IPS-based gaming monitor - what to choose?

Kreon

Limp Gawd
Joined
Jul 4, 2014
Messages
137
I know, I know, guys, you tired of all these junk threads where people ask for "best monitor ever!" As someone who spent a lot of time looking for a decent gaming model and replacement for my CRT (yes, I still use) - I'm not a delusional fool.

I don't follow that much LCD arena anymore, but around 4-5 years ago I decided to swap my old good ViewSonic CRT for some decent "gaming" LCD. What a naive idiot I was. My first experience with TN+film made me throw up a bit and I promised myself I will never buy or use any monitor based on this shitty matrix. Why people do that - beyond my understanding.

However, the expected solution in case with IPS and *VA models didn't come to the rescue. After spending few months reading reviews and forums for the more or less decent models it became clear to me that none of them can be the decent replacement to my CRT. Granted, in few aspects they are always superior, but from the array of models I was trying to choose back then, there always were something that'd put me off: if display had good response time and decent backlight and okay color quality - it was input lag that would kill the whole point of getting it; if input lag was fantastic it was either noticeable trail/blur even with specified good response time or very poor backlight or high value of faulty models with tint (hello, Dell!) and color issues.

I know that perfect models don't exist, something always will be off and you have to deal with it. But I'm hoping that after 5 years may be there is a decent model that more or less will suit me?

MAIN ASPECTS I'M LOOKING FOR:
- low response time (as low as it gets for IPS)
- low input lag (same; I do play often fast-paced games)
- wide fov/angels (crucial to me, that's why I'm mostly looking at IPS)

SECONDARY ASPECTS:
- decent backlight and color quality
- preferably a model which line does not feature a lot of faulty models which f*k up picture

THINGS I'M READY TO SACRIFICE:
- don't really care about refresh rate, but it needs to be boostable at least up to 75 without noticeable issues (altho, if response time is really good - I can live with 60Hz)
- design aspects and features
- size: I'm fine with 22-24 models
- high-contrast: can deal with it
- PWM, "crystal"-effect: can live with it too


Estimated budget is around 1000$. I'd pay more but most of the models after 1000$ (up to 5k) usually more or less professional, slow modes for specific work. Basically, I'm looking for high-end budget gaming variant based on IPS (or, in worst case scenario - *VA.) TN+film can burn.

For reference: Eizo Foris FG2*** last thing I was curious about,but after reading few forums and user feedback I was ehhh.


I'd appreciate any suggestions.
 
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I understand where you're coming from. There is no win with LCDs, just a lesser loss. I would add IPS glow to your list. It is a deal breaker IMO and terrible for darker games. Less of an issue on 22-24", though. It is the worst offender to me of all the LCD's issues, even worse than TN viewing angles, and I hate TN. Even with models without it (or highly reduced), I would go for a gaming *VA panel (supposedly they are upcoming) as there is no substitution for contrast.
 
LCDs really are woeful. These and consoles are the thorns in my side as a PC enthusiast.

I am currently using a 60Hz Eizo EV2336W PLS monitor. Input lag is non existent and motion clarity is decent for an IPS.

You looked at the 21:9 ultrawide monitors? Apparently hey can do 75Hz and the Asus PB298Q has no input lag. The odd aspect puts me off them though.
 
I understand where you're coming from. There is no win with LCDs, just a lesser loss. I would add IPS glow to your list. It is a deal breaker IMO and terrible for darker games. Less of an issue on 22-24", though. It is the worst offender to me of all the LCD's issues, even worse than TN viewing angles, and I hate TN. Even with models without it (or highly reduced), I would go for a gaming *VA panel (supposedly they are upcoming) as there is no substitution for contrast.

+1. Coming from a guy that went from crt to crt to tn, to old va, to currently LG ips, my next panel will be a AHVA (auo) unless they are substantially worse for RT/lag than their other (non ips-like) tech, which seems doubtful...auo has gotten pretty good about making the right compromises (Look at Sony's tvs like w900a/x900a wrt response time, lag, and contrast: pretty much best in class). That said, I don't have experience with PLS.

To me, IPS has some wonderful things going for it (natural color and wide viewing angles), which used to be huge advantages, but that is rapidly being diminished by things like 'ultra-wide viewing angle' tech and larger color gamut panels on va models. Among the huge problems that are not going to go away for ips are pixel persistence (black-to-black) and contrast (including 'IPS glow)...aka probably the two most important things regular (non-pro or not video editting/photoshop) consumers care about (motion and black level). That is just my opinion. I understand they probably can and will be helped by stuff like brighter and faster direct backlights/strobing/dimming tech etc in the future, but inherently ips has a limit, and it's below my personal threshold on both those counts, especially since competitors have improved enough that the trade-off isn't worth it to a primarily gamer/movie watcher.

