Budget Subwoofer

C

covertash

Gawd
Joined
Apr 24, 2006
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So recently I acquired a set of Emotiva Airmotiv 4 speakers that are hooked up to an Audioengine D1, and I am absolutely LOVING this setup! With that said, as much as I do like the punchy bass coming from the Airmotiv's, I would like to fill in that bottom end some more - especially for games and movies - with something that offers a little more punch.

I don't really want to spend too much money on the sub though because:

1. I live in an apartment and the neighbors would not be too thrilled with the sound/vibrations.
2. Because of living in an apartment, space is at somewhat of a premium.
3. I don't blast my sound anyway.

Knowing this, I have narrowed down my picks to the following:

1. Monoprice 8"
http://www.monoprice.com/products/p...=10906&cs_id=1090602&p_id=8248&seq=1&format=2

2. Monoprice 12"
http://www.monoprice.com/products/p...=10906&cs_id=1090602&p_id=9723&seq=1&format=2

3. Dayton SUB-800
http://www.parts-express.com/pe/showdetl.cfm?partnumber=300-627

4. Dayton SUB-1000
http://www.parts-express.com/pe/pshowdetl.cfm?&Partnumber=300-628

Which do you think would be the worthwhile pick? And why?

Keep in mind, I realize that at this price range, I am not looking at audiophile grade bass. Again, I would just like to have a little more punch and to fill in the bottom end as much as possible, but I am definitely not a basshead. If there are any other suggestions, please let me know. The most I would like to spend is around $200 - unless there happens to be a VERY compelling reason why I should spend more. :p

Thanks [H]!
 
Personally, I hate the sound of an 8" sub. I find that it's just not "rolly" enough bass wise. 10-12" is fantastic IMO. I had a Klipsch 5.2 setup with 2x 8" subs and the bass was just so unimpressive. Just from a personal preference point, I'd go with the 10" or 12". They provide that punch of a good sub, and the rolling low end that make movies and games fantastic. Again, that's just my preference and 2 cents lol.
 
I went a round with parts express on 10 inch subs and they suffered from poor quality both times I had them, with 2 different units, I would say steer clear of those. Although customer support was great and I paid no shipping costs and had no issue with refund. I picked up a BIC V1020 for $135 and I have been very happy with it for music and movies.

I have not heard much on the monoprice, but I am tempted to pick one up to round off my pc system.
 
Monoprice 12". I have a similar sub with the same cabinet and for the money it kicks ass. You can play a 12" at lower levels and get more out of it too. Just sounds more full.
 
FM_Fixxxer said:
Personally, I hate the sound of an 8" sub. I find that it's just not "rolly" enough bass wise. 10-12" is fantastic IMO. I had a Klipsch 5.2 setup with 2x 8" subs and the bass was just so unimpressive. Just from a personal preference point, I'd go with the 10" or 12". They provide that punch of a good sub, and the rolling low end that make movies and games fantastic. Again, that's just my preference and 2 cents lol.
Click to expand...

2x8" has almost the same surface area as the 12". If your sub was poor it had nothing to do with the driver size, it was just poor choice of enclosure, speakers and amp.

You can get excellent results by using 8" drivers. The only problem is that a good 8" driver costs just as much as a good 10" driver so small drivers tend to also be cheap / bad.
 
B00nie said:
2x8" has almost the same surface area as the 12". If your sub was poor it had nothing to do with the driver size, it was just poor choice of enclosure, speakers and amp.

You can get excellent results by using 8" drivers. The only problem is that a good 8" driver costs just as much as a good 10" driver so small drivers tend to also be cheap / bad.
Click to expand...

I concur. The "budget" HSU STF-1 is an 8' with impressive low end and clarity. Its quality is easy discernible from my Dayton Sub 80. Same size, different sound.

For the OP, I've heard Dayton is going downhill in quality in the recent months, so I would stay away from them.
 
Look at the Polk PSW10 available for $90 - $120 new. Nice clean low end with a roll off around 40hz so that helps with the sound and vibration penetration not annoying the neighbors. It's a good apartment sub.
 
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Thanks guys for all of these helpful responses! :)

I had read about the Dayton speaker quality going downhill recently, but I didn't know this extended into their subwoofers as well. What a shame. :( Nonetheless, this makes the choices much simpler.

At this point, it's looking like the Monoprice 12" sub is the strongest contender. However, I did have some follow up questions for some of the new suggestions:

Rattle said:
I went a round with parts express on 10 inch subs and they suffered from poor quality both times I had them, with 2 different units, I would say steer clear of those. Although customer support was great and I paid no shipping costs and had no issue with refund. I picked up a BIC V1020 for $135 and I have been very happy with it for music and movies.

