Refresh rate above VScan limit (CRT)

rabidz7

rabidz7

[H]ard|Gawd
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I know that running CRTs out of the HScan range can easily cause damage, but what about the VScan range? My monitor officially supports only 180Hz at 800x600. I set it to 200Hz at 800x600 and it works fine. Would setting the thing to 270Hz at 640x480 cause damage?
 
rabidz7 said:
I know that running CRTs out of the HScan range can easily cause damage,
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source? my sony trinitrons just display an out of range message
but what about the VScan range? My monitor officially supports only 180Hz at 800x600. I set it to 200Hz at 800x600 and it works fine. Would setting the thing to 270Hz at 640x480 cause damage?
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try it lol. yolo
 
flod said:
source? my sony trinitrons just display an out of range message
try it lol. yolo
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Trinitrons go out of range, but if they didn't, they could be damaged. I will try 288Hz at 512x384 tomorrow, when my GPU arrives (am currently using my '05 PowerMac becuase my GPU failed. OS X does not support resolutions above 200Hz. I will be receiving a 980 Classy tommorow).
 
rabidz7 said:
Trinitrons go out of range, but if they didn't, they could be damaged. I will try 288Hz at 512x384 tomorrow, when my GPU arrives (am currently using my '05 PowerMac becuase my GPU failed. OS X does not support resolutions above 200Hz. I will be receiving a 980 Classy tommorow).
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Are you trolling or something? We've gone over this before. There IS a vertical sync hard limit. Read the specifications and you'll see it. You'll never get it to 288 hz because your deflection yoke has a hard limit - which is probably at 170 hz.
 
well he claims
rabidz7 said:
I set it to 200Hz at 800x600 and it works fine
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check a few times with testufo frame skipping to make sure (take 1/10 or so exposure pictures)
also check the osd, usually crts show the hsync and refresh frequencies when you press the osd
 
flod said:
well he claims


check a few times with testufo frame skipping to make sure (take 1/10 or so exposure pictures)
also check the osd, usually crts show the hsync and refresh frequencies when you press the osd
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Impossible, unless his deflection yoke supports 200 hz. And my top-end Trinitrons do not. The firmware built into the logic board would never allow it to go above the vertical limit, which for top-end Trinitrons, is around 170hz.

Looked up the specs on the Sony's. The GDM-F520 does up to 170hz max. FW900 does up to 160Hhz max.

So pray tell, what is this 200hz monitor you're using rabidz?
 
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jbltecnicspro said:
Impossible, unless his deflection yoke supports 200 hz. And my top-end Trinitrons do not. The firmware built into the logic board would never allow it to go above the vertical limit, which for top-end Trinitrons, is around 170hz.

Looked up the specs on the Sony's. The GDM-F520 does up to 170hz max. FW900 does up to 160Hhz max.

So pray tell, what is this 200hz monitor you're using rabidz?
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It is the Nokia 445 Pro. 200Hz worked fine. I will post verification pics when my GPU arrives (either today or Monday).
 
Also, what timings should I use for 800x600@200Hz to keep the HScan under 125KHz?
 
800x600 is pretty crappy resolution. I'd rather play games at 1600x1200@100Hz...
 
rabidz7 said:
It is the Nokia 445 Pro. 200Hz worked fine. I will post verification pics when my GPU arrives (either today or Monday).
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No need. I trust you. It's just that I thought we were discussing Trinitrons. You'll need to look up the 445 Pro's Vsync limit and that's your answer. If it can't go over 200 hz, then you will never get it to 288 hz without modification to the firmware. Just my two cents.
 
Honestly, with CRTs being as old as they are now I wouldn't worry much about it. If you get an image without distortion or clipping and don't hear any strange noises, just enjoy it while it lasts. If you were really that concerned about failures and longevity, you wouldn't be running it out-of-spec in the first place.
 
rabidz7 said:
180FPS is the official VScan limit, however, 200Hz works fine. Would going above 200Hz carry the risk of screwing up the yokes? 200Hz image: https://i.imgur.com/KhDaOps.jpg
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Then I apologize for the trolling question. It looks like Nokia has done some modification to allow you to go above the maximum, or the documentation just states 180 so that you don't go higher? :D Question - will it allow you to take it higher? What happens if you go higher? Garbled image? There must be a scan range. Even if it's documented to only go to 180, there has to be a hard limit somewhere.

Edit: Bump it higher than 200hz and see where that puts you in the Khz region. I would think it tips you over the documented 125khz limit. I'm curious if the documented limit of 125 is the actual limit, or if it will take more?
 
jbltecnicspro said:
Then I apologize for the trolling question. It looks like Nokia has done some modification to allow you to go above the maximum, or the documentation just states 180 so that you don't go higher? :D Question - will it allow you to take it higher? What happens if you go higher? Garbled image? There must be a scan range. Even if it's documented to only go to 180, there has to be a hard limit somewhere.