I reaaaallly like the sound of the new 4k stuff AUO is putting out (100% srgb coverage panels very soon, something wider aimed toward Adobe RGB soonish after). AUO claims 12ms response time on the 27/32 panels, but they are always very conservative in their specs. Asus claims 5ms on at least one product (that is probably) based on them. I believe they make a 1440p version as well, but haven't delved deep into them...more-so awaiting results on those.
 
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I reaaaallly like the sound of the new 4k stuff AUO is putting out (100% srgb coverage panels very soon, something wider aimed toward Adobe RGB soonish after). AUO claims 12ms response time on the 27/32 panels, but they are always very conservative in their specs. Asus claims 5ms on at least one product (that is probably) based on them. I believe they make a 1440p version as well, but haven't delved deep into them...more-so awaiting results on those.

4k too much for me, I have no plans to buy 2xTitans for it, haha. I'm okay with something humble and small. What would you suggest to take a look at from *VA that fits my requirements (OP)?
 
if input lag was fantastic it was either noticeable trail/blur even with specified good response time or very poor backlight or high value of faulty models with tint (hello, Dell!) and color issues.

Why hello there, U2312HM sufferer.

When it comes to a "gaming monitor", you have to define what "gaming" means to you.

If it's Quake or similar, you shouldn't worry about display quality, any 120hz TN panel will serve your needs better because you're after raw performance. Nobody plays these games seriously with all the visuals bells and whistles set to 11 -- quite the contrary.

These are the settings Quake players commonly use:

85201-1.jpg


What do you need good display quality for if your game is going to look like that?

This goes for all competitive games. For good reason. You want maximum visibility and minimum distractions.

If "gaming" is single player and casual multiplayer, just stop worrying about input lag. If it's below 15ms, you just won't really notice it unless you're a competitive player. If not, input lag is really not such a huge boogeyman you make it out to be.

I'll mirror VA recommendations for any "general user" -- non-competitive gaming, movies, browsing, etc. VA caught up to mainstream IPS models in terms of color reproduction and if you ask me, it's currently significantly ahead given VA's better black levels that translate into better contrast. Contrast is very important, especially to someone used to CRTs and I think you don't really understand what it means, given that you pointed it out as a negative. Modern VA pixel response is near identical to IPS -- in other words, a non-issue, unless you're really looking to get annoyed by it. I'm saying this as an AMVA owner with a very good CRT by my side that I've used for years. I only really notice overt blurring when slowly scrolling through text or static images.

Viewing angles? Just like Meeho said -- IPS glow makes IPS superior viewing angles completely moot unless you plan to play fullbright video games like League of Legends exclusively. It's extremely annoying and if it bothers you as much as it does me, you won't get used to it. If you've never seen IPS glow in real life, I insist you do before you get an IPS screen.
 
VA is a bit hit and miss. Either you're a person who swear by them or you dont like them. Its worth a try perhaps.

Dcode's suggestion about PB298Q is probably the closest to your reqs. The only other ways to go IMHO is either the QNix/X-Star route or a low budget 23.6" IPS panel like U2414 (also does 75hz). Since AFAIK all 1440p IPS brand monitors have ~20ms input lag.
 
Qnix qx2710. They are a variation on IPS (PLS) they have very low input latency , can easily overclock 96hz+ , really good picture quality and best of all they aren't very expensive. I believe NCX might have a link to a different website that offers a longer standard warranty but I can't seem to find it.

http://www.amazon.com/QNIX-QX2710-Evolution-LED-Monitor/dp/B00BUI44US

They use to be limited to buying off Ebay but as you can see Amazon stocks them now. I would buy an extended warranty however. But I own three and they are fantastic. Honestly you will have a really hard time time finding anything for the price/performance ratio.

Very few IPS monitors are tuned for gaming honestly though.
 