I have not heard much on the monoprice, but I am tempted to pick one up to round off my pc system.
Click to expand...

The BIC V1020 is an interesting suggestion, and looks to be a better value for the money, with the overall cost being within a few dollars of the Monoprice 12". However (and please excuse my noobness as I am still learning), I searched and saw the amplifier section and am confused on the inputs and outputs. The ports on the back do not look like RCA connectors (at least I don't think they are :p), so how do I connect this subwoofer to my setup? Keep in mind, I do not have a receiver.


Goride said:
This sub gets recommended a lot on avsforum.com for a $200 subwoofer:

BIC F12
http://www.amazon.com/BIC-America-F12-475-Watt-Subwoofer/dp/B0015A8Y5M
Click to expand...

Another interesting choice, and right at the top of my budget! :p Same question as above, how would I connect this sub to my setup?


Ryom said:
Look at the Polk PSW10 available for $90 - $120 new. Nice clean low end with a roll off around 40hz so that helps with the sound and vibration penetration not annoying the neighbors. It's a good apartment sub.
Click to expand...

I had come across this in my searches, but I noticed that the crossover was between 80 Hz - 160 Hz. Isn't this kind of high?

I did see Amazon is offering the Polk PSW125 for $150, after a $100 discount. Any thoughts on this one?

http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0...d_t=201&pf_rd_p=1545819162&pf_rd_i=B0002KVQBA
 
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As an Amazon Associate, HardForum may earn from qualifying purchases.
covertash said:
Thanks guys for all of these helpful responses! :)

I had read about the Dayton speaker quality going downhill recently, but I didn't know this extended into their subwoofers as well. What a shame. :( Nonetheless, this makes the choices much simpler.

At this point, it's looking like the Monoprice 12" sub is the strongest contender. However, I did have some follow up questions for some of the new suggestions:



The BIC V1020 is an interesting suggestion, and looks to be a better value for the money, with the overall cost being within a few dollars of the Monoprice 12". However (and please excuse my noobness as I am still learning), I searched and saw the amplifier section and am confused on the inputs and outputs. The ports on the back do not look like RCA connectors (at least I don't think they are :p), so how do I connect this subwoofer to my setup? Keep in mind, I do not have a receiver.




Another interesting choice, and right at the top of my budget! :p Same question as above, how would I connect this sub to my setup?




I had come across this in my searches, but I noticed that the crossover was between 80 Hz - 160 Hz. Isn't this kind of high?

I did see Amazon is offering the Polk PSW125 for $150, after a $100 discount. Any thoughts on this one?

http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0...d_t=201&pf_rd_p=1545819162&pf_rd_i=B0002KVQBA
Click to expand...


You connect it like any other with a subwoofer cable :p It has the "rca"

http://g-ecx.images-amazon.com/images/G/01/ciu/31/6c/2923c0a398a023337a4a2210.L.jpg
 
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Rattle said:
You connect it like any other with a subwoofer cable :p It has the "rca"

http://g-ecx.images-amazon.com/images/G/01/ciu/31/6c/2923c0a398a023337a4a2210.L.jpg
Click to expand...

That doesnt help him exactly.

The picture here shows only a mono line-level RCA input and stereo high-level speaker inputs. You can't use the high-level speaker inputs because your source is line-level from your DAC.

OP, since you have a DAC that outputs a line-level signal and also active speakers that are full-range here is what I would do.

Simply split the RCA outputs from the DAC into your subwoofer and your speakers. You will need a subwoofer that has line-level stereo RCA inputs or else you will only get bass from one channel.

You will then have to play with the crossover knob on the subwoofer (make sure it has one of these too). You need to cut off the top range of the subwoofer to a reasonable level. Basically wherever your speakers start to really play back frequencies well. Maybe around 80-100Hz.

http://www.amazon.com/RiteAV-RCA-Splitter-Male-Female/dp/B000V1JUJU
 
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Personally, I would avoid Dayton. I've had two and I wasn't satisfied with either. One had internal grounding issues. Both sounded very poor. I would look into some of Polk's and BIC's less expensive options.
 
Rattle said:
You connect it like any other with a subwoofer cable :p It has the "rca"

http://g-ecx.images-amazon.com/images/G/01/ciu/31/6c/2923c0a398a023337a4a2210.L.jpg
Click to expand...

Haha, still learning as I go. :p


SirMaster said:
That doesnt help him exactly.

