How Amazon Shames Warehouse Workers for Alleged Theft

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Somebody smarter than I needs to explain to me how posting signs like this with just generic outlines and no personal information is considered "shaming" employees? I could see if they posted actual pictures of the employees or their names but this just seems like a lame attempt at deterring theft.


In an effort to discourage stealing, Amazon has put up flatscreen TVs that display examples of alleged on-the-job theft, say 11 of the company’s current and former warehouse workers and antitheft staff. The alleged offenders aren’t identified by name. Each is represented by a black silhouette stamped with the word “terminated” and accompanied by details such as when they stole, what they stole, how much it was worth, and how they got caught—changing an outbound package’s address, for example, or stuffing merchandise in their socks. Some of the silhouettes are marked “arrested.”
 
Nothing more American than shitting all over your own employees and making even the good honest hard-working ones feel like criminals, I suppose. Lame practice by Amazon but it's not likely to change anytime soon.
 
Tiberian said:
Nothing more American than shitting all over your own employees and making even the good honest hard-working ones feel like criminals, I suppose. Lame practice by Amazon but it's not likely to change anytime soon.
Click to expand...

Explain how this is shitting on workers or a lame practice. They aren't identifying anyone by name or picture. It is a clear reminder that people do get caught and there are consequences in a job that has a high theft rate as an industry. Best stated in the Article if you bothered to read it by a former worker.

Many of the workers say the screens aren’t a top concern compared with wages or workload. “Only people that would have something to say about it is people that’s doing wrong,” says Maurice Jones, a warehouse worker who left Amazon in February. “It’s just letting people know that you’re being watched.”
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Don't be a dirtbag and this is nothing more than another visual reminder to those who are less morally sound.
 
It's kinda like in a courtroom in the sense that when a lawyer constantly reminds a witness "I remind you, ma'am/sir, that you are under oath and the penalty for perjury is..." and after a few times even the Judge has to agree when the other attorney screams "OBJECTION, he's badgering the witness..."

Least that's how I see it. I don't need constant consistent reminders of something, especially something of that nature (an illegal act tends to lead to punishment for the act). It's bad enough in society these days, and I for one am damned happy I don't work for anyone else anymore and never will again.

YMMV, of course.
 
Tiberian said:
Nothing more American than shitting all over your own employees and making even the good honest hard-working ones feel like criminals, I suppose. Lame practice by Amazon but it's not likely to change anytime soon.
Click to expand...

As a business owner and employer, I see nothing wrong here. As the article states, a percentage of people will never steal, a percentage of people will steal every chance they get, and then there are some in the middle. The ones in the middle will see this a realize that getting caught is a real thing.
 
Steve said:
Each is represented by a black silhouette stamped with the word “terminated” and accompanied by details such as when they stole, what they stole, how much it was worth, and how they got caught—”
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I saw this as a list to current employees on what works and what doesn't to make it safer to steal. :shifty:
 
Probably more about making sure employees know - "hey, we're not stupid. do this and get fired... or worse" - shaming? not really. Most companies do stuff like this - even more so when it comes to actual patrons of a store and not employees. but in a job like this, it's the employees doing the theft. This is all to help keep good people (or people on the fence if you will) honest.
 
Lets also not forget that is theft runs rampant, it affects us as consumers as that translates into higher prices. Somehow when an article like this comes out, there are always people who want to sympathize with the actual thieves or bad guys. People who steal are wrong and they suck, period. You don't need a flat screen TV or the latest gadget to feed your family.
 
Yeah, I see no shaming here. I'm in the middle ground: I'll only steal if I'm underpaid, and it's easy.

When I had a job as a tech in the 1990s, there were no controls on hardware, and no cameras anywhere. Stuff disappeared into the spare parts room never to be found again, so I just made off with a few bits nobody would miss to supplement my amazingly low minimum wage pay (summer internship).

The next year they paid me much better (I got a raise after I assembled enough PCs from the spare parts closet to replace three summer rentals in my first week, and made this very visible to the manager), and what do you know I stopped stealing! And funny, I haven't been underpaid since then!