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if you are CRT user then YOU DO NOT WANT 60HZ WITHOUT FLICKERING, PERIOD
on CRT you have flickering which make this 75Hz or whatever refresh rate you use to be very sharp during movement. LCD without flickering are goddamn mess when it comes to motion and response time does have nothing to do with why is that. Even 0ms response time will be blurry as hell. Not to mention input lag at 60Hz is terrible even if monitor is supposedly no input lag because game will add input lag. You need high refresh rate to reduce it to useable levels. 100Hz is good_enough for me threshold. 120Hz is fine even with small input lag from monitor itself (eg. on lightboost monitors)

if you need IPS then only option are Korean overclockable monitors as they at least have no input lag. But I would still suggest to consider flickering gaming 120Hz monitors if you do want CRT motion clarity. If you play a lot and especially online then its no brainer, visibility of enemies difference on flickering monitor vs non-flickering is quite large. Friend of mine bought Lightboost monitor some time ago and played for some time without lightboost at 144Hz claiming that improvement compared to his previous overclocked to 77Hz TN was very big. But when I enabled Lightboost for him his jaw was on the floor. Its that big of a difference.

BenQ XL2420Z, XL2411Z, and XL2720Z are good performance/price ratio picks, definitely worth considering. All G-Sync monitors are good to go too as they have flickering modes too and obviously variable refresh rate feature which is great when you want no stuttering (for more demanding games).

Also Eizo Foris FG2421 seems to be best when it comes to compromise between 2D picture quality and game performance on LCD and probably something you want. Sure, its no IPS and viewing angles will be an issue but still it will be the best picture-quality wise and if that is priority then I would suggest trying it.

Motion clarity on all those monitors in flickering modes will look exactly like on CRT. Input lag will be slightly worse but you do get better refresh rate to compensate for that.

Most important is not to buy 60Hz IPS 'gaming' monitors because they are just a scam...

BTW. http://www.blurbusters.com/
 
The Eizo FG2421 is one of the best gaming monitors, however its resolution is 1080p. Unless I'm playing fps games, 1440p and above is the way to go for gaming.

Qnix qx2710. They are a variation on IPS (PLS) they have very low input latency , can easily overclock 96hz+ , really good picture quality and best of all they aren't very expensive. I believe NCX might have a link to a different website that offers a longer standard warranty but I can't seem to find it.

http://www.amazon.com/QNIX-QX2710-Evolution-LED-Monitor/dp/B00BUI44US

They use to be limited to buying off Ebay but as you can see Amazon stocks them now. I would buy an extended warranty however. But I own three and they are fantastic. Honestly you will have a really hard time time finding anything for the price/performance ratio.

Very few IPS monitors are tuned for gaming honestly though.

Qnix qx2710 occasionally go on sale for $279 on ebay. If you're lucky, more than a handful can reach 120+hz. Love that monitor.
 
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Thanks for the replies, guys, didn't expect such good responses, haha.

Qnix qx2710. They are a variation on IPS (PLS) they have very low input latency , can easily overclock 96hz+ , really good picture quality and best of all they aren't very expensive. I believe NCX might have a link to a different website that offers a longer standard warranty but I can't seem to find it..
Looking for the reviews right now, thanks.

Siamese Almeida
Why hello there, U2312HM sufferer.
Thanks god, no! Returned on the second day back to local store, haha.

When it comes to a "gaming monitor", you have to define what "gaming" means to you.
If it's Quake or similar, you shouldn't worry about display quality, any 120hz TN panel will serve your needs better because you're after raw performance. Nobody plays these games seriously with all the visuals bells and whistles set to 11 -- quite the contrary.
These are the settings Quake players commonly use:
10-12 years ago I'd say yes, I'm one of them, but these times have passed, haha. I don't do such competitive gaming anymore, mostly casual online multiplayer or offline singleplayer.

But here is a thing both XoR and you addressed that correlates with my main priority/demand to the monitor:

Modern VA pixel response is near identical to IPS -- in other words, a non-issue, unless you're really looking to get annoyed by it. I'm saying this as an AMVA owner with a very good CRT by my side that I've used for years. I only really notice overt blurring when slowly scrolling through text or static images.

if you are CRT user then YOU DO NOT WANT 60HZ WITHOUT FLICKERING, PERIOD
on CRT you have flickering which make this 75Hz or whatever refresh rate you use to be very sharp during movement. LCD without flickering are goddamn mess when it comes to motion and response time does have nothing to do with why is that. Even 0ms response time will be blurry as hell. Not to mention input lag at 60Hz is terrible even if monitor is supposedly no input lag because game will add input lag. You need high refresh rate to reduce it to useable levels. 100Hz is good_enough for me threshold. 120Hz is fine even with small input lag from monitor itself (eg. on lightboost monitors)

Motion clarity.
This is indeed something that will be important to me the most, along with input lag and response time. As someone who got used to play most of his games -- both 3D and 2d side-scrollers/platformers on 85Hz with vsyn and triple-buffer forced - I can say for sure I'm VERY sensitive to even slightest blur or delay. I believe your words that input lag below 15-14ms I probably won't notice much, but clearance of the motioness on my screen is something I'm really concerned about.

