Zuckerberg's New Group Pushing For Immigration Reform

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Mark Zuckerberg, along with a bunch of other tech industry big-wigs, are banding together to push for immigration reform. Odd, I had no idea there was a lack of talented and hard working people in the U.S. to fill these positions.

That’s why I am proud to announce FWD.us, a new organization founded by leaders of our nation’s technology community to focus on these issues and advocate a bipartisan policy agenda to build the knowledge economy the United States needs to ensure more jobs, innovation and investment.

These leaders, who reflect the breadth and depth of Silicon Valley’s entrepreneurial culture, include Reid Hoffman, Eric Schmidt, Marissa Mayer, Drew Houston, Ron Conway, Chamath Palihapitiya, Joe Green, Jim Breyer, Matt Cohler, John Doerr, Paul Graham, Mary Meeker, Max Levchin, Aditya Agarwal and Ruchi Sanghvi.
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One day I asked my students what they thought about going to college. One of my top aspiring entrepreneurs told me he wasn’t sure that he’d be able to go to college because he’s undocumented. His family is from Mexico, and they moved here when he was a baby. Many students in my community are in the same situation; they moved to the United States so early in their lives that they have no memories of living anywhere else.

These students are smart and hardworking, and they should be part of our future.
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For welfare, why work when you can pop out kids and put them on welfare? free money!!! :rolleyes:
 
I assume the people involved want to be regarded as the most hated people in tech?
 
Sooooo because a large majority of immigrants feel the need to break the law the instant the step into the country, we should just shoot down the laws that were voted into place. Why not just get rid of the borders all together?

For loving America "so so much" they sure don't seem to care about the part where they are breaking the law.

If enough of my friends and I wanted to move to france illegally -- should we expect their laws to change just because enough of us showed up?
 
They are most likely most interested in H1B visas for professional workers ... since those were reserved for professionals (usually with advanced degrees) and since most advanced degrees in the USA are awarded to foreign students I think we probably should expand that program (otherwise we are letting other countries profit from their expertise) ... now L1 visas we should be more careful with (which I suspect they also want more of) since those are the ones that create income imbalance ... major tech companies don't knowingly employ illegal immigrants and the H1B visa allotment usually ran out in hours to weeks so we definitely need more of them ;)
 
kbrickley said:
They are most likely most interested in H1B visas for professional workers ... since those were reserved for professionals (usually with advanced degrees) and since most advanced degrees in the USA are awarded to foreign students I think we probably should expand that program (otherwise we are letting other countries profit from their expertise) ... now L1 visas we should be more careful with (which I suspect they also want more of) since those are the ones that create income imbalance ... major tech companies don't knowingly employ illegal immigrants and the H1B visa allotment usually ran out in hours to weeks so we definitely need more of them ;)
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Correction: CHEAPER professional workers. There is no shortage of skilled workers. However, there is a shortage of workers from the US who prefer to get paid below market rate. What we actually need is an increase in funding for STEM educational programs.
 
Grahamkracka said:
Correction: CHEAPER professional workers. There is no shortage of skilled workers. However, there is a shortage of workers from the US who prefer to get paid below market rate. What we actually need is an increase in funding for STEM educational programs.
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H1B workers are usually paid the same wages as any other professional worker in the USA but they are generally required to be PHD's or other highly advanced workers ... since about 75% of all PHDs in the USA are granted to foreign students there is definitely a need for these ... without this Visa type these workers would take their PHD back to their home country ... that would be bad for the US's long term competitiveness

L1 workers are the cheaper labor pool ... they are local workers at a foreign site who are transferred into the USA for "temporary assignment" ... they are generally paid their prevailing wage (with some cost of living adjustments) but usually make far less than their local counterparts ... those Visa types don't require the advanced degrees, only that the person already work for your company at the foreign site ... these Visas can be abused and should be limited

The USA also desperately needs some form of temporary worker program ... a program that would allow foreign nationals to enter and work in the USA but would grant them no citizenship privileges at all ... and when their temporary status expires they should return to their home countries ... this would satisfy the need for migratory workers in agriculture and construction

