Best 30 inch LCD?

[foodfightr]

Dell 3008WFP (http://accessories.us.dell.com/sna/products/Monitors/productdetail.aspx?c=us&l=en&s=dhs&cs=19&sku=223-4890)

Apple Cinema M9179LL/A (http://www.apple.com/displays/specs.html)

Samsung LTM300M1P02 (http://www.samsung.com/global/business/lcdpanel/productInfo.do?upper_fmly_id=603&fmly_id=609&partnum=LTM300M1P02)

Sony maybe?

... price is somewhat of a factor. Need a general idea of what monitor is best quality and what monitor is the best purchase.

Use is web design, gaming and TV (through my pci capture card).

[isai95]

have you checked this one?
http://accessories.us.dell.com/sna/products/Monitors/productdetail.aspx?c=us&l=en&s=dhs&cs=19&sku=A0970148

6ms response time! Better than the Dell 3008 and almost half the price.

[Mr. Wolf]

If you're going to buy now, I'd go with the Samsung 305T.

[isai95]

For the money and response time, the Samsung 305T is the best! Perhaps it doesn't have all the connectors that the Dell 3008 has, but who cares? The only connector that I need is for the video card to see what the hell I'm doing in the computer. For movies, well, a good blu-ray player and the Samsung LN-T5281F is the one to get:
http://www.samsung.com/us/consumer/detail/detail.do?group=televisions&type=televisions&subtype=lcdtv&model_cd=LNT5281FX/XAA.

[gwu168]

The dell is a IPS, so the response time is naturally going to be slower than the PVA based samsung. In addition IPS beats PVA in picture quality and input lag. I would go with the Dell 3007 or 3008.

[Mr. Wolf]

I've yet to read any review that puts the 3007-HC ahead of the 305T. Now that Dell has hoisted the 3007's price to $1399, the 305T looks even better.

[FragMan]

i cant say enough about the 305t - its a great monitor- no nonsense, fast big giant screen

[Mr. Wolf]

i cant say enough about the 305t - its a great monitor- no nonsense, fast big giant screen
How do games perform on your 305T? I'm probably going to use my tax refund to get one.

[Frosteh]

If all you're hooking up is a PC, then the Dell 3007 without a doubt.

[gwu168]

The dell panel is better than the samsung panel.

Typically the factory default of the samsung 305T is better than the dell 3007WFP, but with calibration the S-IPS in the dell beats the S-PVA in the samsung.
Without a doubt, the dell has better color accuracy than the samsung. A lot of people think the samsung "looks better" due the artificial color saturation.

You can see the results for yourself at
http://www.digitalversus.com/duels.php?ty=6&ma1=88&mo1=237&p1=2302&ma2=36&mo2=238&p2=2303&ph=11

Plus the 3007 is cheaper. Also there are other 30" S-IPS monitor brands like apple and hp if you really don't want a dell.

[Mr. Wolf]

How do you go about calibrating a monitor?

The 3007-HC's response time is double that of the 305T (and my 2407WFP). Isn't that a pretty steep and noticeable difference? I'm not absolutely firm on the 305T. I want the best 30"er strictly for PC use (games and lots of writing/editing).

[FragMan]

How do games perform on your 305T? I'm probably going to use my tax refund to get one.

i play hl2 and oblivion @ 1900- its beautiful! - i guess i could game at 2560 x 1600 too, its gorgeous at this resolution, sli would help at this high rez

[Dan_D]

How do you go about calibrating a monitor?

The 3007-HC's response time is double that of the 305T (and my 2407WFP). Isn't that a pretty steep and noticeable difference? I'm not absolutely firm on the 305T. I want the best 30"er strictly for PC use (games and lots of writing/editing).

S-IPS panels are way better for color reproduction than the other technologies. I've had them side by side and the difference is huge. I've got the older Dell 3007WFP and it is fast enough for gaming. I quite enjoy gaming on it actually. The 3007WFP-HC is even better as I understand it.

[foodfightr]

If you're going to buy now, I'd go with the Samsung 305T.

Why would you recommend waiting?

[kleox64]

How do you go about calibrating a monitor?