I'm ready to sacrifice the viewing angles and take VA if I had to. Let's say, I change my priority to this:

TOP PRIORITY
- motion clarity (boostable refresh rate)
- input lag
- response time
- decent image quality/backlight/blacks

LOW PRIORITY
- the rest

What would you suggest, XoR?
 
He suggested a few models, I decided to clarify my position to narrow his suggestion.

I did read the thread about Eizo FG2421, there were a lot of complains as well.
 
The Eizo FG2421 is one of the best gaming monitors, however its resolution is 1080p. Unless I'm playing fps games, 1440p and above is the way to go for gaming.

If you win the panel roulette.


Get a Eizo Forris heard nothing but good from that monitor.

You haven't been keeping very close tabs on our thread here for starters. As a fence sitter I have. There's a serious panel roulette issue. If you get a good one you're gold but it's dicey odds.


Unfortunately that monitor has all the appearances of being experimental abandonware on part of Eizo and that's a damned shame. It should be/should have been an industry shaker and a game changer.

I'm frustrated because it was at the top of my list and if it weren't such a dicey gamble I'd happily buy it now but I have ZERO confidence.



This might be helpful: http://wecravegamestoo.com/forums/m...5027-best-2560x1440-monitors.html#post1219700
 
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Yeah, that too. Don't really want to throw out 900$ for something that I will hate forever later.
 
If you win the panel roulette.

Yeah, you're right. A good chunk have gotten lucky (me), but many have had problems with that eizo monitor.

The qnix is still the best bang for the buck option imo. Input lag is non-existent for me, coming from a lightboost vg248qe monitor.
 
Yeah, you're right. A good chunk have gotten lucky (me), but many have had problems with that eizo monitor.

The qnix is still the best bang for the buck option imo. Input lag is non-existent for me, coming from a lightboost vg248qe monitor.

It's on my shortlist.
 
he already told you FG2421
pretty much yup :D

it is lottery but still better bet than TN or smearing IPS...

BTW. Good that I do not have to buy gaming monitor now because its all such a mess :cool:
 
Yeah, you're right. A good chunk have gotten lucky (me), but many have had problems with that eizo monitor.

The qnix is still the best bang for the buck option imo. Input lag is non-existent for me, coming from a lightboost vg248qe monitor.

Okay, I'm going to re-read the Eizo thread again but could you sum it up please what should I look out for regarding faulty panels and is it possible to check for them quickly before purchasing?

UPD: http://hardforum.com/showthread.php?t=1788465&page=85

Yeah, last page and I already see what I don't like.

Okay, so is there truly nothing besides QNX left? That's pretty much the problem I ended up with 5-6 years ago - 2 decent models that had issues which eliminate the point of getting them. back to the beginning.
 
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Glossy MOTV M2700 or Yamakasi Catleap
Semi-glossy (matte) Qnix QX2710 or X-Star DP2710 with 1x Dual-link DVI input since the multi-input versions drop frames when overclocked. Thread with review links for all of the best 1440p monitors.

The Acer H236H uses LED PWM Dimming (Side Effects), the Acer S236hltmjj doe not and offers equal performance and TN-like pixel response times with minor overshoot ghosting which can be reduced by changing a setting in the service menu.

The Dell P & U series 23-24" and Samsung S2xD390H and S2xD590P monitors overclock and are PWM Free. Review links for all of the best monitors can be found in here.

The frame-less IPS like the 29" 21:9 and most of the 22-24" AH-IPS monitors inner black bezels make the monitors blacks look grayish and dark scenes look washed out by comparison. The Asus PG278Q also uses the bs frame-less bezel/casing. Glossy vs Matte bezel comparisons.
 
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G

The Acer H236H uses LED PWM Dimming (Side Effects), the Acer S236hltmjj doe not and offers equal performance and TN-like pixel response times with minor overshoot ghosting which can be reduced by changing a setting in the service menu.

The Dell P & U series 23-24" and Samsung S2xD390H and S2xD590P monitors overclock and are PWM Free. Review links for all of the best monitors can be found in here.

