1,000 Chinese Workers Strike at Apple and IBM Supplier

CommanderFrank

CommanderFrank

Cat Can't Scratch It
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China and its workers are coming of age and collective bargaining by striking will be a large part of the new ideology. Workers at plants that manufacture parts for Apple, IBM and other major corporations struck over excessive overtime requirements recently according to the China Labour Watch.

CLW said staff "commonly worked anywhere from 100 to 200 hours of overtime a month" but the factory refused to let them put the hours in at the weekend because under Chinese labour law JEC would have had to double the wages.
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I support any worker that is being asked to work unhealthy hours or in similarly unhealthy conditions.

Just realize...

The fallout from this of course will be an increased cost of goods. Which will get passed onto the buyer.
Makes you wonder.
When it costs Apple $188* to manufacturer an iPhone 4s and they sell it for $649, is there no way to lower that price without passing it on to the customer? Do they need to have 80 Billion** in cash as a company? When will he greed stop?

I selected Apple since the prices of their products are more easily researched than those of the other companies listed.



*http://news.cnet.com/8301-13506_3-20123112-17/iphone-4s-parts-cost-$188-study-finds/

**http://seekingalpha.com/article/309061-how-much-cash-does-apple-really-have
 
China is going to say goodbye to manufacturing real soon now. I have already noticed much of the things I buy no longer say made in China. Foxconn China loosing 1M jobs to Foxconn Taiwan robots. Automation is taking hold in China just like US/Europe/Japan. They can't implement a service economy because their workforce doesn't even have a high school education.
 
Good... Pay the Chinese workers more. That means more companies are likely to stay here in the US with increased costs in China. China jacked up the price of their rare earth minerals recently due to the fact that we shut down our mines here in America because they were so much cheaper.

Now they recently opened the mine back up after almost 10 years and opened up tons of jobs (both construction and permanent). Let China keep raising the pricing on their goods, maybe we can bring back MADE IN THE USA.
 
Someone must have slipped a book about labor unions past the Chinese information ministry.

I particularly like this one:
"China Labour Watch calls upon Apple, IBM and the other clients of this factory to assume responsibility for these workers’ dissatisfaction and work with the factory to improve the working conditions in the factory.

"We particularly urge Apple to take responsibility, as there are more than 300 workers working on the Apple keyboard assembly line," it added.
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Have they not figured it out yet? The reason American businesses use Chinese labor is because they DON'T have to take responsibility for the workers! HAH!

I suppose it's only a matter of time until the majority of overworked Chinese people unionize and force the government to step in and do something about it. Then, employers will be required to implement safety measures, paid time off, and benefits and that's when it becomes too expensive to manufacture in China and we move operations to ravished African countries to take advantage of the next group.
 
djoye said:
I suppose it's only a matter of time until the majority of overworked Chinese people unionize and force the government to step in and do something about it. Then, employers will be required to implement safety measures, paid time off, and benefits and that's when it becomes too expensive to manufacture in China and we move operations to ravished African countries to take advantage of the next group.
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++

Tomorrow, AFRICA! Then what, Borneo, New Guinea?
 
doz said:
Good... Pay the Chinese workers more. That means more companies are likely to stay here in the US with increased costs in China. China jacked up the price of their rare earth minerals recently due to the fact that we shut down our mines here in America because they were so much cheaper.

Now they recently opened the mine back up after almost 10 years and opened up tons of jobs (both construction and permanent). Let China keep raising the pricing on their goods, maybe we can bring back MADE IN THE USA.
Click to expand...

Companies like Apple will just move their manufacturing to another third world country in Asia or Africa instead of paying decent wages. Look at what happend to Japan. They took over the electronics industry from the USA and thought they had a lock on it forever only to see the Koreans and Chinese fuck their electonics industry up. Now the same thing is happening to Japans auto industry. As soon as the Koreans and Chinese bring wages up to an exeptable level they too will lose their industries to third world slave labor states.
 
This is the beginning of the end of cheap labor for corporate scumbags. Better start building factories in Peru now.
 
The increased slave labor costs are a good thing for every non-chinese economy. The higher local production costs rise in China the less will there is to farm traditional NA jobs to them as a measure of cost savings.
 
So this could besicaly be the economy slowly evening out and we will not be buying so much cheap chinese junk and wasting resources getting it way over here sounds like a win in the long run.
 
This is great to see. Workers are starting to realize they are being treated as slaves, and are starting to stand up for themselves. The Foxconn incidents, now this. This will perhaps force Chinese companies to do more for them. It will increase costs, which may justify local manufacturing a bit more. This wont happen overnight, but it may possibly happen at some point.
 
Red Squirrel said:
This is great to see. Workers are starting to realize they are being treated as slaves, and are starting to stand up for themselves. The Foxconn incidents, now this. This will perhaps force Chinese companies to do more for them. It will increase costs, which may justify local manufacturing a bit more. This wont happen overnight, but it may possibly happen at some point.
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Cost of living adjustment.
 
djoye said:
Then, employers will be required to implement safety measures, paid time off, and benefits and that's when it becomes too expensive to manufacture in China and we move operations to ravished African countries to take advantage of the next group.
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Sad but probably correct. Africa has an abundance of human resources, but not money. Africans will be the next slave group after China. I don't wish to put the cart before the horse, but China's people have worked themselves into a little more affluence than they had before with an influx of foreign money. Maybe Africa can do the same.

