What brand of power protection do you use?

Which brand UPS do you use?

  • APC

    Votes: 34 56.7%
  • Tripp-lite

    Votes: 5 8.3%
  • CyberPower

    Votes: 15 25.0%
  • Belkin

    Votes: 4 6.7%
  • Other

    Votes: 12 20.0%
  • None

    Votes: 7 11.7%

  • Total voters
    60

tdowning

Gawd
Joined
Oct 7, 2000
Messages
518
Looking through the network pics thread, it appears to me that at least some professional sysops believe APC brand battery back-ups to be of inferior quality, having a tendency to overcharge the batteries and damaging them.

What brand, if any, of UPS do you use, and what has your experience with them been?
 
I only trust APC. Sometimes they overcharge batteries, but I still think they are by far the better brand.
 
Just turned on an Emerson/Liebert GXT2 that's been sitting for years unplugged and it still has a usable battery charge. Well engineered like Makita battery powered gear with very low current leakage.
 
I have APCs and Cyberpowers for smaller loads, but I have an Eaton for my servers.
 
Been using the APC simple back-ups for over a decade without issue. When the battery dies after 3-4 years the cost is more then just getting a new unit unless you buy some really cheap Chinese junk battery.

I upgrade to the pro 700 a few years ago and it's been flawless.
 
I stopped buying APC after one had an internal fan that was noisy and drove me crazy, followed up by another that had a high frequency buzzing from a defective internal design. They sure aren't making them like they used to. I switched to CyberPower and everything is well again.
 
using APS CS-350 for my NAS, switch, router, and modem. Has worked great so far. Connects in with the USB port to transmit info, this UPS isn't on Synology's support list but works perfectly.
 
I'm using a stepped sine APC BR1500G with a delayed master control function on a system with a PFC protected PSU... It's an accident waiting to happen. They've replaced 2 units that arrived scratched/damaged and failed within weeks/months and I'm not expecting the third to last much longer than that. Next time it happens I think I'm just going to take it off the computer and use it as a giant surge protector.
I will be going APC again because they've taken excellent care of me but I wont be doing a "approximation of a sine wave" unit again.
 
I'm using a stepped sine APC BR1500G with a delayed master control function on a system with a PFC protected PSU... It's an accident waiting to happen. They've replaced 2 units that arrived scratched/damaged and failed within weeks/months and I'm not expecting the third to last much longer than that. Next time it happens I think I'm just going to take it off the computer and use it as a giant surge protector.
I will be going APC again because they've taken excellent care of me but I wont be doing a "approximation of a sine wave" unit again.

I have stepped sine on my 700 pro with a Corsair 650 pro which is PFC without any issues for the past 3 years.
I've had glitches and blackouts and it does it's job, powerchute puts the computer into hibernation.

I've read that even Cyberpower does not use a true sine, if you want that expect to pay $300+.
 
I have stepped sine on my 700 pro with a Corsair 650 pro which is PFC without any issues for the past 3 years.
I've had glitches and blackouts and it does it's job, powerchute puts the computer into hibernation.

I've read that even Cyberpower does not use a true sine, if you want that expect to pay $300+.

I didn't expect true sine at all. I knew to expect it to work with my PSU from someone's recommendation despite the fact it is not true sine as well or I wouldn't have ordered it, but they do not make Master Control UPS units that are true sine wave as far as I know. Not at the consumer level perhaps? The BR1500G is the most powerful unit I could find that has this feature. It allows you to configure a delayed power on/off state to several slave outlets from PowerChute and it is pretty damn slick.

As far as the stepped-sine w/ large APFC PSUs like my 1000watt Seasonic (of which currently not more than 800W of power is being used from the wall according to the APC battery backup)--but soon my main rig will not be safe to run on it as it will easily use up to 1100 with another 290X for trifire + 2 pumps etc. And so I will have to pay for what I want to get :D

But my current setup does work--I've had zero damage throughout these experiences, and I must say we've had an amazing and unusually frequent run of power dips and short outages this year. The fact the units have come through this without even actually dying is good and the fact they didn't hurt my stuff when I let it keep running during a storm is good too. I'm stubborn about the weather interrupting me when I'm on the computer... that's what I have a backup battery for. But no, it runs a self test when you plug it in and it buzzes while on battery power but it works fine. APC said I could just rip the cord out of the wall and see what happens with the 2 units that failed... they worked fine for that but I lost data on the second occurrence and on the first it was a failed self test and subsequent battery warnings. I had about 6 brownouts in a row during a crazy ass Texas T-storm just a few nights ago and this third unit (which arrived in pristine condition...) seems to be very much in control. It beeped briefly after a full outage during that storm and I did go ahead and shut everything down. That's probably good because shortly thereafter there was a complete power-cut and I saw on the news a hotel not far from here had actually caught fire after a direct hit from a lightning bolt.

