kid brother. If I get one with an unacceptable colour gradient I'll just return it, and repeat the process until either I get a good one or I conclude they're all the same, in which case I'll have a rethink. :)
 
kmetek said:
so you people are doubting this LCD is good for money?
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Absolutely.
There are just a few models better than this one (NECs 90-series in all aspects, possibly glossy Hazro and iMac and the Dell 3008 due to resolution only). No LG, no Planar, no DoubleSight, no TripleSight ...
2475 has it's cons, but low price justifies everything.
 
I've sadly come to the decision to return mine as faulty, and not risk getting another (for the time being, until I get some idea of how common this is, or whether it is just normal on this panel). Hopefully they won't argue that it's within normal tolerances. I measured a 300K colour temperature difference across my screen, which is subtle but easily seen on pale tones, especially once you are aware of it.

I'd be very interested to see the results of such a measurement performed by someone who has this screen and is happy that it does not have a colour gradient. Is anyone in a postition to do that, or does everyone with a 2475 and access to a colorimeter also have the gradient!?

In the meantime I might have to consider my alternatives.... including possibly squeezing out another £250 for an NEC LCD2690WUXi, but I might have to do a good few paper rounds first ;)
 
I measured mine as having over 400k difference, not so good. Apart from this it is a fine monitor. I would be sad to see it go.
 
skitlets said:
Second that on PCConnection.com's service. If I run into any defects, would I be dealing with HP instead of the seller? And I know buying from HP direct, the warranty is 3 years. Is it the same from resellers?
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I'm generally working under the presumption that if anything is significantly wrong with the monitor, I can just go directly to HP right out of the box if a vendor won't work with me.

That said, the only time I've had to exchange something with PC Connection was for an NEC Tablet PC that had a tiny bit of debris inside the screen back in 2003. I called them up, described the issue, and they arranged an RMA without any hassle, and the turnaround was quick.

I don't know how they'd handle a situation like "I see a little bit of a pink cast on the lower right corner of the screen". All I know is that they've always been real helpful to me and actually answer their phones with a real representative who works there.
 
aramando said:
I've sadly come to the decision to return mine as faulty, and not risk getting another (for the time being, until I get some idea of how common this is, or whether it is just normal on this panel). Hopefully they won't argue that it's within normal tolerances. I measured a 300K colour temperature difference across my screen, which is subtle but easily seen on pale tones, especially once you are aware of it.

I'd be very interested to see the results of such a measurement performed by someone who has this screen and is happy that it does not have a colour gradient. Is anyone in a postition to do that, or does everyone with a 2475 and access to a colorimeter also have the gradient!?

In the meantime I might have to consider my alternatives.... including possibly squeezing out another £250 for an NEC LCD2690WUXi, but I might have to do a good few paper rounds first ;)
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Yeah I really wish someone with a colorimeter could come by and test mine. Mine is perfect aside form a litle bleed in corners + the text
 
Biosphere said:
Yeah I really wish someone with a colorimeter could come by and test mine. Mine is perfect aside form a litle bleed in corners + the text
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Biosphere, are you saying that in the absence of a colorimiter you don't see any sign at all of the colour shift problem? aramando's pics at tftcentral show it well, although the one I saw wasn't that bad.

Another good example is to go to the BBC News front page, maximise the browser window and compare the grey areas on the left and right sides of the screen.

I feel a bit guilty for even asking, in case it starts to annoy you when it didn't previously... :D
 
Argentum said:
I'm generally working under the presumption that if anything is significantly wrong with the monitor, I can just go directly to HP right out of the box if a vendor won't work with me.

That said, the only time I've had to exchange something with PC Connection was for an NEC Tablet PC that had a tiny bit of debris inside the screen back in 2003. I called them up, described the issue, and they arranged an RMA without any hassle, and the turnaround was quick.

I don't know how they'd handle a situation like "I see a little bit of a pink cast on the lower right corner of the screen". All I know is that they've always been real helpful to me and actually answer their phones with a real representative who works there.
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Thanks for the response. =)
Would HP's warranty cover relatively minor defects, such as the pink discoloring or gradient issues? I tried looking over HPs site but I could not find an actual copy of the warranty. If the monitor reports hold up over the next week or so, I might have to give pc connection a visit!
 
nick8571 said:
Biosphere, are you saying that in the absence of a colorimiter you don't see any sign at all of the colour shift problem? aramando's pics at tftcentral show it well, although the one I saw wasn't that bad.

Another good example is to go to the BBC News front page, maximise the browser window and compare the grey areas on the left and right sides of the screen.