Today with webcams and hardware tracking codes and software allowing tracking of thieves over the internet? HELL FUCKING NO! But the idiots are welcome to try :D
 
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People have way too thin a skin to be working if this is considered shaming or some kind of hostile environment. Even when employees know something is forbidden and subjects them to immediate dismissal they still sometimes do it, whether it is sex in the work place, sleeping on the job, theft, etc. A little reminder that in this case some of the indiscretions can be a criminal offense can't hurt. They are already a pretty high turnover employer so I doubt this is going to impact employee moral and turnover but it might discourage some theft.
 
Tiberian said:
Nothing more American than shitting all over your own employees and making even the good honest hard-working ones feel like criminals, I suppose. Lame practice by Amazon but it's not likely to change anytime soon.
Click to expand...


Nothing more American thinking that just because you work for a company, you entitled to steal from them. Great job making life miserable for everyone else in the company.
 
My point since nobody seems to have grasped it is this: putting up signs doesn't do shit to change people's behavior. If all the cameras, the security, and the signs haven't done much to sway things, they're not going to magically cause a massive upheaval in how humans perceive things nor in their particular behaviors. How many times have any of you witnessed people walk up to doors that plainly say PUSH on them only to see the people stand there pulling on 'em wondering why they're not getting in - remember the McDonald's hot coffee thing years ago? HOT COFFEE IS HOT but apparently that just doesn't register on the people with the cup in their hand even today.

Hell, just yesterday I almost got hit by someone - as I crossed a street at the intersection with the light in my favor - because they simply ignored the big white sign with big black letters sitting on top of another sign under it that said DO NOT ENTER on both sides of the street they were now on that said ONE WAY: the only way they'd be able to read the sign is if they were going the wrong way but of course they missed it for their own reason(s).

Do I have a negative outlook on humanity? You're damned right I do and with good reason, and no damned signs or videos are going to change things for those that make the bad decisions but it sure does have an effect on those of us that wonder why we're being treated like criminals just the same.
 
Tiberian said:
My point since nobody seems to have grasped it is this: putting up signs doesn't do shit to change people's behavior. If all the cameras, the security, and the signs haven't done much to sway things, they're not going to magically cause a massive upheaval in how humans perceive things nor in their particular behaviors. How many times have any of you witnessed people walk up to doors that plainly say PUSH on them only to see the people stand there pulling on 'em wondering why they're not getting in - remember the McDonald's hot coffee thing years ago? HOT COFFEE IS HOT but apparently that just doesn't register on the people with the cup in their hand even today.

Hell, just yesterday I almost got hit by someone - as I crossed a street at the intersection with the light in my favor - because they simply ignored the big white sign with big black letters sitting on top of another sign under it that said DO NOT ENTER on both sides of the street they were now on that said ONE WAY: the only way they'd be able to read the sign is if they were going the wrong way but of course they missed it for their own reason(s).

Do I have a negative outlook on humanity? You're damned right I do and with good reason, and no damned signs or videos are going to change things for those that make the bad decisions but it sure does have an effect on those of us that wonder why we're being treated like criminals just the same.
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Define being treated as a criminal. This is just an announcement of the possible impact to workers of theft (criminal vs dismissal) and a reminder that chances are the violators will be caught. They aren't strip searching employees or requiring ongoing credit checks to maintain employment. I have worked at companies, Intel in my case, with high value inventory at risk. The USA plants required bag searches and permits to remove computers from the building. The overseas plants ran employees through metal detectors and X-Rayed any personal items. This wasn't to treat employees as criminals but to insure the security of the company. For someone that finds these things intrusive they can find lower security (and possibly lower paying) employment.
 
lets get some perspective here guys. ten dollar metal signs everywhere showing a person stealing that say "dont do wat johnny dont does" or "LOL ur on camera" would be just as effective (or ineffective) at stopping a determined...or even just opportunistic...thief. but nah amazon is going to pay people to produce these little videos, pay for god knows how many tvs, pay for them to be installed everywhere, pay for them to run 24/7. they dont care, theyre making money hand over fist.

meanwhile they treat their warehouse employees like cattle. one of their warehouses AC went out in the summer & after a number of workers fell over from literal heat stroke, they paid for ambulances instead of fixing the air quickly

/edgy rant
 
High profile issues within an org need to be dealt with quickly, fairly, and privately. This isn't that. You will get people paralyzed by this.
 
