Recon3D Fatal1ty Pro vs X-Fi Titanium Fatal1ty Professional

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Limp Gawd
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Apr 6, 2011
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The reviews make it hard to tell which card would you say is better? Or does another manufacturer have a better a better card around that price?
 
Hard to find any reviews at all on the Recon3D (which I take as a bad sign). The Xonar DX is in that quality/price range as well.
 
I bought the Recon3D the day it came out. Havent had 1 issue whatsoever, no crackling or popping that I've heard people reporting on other Creative or ASUS cards. HD 558's paired with them and I play battlefield at about 13% volume. The 600ohm amp makes the thing LOUD. I can turn it up to max and hear my cans clear as day from halfway across a 1500sq ft townhouse.

If headphones are your main audio source, Recon3D or Xonar STX.

If you use a 5.1, it's a toss up. The Titanium series seems to be better with speakers, I wouldn't know firsthand as I am not currently using any speakers (mine died).
 
The Recond3D is complete overpriced crap. Sorry for the person above who bought it. There is no way Creative should be charging that much for what amounts to about $30 of components. This is worse than Apple!

If you want a detailed non-biased writeup on just how bad this card is, see the Creative forums, and see the post by Daniel K. He really know all of the creative cards in and out.

Here is the full text from his post:

Thanks to the user BF, I was able to see what the Recon3D is all about, just by analyzing the software and driver included in the Installation Disc.

About the card itself:

- Recon3D does have a DSP with pre-programmed functions for the THX TruStudio and CrystalVoice.


About the Sound Core3D quad-core processor:

- Not quad-core at all: even the original SB Live! could process as many sound effects at the same time.
- Design is based around the CA0110 PCI Express HD Audio controller with an embedded DSP and integrated DAC.
- EAX is software based, as it is supported through Host OpenAL.
- Pre-programmed DSP with as many sound effects you could find on any car stereo or home theater.


Pros

- Less compatibility issues, as it basically uses simple codec drivers and all EAX gaming effects are processed in software by the system's CPU.
- Dedicated Headphone amplifier.
- THX TruStudio surround sound effects are better than Creative's CMSS3D.
- Hardware accelerated THX TruStudio/CrystalVoice effects.
- Microphone enhancements by CrystalVoice.


Cons

- Really overpriced, not justifiable for such cheap design.
- Average sound quality, even worse than some motherboard integrated HD Audio codecs.
- Limited to 5.1 speakers and 96kHz, questionable for a cutting edge sound card, even if a gaming only card.
- Sound Core3D is just a simple pre-programmed DSP.
- No HDMI connector.
- No hardware EAX acceleration.
- No THX speaker calibration.
- No hardware MIDI synthesizer.
- No ASIO.
- Control panel written in Microsoft .NET, loads slowly and wastes 50MB of RAM when minimized to tray.
- No WHQL drivers.
- Questionable dedicated headphone amp, as the integrated DAC is of poor quality.


The included drivers are not WHQL signed and worse, are from a debug version (just open the .sys driver and you'll see it).

Did Creative improve the software/drivers?

No, if it has less compatibility issues or does not have any at all, is because the drivers MUST be simple, as it is just an HD Audio driver, like I've said before. Then we have the Control Panel which uses a DLL to access the registers in the embedded DSP to enable and adjust the sound enhancements.


Is this a revolutionary sound card?

Not a all.

THX TruStudio Surround is the only REALLY improved feature.

CrystalVoice enhancements have been around for years, being the hardware implementation the only improvement.



As Creative have just released X-Fi MB2 as a retail product, you should better buy this if you DO NOT have a Creative soundcard and want THX TruStudio and EAX5.

Curiously, X-Fi MB2 does not work with Creative cards.

X-Fi MB2 works with ANY soundcard or HD Audio codec, although it needs some tweking for the ASUS Xonar series.



X-Fi Titanium Features you'll be missing:

- Hardware accelerated EAX.
- Fully programmable DSP in Audio Creation mode.
- Hardware MIDI Synthesizer with SoundFont support.
- Very good sound quality for Creative designs, premium/audiophile sound quality for Auzentech/Onkyo designs.
- THX speaker calibration.
- DTS Connect (DTS Interactive encoder/DTS Neo:pC)
- HDMI connector for some models.
 