I feel a bit guilty for even asking, in case it starts to annoy you when it didn't previously... :D
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lol, don't feel quilty for pointing out flaws. I have done it to other people myself :rolleyes:
Ok so I did the tests you wanted. I also created a series of fullscreen different shades of grey and been watching fullscreen colors for the last ½ hour.

Hard pressed the screen is clearly not 100% homogen.
I am not able to see any difference in the grey color on the left and right side of BBC homepage.

I can't see any difference in colortone on two splitscreen browsers with google.

I'll try and get you a couple of photos.
 
lol I'm actually beginning to doubt myself :(

Maybe I'm wrong. I definitely found a sort a dark line on the screen.

bbc.jpg


grey.jpg
 
Dark line ...really ? Where ?

This may come out a little harsh but ... I've owned this monitor for 2 weeks now and calibrated it with a Spyder3 Elite an I find it to be the best monitor I've owned yet.I also have no doubt that NEC 2490WUXI is better than this but also it's significantly more expensive, so it makes sense.

In other words HP LP2475w has no (at least to my control-freak eyes) color shifting, banding, dark line & Co. defects some users here imagine it to have.

Paranoia kills.

Oh and here's my calibration results :

Gamma : 2.2
White point : 6500

Black Luminance : 0.25
White Luminance : 120

..obtained with

Brightness : 16
Contrast : 100
Red : 230
Green : 202
Blue : 209

Spyder3 Elite "certified" & Ambient Light Level : Very Low (completely dark room, the only light source being a TV situated 2m to the left of the monitor, at 15 degrees).
 
Um... if your panel has no color shifting or dark/light lines, how does that mean that others have imagined theirs? Seems that lines of different brightness would be a manufacturing defect and would vary from panel to panel; it's certainly not a normal backlight effect. I don't know what would cause the color shifting, but to say that you don't see it on your panel, so everyone who does is imagining it....
 
ninethirty said:
Um... if your panel has no color shifting or dark/light lines, how does that mean that others have imagined theirs?
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You are talking about color or backlight uniformity issues.
Color shifting is completely different thing - it's a major difference between IPS and PVA. IPS doesn't have color shifting.

Color uniformity issue is so minimal that it's hard to see it on a photo in most cases.
Backlight or panel uniformity issue is much more noticable.
This is how it looks on HP 2475w (vertical strip):
panel2475as1.jpg
 
Let me rephrase that.

1) I don't deny the possibility that some panels might have issues (since I've been the subject of Murphy's laws countless times when everyone had the same thing as I did but only mine was flawed)
2) I'm also not denying that Biosphere has some issues with his/her panel , I'm just saying that I can't draw that conclusion from the photographs she/he posted => hence the supposed paranoia
3) HP LP2475w is in many people's opinion (mine included, and our friend google testifies for that) the best monitor in its price range.

I'm sorry if I have offended anyone in my previous post, my choice of words was inappropriate and therefore failed to to say something that I find now, better to be left behind.
 
uhhh...re: "colour shifting" - I guess some of us are guilty of imprecise terminology here. What I at least meant by it is _not_ the type of shifting you see on a PVA panel, which is dependent on viewing angle, but an intrinsic difference in colour temperature between the left and right sides of the screen. Maybe describing it as "colour gradient" would avoid confusion.

@Biosphere: thanks very much for the pics. I can see it on your example, although it's not dramatic, and it's very obvious in the image posted by albovin (which also clearly shows the vertical stripe). Given all the variables, how much we can conclude from user-posted pics in absolute terms is open to question, but I do at least feel we're seeing a consistent pattern. My gut feeling is that the effect is an inherent characteristic of this model, and it will be there in all samples to a certain extent - maybe some are worse than others, or some people are simply less sensitive to it (probably a combination of both).

I do appreciate that you're never going to achieve perfect uniformity with current technology, and some brightness variation is to be expected, but the colour gradient from one side to the other is more difficult to ignore, for me at least. That said, we're dealing with some fairly nebulous issues here by most standards, and if someone were to describe me as paranoid or neurotic I could certainly understand where they were coming from. :D

Kargeras said:
3) HP LP2475w is in many people's opinion (mine included, and our friend google testifies for that) the best monitor in its price range.
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I wouldn't argue with that - if you get a good one (and/or) if the problem, if you see it, doesn't bug you too much, it's a great product when you factor in the price tag. :)
 
nick8571 said:
Biosphere, are you saying that in the absence of a colorimiter you don't see any sign at all of the colour shift problem? aramando's pics at tftcentral show it well, although the one I saw wasn't that bad.

Another good example is to go to the BBC News front page, maximise the browser window and compare the grey areas on the left and right sides of the screen.

I feel a bit guilty for even asking, in case it starts to annoy you when it didn't previously... :D
Click to expand...