The H1B Visa is the only form that would allow the worker to eventually become a citizen, if they remained in the USA long enough ... not all Visas and immigrants are created equal and we shouldn't judge them all by the same measuring stick ;)
 
kbrickley said:
They are most likely most interested in H1B visas for professional workers ... since those were reserved for professionals (usually with advanced degrees) and since most advanced degrees in the USA are awarded to foreign students I think we probably should expand that program (otherwise we are letting other countries profit from their expertise) ... now L1 visas we should be more careful with (which I suspect they also want more of) since those are the ones that create income imbalance ... major tech companies don't knowingly employ illegal immigrants and the H1B visa allotment usually ran out in hours to weeks so we definitely need more of them ;)
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Grahamkracka said:
Correction: CHEAPER professional workers. There is no shortage of skilled workers. However, there is a shortage of workers from the US who prefer to get paid below market rate. What we actually need is an increase in funding for STEM educational programs.
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Pretty much spot on. I am a Gulf War Vet (the first one) and I have no degree, but these H1B folks do, ergo they are smarter than I am. Not the case. Once I finally got established in my field (still with no degree) I managed to crack that network where people aren't looking for a person with xyz skills & a degree, they're looking for me specifically. If that weren't the case and I still had to go through HR departments for jobs, the fact that I have "no advanced degree" gets me thrown out of the pool.

I would be surprised if there weren't a lot of military veterans that don't have degrees, but are more qualified for a lot of positions than people getting H1B visas. Too bad our government can't see that particular reality.
 
Are you guys even talking about the same kinds of jobs that these people are interested in? If we look at the vast majority of those individuals that have started this group, they're all major software companies. The amount of people who are actually qualified for those jobs and actually are found by these companies is actually retardedly small. It's not uncommon for these companies to go through dozens of candidates and only come out with one person who is qualified.

I've heard stories of game development studios trying to find qualified programmers to join their teams and they want you to succeed in their interview (if you even got that far, you're way ahead of the pack). But they often find during the interview that you're not as good as they thought you were and won't hire you.

My graduating class in CS, I would easily rule out half to 3/4ths of them as immediate no hires. The rest, I would have to grill the shit out of them in interviews before I could come to any conclusion about their skill level and competency. Just judging by those sort of numbers alone, I wouldn't doubt at all the skill shortage is very real for the jobs these people are looking to fill. We're not talking about something where somebody knows how to use a computer. We're talking about people who would know how to build a compiler or speed up algorithms by exponential amounts. People who can squeeze out every last ounce of power out of computer systems or scale them up linearly over massive distributed systems.

These things aren't trivial and requires a lot of experience and education to be able to do. People with good hiring practices (in my opinion) will consider candidates from all backgrounds as long as they have some sort of grounds to suspect they might have the skills necessary. It's unfortunate that many large companies will immediately rule out those who don't have a degree from XYZ university or some other retarded measure, but they've got to rule people out somehow to whittle down the numbers...
 
How about we take care of our own first and let immigrants compete for the leftovers?
In the meantime I guess all of our out of work citizens can always go to Mexico, India, etc.. and sign up for a free lunch...oh wait. :rolleyes:

In times like these I feel that H1B's should be limited or suspended until the job market stabilizes. But since the US has no unemployment, homeless or hunger problems of our own...carry on. :rolleyes:
 
collegeboy69us said:
If enough of my friends and I wanted to move to france illegally -- should we expect their laws to change just because enough of us showed up?
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is the United States killing all of your relatives and you're being oppressed enough to seek refuge into France, which is a border country to said oppressive country?

I guess it's alright if we preach about human rights, but fuck you if you seek refuge from countries that violate it.

Immigration reforms isn't about handouts. It's about giving them a chance to earn their living in this country. Stop reading GOP regurgitation and start reading some of the reform policies being considered.
 
Ohmycaptain said:
Minimum wage fucks our economy worse in the first place let alone raising it.
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Is that right? I guess the states and/or cities that are doing so well because their minimum wages are higher than those that aren't doing so well are doomed to be fucked in the next few days.

Another bullshit GOP regurgitation.
 
Ohmycaptain said:
Minimum wage fucks our economy worse in the first place let alone raising it.
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Thank you!

Why is it that so many not understand that raising the minimum wage is a farce, and that the extra cost of the increased wages simply gets passed on to customers? Therefore the cost of living goes up, eating away the newfound "wealth". Anyone already making the new minimum wage and above don't get a raise, and therefore get a pay CUT.

EVERYONE LOSES! (except maybe the elite).
 
kbrickley said:
H1B workers are usually paid the same wages as any other professional worker in the USA but they are generally required to be PHD's or other highly advanced workers ... since about 75% of all PHDs in the USA are granted to foreign students there is definitely a need for these ... without this Visa type these workers would take their PHD back to their home country ... that would be bad for the US's long term competitiveness

L1 workers are the cheaper labor pool ... they are local workers at a foreign site who are transferred into the USA for "temporary assignment" ... they are generally paid their prevailing wage (with some cost of living adjustments) but usually make far less than their local counterparts ... those Visa types don't require the advanced degrees, only that the person already work for your company at the foreign site ... these Visas can be abused and should be limited

The USA also desperately needs some form of temporary worker program ... a program that would allow foreign nationals to enter and work in the USA but would grant them no citizenship privileges at all ... and when their temporary status expires they should return to their home countries ... this would satisfy the need for migratory workers in agriculture and construction

The H1B Visa is the only form that would allow the worker to eventually become a citizen, if they remained in the USA long enough ... not all Visas and immigrants are created equal and we shouldn't judge them all by the same measuring stick ;)
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Just by being dumped into the labor pool, they drive wages down.