Anyway, I'll try to get to my point. Seems to me the stepped sine wave from the first 2 units was causing a pretty loud buzzing sound that was quite clearly coming directly from my PSU itself. Now--this third unit also causes the same buzzing noise. But, unless I'm really going Beethoven style crazy+deaf this third unit buzzes from the UPS instead of my PSU. What in the hell lol.

Also--On the rip the cord from the wall test we performed: 1st unit, buzzing sound from PSU during cord unplug test. Second unit--Rip the cord from wall, no buzzing at all. wth... Too weird. I'm getting a regular expensive ass true sine-wave 1200watt *APC* UPS when I can get my damn credit cards paid off again. I was doing so well... :(
 
At work I have the first 3. The best unit I have is a CyberPower 2200VA devices. Well I rate it the best because 5+ years later the original 4 batteries are still working. Maybe they have a lower float voltage or do not apply the float voltage 24/7 like APC Smart units.
 
Uhh... You haven't listed any good brands... I guess T-L ISOBAR is fairly good - or at least was relatively good in the past...

For me, Panamax or Furman. Nothing you listed compares.

For UPS, Emerson/Liebert or Eaton
 
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I have 1x APC1000 rs(tall slim white, going on 10 years old, still working great), 2x APC1200 rs(APC mfg branded as Office Depot units) and 2x APC1300 lcd units,

I have bought a local battery supplier batteries and get a couple of years out of ~$30ea batteries but with my loads, get nearly an hour of on battery backup time with newer batteries.

The 2x 1200 units branded as OD ones, have crappy 40mm 24v fans internally, but they are cheap($4 on amazon prime) and fairly easy to replace. they do get a tad loud when running on battery, but thats to be expected..

Other than the fans, and batteries(expected) I have had next to zero issues with the units or the devices connected to them. In fact, they are probably the reason why I have a couple of computers still running on 5+ year old gear in them with Central Florida's storm's and power issues..

now, working in the IT field I can say that the units we have at my job, they have varying quality control on both batteries and the units.. we have a huge eaton building UPS with generator control for the datacenter/call center floor but even with that, some of the APC units are not very trustworthy these days :/
 
Makes me wonder how well this might do for battery longevity.

APC Back-UPS Pro 500 Lithium Ion
500 is rather small but should/might ramp up to higher ratings in the future but no other models I can find.
$250 at AZ, not the cheapest of course and only 2 backup ports!
Guess it's designed for NAS boxes in mind, not tower computers.

"battery life at 8 years versus just 3-5."

"Waveform Type: Quasi Sine"
 
I have a few APCs and ultras around. My main ups for servers is a trip lite inverter charger connected to 4 100ah rv batteries.

You can get "cheap Chinese batteries" for a tenth of APCs price and its the same exact battery. There's a local electrical store I go to.
 
Slightly off topic, anybody heard of/bought from battries plus? I have one local that sells around 6 different brand UPS batteries and AGM for a reasonable price.
You can even get the correct version for your UPS with higher amp hours for some extra runtime.

Amazon is the worst place you want to buy batteries though as they cannot be returned from what I read as they are deemed hazardous.
 
I'd be very surprised if APCs made in the past 5 years, at least the cheap models, would overcharge batteries because the user manual says a full charge requires something like 16+ hours. That's almost twice the time their older models required, indicating APC cut back the charging current. I think I've measured the voltage applied during charging as 13.8V or 13.6V, which indicates use of low current.

To tell the quality of the output wave, look at the Total Harmonic Distortion (THD) rating. If THD is about 10% or less, it's a true sine wave, but 40% - 50% indicates a stepped square wave.
 
My only complaint with newer APCs is the recent one (bought last year sometime) does something odd. Namely, after a power outage it'll completely drain the battery before recharging it.

My older one (like 5-6 years or so, on it's second set of batteries now) doesn't do this at all.
 
Thanks for the advice. I've gone to the local electrical supply shop before, and they had batteries for one Smart-UPS I had a while back, (Guy at the counter said they were the same SLA batteries used in exit sign emergency blackout lights) but had to go to a Batteries Plus location for the other ones I needed. Fortunately there is now a specialty battery shop about 5 minutes away from my house and they stock everything I have needed... (with the exception of the Belkin unit...they had batteries of correct dimensions and ratings, but different terminals, and they gave me adapters to convert the terminals to the correct size...)

on the subject of cheep Chinese batteries, has anyone gone that route with the newer APC units with LCDs? my older one with a red LED lit LCD panel has a pair of naked 12v batteries (IIRC) but the newer ones look like they have two batteries sandwiched terminal side to terminal side with a plastic bit in the middle with the wiring connecting the battery terminals to custom terminals on the "Cartridge"

It looks like I could cut the sheet of adhesive-backed plastic remove the old SLA batteries and connect new ones, duct-tape them to the plastic bit and put them back in... has anyone tried this?
 