"Average sound quality, even worse than some motherboard integrated HD Audio codecs." - I'm sorry but I have a brand new Z68 board with the latest realtek codec and this thing blows it out of the water in every way possible. So unless Realtek has also downgraded in quality over time I have to say that this statement is complete BS. There is no onboard sound better than a Recon3D. I will agree that it is overpriced, but the reason I bought it is because I have seen *many* complaints of crackling, hissing, and popping noises on X-Fi cards on W7. I've heard the same for some of the ASUS cards and I refuse to by anything they make due to the fact that they have the *WORST* customer service out of any parts manufacturer I've ever had to deal with. In my experience with the Recon3D, which includes listening to music and playing games at the same time/playing things at 100% volume at times (with the headphones around my neck or sitting on my desk) I have never experienced anything weird or out of the ordinary, even once. It has performed the way it has supposed to since I installed it, so it was worth the money in my opinion.
 
I figured you wouldn't be happy with that post :)

To me the deal killer is the Control Panel being written with .NET. Tied to this, there are several complaints on the Creative forum about this card's drivers adding about 30 seconds to the startup time of their PCs. Not sure if you are running into that or not, but that would piss me off. I have an SSD drive so I could get the startup time of my computer down to about 20 seconds, and having it revert to 1 minute would just cause me to return the thing.
 
I have an SSD as well for my OS drive. My only delay currently is on my BIOS screen, which is just from the mobo. The second I hit enter after typing my PW into Windows the entire tray is loaded within 2-3 seconds. So that has not affected me.

PS the post doesn't bother me. I've spent much more money on things that turned out to be a total waste, but for me, this card is performing exactly the way I expected it to so I have no complaints and I'm just giving my own personal feedback having owned it since it came out. No hard feelings toward anyone who says otherwise, and I'm definitely not a Creative fanboy by any means. I just like the "latest and greatest".
 
Wow thanks guys. This was excellent as usual the members on this forum are incredible with their knowledge. I think I will look at the xonar, the only thing I like about the soundblaster is the case, but thats not a reason to buy a product.
 
txfeinbergs said:
The Recond3D is complete overpriced crap. Sorry for the person above who bought it. There is no way Creative should be charging that much for what amounts to about $30 of components. This is worse than Apple!

If you want a detailed non-biased writeup on just how bad this card is, see the Creative forums, and see the post by Daniel K. He really know all of the creative cards in and out.

Here is the full text from his post:

Thanks to the user BF, I was able to see what the Recon3D is all about, just by analyzing the software and driver included in the Installation Disc.

About the card itself:

- Recon3D does have a DSP with pre-programmed functions for the THX TruStudio and CrystalVoice.


About the Sound Core3D quad-core processor:

- Not quad-core at all: even the original SB Live! could process as many sound effects at the same time.
- Design is based around the CA0110 PCI Express HD Audio controller with an embedded DSP and integrated DAC.
- EAX is software based, as it is supported through Host OpenAL.
- Pre-programmed DSP with as many sound effects you could find on any car stereo or home theater.


Pros

- Less compatibility issues, as it basically uses simple codec drivers and all EAX gaming effects are processed in software by the system's CPU.
- Dedicated Headphone amplifier.
- THX TruStudio surround sound effects are better than Creative's CMSS3D.
- Hardware accelerated THX TruStudio/CrystalVoice effects.
- Microphone enhancements by CrystalVoice.


Cons

- Really overpriced, not justifiable for such cheap design.
- Average sound quality, even worse than some motherboard integrated HD Audio codecs.
- Limited to 5.1 speakers and 96kHz, questionable for a cutting edge sound card, even if a gaming only card.
- Sound Core3D is just a simple pre-programmed DSP.
- No HDMI connector.
- No hardware EAX acceleration.
- No THX speaker calibration.
- No hardware MIDI synthesizer.
- No ASIO.
- Control panel written in Microsoft .NET, loads slowly and wastes 50MB of RAM when minimized to tray.
- No WHQL drivers.
- Questionable dedicated headphone amp, as the integrated DAC is of poor quality.


The included drivers are not WHQL signed and worse, are from a debug version (just open the .sys driver and you'll see it).

Did Creative improve the software/drivers?

No, if it has less compatibility issues or does not have any at all, is because the drivers MUST be simple, as it is just an HD Audio driver, like I've said before. Then we have the Control Panel which uses a DLL to access the registers in the embedded DSP to enable and adjust the sound enhancements.


Is this a revolutionary sound card?

Not a all.

THX TruStudio Surround is the only REALLY improved feature.

CrystalVoice enhancements have been around for years, being the hardware implementation the only improvement.



As Creative have just released X-Fi MB2 as a retail product, you should better buy this if you DO NOT have a Creative soundcard and want THX TruStudio and EAX5.

