Amazon Trying To Ruin Valentine's Day

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Hey Amazon, quit being jerks and give this lady her money. The sad part is, the lady being hosed by Amazon literally drained her bank account to make sure everyone got their flowers for Valentine's Day.

"They said your account is currently under review because you're very new, you have no feedback and we're gonna hold the money up to 90 days," Susan says. She claims she made over $10,000 in five days, but that so far she's only seen $45.02 of that. Susan needed those funds to buy more supplies for a very important holiday in the flower world — Valentine's Day — so instead of leaving her customers in the lurch, she drained her bank account to ship what orders she could last week.
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As Amazon customers, would we really want Amazon to just hand over our money to an entity thats brand new, with no feedback, and with a sudden flurry of orders? Thatd be a recipe for disaster. Anyone would be able to post listings on Amazon for popular products, undercut prices by 50% to get a bunch of quick orders, and then just take off with the cash.
 
The messed up part is amazon is still taking orders for her products, but she can't even login to fill them due to this "review".
 
GoldenTiger said:
The messed up part is amazon is still taking orders for her products, but she can't even login to fill them due to this "review".
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She might need a good PR representative to pacify her customers. I hear Paul Christoforo is free. :D
 
Hmph, I'll bet they have a policy somewhere she should have read.
 
If her bank account only had enough to cover $10,000 worth of orders for this so called "business", theres an issue. A business should be able to go unpaid for a minimum of 6 months and still be able to operate. Sounds like she wasnt prepared and even though its not exactly right for Amazon to hold her money, I do understand the reasoning and its something she probably should have researched and spoke with Amazon PRIOR to doing business.
 
I wasn't aware there were limits to how much you can sell through Amazon. Wouldn't you have to pay for "big business" traffic using Amazon's e-commerce servers? Also, isn't there an entry in the TOS that says there's a limit to how much you can sell at a given period of time and she failed to read it?

These are genuine questions. I have no idea what Amazon's third party sale TOS contain.
 
I wonder why Amazon doesn't have a system in place that prevents these catch-22s.

Why allow someone to sell at all if you don't trust them?
 
I can understand a review process (and would imagine it's referenced in the full TOS, but it isn't mentioned in the 'How do I get paid' section of the FAQ for selling*; the normally there seems to indicate that bank transfers are sometimes slow, not that they might put a hold), but it does seem completely unreasonable for Amazon to allow additional orders if she is unable to see them.

Knowing how long it takes to get the money from purchases is a pretty important business input.


*
Seller FAQ

How do I get paid?

Amazon first settles your account 14 days after you register. Subsequently, the settlement process repeats every 14 days. It normally takes 5 business days from the settlement until the money is available in your bank account. For a settlement to take place, you must

Have a positive or zero Selling on Amazon account balance. Selling fees and customer refunds, if any, can affect your balance.

Have entered valid information in Seller Central for your U.S. bank checking account.
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PaperclipGod said:
Thatd be a recipe for disaster. .
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The "recipe for disaster" is this:

Occhino said she had made over $10,000 in just five days but "they said that they were going to give me $1,100 on Tuesday and they only dispersed $45.02.

Her products are still on their page, Amazon is still taking orders and their commission money, but now her account's been frozen. She can't even log on and she can't fill the new orders coming in.
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She has filled all her orders up to the point they froze her account. She even filled the remaining orders with the cash she had in the bank so her customers don't go without on VDay.

Has she been accused of stealing? Has she been accused of not fulfilling orders or some other scam that would be a "recipe for disaster?" Thanks to Amazon, you can bet she will be accused of not shipping etc. after being locked out of her page while Amazon continues to take orders she can't fill. :eek:

Amazon should have pulled her page / products when they froze her account.