The picture here shows only a mono line-level RCA input and stereo high-level speaker inputs. You can't use the high-level speaker inputs because your source is line-level from your DAC.

OP, since you have a DAC that outputs a line-level signal and also active speakers that are full-range here is what I would do.

Simply split the RCA outputs from the DAC into your subwoofer and your speakers. You will need a subwoofer that has line-level stereo RCA inputs or else you will only get bass from one channel.

You will then have to play with the crossover knob on the subwoofer (make sure it has one of these too). You need to cut off the top range of the subwoofer to a reasonable level. Basically wherever your speakers start to really play back frequencies well. Maybe around 80-100Hz.

http://www.amazon.com/RiteAV-RCA-Splitter-Male-Female/dp/B000V1JUJU
Click to expand...

Thank you for the detailed reply! :) Judging from your response, it looks like none of the BIC's mentioned above would work with my setup, which is a shame since the reviews are very favorable. If that is the case, it looks like the Monoprice 12" is all that is left since it coincidentally has RCA inputs and outputs, unless there are other good choices for $200 or less.

Does that sound about right?
 
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covertash said:
Thank you for the detailed reply! :) Judging from your response, it looks like none of the BIC's mentioned above would work with my setup, which is a shame since the reviews are very favorable. If that is the case, it looks like the Monoprice 12" is all that is left since it coincidentally has RCA inputs and outputs, unless there are other good choices for $200 or less.

Does that sound about right?
Click to expand...

Correct, anything that has a Red and a White (stereo) Line-In as well as a crossover knob (like the Monoprice 12"). Though the crossover knob isnt strictly necessary, it's just highly recommended for optmal sound and subwoofer performance.
 
Normally I'd tell you to get the 12" Dayton or Bic, but since you don't like too much bass and have neighbours, you'd probably be better off with an 8 or 10". Also those speakers you have run a 4.5" midrange, pairing them with a 12" sub might not deliver as much midbass. I'd stay away from Polk subwoofers, they're kind of shit.
 
SirMaster said:
Correct, anything that has a Red and a White (stereo) Line-In as well as a crossover knob (like the Monoprice 12"). Though the crossover knob isnt strictly necessary, it's just highly recommended for optmal sound and subwoofer performance.
Click to expand...

Thank you so much! Your information has helped clear things up for me. :cool:

matteos said:
Normally I'd tell you to get the 12" Dayton or Bic, but since you don't like too much bass and have neighbours, you'd probably be better off with an 8 or 10". Also those speakers you have run a 4.5" midrange, pairing them with a 12" sub might not deliver as much midbass. I'd stay away from Polk subwoofers, they're kind of shit.
Click to expand...

Yeah, I was originally looking at those Daytons above. However, with a growing number of concerns surrounding their recent quality control, would you still recommend them? It'd be interesting especially considering that they are cheaper after shipping is assessed. :)
 
PolygonGTC said:
You'll recommend Dayton, then call Pok shit. Well, that's interesting...
Click to expand...

Not really. Look at frequency response charts for either. In that price range, the Polks are really peaky, have substantial ringing, and THD numbers are high. Something like a Dayton Sub 1200 measures well in that price range.
 
LeninGHOLA said:
Not really. Look at frequency response charts for either. In that price range, the Polks are really peaky, have substantial ringing, and THD numbers are high. Something like a Dayton Sub 1200 measures well in that price range.
Click to expand...

I honestly don't give a crap about the spec sheets. I've heard many subs from both and Daytons sound like a flatulent geriatric. Polks have much tighter bass. They sound better all around. Not to mention, I've had to deal with the poor construction of Daytons as well. I'll never buy another one. They're cheap, not inexpensive.
 
PolygonGTC said:
What you mentioned are specs, whatever the source. The point is that I don't care what they do on paper. I care about how they sound. I've not heard a good sounding Dayton.
Click to expand...

The... sound... is what is measured. There is never a case of measurements not matching up with real world sound, if the testing is done correctly.
 
I highly recommend the Bic F12 if you can swing it. I got one for my home theater setup and it's been great.

I do have a Dayton for my PC rig and it's been great, but it's pretty old at this point and pre-dates the time when all the complaints started to surface about Dayton gear.
 
PolygonGTC said:
You'll recommend Dayton, then call Pok shit. Well, that's interesting...
Click to expand...

Dayton are good for the price, which is cheap.

Polk are shit for the price. That's the difference. There are much better subs out there, but this is a thread about budget subs. The Dayton doesn't stack against an HSU or an SVS but it is much better than the boomy weak ass Polk.