Tiberian said:
My point since nobody seems to have grasped it is this: putting up signs doesn't do shit to change people's behavior. If all the cameras, the security, and the signs haven't done much to sway things, they're not going to magically cause a massive upheaval in how humans perceive things nor in their particular behaviors. How many times have any of you witnessed people walk up to doors that plainly say PUSH on them only to see the people stand there pulling on 'em wondering why they're not getting in - remember the McDonald's hot coffee thing years ago? HOT COFFEE IS HOT but apparently that just doesn't register on the people with the cup in their hand even today.

Hell, just yesterday I almost got hit by someone - as I crossed a street at the intersection with the light in my favor - because they simply ignored the big white sign with big black letters sitting on top of another sign under it that said DO NOT ENTER on both sides of the street they were now on that said ONE WAY: the only way they'd be able to read the sign is if they were going the wrong way but of course they missed it for their own reason(s).

Do I have a negative outlook on humanity? You're damned right I do and with good reason, and no damned signs or videos are going to change things for those that make the bad decisions but it sure does have an effect on those of us that wonder why we're being treated like criminals just the same.
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I'm usually one of the first to jump on the "Unnecessarily treating people like criminals" bandwagon. However that just isn't the case here. I most certainly grasped your point in the first point. The problem is I don't believe you know the point you were trying to convey or you just did an incredibly bad job at conveying it.
 
I worked at Amazon for a little while. Theft was disgustingly rampant. It was even worse among the nerd crowd.
 
Tiberian said:
Nothing more American than shitting all over your own employees and making even the good honest hard-working ones feel like criminals, I suppose. Lame practice by Amazon but it's not likely to change anytime soon.
Click to expand...

YeuEmMaiMai said:
Nothing more American thinking that just because you work for a company, you entitled to steal from them. Great job making life miserable for everyone else in the company.
Click to expand...


nothing more american than sweeping generalizations
 
Sounds like Amazon needs one of those hand-chopper-offer machines they use in Iran.
 
Tiberian said:
Nothing more American than shitting all over your own employees and making even the good honest hard-working ones feel like criminals, I suppose. Lame practice by Amazon but it's not likely to change anytime soon.
Click to expand...

Meh, I have no problem using these criminals actions as examples for others.

The downside - however - is that employees right off the bat don't feel like they are trusted, which can result in a harsh and suspicious work environment, which benefits no one.

It seems to me they could have conveyed the "crime doesn't pay, look who we caught" message in a way that doesn't cast a shadow of doubt over the entire workforce. No one likes working somewhere where they are constantly under suspicion. Must not be very good for turnover.

Then again, Amazon is apparently well known for creating hostile work environments.
 
I'm going to add to this by saying this sort of thing works, I use to shoplift a lot when I was younger and guess what doesn't work? Stupid littles signs saying "smile you're on camera", that's about effective as telling someone pop will make you fat and walking away expecting them to never drink again. You know what did work in stopping it? Meeting and seeing other people who did get caught, it scared the stupid right out of my moronic head and made me realize that you will eventually be caught and there are real consequences. People need to see the consequences of their actions and not just hear about it for it to be effective.
 
As someone that works at a distribution center IT dept (not amazon) ... I can chime in a bit. From the time I swipe my badge in at the front gate till the time I leave, I assume I'm 100% being watched at all times, some of the hardware and drugs that are on site are worth more than I make all year.

Not just in this sector but any low skill job, you are dealing with people who generally aren't educated, and lack much of the common sense about the working world. These are people that don't realize it's not okay to steal, it's not okay to sleep on the job, show up drunk, have sex at the workplace, harass others, or generally be a piece of shit. These people make close to minimum wage because their job is literally take Item from box 1 and put it into a box 2. It's not rocket science, and there's a whole host of reasons how they ended up in that position far beyond the scope of this article.