I think it is odd that selling a TON of <insert product> at a better price than everyone else....you'll be shut down by Amazon for being new with no feedback?
 
doz said:
If her bank account only had enough to cover $10,000 worth of orders for this so called "business", theres an issue. A business should be able to go unpaid for a minimum of 6 months and still be able to operate. Sounds like she wasnt prepared and even though its not exactly right for Amazon to hold her money, I do understand the reasoning and its something she probably should have researched and spoke with Amazon PRIOR to doing business.
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um ok we have a family business that been going since 2001 doing ac and electrical work,if we had to go 6 months of doing work whit out getting paid we would be bankrupt. 10g is a lot of money for a small business and i would bet that 90% of small business would fall if some thing like this happened to them where they sold a lot of goods and the money never comes in when they think it is.
 
doz said:
If her bank account only had enough to cover $10,000 worth of orders for this so called "business", theres an issue. A business should be able to go unpaid for a minimum of 6 months and still be able to operate. Sounds like she wasnt prepared and even though its not exactly right for Amazon to hold her money, I do understand the reasoning and its something she probably should have researched and spoke with Amazon PRIOR to doing business.
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The article states that she runs this business out of her home. You don't need 6 months of operating reserves when using this business model. As for preparation, it does sound like she was prepared. Even with the huge influx of new orders (100x normal) that Amazon sent her way, filling said orders and keeping the customers happy seems to be well within her range of capability. The only thing that failed was that the money cycle was severed at the exact moment her business underwent rapid expansion. Not every business out there starts with a quarter-million dollar bank loan and full staff.

Second point - It seems her business did have enough for "six months of business" as you put it as her typical order count was 1 per day. Or are you saying six months of business means 6 months Special Holiday reserves?
 
tunatime said:
um ok we have a family business that been going since 2001 doing ac and electrical work,if we had to go 6 months of doing work whit out getting paid we would be bankrupt. 10g is a lot of money for a small business and i would bet that 90% of small business would fall if some thing like this happened to them where they sold a lot of goods and the money never comes in when they think it is.
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Dude come on this is [H] everyone has 2 years worth of salary in the bank, people only bang 10's and have never had any adversity in life at all. Also they have at least 6 months of operating money in the bank for a business because well only some kinda scammer scumbag would not have that much money laying around.
 
At the time she was being scrutinized by Amazon, Amazon should have removed her listings. But instead, Amazon allowed customers to keep on purchasing from this lady, all the while taking commissions on those orders. Shame on Amazon.
 
Sounds like a lawsuit if she don't get her money. You'd be crazy not to sue with that kind of money being withheld.
 
dbu8554 said:
Dude come on this is [H] everyone has 2 years worth of salary in the bank, people only bang 10's and have never had any adversity in life at all. Also they have at least 6 months of operating money in the bank for a business because well only some kinda scammer scumbag would not have that much money laying around.
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You mean after taxation ? I do :p.
 
Funny, they are going all out on this lady, but refuse to look at the ones that are soo called established and ripping people off. Sorry,but three weeks for an item to be sent that was claimed to be in stock? No, no no and hell no.. Atm, i'm only trusting items shipping directly from amazon via the prime option.. The rest i'm skipping till they actually get ahold of this shit.
 
Let's see 10K @ 7% = $700/12 months = 58.33 * 3 months = $175. Makes perfect sense to me. Fkn Amazon!
 
dbu8554 said:
Dude come on this is [H] everyone has 2 years worth of salary in the bank, people only bang 10's and have never had any adversity in life at all. Also they have at least 6 months of operating money in the bank for a business because well only some kinda scammer scumbag would not have that much money laying around.
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Goddamn, your sarcastic input was really beneficial to this discussion....

Seriously, things happen in business and thats what makes or breaks ALOT of small businesses. If you run your business day to day, you will ALWAYS run the risk of having a catastrophe, failed payment, or any other thing that may ruin it. Small businesses that survive are the ones that can support themselves through the hardtimes. I guess it wasnt exactly right to say 6 months operating cost, but you need to have some leeway. If you run a strict day to day operation, thats really not smart business and I wouldnt want to spend my consumer money there (what happens when the business providing the service/product is gone and you need warranty work/repair 6 months later?).

If this lady just started selling on Amazon, sold $10,000 worth of stuff in 5 days, and cant support having that money held for 14 days there is something VERY wrong with her business/practices. I work for a small shop and they are out 2.5 million currently from payments they are owed from 3 years ago. Things happen, unexplainable things. We performed the work and guess what, they got screwed (to this point).

I see some of you believe this is harsh, but its also the cold truth. It takes money to make money. How many day to day small businesses survive? Lets be honest here, its not smart to start a small business on a day to day budget. I havent started a business yet just because of this. Im saving so that when I do open a business, Ill be able to support myself without having to worry if Ill have money to pay myself or employees at the end of the month.
 
doz said:
Goddamn, your sarcastic input was really beneficial to this discussion....