Curiously, X-Fi MB2 does not work with Creative cards.

X-Fi MB2 works with ANY soundcard or HD Audio codec, although it needs some tweking for the ASUS Xonar series.



X-Fi Titanium Features you'll be missing:

- Hardware accelerated EAX.
- Fully programmable DSP in Audio Creation mode.
- Hardware MIDI Synthesizer with SoundFont support.
- Very good sound quality for Creative designs, premium/audiophile sound quality for Auzentech/Onkyo designs.
- THX speaker calibration.
- DTS Connect (DTS Interactive encoder/DTS Neo:pC)
- HDMI connector for some models.
Click to expand...

This. Spec wise, there didn't seem to be any positive attributes of the Recon3D over older X-Fi cards like the Elite Pro and the Titanium HD. For audiophiles, the lack of ASIO and lower quality DACs are a huge con.
 
Top of the line ASUS card is the Xonar Essence ST if you have a free PCI slot. (Some newer mb's don't.)

If you only have PCI-E, then the Xonar Essence STX is a very close second.

Both are pretty incredible cards - heaven if paired with a high end set of cans.
 
I just saw this card on my local best buy a few days ago. Thought about pulling the trigger like I did with my X-Fi HD a few years back. Glad I didn't...Thx for the mini review. It seems as though this new SB is actually a downgrade compared to the HD...
 
The Cobra said:
I just saw this card on my local best buy a few days ago. Thought about pulling the trigger like I did with my X-Fi HD a few years back. Glad I didn't...Thx for the mini review. It seems as though this new SB is actually a downgrade compared to the HD...
Click to expand...

Creative is trying extreme hardly to market it towards gamers because you can buy such better hardware either via another brand (ASUS STX or ST) or just simply use an external AMP/DAC for a world of new options and much higher sound quality.

The days of being forced to use sound cards for your PC are long gone.
 
Godmachine said:
Creative is trying extreme hardly to market it towards gamers because you can buy such better hardware either via another brand (ASUS STX or ST) or just simply use an external AMP/DAC for a world of new options and much higher sound quality.

The days of being forced to use sound cards for your PC are long gone.
Click to expand...

What bothers me the most about Creative is that their own tech support can't explain the few selling points of their products or how to use them. For example they insist that for headphones cmss-3d or thx tru-studio don't take advantage of a 5.1 signal. I honestly don't see that company being around for that much longer.

I honestly prefer my Xonar DX to the Titanium HD that I had, mostly due to dolby headphone.
 
BababooeyHTJ said:
What bothers me the most about Creative is that their own tech support can't explain the few selling points of their products or how to use them. For example they insist that for headphones cmss-3d or thx tru-studio don't take advantage of a 5.1 signal. I honestly don't see that company being around for that much longer.

I honestly prefer my Xonar DX to the Titanium HD that I had, mostly due to dolby headphone.
Click to expand...

I think they'll stick around but drop from the sound card business entirely , most people don't really care anyway. Most of the gamers I know either use the coax or optical connections from the cards or a set of USB headphones or an external DAC/AMP. Or they simply don't give a shit and just use on board sound since sound is the last thing they are really concerned with.

USB has really opened up a world of options for audiophiles who also happen to game and the who positional audio fad of the mid to late 90's has just died out as far as PC gaming is concerned. You can spend a few hundred dollars on a great pair of headphones and to try and replicate that same sound stage from speakers would easily cost thousands , plus headphones are great for privacy and really personalize the experience of gaming now.
 
Godmachine said:
I think they'll stick around but drop from the sound card business entirely , most people don't really care anyway. Most of the gamers I know either use the coax or optical connections from the cards or a set of USB headphones or an external DAC/AMP. Or they simply don't give a shit and just use on board sound since sound is the last thing they are really concerned with.

USB has really opened up a world of options for audiophiles who also happen to game and the who positional audio fad of the mid to late 90's has just died out as far as PC gaming is concerned. You can spend a few hundred dollars on a great pair of headphones and to try and replicate that same sound stage from speakers would easily cost thousands , plus headphones are great for privacy and really personalize the experience of gaming now.
Click to expand...