Edit: Bump it higher than 200hz and see where that puts you in the Khz region. I would think it tips you over the documented 125khz limit. I'm curious if the documented limit of 125 is the actual limit, or if it will take more?
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Things over 125KHz do not work; an out of range message appears. OS X does not support refresh rates over 200Hz, so I have to wait until Monday for my GPU to arrive or try to install Debian on my PowerMac.
 
dafuq??

what resolution did you get that at? And can u take a pic of the OSD reporting 288 hz?

Also, why did you choose 288 hz?
 
think he mentioned 512x384

288 with 384 vertical res should be approaching his monitor's hsync limit

actually thinking about it, i don't see why pushing vertical refresh rate would really harm crts at all as long as resolution is dropped so that horizontal scan freq is kept below the limit... even at 500hz it's still 200x lower than the horizontal scan frequency
 
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flod said:
think he mentioned 512x384

288 with 384 vertical res should be approaching his monitor's hsync limit

actually thinking about it, i don't see why pushing vertical refresh rate would really harm crts at all as long as resolution is dropped so that horizontal scan freq is kept below the limit... even at 500hz it's still 200x lower than the horizontal scan frequency
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Makes sense to me. Except that none of my Sony's allow me to push past the veritcal limit even if it's below the Horizontal. Oh well - the default 85 hz and even lower than that looks just fine to me. Cool that you got it to 288 though.
 
spacediver said:
dafuq??

what resolution did you get that at? And can u take a pic of the OSD reporting 288 hz?

Also, why did you choose 288 hz?
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The OSD actually reports 36Hz, but that would be laggy and flicker like a strobelight, so the OSD is obviously wrong. I choose 288Hz because that is double the refresh rate of the fastest LCDs.
 
rabidz7 said:
The OSD actually reports 36Hz, but that would be laggy and flicker like a strobelight, so the OSD is obviously wrong. I choose 288Hz because that is double the refresh rate of the fastest LCDs.
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Pretty neat stuff then. Congratulations.
 
Just got 340Hz at 384x288. The yokes gave out around 350Hz (the monitor is fine when refresh rate is lowered; no CRTs were harmed), with the image bouncing up and down the screen, but 340Hz is still absolutely incredible. Imagine what modern CRTs could do! Image: http://i.imgur.com/1e8TiPH.jpg
 
so does 288 Hz actually feel twice as smooth as 144 Hz or is it a case of diminishing returns?
 
You are out of your mind to be possibly degrading your rare, perfectly-functional high-end CRT by aiming for these retarded refresh rates. What, you think you can tell the difference between 150 and 200Hz in a double-blind? They ain't making any more of these. LCDs are garbage. Plasmas are gone. OLEDs are going to be absurdly and stupidly expensive for another decade at this rate. SED and crystal LED are sadly never going to happen. CRT is the last great display technology of the next decade.

Do whatever you want with your own hardware, we don't care. I wouldn't be messing with it for marginal benefits if I were you.
 
wabbitseason said:
You are out of your mind to be possibly degrading your rare, perfectly-functional high-end CRT by aiming for these retarded refresh rates. What, you think you can tell the difference between 150 and 200Hz in a double-blind? They ain't making any more of these. LCDs are garbage. Plasmas are gone. OLEDs are going to be absurdly and stupidly expensive for another decade at this rate. SED and crystal LED are sadly never going to happen. CRT is the last great display technology of the next decade.

Do whatever you want with your own hardware, we don't care. I wouldn't be messing with it for marginal benefits if I were you.
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High vertical refresh rates do not damage CRTs. High horizontal refresh rates are what cause degradation.
 
dmonkey said:
Why does the top ufo look more blurry than the middle one? I'm assuming it doesn't look like that actually viewing it?
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It looks like that because the resolution is extremely low. Even still text is very hard to read.
 
rabidz7 said:
It looks like that because the resolution is extremely low. Even still text is very hard to read.
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The middle one looks quite clear, though. Do you see any perceptible motion definition gains with this?
 
rabid maybe try reducing the vertical height of the image... maybe that would allow > 350hz :D
wabbitseason said:
You are out of your mind to be possibly degrading your rare, perfectly-functional high-end CRT by aiming for these retarded refresh rates. What, you think you can tell the difference between 150 and 200Hz in a double-blind? They ain't making any more of these. LCDs are garbage. Plasmas are gone. OLEDs are going to be absurdly and stupidly expensive for another decade at this rate. SED and crystal LED are sadly never going to happen. CRT is the last great display technology of the next decade.

Do whatever you want with your own hardware, we don't care. I wouldn't be messing with it for marginal benefits if I were you.
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i think he's messing with it to see how far it goes, not for "marginal benefits"

i cant think of any use case for resolutions < 640x480

anyway now all we needa do is figure out how to remove the soft limit on other crts
 
i used to to own one of these babies they are available for purchase if anyone wants one. shipping is a bomb though.
 
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