Seriously, things happen in business and thats what makes or breaks ALOT of small businesses. If you run your business day to day, you will ALWAYS run the risk of having a catastrophe, failed payment, or any other thing that may ruin it. Small businesses that survive are the ones that can support themselves through the hardtimes. I guess it wasnt exactly right to say 6 months operating cost, but you need to have some leeway. If you run a strict day to day operation, thats really not smart business and I wouldnt want to spend my consumer money there (what happens when the business providing the service/product is gone and you need warranty work/repair 6 months later?).

If this lady just started selling on Amazon, sold $10,000 worth of stuff in 5 days, and cant support having that money held for 14 days there is something VERY wrong with her business/practices. I work for a small shop and they are out 2.5 million currently from payments they are owed from 3 years ago. Things happen, unexplainable things. We performed the work and guess what, they got screwed (to this point).

I see some of you believe this is harsh, but its also the cold truth. It takes money to make money. How many day to day small businesses survive? Lets be honest here, its not smart to start a small business on a day to day budget. I havent started a business yet just because of this. Im saving so that when I do open a business, Ill be able to support myself without having to worry if Ill have money to pay myself or employees at the end of the month.
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Couldnt edit not sure why... And to clarify, 6 months operating cost I was referring to that she could run 6 months without being paid for a single thing, and still be running. Even out of your home (you save on operating cost as you dont have to pay for rent), doesnt matter. Granted, in this case 6 months is probably a bit much but atleast be able to make it a month without being paid.
 
Amazon's new seller policies blow.

I probably won't ever sell on there after I got scammed by a dishonest customer and Amazon refuses to even address my issues.
 
MavericK96 said:
Maybe not, but he's absolutely right though. Lot of bullshit attitudes around here sometimes.
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How is it a bullshit attitude? Are you kidding me? How is it a bullshit attitude? Companies that are run like this are the reason people get screwed all the time. Granted, there are companies that have the money that will screw you too but things happen to the small businesses.

Im not sure what you dont understand? Its not an "attitude" that people have, its reality. If you want to spend your money with that type of business, be my guest but Id rather go elsewhere even if it costs a bit more. She shouldnt be selling more than she can handle and obviously not being able to accept payment for 5 days of sales indicates that she took on WAYYY more than she could handle.

And if you look at post #9, their policy is clearly stated. Im really not sure why there is such a gripe? That seems to be a pretty cut and dry settlement policy that she probably didnt read.
 
doz said:
Im really not sure why there is such a gripe?
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I think that is the problem right there.

BTW...got $10,000 I can have? :D


dbu8554 said:
Dude come on this is [H] everyone has 2 years worth of salary in the bank, people only bang 10's and have never had any adversity in life at all.
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I see no reason for you to bring my personal life into this ... :D
 
stealthy123 said:
Amazon's new seller policies blow.

I probably won't ever sell on there after I got scammed by a dishonest customer and Amazon refuses to even address my issues.
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MavericK96 said:
Maybe not, but he's absolutely right though. Lot of bullshit attitudes around here sometimes.
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doz said:
How is it a bullshit attitude? Are you kidding me? How is it a bullshit attitude? Companies that are run like this are the reason people get screwed all the time. Granted, there are companies that have the money that will screw you too but things happen to the small businesses.

Im not sure what you dont understand? Its not an "attitude" that people have, its reality. If you want to spend your money with that type of business, be my guest but Id rather go elsewhere even if it costs a bit more. She shouldnt be selling more than she can handle and obviously not being able to accept payment for 5 days of sales indicates that she took on WAYYY more than she could handle.

And if you look at post #9, their policy is clearly stated. Im really not sure why there is such a gripe? That seems to be a pretty cut and dry settlement policy that she probably didnt read.
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I agree with you about having operating capital in reserve, However Amazon did not have this shitty policy until right before this holiday season which is why i stopped selling on there. I do feel a little bad for the lady BUT she should have read the fine print plain and simple.
 
doz said:
Are you kidding me? How is it a bullshit attitude? Companies that are run like this are the reason people get screwed all the time.
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You know how many companies started like this lady did that you say you would never do business with?