PSW10 is around $200 at brick and mortar stores, sure you can get it less online, but it performs much worse than the Dayton 1200 which can be had for considerably less money. The PSW10 is boomy, underpowered (50 watts RMS), I don't think it's even braced, it has thin cabinets and is basically crap. If someone is suggesting budget Pols, that is no doubt the one they are recommending, May as well get yourself the $50 Yamaha.

Polk PSW10 - weight 26lbs
Power 50 Watts RMS
Driver 10 inch
FR - 35hz - 200hz

Dayton 1200 - weight - 44lbs
Power - 120 watts RMS
Driver 12 inch
FR - 25hz -140hz


The better Polk sub the PSW110 which is $250 at best buy


FR - 32Hz-250Hz
Power 100W RMS
Driver - 10 inch
Weight - 33.5lbs


Polk make some good speakers, but they are fairly well known for making shite subwoofers, go on into best buy and have a listen to the PSW10. It sounds like garbage, it's really light and it feels cheaply made and of low quality.
 
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covertash said:
Thank you so much! Your information has helped clear things up for me. :cool:



Yeah, I was originally looking at those Daytons above. However, with a growing number of concerns surrounding their recent quality control, would you still recommend them? It'd be interesting especially considering that they are cheaper after shipping is assessed. :)
Click to expand...

I don't know. Maybe your better off getting the BIC. It wouldn't be the first time someone's cut the quality after getting good reports for best bang for buck.
 
ThinJ said:
I highly recommend the Bic F12 if you can swing it. I got one for my home theater setup and it's been great.

I do have a Dayton for my PC rig and it's been great, but it's pretty old at this point and pre-dates the time when all the complaints started to surface about Dayton gear.
Click to expand...

matteos said:
I don't know. Maybe your better off getting the BIC. It wouldn't be the first time someone's cut the quality after getting good reports for best bang for buck.
Click to expand...

LeninGHOLA said:
Yes, the BIC is a pretty good value.
Click to expand...

I was close to pulling the trigger on a BIC. Sadly, I do not have a receiver, so I wouldn't be able to utilize them at all... unless there is a way that I can use them with my Audioengine D1 and Airmotiv speakers. :(
 
These are the days that I wish Adire Audio was still around.. they had great quality for the price. (they weren't very pretty though)

DIY an option? You could pick and choose an onboard amp or go with a reciever.
 
LeninGHOLA said:
Nobody was talking about spec sheets.
http://www.avsforum.com/t/1457357/polk-psw10-omnimic-frequency-response-graphs
Click to expand...

From that very same review (RE: Polk PSW10):

It is more than I would have expected from the little 50 watt powerplant. (100watt peak) I will say this sub is significantly superior to the Pioneer SW-8 I own and have reviewed (also rated at 50watt). The Pioneer couldn't do half of what this sub was doing in my theater room. I'm starting to agree with my friend. This sub would suit the average Joe non audio enthusiast just fine. It's something my uncle or cousin who just wants something to fill in the bottom end would likely be most pleased with. Listening to dubstep most of the music is okay at the 90dB level. Listening to top 40 type music you can approach the 95dB level. Especially bass heavy music will need be backed off a bit. The sub is most comfortable in the <90dB range for bass heavy music. How about relative to other budget subs??? The BIC F12 is superior in sound quality, volume capability, frequency response, and exhibits less port noise -- but it costs twice as much. The Klipsch RW-12D is a significant step above the BIC F12, but it is 3x's the cost at the current Newegg closeout. For $80 - $100 this sub just became my recommended bare budget recommendation. I've updated my list. It won't do everything right - but it does enough right to be enjoyable in a small to medium sized room. I'd expect it'll best most medium tier "home theater in box" subs. Keep your expectations for reasonable playback levels in check and figure the price in with your rating and this truly is a "good" subwoofer... ... ... for those that haven't heard better.
Click to expand...

Sounds like exactly what the OP described as his needs. If he gets a sub with substantial output below 40hz his neighbors will hate him. A strong 20hz wave goes right through walls and gets attenuated into an annoying hum and vibration. People are recommending GREAT subs, but they aren't really looking at what the OP POSTED AS HIS NEEDS! Lower volume levels, trying to avoid sending sound through the walls, needs to fill in the low end a bit, inexpensive, compatible with his setup.
 
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magnetik said:
These are the days that I wish Adire Audio was still around.. they had great quality for the price. (they weren't very pretty though)

DIY an option? You could pick and choose an onboard amp or go with a reciever.
Click to expand...