After having a look to aramando's pics, where colour shift is evident, I must say that my HP-LP2475w doesn't have any of this problems. I can't see any change of color from left to right in mine. So if in your monitors there is a similar colour shift, directly noticiable, even if it is less than the one on aramando's pics, SEND THE MONITOR BAK, THIS IS NOT NORMAL. You can not keep a display that has such a variation of colour (have a look at the grey and even blue iexplorer bars of aramando's post).

Reading the posts on this forum I began to serch for the green-pink shift in a white page, and I couldn't notice it. I also searched for the brightness difference between the left and right side of the display, and there it seemed to me that the side closer to me (the left) was a little brighter on a pure white page. But when I mooved to the right side of the monitor, it was the opposite, and the right became a bit more brighter than left. All this is a very subtle difference, only noticiable if you are hunting it.

All in all, I am very satisfied with this monitor, after two weeks of usage, not just because it is afordable, but because it is a good all rounder. In fact I belive that at the moment we are buying it at a promotional price (KD911AT in Europe), but there is another reference for this display (KD911A4#ABB) which is about 200$ more expensive.

Concerning the pics, only Aramando can confirm if such a huge color variation in his iexplorer bars is really the same as it shows on the pics, or if it is a problem amplified by the camera, but if his pics are reflecting the reality, his display should be sent back ASAP. And this has nothing to do with calibration.

Hope it helps those that have similar problems.
Regards.
 
I have been considering this monitor as it seems amazing for the price, however, I have come across two different manufacturer model numbers.

KD911A4ABA vs KD911A8ABA

The 4ABA has been consistently higher. Does anyone know the difference?
 
For me the biggest issues is still the text.
I have come to the conclusion that the text issue might be caused by the fact that H-IPS is less sharp than S-IPS and VA.

My previous OcUK Value L2442W had miles better text.

I'm also not that impressed by the viewing angles. Not much better than TN IMHO..

Sorry for the negative feedback. But I find especially the text issue hard to justify at this price.I paid 869$ or 468£ in my country (Denmark)
 
Has anyone had experiences with the Dell 2408WFP (Rev A01) and could offer a comparison of the two (colors, input lag, overall issues)? I bought a 2408WFP that initially had an issue with uneven colors/brightness from left to right, exchanged it for another that didn't have the issue as bad but the center of the screen has a blue-ish hue that causes all colors in the area to darken, whereas the outer areas of the monitor look fine (most noticeable on pure white backgrounds).

I've just about had enough dealing with the 2408WFP and am looking to see if the LP2475W is the next logical move...
 
Biosphere said:
I have come to the conclusion that the text issue might be caused by the fact that H-IPS is less sharp than S-IPS and VA.

I'm also not that impressed by the viewing angles. Not much better than TN IMHO..

Sorry for the negative feedback.
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Don't apologize and don't put IMHO.
You cannot come to any conclusion due your total incompetence you show posting this nonsense.

Your feedback is not negative, just stupid. And it shows.

"IPS viewing angles not much better than TN" - this is a diagnosis for you, not for your monitor.
 
albovin said:
Don't apologize and don't put IMHO.
You cannot come to any conclusion due your total incompetence you show posting this nonsense.

Your feedback is not negative, just stupid. And it shows.

"IPS viewing angles not much better than TN" - this is a diagnosis for you, not for your monitor.
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Wow you most certainly deserved your bad rep ;) Don't tell me what I can and cannot write ! I will be polite if I please thats not for you to decide :rolleyes:

I wouldn't begin to comment on something I didn't have first hand experience with.

Have had both ips + va based monitors in my hunt. Maybe it's the lack of the A-TW polarizer. Dunno

But what I can say is this screen looses contrast fast if you move your head. Of course not quite as bad as TN. But definetly worse than the L2442W which is VA and on paper should have worse viewing angles..
 
Biosphere said:
Wow you most certainly deserved your bad rep ;) Don't tell me what I can and cannot write ! I will be polite if I please thats not for you to decide :rolleyes:

I wouldn't begin to comment on something I didn't have first hand experience with.

Have had both ips + va based monitors in my hunt. Maybe it's the lack of the A-TW polarizer. Dunno

But what I can say is this screen looses contrast fast if you move your head. Of course not quite as bad as TN. But definetly worse than the L2442W which is VA and on paper should have worse viewing angles..
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I don't care about what noobs say about my rep.;) This is not a diplomatic meeting. This is (could be) a technical forum where people post under their user names. So "thank you" is more than enough here.

The worst thing is posting incompetent BS here.
Of course, I cannot prevent you from posting this sort of statements.
But as you post BS, expect appropiate comments.
 