By the way, "human resources" is kind of a creepy, sinister term if you think about it. Like "soylent green".
 
fattypants said:
By the way, "human resources" is kind of a creepy, sinister term if you think about it. Like "soylent green".
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I always found that term creepy too. In my mind a "human resource" office would be in the basement to power the hvac systems. "We need 3 more humans to keep the boilers running, it's going to be cold today!" *job posting*
 
I can see the headline in one week:

"Strike Ends After 1,000 Chinese Workers Disappear from Apple and IBM Suppliers"
 
Gee, what is the Chinese government doing? Nothing?

Last I heard, they controlled all commerce and industry there. Apple, IBM, et. al. are customers.

China should do more to improve the lives of their people. Odd how blame is deflected to the West and not where it belongs, with the Chinese (supposed) communist party.
 
fattypants said:
Sad but probably correct. Africa has an abundance of human resources, but not money. Africans will be the next slave group after China. I don't wish to put the cart before the horse, but China's people have worked themselves into a little more affluence than they had before with an influx of foreign money. Maybe Africa can do the same.

By the way, "human resources" is kind of a creepy, sinister term if you think about it. Like "soylent green".
Click to expand...

Africa is not an ideal location for most industries but yes, I am sure it has been considered. Africa lacks key infrastructure and security is an ever present issue in many locales. In China, the gov't runs the show. In more than a few African countries there is no gov't at all.

The Philippines, Thailand, and Vietnam would be likelier candidates in the short term but again, there are issues. Cambodia and Laos are in the same boat as many African countries are.

...but...do not think for a moment that the last nail is in the coffin for Chinese manufacturing. Far from it. Even if costs continue to rise there is not another country right now I can think of that has the infrastructure in place to accommodate ultra large scale manufacturing across varying sectors.

Also...hate to say this but I can imagine not many companies would want to be considered as utilizing 'slave' labor in Africa. I reckon there may be a stigma associated with that for some countries.................
 
We don't care about the workers. We just care about prices :cool:

75MacysonBlackFriday.jpg
 
snapperdragon0 said:
Gee, what is the Chinese government doing? Nothing?

Last I heard, they controlled all commerce and industry there. Apple, IBM, et. al. are customers.

China should do more to improve the lives of their people. Odd how blame is deflected to the West and not where it belongs, with the Chinese (supposed) communist party.
Click to expand...
Good point, but that's just not how it works over there. They value the individual and human life on a much different (read: lower) scale. It's going to take generations to change the ideology/sociology of it.
 
Time for American companies to find another country to exploit.
 
The Gonz said:
When it costs Apple $188* to manufacturer an iPhone 4s and they sell it for $649, is there no way to lower that price without passing it on to the customer?
Click to expand...

You can't manufacture a product without first researching it, which costs money. You can't sell a product in mass quantities without marketing it, which costs money. $188 is not the bottom line.
 
The Gonz said:
I support any worker that is being asked to work unhealthy hours or in similarly unhealthy conditions.

Just realize...

The fallout from this of course will be an increased cost of goods. Which will get passed onto the buyer.
Makes you wonder.
When it costs Apple $188* to manufacturer an iPhone 4s and they sell it for $649, is there no way to lower that price without passing it on to the customer? Do they need to have 80 Billion** in cash as a company? When will he greed stop?
Click to expand...


ok, while I hate Apple's business model as much as the next guy, lets not make unrealistic claims. If it cost $188 per device to manufacture the device that does not take into account packaging, shipping, marketing, and all sorts of other costs associated with bringing a mass market consumer product to market.
 
nobody_here said:
ok, while I hate Apple's business model as much as the next guy, lets not make unrealistic claims. If it cost $188 per device to manufacture the device that does not take into account packaging, shipping, marketing, and all sorts of other costs associated with bringing a mass market consumer product to market.
Click to expand...

they sell it for 649


6

4


9
 
goodcooper said:
they sell it for 649


6

4


9
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yes

$188 to manufacture

leaves $461

now we need to know how much it cost to pay engineers to do research and development, marketing, and all the other costs associated with doing business.....which could easily cost more than it does to produce.

If it cost $400 to get it to a point where it only costs $188 to manufacture, that leaves a $60 net profit, which is 30%, which is decent and average

but we have no way of knowing what their cost of doing business is, so we cannot go making statements like "look at how much they make because they sell for $649 but only cost $188 to make", because there is a monster number left out of that equation
 
nobody_here said:
yes

$188 to manufacture

leaves $461

now we need to know how much it cost to pay engineers to do research and development, marketing, and all the other costs associated with doing business.....which could easily cost more than it does to produce.