The article said it best -- you have people that will never steal, and you will have people that will always steal, and those in between. And quite honestly the signs they put up, aren't offensive at all, personally when I see something like that I laugh at the dumb piece of shit who decided to steal. Why is it that part of society feels the need to protect or conceal the identity of a thief? If you are a thief, fuck you, end of story. You make everyone elses life harder and cost more.


We are so worried about hurting peoples feelings or worried about what they might think. It sounds to me like the people who are most "outraged' over this are the people who are more likely to have flexible moral stances and thus a higher proclivity to stealing.

Theft costs us tens of billions of dollars a year... while it would never happen in the US, you could stop quite a bit of it overnight if people suddenly knew they would lose a hand if they are convicted of stealing. Hard to keep stealing if all you have is a stump. At the end of the day, it's the person themselves who made the decision to steal, same with drunk drivers, or any other shitbag who makes the world a crappier place to live in due to their actions.

Actions have consequences, nobody seems to want to accept that basic notion in life.
 
harbingerofdoom said:
nothing more american than sweeping generalizations
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that was an awesome reply, no not really.. But this is to be expected in a society where the criminal is elevated and the regular guy is considered the criminal.

So, tell the rest of us exactly, what gives an employee the right to steal from an employer? Amazon would not spend their hard earned time and money on this if theft was not a problem.
 
The hell with the silhouette, I want to see mugshots. Maybe it's because I have worked with small businesses most of my life, but screw you if your stealing from your employer. Taking advantage of perks is one thing , but theft straight up costs everyone more; from wages to insurances to the costumer costs. Someone has to pay for it. I think a wall of shame is a great idea, I liken it to the police report in the free local paper :) .02
 
collegeboy69us said:
As someone that works at a distribution center IT dept (not amazon) ... I can chime in a bit. From the time I swipe my badge in at the front gate till the time I leave, I assume I'm 100% being watched at all times, some of the hardware and drugs that are on site are worth more than I make all year.

Not just in this sector but any low skill job, you are dealing with people who generally aren't educated, and lack much of the common sense about the working world. These are people that don't realize it's not okay to steal, it's not okay to sleep on the job, show up drunk, have sex at the workplace, harass others, or generally be a piece of shit. These people make close to minimum wage because their job is literally take Item from box 1 and put it into a box 2. It's not rocket science, and there's a whole host of reasons how they ended up in that position far beyond the scope of this article.

The article said it best -- you have people that will never steal, and you will have people that will always steal, and those in between. And quite honestly the signs they put up, aren't offensive at all, personally when I see something like that I laugh at the dumb piece of shit who decided to steal. Why is it that part of society feels the need to protect or conceal the identity of a thief? If you are a thief, fuck you, end of story. You make everyone elses life harder and cost more.


We are so worried about hurting peoples feelings or worried about what they might think. It sounds to me like the people who are most "outraged' over this are the people who are more likely to have flexible moral stances and thus a higher proclivity to stealing.

Theft costs us tens of billions of dollars a year... while it would never happen in the US, you could stop quite a bit of it overnight if people suddenly knew they would lose a hand if they are convicted of stealing. Hard to keep stealing if all you have is a stump. At the end of the day, it's the person themselves who made the decision to steal, same with drunk drivers, or any other shitbag who makes the world a crappier place to live in due to their actions.

Actions have consequences, nobody seems to want to accept that basic notion in life.
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Exactly! The only person that should feel shame is the pile of crap human being that would steal in the first place. If you are a stand-up human being you have nothing to worry about and a laugh that their are shady co-workers(we all have them and know who they are) need a physical reminder not to be a garbage human.
 