Is it normal that the screen surface in the top right and left corners aren't fully contact? I mean if I push my screen's top right or left corner the surface moves in and out, like its not glued well enough. It might be bad if the dust gets inside the panel? Hope you understand what I mean.
 
albovin said:
The worst thing is posting incompetent BS here.
Of course, I cannot prevent you from posting this sort of statements.
But as you post BS, expect appropiate comments.
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Oh, do shut up, you old tart. Have some more vodka.* ;)

Biosphere said:
I'm also not that impressed by the viewing angles. Not much better than TN IMHO..
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I have to say, of all the criticisms I have of the LP2475W, viewing angles isn't one of them. The only artefact I noticed in this respect was the IPS "white glow" (and yes, albovin, it was specific to this panel and not a general LCD characteristic) at certain angles, or in the corners of the screen if you sit too close. Really insignificant in day-to-day use though.

*disclaimer: from what I've seen here, I do like albovin, and look forward to getting drunk with him if he ever visits London... :D
 
>>For me the biggest issues is still the text.
>>I have come to the conclusion that the text issue might be caused by the fact that H-IPS is less sharp than S-IPS and VA.

Well I completely agree with you on this one.

I purchased the HP2475W about 2 weeks ago and returned it after a few days.
The FACT is that the AG coating is way too heavy and the text looks shit.

Don't listen to what some 'graphics' pros who are in love with this LCD are saying ... they like it for other reasons ... mainly the cheap price and the fact that is IPS.

I have an Eizo PVA display here and the text is excellent ... very sharp, no distortion.

Also, I just received the NEC 2490 today and the AG coating is completely different and the text is excellent.

I think old addage 'you get what you pay for' ... the HP is ~$600 ... the NEC ~$1000
HP might have an IPS panel in there, but have probably skimped on everything else to get that price point.
 
temp444 said:
I purchased the HP2475W about 2 weeks ago and returned it after a few days.
The FACT is that the AG coating is way too heavy and the text looks shit.

Don't listen to what some 'graphics' pros who are in love with this LCD are saying ... they like it for other reasons ... mainly the cheap price and the fact that is IPS.

I have an Eizo PVA display here and the text is excellent ... very sharp, no distortion.

Also, I just received the NEC 2490 today and the AG coating is completely different and the text is excellent.
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Again, I just don't see it. The AG coating is no more intrusive to me than any other non-glossy panel I've used to date, and much less offensive than some (take a bow, Dell 3007WFP-HC). Believe me, if I could find a reason to moan, I would do so, loud and long. :D

I _can_ see the text sharpness problem, but only when I have another panel alongside it as a direct comparison. If you spend most of your time in MS Office, this probably isn't the best panel for you.

Having seen the PVA gamma shift in action (it didn't bother me until I started hanging out here, thanks guys :rolleyes: ), I can say without a shadow of a doubt, I will only ever consider IPS screens in future... :)
 
I'm happy for you. I wouldn't want to ruin your pleasure ;)

I might consider this even if it is MVA and excessive priced:

NEC LCD24WMGX3
LCD24WMGX3-MonitorViewLeftBlack.jpg
 
nick8571 said:
Again, I just don't see it. The AG coating is no more intrusive to me than any other non-glossy panel I've used to date, and much less offensive than some (take a bow, Dell 3007WFP-HC). Believe me, if I could find a reason to moan, I would do so, loud and long. :D

I _can_ see the text sharpness problem, but only when I have another panel alongside it as a direct comparison. If you spend most of your time in MS Office, this probably isn't the best panel for you.

Having seen the PVA gamma shift in action (it didn't bother me until I started hanging out here, thanks guys :rolleyes: ), I can say without a shadow of a doubt, I will only ever consider IPS screens in future... :)
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Yes, I am in the unfortunate position of needing a large monitor with excellent text ... as I work 8-10 hours a day as a software developer. So it seems that other features are more important in these higher end monitors, which is understandable.

At the moment there are 100s of rubbish TN displays in the market ... for the last few years I have had Eizo monitors which had great text clarity ... but Eizo seems to have gone to heavier AG coatings and not jumped on the IPS bandwagon.

So have tried the iMac24 (thick glass, mirror city), Dell 2709W (all round terrible), HP 2475W (much better than the dell, but terrible text) and the NEC 2490 (the winner so far!)

And I think the sad thing is that with Apple and Microsoft going towards touch displays ... thick glass seems mandatory in front of the panel.
 
Biosphere said:
...Thanx for the test image. However I can't seem to see any of the defects you refer to :confused:
...
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So you are sure you don't see little red pinpoint pixels to the left of the white dots in that test pattern? That may be good news... if others do not have this problem, then I may try swapping this display for another of the same model.
 
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