.

OP said not concerned with PWM. Most people can't notice it on todays displays. Its like flashing red lights and epilepsy. No need to scare all kids away from cartoons lol. If prices were even I would drop it but I wouldn't spend an extra 100 bucks anymore than I would pay more for non epilepsy free Pokemon.
 
OP said not concerned with PWM.

He should be since low frequency PWM increases motion blur and there are plenty of equally priced PWM free monitors available. Usually the S236H is the same price as the H236H.

NCX does the U2413 clock to 75hz?

No and there are no wide gamut monitors available for under 800$ worth considering over the standard gamut monitors, especially Dells. Not sure why you would want to buy a U2413H or a cheaper, overclock-able Qnix/X-Star...
 
Have you considered the Eizo EV2736W?

http://www.tftcentral.co.uk/reviews/eizo_ev2736w.htm

It is an PLS monitor with virtually no 'IPS glow', so it has fantastic viewing angles. On top of that, it has little input lag and reasonably fast pixel response times too. TN panels are obviously much faster, but TN panels have horrible viewing angles.
 
Glossy MOTV M2700 or Yamakasi Catleap
Semi-glossy (matte) Qnix QX2710 or X-Star DP2710 with 1x Dual-link DVI input since the multi-input versions drop frames when overclocked. Thread with review links for all of the best 1440p monitors.

The MOTV M2700 got me interested after reading about it in that thread, but I can only find one ebay seller for it and their rating is pretty crap with very few sales. Where do people get those?
 
No and there are no wide gamut monitors available for under 800$ worth considering over the standard gamut monitors, especially Dells. Not sure why you would want to buy a U2413H or a cheaper, overclock-able Qnix/X-Star...
My budget is around 1000-1100$.
Wide gamut is not a requirement, all requirements listed here:
http://hardforum.com/showpost.php?p=1040968749&postcount=12
and in the OP.

Eizo Foris FG would be perfect is no so many faulty panels. Considering I live far, far away on East from EU I'd say we, as 4rd world country, would get the worst of the worst units. We aren't people, after all, just some barbarians.
 
buy fg2421, if you don't get a perfect panel after three tries get something else. done.
 
buy fg2421, if you don't get a perfect panel after three tries get something else. done.

After 3 times? If I have to send something back or take something back once I am done. Unless it is an exchange only product.
 
No and there are no wide gamut monitors available for under 800$ worth considering over the standard gamut monitors, especially Dells. Not sure why you would want to buy a U2413H or a cheaper, overclock-able Qnix/X-Star...

I don't want to buy a U2413H. Just curious if it overclocked.
 
Glossy MOTV M2700 or Yamakasi Catleap
Semi-glossy (matte) Qnix QX2710 or X-Star DP2710 with 1x Dual-link DVI input since the multi-input versions drop frames when overclocked. Thread with review links for all of the best 1440p monitors.

The Acer H236H uses LED PWM Dimming (Side Effects), the Acer S236hltmjj doe not and offers equal performance and TN-like pixel response times with minor overshoot ghosting which can be reduced by changing a setting in the service menu.

The Dell P & U series 23-24" and Samsung S2xD390H and S2xD590P monitors overclock and are PWM Free. Review links for all of the best monitors can be found in here.

The frame-less IPS like the 29" 21:9 and most of the 22-24" AH-IPS monitors inner black bezels make the monitors blacks look grayish and dark scenes look washed out by comparison. The Asus PG278Q also uses the bs frame-less bezel/casing. Glossy vs Matte bezel comparisons.

Thanks for the suggestions again, NCX, I will probably end up with S236hltmjj for a time being, until Acer Predator will be available. Altho, it is damn pricy.
 
Thanks for the suggestions again, NCX, I will probably end up with S236hltmjj for a time being, until Acer Predator will be available. Altho, it is damn pricy.

The HP 23 Envy is pretty much the same as the Acer, but has better overdrive which does not reset itself when the monitor is turned off or loses a signal, unlike the Acer.
 
Oh, right. Haha.
Here is the proper link: http://www.mvideo.ru/products/monitor-hp-envy-23-e1k96aa-30019299

Unfortunately, this one is almost impossible to order/find.

Regardless, I can deal with the OD issue, since it just 10 seconds of work.

That being said I also look at Samsung S24D590PL. Simply because of the overclock. 72Hz goodness, ahh. Too bad it is matte and has worse glow and dark than Acer, it seems (at least by reviews).
 
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