Without something like Dolby headphone you really can't get that speaker experience imo. That hard panning really ruins it to me and sadly most USB solutions don't seem to offer dolby headphone, even that Asus desktop dac and amp doesn't seem to offer it.
 
wow, whats up with the guy who has serious beef with Creative in this thread? lol

i have owned alot of sound cards, asus, ht omega, diamond, creative, and turtle beach.

had problems with all of them, but managed. But to attack just one company makes you look like a serious troll.

i know few people who own those new Creative cards, they seem to like them alot for games, very good sound card for locating the enemy in online games is what they are saying.

im sure its alot better than onboard sound, any aftermarket sound card is better than onboard sound, but to say that onboard is better than this new creative sound card is beyond trolling.
 
Last edited:
@ TroyX

those are DanielK's conclusions, not the posters, and i support danielk's findings having tested it against better onboard audio like AD's smartmax

would never compare to realtek's junk.......
 
diceman2037 said:
@ TroyX

those are DanielK's conclusions, not the posters, and i support danielk's findings having tested it against better onboard audio like AD's smartmax

would never compare to realtek's junk.......
Click to expand...

It is trolling indeed. I was on a Z68 board with the latest Realtek codec...the Recon3D is definitely an upgrade, absolutely no doubt about it whatsoever, and ESPECIALLY in the headphone department, it's a dedicated headphone amp! You can argue that the Recon might not be worth price premium, but you most definitely cannot say that onboard audio is better, it doesn't even come close.
 
I just don't understand why Creative would release a new product that is a downgrade from their last product in almost every single way....?
 
Zinn said:
I just don't understand why Creative would release a new product that is a downgrade from their last product in almost every single way....?
Click to expand...

Economics. They want your money and the easiest way to get it is to release a "new" card with no cost in development etc.
 
Just browse the Creative forums. There is the huge and still unresolved 'disappearing sound card' issue with most of their models. Creative insists it is due to a combination of Windows 7 on an SSD drive BUT others have the same problem do not any SSDs at all...including me when I first had the problem. Well past a year now...almost 2?...and still no solution or real effort on Creative's part to fix this. Most onboard sound today can easily beat the older X-Fi cards anyway so just yank it out and sell it on eBay like I did.

I agree with DanielK's assessment and his evaluations of most of the Creative tech. It is generally pretty lame stuff. The guy developed his own line of drivers even! Creative felt so deeply threatened they attacked him with lawyers to make him stop. Honestly, my Creative cards never sounded so good with his drivers! The dude knows his sh*t! I don't have anything against Creative...I really want them to turn things around and succeed. I like competition. I want to see Asus make better sound cards too. I wish there were 4 or 5 more major players. But the truth is the truth...Creative is scraping bottom right now. You can read reviews from all over, reviews done by guys that are engineers and could build sound cards and they agree Creative is slumping and the Recon3D line is way overpriced hype.
 
Munch MaCoochi said:
Just browse the Creative forums. There is the huge and still unresolved 'disappearing sound card' issue with most of their models. Creative insists it is due to a combination of Windows 7 on an SSD drive BUT others have the same problem do not any SSDs at all...including me when I first had the problem. Well past a year now...almost 2?...and still no solution or real effort on Creative's part to fix this. Most onboard sound today can easily beat the older X-Fi cards anyway so just yank it out and sell it on eBay like I did.

I agree with DanielK's assessment and his evaluations of most of the Creative tech. It is generally pretty lame stuff. The guy developed his own line of drivers even! Creative felt so deeply threatened they attacked him with lawyers to make him stop. Honestly, my Creative cards never sounded so good with his drivers! The dude knows his sh*t! I don't have anything against Creative...I really want them to turn things around and succeed. I like competition. I want to see Asus make better sound cards too. I wish there were 4 or 5 more major players. But the truth is the truth...Creative is scraping bottom right now. You can read reviews from all over, reviews done by guys that are engineers and could build sound cards and they agree Creative is slumping and the Recon3D line is way overpriced hype.
Click to expand...

the disappearing sound is not a driver issue, the Windows Audio service is failing to start due to service time out. There is a hotfix available for this, linked in that very thread you mentioned on the creative forums.
 
c110256d_25.jpeg


Kinda self explanatory. Nothing spec wise on the Recon series is impressive at all.

SnR is horrid by modern standards; worse then top tier Realtek onboard chipsets [102dB vs. 109dB], though I'm sure thats fluffed up a bit software side, and lack of Open AL HW support is dissapointing to say the least. I really see no reason to recommend a Recon3d series card over an X-fi, let alone an ASUS/Auzentech/HT Omega C-Media based chipset.
 
Based on what everyone's said, I'm actually interested in the Recon3D over my Titanium Fatal1ty, for headphone gaming using HD555's.