If it cost $400 to get it to a point where it only costs $188 to manufacture, that leaves a $60 net profit, which is 30%, which is decent and average

but we have no way of knowing what their cost of doing business is, so we cannot go making statements like "look at how much they make because they sell for $649 but only cost $188 to make", because there is a monster number left out of that equation
Click to expand...

The fact that they have so much surplus cash suggests that it did not cost them $400 per device to engineer and market it. Probably closer to $4, maybe even $0.40.
 
wizdum said:
The fact that they have so much surplus cash suggests that it did not cost them $400 per device to engineer and market it. Probably closer to $4, maybe even $0.40.
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you and i have no idea

cant hate because they have cash

i refuse to own any of their products

but i wont pretend to know their cost of doing business
 
nobody_here said:
you and i have no idea

cant hate because they have cash

i refuse to own any of their products

but i wont pretend to know their cost of doing business
Click to expand...

Isn't it in their quarterly financial reports?
 
MajorDomo said:
China and its workers are coming of age and collective bargaining by striking will be a large part of the new ideology. Workers at plants that manufacture parts for Apple, IBM and other major corporations struck over excessive overtime requirements recently according to the China Labour Watch.
Click to expand...


I've been working at the same company for almost 30 years, paid very well. Don't need the overtime as my wife has a good paying job as well. Recently two departments where I work were "amagamated" into one. I've been re-assigned from a job I really enjoyed to something very different because I won't work overtime on weekends. 6:00 am, 7:30 am and 7:30 pm phone conferences on Saturday and Sunday? F# that. In the last 4 years I've not taken any pay for the overtime I've worked, all on weekdays except for 8 hours when there was a "special project". I've banked it and now have over 550hrs that the company owes me in time off. I'm taking from April 28 through to July 9th off, PAID. Only 2+ more years to go... Come on Jan. 2014!!! :D
 
nobody_here said:
good question, where would one find that data? is it really broken out that clearly?
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so im reading their latest 10-K

Research and Development
Because the industries in which the Company competes are characterized by rapid technological advances, the
Company’s ability to compete successfully depends heavily upon its ability to ensure a continual and timely flow
of competitive products, services and technologies to the marketplace. The Company continues to develop new
technologies to enhance existing products and to expand the range of its product offerings through research and
development, licensing of intellectual property and acquisition of third-party businesses and technology. Total
research and development expense was $2.4 billion, $1.8 billion and $1.3 billion in 2011, 2010 and 2009,
respectively.
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Fiscal Year 2011 versus 2010
Net sales during 2011 increased $43.0 billion or 66% compared to 2010. Several factors contributed positively to
this increase, including the following:
• Net sales of iPhone and related products and services were $47.1 billion in 2011, representing an
increase of $21.9 billion or 87% compared to 2010. iPhone handset unit sales totaled 72.3 million
during 2011, representing an increase of 32.3 million units or 81% compared to 2010. iPhone yearover-
year net sales growth reflected strong demand for iPhone 4 in all of the Company’s operating
segments. The expanded U.S. distribution of iPhone to the Verizon Wireless network beginning in
February 2011, continued expansion into new countries, and increased distribution with other new
carriers and resellers also contributed to the year-over-year growth of iPhone. As of September 24,
2011, the Company distributed iPhone in 105 countries through 228 carriers. Additionally, the
Company distributes iPhone through its direct channels and certain third-party resellers. Net sales of
iPhone and related products and services accounted for 43% of the Company’s total net sales for 2011.
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The gross margin percentage in 2011 was 40.5%, compared to 39.4% in 2010. This year-over-year increase in
gross margin was largely driven by lower commodity and other product costs.
The gross margin percentage in 2010 was 39.4% compared to 40.1% in 2009. This year-over-year decline in
gross margin was primarily attributable to new products that had higher cost structures, including iPad, partially
offset by a more favorable sales mix of iPhone, which had a higher gross margin than the Company average.
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So on page 30 of the 10-K we see 2011 units (in millions, except unit sales in thousands and per unit amounts)

Net Sales by Product: iPhone and related services 47,057,000
Unit sales by Product: iPhone 72,293,000


It looks like they did have a higher than typically margin on the iPhone product although it also sounds like they make have taken a hit on other products in the same time period as margins overall fell. What is important to note is they are in that 40% margin range as a company. It's not like you can say $649 Retail - $188 TCOG = $461 profit. That's not how business works. I would bet they were in the 45% margin range on the iPhone for 2011. A healthy but not irresponsible margin. Quite the norm.
 
jstnomega said:
++

Tomorrow, AFRICA! Then what, Borneo, New Guinea?
Click to expand...

Most of Africa isn't noted for it's...stability, politically or otherwise. Would be a risky investment building it in an area where famine/war broke out. Theres also the qestion of transport and infastructure. 2nd world countries are a far cry from 3rd world, especially those far from the US or europe.
 
lostinseganet said:
I think Vietnam, and Brazil are the next places.
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Vietnam has infrastructure and labor problems, and a lack of second tier suppliers to support the volume of production that China has. Brazil already has quite a few of the large CM/ODMs producing there, but for the local market, due to relatively high import duties.
 
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