Instead of wages going up to attrack employees, the get an H1B. And I'm not talking about it negating a undo increase. Essentially an employer no longer has to keep pace with inflation or the professional rate relative to industries. Do this for 6-7 years and its like you gave everyone a 20% pay cut.
 
Azhar said:
is the United States killing all of your relatives and you're being oppressed enough to seek refuge into France, which is a border country to said oppressive country?

I guess it's alright if we preach about human rights, but fuck you if you seek refuge from countries that violate it.

Immigration reforms isn't about handouts. It's about giving them a chance to earn their living in this country. Stop reading GOP regurgitation and start reading some of the reform policies being considered.
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If you ask someone if we should pull out of every foreign country -- I'd be one of the first people to raise my hands. I pulled France out of my ass as an example -- has nothing to do with borders or who's being oppressed/repressed.

The major problem we have is Mexico (i'm just going to come out and say it) -- I've lived in south texas -- ask me how I know. As far as I know the US isn't oppressing or destroying Mexico in any way, yet every day we have more coming over.

I'm not opposed to immigration at all -- I just want it to be the legal and fair kind. If you put in the time to apply, get approved, and are allowed in, welcome!

Just because you can swim a river or climb a fence does not entitle you to be able to sap our increasingly limited social services. I'd love to be able to walk into a hospital for some common non life threatening ailment, when it's time to pay the bill just shrug and say "no english" and stroll out without paying a dime.
 
Azhar said:
Immigration reforms isn't about handouts. It's about giving them a chance to earn their living in this country. Stop reading GOP regurgitation and start reading some of the reform policies being considered.
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"Immigration reform"

Just the double talk nature of the words indicate the type of person that is pushing it and their deceptive motives. For democrats, its about future voters. For GOP leadership, its about dumping labor into the labor market. Which also indirectly helps democrats. I guess Christians want it because they're hoping to pad the country with Catholics. (I won't weep when California starts restricting the liberal sacrament of abortion and the liberals just go bananas over it - meager consolation prize, though).

The majority doesn't want it but they keep bringing it up. And we focus on the sob stories and ignore the negatives. Its obvious its beng jammed down our throats.
 
Frankly, we should have just taken Mexico when we occupied Mexico City in the Mexican-American War. Everyone would be better off for it.
 
jpm100 said:
"Immigration reform"

Just the double talk nature of the words indicate the type of person that is pushing it and their deceptive motives. For democrats, its about future voters. For GOP leadership, its about dumping labor into the labor market. Which also indirectly helps democrats. I guess Christians want it because they're hoping to pad the country with Catholics. (I won't weep when California starts restricting the liberal sacrament of abortion and the liberals just go bananas over it - meager consolation prize, though).

The majority doesn't want it but they keep bringing it up. And we focus on the sob stories and ignore the negatives. Its obvious its beng jammed down our throats.
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Got a source to back up that claim?
 
collegeboy69us said:
Sooooo because a large majority of immigrants feel the need to break the law the instant the step into the country, we should just shoot down the laws that were voted into place. Why not just get rid of the borders all together?

For loving America "so so much" they sure don't seem to care about the part where they are breaking the law.

If enough of my friends and I wanted to move to france illegally -- should we expect their laws to change just because enough of us showed up?
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Yes, because they managed to out populate the people of this country, that made them voters and now any political party that wants to be in office has to pander to that vote.

Also my favorite part about immigration reform is that when you look at it and think about how it will pan it, its not immigration reform its central American immigration reform, meaning the people who will far and away benefit the most from it are Hispanics. No one else who has to some how break into this country from across an ocean is going to see the benefit of this in any significant numbers. That is how you know that all this stuff is just pandering to the Hispanic vote and has nothing to do with trying to be fair or right to foreigners.

To me its a simple deal, you come into this country illegally then you deal with it, that's your problem, look on the bright side we don't throw you in jail like other countries. Personally it all bugs me to no end mostly because in my family their are immigrants, people who did it the right way, paid the fees, waited for long periods of time to get slow shit through USCIS and didn't cut the line, but all we are told is, hey because you came here legally you have to sign an affidative of support which means you cant get various aid, and because you came here legally you have to keep paying hundreds of dollars for this or that application. But the illegals what do they get? All the benefits and now, they are going to be told its even more lucrative to break in and cut the line.