Slightly off topic, anybody heard of/bought from battries plus? I have one local that sells around 6 different brand UPS batteries and AGM for a reasonable price.
You can even get the correct version for your UPS with higher amp hours for some extra runtime.

Amazon is the worst place you want to buy batteries though as they cannot be returned from what I read as they are deemed hazardous.
Thats where I buy all mine from, slightly more expensive than online but same day, and easy replacement if one is not upto snuff, plus they honor the 1 year warranty in store.

I have bought almost 10 UPS batteries from them over the last 6 years and 1 laptop battery last year.

They also gave me 25% off a replacement set when I tried to return a set that I didn't realize were outside of warranty so that was pretty awesome too.
 
I'd be very surprised if APCs made in the past 5 years, at least the cheap models, would overcharge batteries because the user manual says a full charge requires something like 16+ hours. That's almost twice the time their older models required, indicating APC cut back the charging current. I think I've measured the voltage applied during charging as 13.8V or 13.6V, which indicates use of low current.

To tell the quality of the output wave, look at the Total Harmonic Distortion (THD) rating. If THD is about 10% or less, it's a true sine wave, but 40% - 50% indicates a stepped square wave.
I dont think its an issue about voltage/current as much as quality of the power sent to the battery, and changes in batteries.

I have heard some of my units make a faint whine while charging after a power outage, and in some cases even while keeping the batteries topped off.
 
Thanks for the advice. I've gone to the local electrical supply shop before, and they had batteries for one Smart-UPS I had a while back, (Guy at the counter said they were the same SLA batteries used in exit sign emergency blackout lights) but had to go to a Batteries Plus location for the other ones I needed. Fortunately there is now a specialty battery shop about 5 minutes away from my house and they stock everything I have needed... (with the exception of the Belkin unit...they had batteries of correct dimensions and ratings, but different terminals, and they gave me adapters to convert the terminals to the correct size...)

on the subject of cheep Chinese batteries, has anyone gone that route with the newer APC units with LCDs? my older one with a red LED lit LCD panel has a pair of naked 12v batteries (IIRC) but the newer ones look like they have two batteries sandwiched terminal side to terminal side with a plastic bit in the middle with the wiring connecting the battery terminals to custom terminals on the "Cartridge"

It looks like I could cut the sheet of adhesive-backed plastic remove the old SLA batteries and connect new ones, duct-tape them to the plastic bit and put them back in... has anyone tried this?
what you are speaking of is the same system used in my almost 10 year old back-ups 1000 rs

just peal back the sticker on one side first and the batteries will separate, take a moment before you unplug to get your new batteries ready so you can swap one at a time and deal with the retaining method they used to keep the connectors plugged in and such.

also clean the side of the new battery with some rubbing alcohol (avoiding any marker that your shot may have put on the batteries) so that the adhesive can be re-used and stay applied.
 
I dont think its an issue about voltage/current as much as quality of the power sent to the battery, and changes in batteries.

I have heard some of my units make a faint whine while charging after a power outage, and in some cases even while keeping the batteries topped off.
What should the quality of the power sent to the battery be, as far as current, voltage, and ripple are concerned?

I haven't seen anything saying lead-acid batteries are fussy about the quality of power sent to them, but it's important not to overcharge them, and trickle charging at way below C/10, even indefinitely, is supposed to be very safe. So what do you mean?
 
I have 3 Liebert's in service.. and 1 I can replace the battery in.. but it was a lower series line interactive only one.. so I don't really need it right now
 
I've had three APC rackmount UPSes in service for about seven years now (two SmartUPS 1000 and one SmartUPS 1500).

I've replaced the batteries on them once each about four years in because they alerted, but the devices have been rock solid the whole time. I live on an island with 95% reliable power and before that lived in a 90 year old house with knob and tube wiring so these bad boys see their share of use (to the point that I have an email rule set up for power fluctuation alerts).
 
Pure sine = lots of $$$$$. While better, it's not required.

Eventually I do want to upgrade to a pure sine dual conversion system though. -48 volt rectifier bay + 120v pure sine inverters + battery bank. Idealy some kind of redundant system for inverter, or just two separate units.
 
I agree, pure sine wave is unuseful on a PC.
I'm using my BR1500GI since more than three years now, there are frequent outages here and a lot of spikes.
My UPS saved my PC for three years without any problem to my current Active FPC Enermax.
 
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