That looks to be an awesome project to embark upon! :eek: Sadly, I don't have the space nor the tools to do it at the moment. I will bookmark that site should my living arrangements change for the better. :D

How long did the project take you in total, from start to finish?

Ryom said:
From that very same review (RE: Polk PSW10):



Sounds like exactly what the OP described as his needs. If he gets a sub with substantial output below 40hz his neighbors will hate him. A strong 20hz wave goes right through walls and gets attenuated into an annoying hum and vibration. People are recommending GREAT subs, but they aren't really looking at what the OP POSTED AS HIS NEEDS! Lower volume levels, trying to avoid sending sound through the walls, needs to fill in the low end a bit, inexpensive, compatible with his setup.
Click to expand...

Thank you. These are very good points in favor of the Polk. :)
 
No problem, I have the PSW10 and as long as you aren't trying to fill a stadium it does just fine for what it costs. One of the biggest factors in your enjoyment is going to be placing the sub correctly. Look up "subwoofer crawl" before you just pick a spot to put it in. Properly placed you'll get great sound out of it.

IMG_1911.jpg
 
I also have a Polk PSW10 i have had mine for 4yrs or so... I'm happy with it.. I am not trying to shake the walls or the neighbor's houses.. I use mine with my pc with a pair of JBL L1s and a Pioneer SX-780 to fill out the low end ..
 
covertash said:
That looks to be an awesome project to embark upon! :eek: Sadly, I don't have the space nor the tools to do it at the moment. I will bookmark that site should my living arrangements change for the better. :D

How long did the project take you in total, from start to finish?
Click to expand...

yeah tools are very expensive when you don't have any. :D Luckily I still use a lot of the tools I had to buy back then for the project. It took a little over 3 weekends with a little work sprinkled here and there.
 
I own both the Polk PSW10 and TWO of the Dayton SUB-1200's.

Yes, the Dayton sounds better than the Polk with a lower bottom end (obviously) ... but the difference is not NEARLY as cut and dry as certain people above (with a rather obvious bias) would try and make it out to be. When you can routinely get the PSW10 for under $100 and you're looking to save every penny, it's going to be a winner every time.

The Polk PSW10 is quite a beast for $100 (and I don't give a fucking rat's ass what the MSRP is, it SELLS routinely for $99 or less). Although rated for 50w RMS (100w peak), wattage isn't everything... take a look at your average 12,000 DVD/HTIB if you really need an example. The PSW10 puts out some impressive low end and handles even high output demands quite well. If you crank the bass all the way up, lower the crossover all the way, and crank the bass and volume on your receiver/amp you will notice some chuffing - but in all situations but that it handles itself quite well.

I've been inside the PSW10 (and the PSW12 as well) and although the design is certainly not 'high end' it's more than adequate for the price. Component choices and soldering on the plate amp are decent and overall construction is nice and heavy. No, it's not a $1,000 subwoofer and it doesn't make any claims to be... but it's hardly 'crap' either.

The Dayton SUB-1200 isn't a bad build either, but it's also $40 - $50 more expensive and may even be overkill depending on your system's configuration and room characteristics.

If I had the money to throw around I'd still pick the SUB-1200 (or even the Monoprice 12") every time, but that extra $40 - $50 might be useful for speaker wire, stands, ceiling mounts, or other accessories. Let your budget and your ears decide and try not to go it based on forum posts alone....
 
I own the Polk PSW505 , it's not a "tame" sub by any means. But it has a volume knob so you can easily turn it down if you feel its too aggressive for your apartment. It hits HARD , not as deep sub bass as other subs but if you want sub bass you are going to pay for it (that and a noiseless cabinet seem to be the big ticket items) but its easily worth the price. I got mine on sale for $150 and haven't looked back.

Polk gets its share of hate (as evident in this very thread) but for the money they are worth while. Dayton has also changed manufacturers so its not the great deal it use to be since the quality has taken a nose dive. The reality is for the budget you want , the PSW505 is probably as good as its going to get. There are better subs for sure but they will cost probably double what you will pay for the PSW505. So you just have to be realistic with your expectations and you'll be fine. I'll probably get a HSU down the line but right now I'm still digging my PSW505 pretty well. I have no experience with the Monoprice 12" sub so I can't really give you any advice on that.

I recommend you go for the PSW505 , its certainly more than you need but for the price its hard to pass up.
 
I would definitly go with the Polk PSW505 OP. It has the stereo Line-In that you need as well as lowpass adjustment. Also, the current $179 price is the best it's ever been.

Don't bother with the PSW10 it was very underwelming when I had the chance to hear it.
 
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