Personally, I don't think they should fire the thieves. When they catch someone stealing, put a sign up with their picture, name, how many $$ worth of stuff they stole.. followed by a list of 10 random employees that are getting their weekly pay docked to make up the difference. Then just let the other employees handle the punishment phase :p
 
farscapesg1 said:
Personally, I don't think they should fire the thieves. When they catch someone stealing, put a sign up with their picture, name, how many $$ worth of stuff they stole.. followed by a list of 10 random employees that are getting their weekly pay docked to make up the difference. Then just let the other employees handle the punishment phase :p
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And then drive 10 more people to theft...brilliant.
 
My job does similar, It's just stock silhouettes, not pictures of the people who stole. In our case it's people who allegedly were fired for taking drugs, driving a company car using a cellphone or similar 'Zero Tolerance' things. Because it's just a outline you can believe it's anyone.
 
Tiberian said:
Nothing more American than shitting all over your own employees and making even the good honest hard-working ones feel like criminals, I suppose. Lame practice by Amazon but it's not likely to change anytime soon.
Click to expand...


If the shoe fits .....

My question about the whole thing is different.

Wasn't Amazon one of the companies that didn't want to pay wages while they have their employees wait in lines for security? In and out?

It seems if I recall correctly, the court rules that the time wasn't very long per employee so it wasn't considered long enough to be worth arguing over, wasn't the case dismissed or the plaintiff's lost?

If so, these "theft awareness" displays seem like a minor element, something you'd maybe catch a couple of minutes of at the most and probably wouldn't pay a lot of attention too anyway.

I'm agreeing with Steve on this one, nothing much here to be shamed about. Big tado about nothing.
 
No we won't pay them a livable wage to make them not steal our shit we'll just fire and shame those who do and make the other employee's lives a living hell. Yay, America!
 
Dwango said:
No we won't pay them a livable wage to make them not steal our shit we'll just fire and shame those who do and make the other employee's lives a living hell. Yay, America!
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Wages and theft aren't directly related necessarily. These people are not stealing bread to feed their starving babies they are stealing high value merchandise to use themselves or sell on Ebay. Most workers just steal time from their employers. Stealing physical merchandise from your employer is never justified (regardless of what you are paid). There isn't a magic number that says, "Pay your workers at least $50K or they will steal from you". Stealers gonna steal and workers gonna work.
 
Tiberian said:
Nothing more American than shitting all over your own employees and making even the good honest hard-working ones feel like criminals, I suppose. Lame practice by Amazon but it's not likely to change anytime soon.
Click to expand...

Nothing more liberal democrat american than pretending like criminals are victims.
 
Dwango, Do you know how much they make or are you just trolling?
 
Tiberian said:
My point since nobody seems to have grasped it is this: putting up signs doesn't do shit to change people's behavior. If all the cameras, the security, and the signs haven't done much to sway things, they're not going to magically cause a massive upheaval in how humans perceive things nor in their particular behaviors. How many times have any of you witnessed people walk up to doors that plainly say PUSH on them only to see the people stand there pulling on 'em wondering why they're not getting in - remember the McDonald's hot coffee thing years ago? HOT COFFEE IS HOT but apparently that just doesn't register on the people with the cup in their hand even today.

Hell, just yesterday I almost got hit by someone - as I crossed a street at the intersection with the light in my favor - because they simply ignored the big white sign with big black letters sitting on top of another sign under it that said DO NOT ENTER on both sides of the street they were now on that said ONE WAY: the only way they'd be able to read the sign is if they were going the wrong way but of course they missed it for their own reason(s).

Do I have a negative outlook on humanity? You're damned right I do and with good reason, and no damned signs or videos are going to change things for those that make the bad decisions but it sure does have an effect on those of us that wonder why we're being treated like criminals just the same.
Click to expand...

So by your logic, because a few people ignore signs we can conclude that nobody uses signs? For every 1 person that ignores the "do not enter" sign, there's probably 10,000 that obey it. For ever 1 person that ignores the amazon do not steal signs, there's probably 10 who were thinking about stealing and says "oh I didn't know I could get caught, maybe I won't do that".

If you're offended by the "do not steal" signs, are you offended by the "do not drink" warning on bleach?
 
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