Properly driving cans is more important for getting proper sound out of them, SnR be damned. EAX support is completely unneeded, and since it's implemented up to EAX5 in software, it's a non-issue. Lack of 7.1 output? Who cares! Are you really going to run four stereo cables to a receiver? Do you have an entire HT setup positioned perfectly around your computer?

Lack of ASIO support and programmable DSP functionality is also a wash. If you need ASIO, you get a real sound card, i.e. NOT CREATIVE. If you need 'DSP' functionality, you get real software, not a sound card!
 
Anything close to 96dB SNR is a non-issue for 99% of you. If you were running it through more analog processing (like channel compression/de-essing OTB) you'd want it to be higher than 116dB SNR.

With that said, I went from an X-Fi Forte 7.1 in my gaming PC to a Recon3D Fatal1ty, and I'm glad of the upgrade. Unfortunately, it has the same ground-loop issue as all other prior X-Fi devices I've had (hard drive activity is audible at high gain), and I had to throw a Radial J-ISO from my troubleshooting box in to solve that once and for all. An ART DTI with some adapters would also go well filtering the ground issues, for a lot cheaper if you don't have any 1:1 transformers in your possession. It might even tame the bass frequencies a little. Before getting the Recon3D, I had also tried out the MB2 drivers with my onboard Realtek wondering if it'd give me THX TruStudio Pro and CMSS3D. Only CMSS3D was supported, so that was a drag. It took a lot of messing around in Safe Mode to remove the Forte drivers manually from the registry, to get that MB2 driver to even properly function. I for one, am happy with the new .NET driver interface for the Recon3D. The uninstaller for the Recon3D is improved and actually cleanly removes it! I was able to change PCI-E slots, without getting a #2 attached to the device description.

I've noted a few people say that the card is terrible for music and movies. While I'll agree on the music front (unless you like the 80's style Walkman Bass Boost), I think for movies the exaggerated bass response is pretty nice. Dolby Digital Live does pretty well on Stereo, 5.1 and headphone output.

The biggest downside of the product (aside from lack of proper shielding/isolation) is that only the headphone port downmixes 5.1 to stereo. If you're using the front stereo line-out, and have Windows set to 5.1 channels it won't automatically downmix. Since the drivers can detect which port is connected, I would have really like to seen it downmix with the surrounds not plugged in. Having to select Stereo from the drop down list, or mess with the source output in a video player kind of sucks.

As far as complaints about lack of ASIO -- WASAPI exclusive is effectively the same thing (minus the mixer being "open"), and is supported in Cubase, Ableton, etc. Not that this matters, since it's a gaming solution. But in a pinch, you could get used to the sound and check your mixes on the Recon3D without little learning curve. Audio engineers have dealt with a lot worse interfaces over the years, that's for sure.
 
Thanks for the response Farkle. I'm mostly interested in it as a headphone amp solution as compared to shelling out for an STX, and I could give a rats about 5.1 (as most should!) or down-mixing. It would stay in stereo/headphone mode.
 
For those commenting on the built in amp, I'm wondering why the ASUS Xonar DG(X) is getting so little attention...
 
gamerk2 said:
For those commenting on the built in amp, I'm wondering why the ASUS Xonar DG(X) is getting so little attention...
Click to expand...

Agreed.

As for anything based on the Recon3D, I agree with those that can't understand why Creative would release a "flagship" card that is poorer than the (true, not Xtreme Audio) X-Fi cards that came before. I passed on the Recon3D because the basic X-Fi Titanium PCIe card I have is better than it.

Love or hate Creative, their new product doesn't beat the old one in any noticeable way, and in many ways, falls short of it.
 
Creative Gigaworks S750 so recon is useless on my speaker system. Plus Creative no longer supplies cables or anything with Gigaworks S750 so I am stuck with older audio as in Creative Champion Fatiltity. Hey its great sound card. Should have kept Elite Pro I had before it. Hey, sound cards still have long way to go to improve in my opinion.
 
^^ Ummm, what? PC audio has come a long way, and the top tier cards already are better then some mid-tier digital receivers. Really isn't much left to do besides even more quality, but I don't think theres a huge market for >$400 soundcards out there...
 
gamerk2 said:
^^ Ummm, what? PC audio has come a long way, and the top tier cards already are better then some mid-tier digital receivers. Really isn't much left to do besides even more quality, but I don't think theres a huge market for >$400 soundcards out there...
Click to expand...

That might be your opinion.
I suppose the mid tier crappy receiver but not mid tier from a good manufacturer.
 
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