At the end of the day, right and wrong don't matter its all about voters. So what can you do? Learn to abuse the system that bad voting and policy made best.
 
And just for the record I think if they are going to push this stuff through, then they need to go part huge ships over in Asia, Europe and Africa and load them up with any people who want to come into this country and allow them in, in equal numbers to what comes across the Rio Grande every year.
 
'That’s why I am proud to announce FWD.us, a new organization founded by leaders of our nation’s technology community to focus on these issues and advocate a bipartisan policy agenda to build the knowledge economy the United States needs to ensure more jobs, innovation and investment.'

That's why I am proud to annouce FWD.us: Fuck Working Dudes in the US. A new organization founded by industry leaders to maximize profit at any cost.
 
Madoc said:
'That’s why I am proud to announce FWD.us, a new organization founded by leaders of our nation’s technology community to focus on these issues and advocate a bipartisan policy agenda to build the knowledge economy the United States needs to ensure more jobs, innovation and investment.'

That's why I am proud to annouce FWD.us: Fuck Working Dudes in the US. A new organization founded by industry leaders to maximize profit at any cost.
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I'll support this product or service since the only thing US citizens do with their money is buy imported Sony Playstations and junky German automobiles like the Subaru Outback or the Lamborghini Ferengi XPS.
 
Not to forget history, Americans poured into the Texas territory illegally too in the 1800's. The biggest difference in how we treat the illegal immigrants and how Mexico treated Americans: USA affords illegal immigrants lots of benefits; Mexico attacked Texans of the time, which is why Texas rose up to defeat Mexico.
 
Without Immigration, the US's talent pool dries right up.

The majority of your brightest people are immigrants.

let it begin.
 
EVIL-SCOTSMAN said:
Without Immigration, the US's talent pool dries right up.

The majority of your brightest people are immigrants.

let it begin.
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Not so much anymore. We drained all the smart ones out of Europe a long time ago. But still plenty of legal immigration from other areas.
 
ravx25 said:
Not to forget history, Americans poured into the Texas territory illegally too in the 1800's. The biggest difference in how we treat the illegal immigrants and how Mexico treated Americans: USA affords illegal immigrants lots of benefits; Mexico attacked Texans of the time, which is why Texas rose up to defeat Mexico.
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what are you talking about? America was 100% founded on white people. Anyone else who come here are welfare recipients and anyone who support them are s.

:rolleyes:

It's pathetic how the right consider themselves Christians and in the same breath, shun fellow humans rather than to help them.

As for electioneering, the Democrats are doing it for the votes? Last I checked, it was the Republicans who has to win the hearts of the latino population, not the Democrats.
 
Azhar said:
what are you talking about? America was 100% founded on white people. Anyone else who come here are welfare recipients and anyone who support them are s.

:rolleyes:

It's pathetic how the right consider themselves Christians and in the same breath, shun fellow humans rather than to help them.

As for electioneering, the Democrats are doing it for the votes? Last I checked, it was the Republicans who has to win the hearts of the latino population, not the Democrats.
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No one said that, bub.

And, on electioneering, yeah they are doing it for the votes primarily: how is it therefore a surprise that they have the "hearts of the latino population" as a result of pandering? No one wants to hear "you committed a crime to come here, get behind those not breaking the law", they want to hear "you can be legal, come enjoy all our benefits for free!". Who wouldn't?
 
I must have bumped the backspace key somehow. The first paragraph should have said "and anyone who support them are s"

And I still disagree, Democrats already have the Latino votes. It's the GOP who needs to play the election game to get them back. If they would stop saying stupid shit like wetbacks, MAYBE they'll have some chance of getting their attention in 2014 and 2016, but I'm not holding my breath. More undocumented immigrants have been deported by the Obama administration than any administration in US history by a long shot, and the democrats STILL got the Latino vote easily.

Immigration reforms isn't about pandering. It's about solving a very real problem this country faces. You can spin it as a Democrat ploy all you want, but what you're really doing is denying that 1. the GOP are assholes, and 2. there's a problem that needs fixing.

Do the Democrats do everything as promised? no of course not. That's the nature of politics - sometimes compromise is necessary and broken promises are the lesser of a party's evil than doing nothing.

Besides, isn't a bunch of Republicans also behind the reform?
 
nope I didn't bump the backspace keys. I guess the forum doesn't like the word l i b t a r d s.
 
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