The 3007-HC's response time is double that of the 305T (and my 2407WFP). Isn't that a pretty steep and noticeable difference? I'm not absolutely firm on the 305T. I want the best 30"er strictly for PC use (games and lots of writing/editing).


I do not recommend the 305T for gaming based on the input lag alone!!!!! Also the contrast shift is the worst you will ever see on a 30" panel, 40% of the screen is the wrong tone even after calibration, the calibration assumes you are looking 0 degrees on the whole surface of the monitor.

thank me later.

[The-One]

The dell panel is better than the samsung panel.

Typically the factory default of the samsung 305T is better than the dell 3007WFP, but with calibration the S-IPS in the dell beats the S-PVA in the samsung.
Without a doubt, the dell has better color accuracy than the samsung. A lot of people think the samsung "looks better" due the artificial color saturation.

You can see the results for yourself at
http://www.digitalversus.com/duels.php?ty=6&ma1=88&mo1=237&p1=2302&ma2=36&mo2=238&p2=2303&ph=11

Plus the 3007 is cheaper. Also there are other 30" S-IPS monitor brands like apple and hp if you really don't want a dell.


So is this absolutely true ?
I looked at the picture an the S-IPS does look better but is that all that matters?
It's just that this is the first time I've heard someone say Dell is better then Samsung for 30" LCD's or anything for that matter. I've been under the assumption that Samsung has always had superior LCD's. But I've only owned ViewSonics myself so far.

I've wanted to get a 24" or 30" LCD screen to leave the 19" realm behind but I want the best product for my money. Also, wouldn't the new Dell 3008 be better then the old Dell 30" ? Why get the 3007-HC over the 3008 ?

thanks

[kleox64]

IPS is superior to PVA, PVA is a flawed LCD technology and is something that should of been scraped long ago. Samsung need to get back to basics and start producing panels that can match IPS, the professinal market is there and its upto them whether they want to join in.

I do not recommend PVA based monitos and never will, too each his own.

[Mr. Wolf]

I do not recommend the 305T for gaming based on the input lag alone!!!!! Also the contrast shift is the worst you will ever see on a 30" panel, 40% of the screen is the wrong tone even after calibration, the calibration assumes you are looking 0 degrees on the whole surface of the monitor.

thank me later.
Nah, I'll thank you now. I finally got a look at the 305T. The guy who showed it to me pointed out the drawbacks of PVA and strongly discouraged it as a gaming screen. Since I don't want/need all the inputs of the 3008, it looks like the 3007-HC is the screen for me... unless Dell updates the 2707 within the next couple of months.

[FragMan]

I do not recommend the 305T for gaming based on the input lag alone!!!!! Also the contrast shift is the worst you will ever see on a 30" panel, 40% of the screen is the wrong tone even after calibration, the calibration assumes you are looking 0 degrees on the whole surface of the monitor.

thank me later.

I play Oblivion, HL2 and watch movies and TV on my 305T- input Lag? no such thing - mine works great, Tv , movies you name it - the 305T takes second place to no other 30 inch screen

[Dan_D]

I play Oblivion, HL2 and watch movies and TV on my 305T- input Lag? no such thing - mine works great, Tv , movies you name it - the 305T takes second place to no other 30 inch screen

I think not. I'd put it behind any display using an S-IPS panel.

[kleox64]

I think not. I'd put it behind any display using an S-IPS panel.

I second that.

[isai95]

IPS is superior to PVA, PVA is a flawed LCD technology and is something that should of been scraped long ago. Samsung need to get back to basics and start producing panels that can match IPS, the professinal market is there and its upto them whether they want to join in.

I do not recommend PVA based monitos and never will, too each his own

This is pure BS. Samsung LCDs are the best in the industry for the money. Sure, you can do a few twiks to make an LCD look different but not better. All use the same screen sheet.

[kleox64]

This is pure BS. Samsung LCDs are the best in the industry for the money. Sure, you can do a few twiks to make an LCD look different but not better. All use the same screen sheet.

but different technology, is it not?
Best LCD's but worst LCD technology.

I stand by my opinion.