Microsoft...buncha nerds coding together. Apple (literally, in a garage)...screw it, damn near EVERY small business on the planet that went on to be a major business, all started out small, most had little to no money and they invested everything they had...most

...I get any further into explaining this and I'll start spouting "The American Dream." :)
 
doz said:
If her bank account only had enough to cover $10,000 worth of orders for this so called "business", theres an issue. A business should be able to go unpaid for a minimum of 6 months and still be able to operate. Sounds like she wasnt prepared and even though its not exactly right for Amazon to hold her money, I do understand the reasoning and its something she probably should have researched and spoke with Amazon PRIOR to doing business.
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Dumb comment not even worth my time.
 
Steve said:
I think that is the problem right there.

BTW...got $10,000 I can have? :D




I see no reason for you to bring my personal life into this ... :D
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Of course, according to Steve's math, (10) 1s equal (1) 10..... And seeing as Steve's salary is peanuts, perhaps he has 2 bags full in the bank ;)

J/k.
 
NoOther said:
And seeing as Steve's salary is peanuts...
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:mad:

I'll have you know that my SALARY IS NOT PEANUTS!!!!



IT IS MIXED NUTS (maybe someday it will be cashews...well, probably just the cashew halves, not the whole ones with sea salt)!
 
eggrock said:
She might need a good PR representative to pacify her customers. I hear Paul Christoforo is free. :D
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I don't know about that, I hear that he's been pretty busy trolling the graphics card section here lately.

This lady's business may have been destroyed right as it was getting started, which is a shame but I'm not sure what the answer is. I stopped buying anything from Amazon Marketplace merchants for several years after getting burned by some of their policies that favored merchants, now they seem to have shifted to a more consumer friendly stance but the merchants are getting burned. Of course the root of this problem is that Amazon policies will always protect Amazon's interests above all others.
 
doz said:
Goddamn, your sarcastic input was really beneficial to this discussion....

Seriously, things happen in business and thats what makes or breaks ALOT of small businesses. If you run your business day to day, you will ALWAYS run the risk of having a catastrophe, failed payment, or any other thing that may ruin it. Small businesses that survive are the ones that can support themselves through the hardtimes. I guess it wasnt exactly right to say 6 months operating cost, but you need to have some leeway. If you run a strict day to day operation, thats really not smart business and I wouldnt want to spend my consumer money there (what happens when the business providing the service/product is gone and you need warranty work/repair 6 months later?).

If this lady just started selling on Amazon, sold $10,000 worth of stuff in 5 days, and cant support having that money held for 14 days there is something VERY wrong with her business/practices. I work for a small shop and they are out 2.5 million currently from payments they are owed from 3 years ago. Things happen, unexplainable things. We performed the work and guess what, they got screwed (to this point).

I see some of you believe this is harsh, but its also the cold truth. It takes money to make money. How many day to day small businesses survive? Lets be honest here, its not smart to start a small business on a day to day budget. I havent started a business yet just because of this. Im saving so that when I do open a business, Ill be able to support myself without having to worry if Ill have money to pay myself or employees at the end of the month.
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No need to backpedal, you were absolutely on the money. The reason most small businesses fail is a lack of initial capital. If you're starting a business with 10k in the bank, unless you're incredibly lucky, you're planning for failure.

Additionally...if you're expecting your average collection rate to be <14 days, good farking luck staying in business. Even in 'the networked economy'...yeah right. Traditional finance teaches you to not pay until the point at which your start incurring fees (time value of money). Sometimes, it's even worth it to eat the fees to hang on to cash longer for the interest. Long story short, woman is in way over her head.
 
doz said:
How is it a bullshit attitude? Are you kidding me? How is it a bullshit attitude? Companies that are run like this are the reason people get screwed all the time. Granted, there are companies that have the money that will screw you too but things happen to the small businesses.

Im not sure what you dont understand? Its not an "attitude" that people have, its reality. If you want to spend your money with that type of business, be my guest but Id rather go elsewhere even if it costs a bit more. She shouldnt be selling more than she can handle and obviously not being able to accept payment for 5 days of sales indicates that she took on WAYYY more than she could handle.

And if you look at post #9, their policy is clearly stated. Im really not sure why there is such a gripe? That seems to be a pretty cut and dry settlement policy that she probably didnt read.
Click to expand...

Nothing in your post was even remotely related to the tone or the intent of the one I was quoting.
 
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