[Dan_D]

This is pure BS. Samsung LCDs are the best in the industry for the money. Sure, you can do a few twiks to make an LCD look different but not better. All use the same screen sheet.

That's your opinion. However we aren't talking about the "best for the money". We are talking about the BEST LCD panels. S-IPS panel technology is FAR better than PVA or TN panels. So as long as Samsung's 30" panel is based on PVA technology it will be forever inferior to the Dell 3007WFP, 3007WFP-HC, 3008WFP and Apple LCD monitors as well.

There is more to LCD panels than pure response times.

[isai95]

i cant say enough about the 305t - its a great monitor- no nonsense, fast big giant screen
AND you can get it for like $1,099.00 brand new in the box. Very affordable compared to dell's 30 inchers. These monitors are very well made, very reliable and nice. For the avarage computer user is a dream come thru! Even for professionals that want losts of space. Photos, text, spread sheets, you name it, looks great!

[Dan_D]

AND you can get it for like $1,099.00 brand new in the box. Very affordable compared to dell's 30 inchers. These monitors are very well made, very reliable and nice. For the avarage computer user is a dream come thru! Even for professionals that want losts of space. Photos, text, spread sheets, you name it, looks great!

You get what you pay for. Graphics professionals would do well to spend another $200 on a Dell that has far superior color reproduction.

[isai95]

but different technology, is it not?

I stand by my opinion.
It does not matter, I have seen them side by side with a 11MP photo and it look exactly the same.

Just like their TV LCDs. Samsung 81 series vs. 71 vs. Sony XBR4 or XBR5.

They are made with different technologies but in the end they look the same.
81 series is like 50,000 to 1 while Sony XBR5 is like 15,000 to 1 they are about the same price and still look the same. Even the 52" size 81 model that cost about $4,500.00 vs the 52" 71 model with an inferior technology and that cost $2,000.00 look the same. Reviewers always find a flaw to enfasis that one model is inferior to the other one that they don't like but for the most part all are the same. A really well recorded HD video will look great in any of those models!.

[isai95]

You get what you pay for. Graphics professionals would do well to spend another $200 on a Dell that has far superior color reproduction

Not in all the cases. For example:
The 8800GTX video card is more expensive than their 8800GTS 512MB and the GTS is way better than the GTX. We are talking around $500.00 vs. $300.00 for the 8800GTS 512mb. Good thing that we can use the value in dollar as a reference! If not, Steve Jobs would be sellings us his apple computers for $7,000.00. or his iPod for $500.00. Thanks to Creative labs and other good companies we get better for less.

[isai95]

There is more to LCD panels than pure response times.

More shiny electronics? Better paint? Better color? more connectors? What else can they add to a piece of LCD sheet so a picture would really look superior to one looked thru a basic/average LCD?

Everything is in the drivers at this point! Perhaps the OLED (Organic Light Emitting Diode) monitor would show a noticeable difference. I mean day and night!

[Dan_D]

Not in all the cases. For example:
The 8800GTX video card is more expensive than their 8800GTS 512MB and the GTS is way better than the GTX. We are talking around $500.00 vs. $300.00 for the 8800GTS 512mb. Good thing that we can use the value in dollar as a reference! If not, Steve Jobs would be sellings us his apple computers for $7,000.00. or his iPod for $500.00. Thanks to Creative labs and other good companies we get better for less.

What are you smoking? The 8800GTX is faster than the GTS at high resolution with AA and AF. Sure the 8800GTS 512MB nearly matches the Ultra much of the time but only below 1920x1200. Again you generally get what you pay for and the G80 vs. G92 card argument isn't the same.

I stand by my opinion. I've seen S-IPS and PVA panels side by side and I can tell the difference. S-IPS does look better after calibration!

[kleox64]

More shiny electronics? Better paint? Better color? more connectors? What else can they add to a piece of LCD sheet so a picture would really look superior to one looked thru a basic/average LCD?

Everything is in the drivers at this point! Perhaps the OLED (Organic Light Emitting Diode) monitor would show a noticeable difference. I mean day and night!

OLED is next gen and so should not be considered, so is SED and FED. As for the Samsung VS IPS, one has horendous contrast shift and one doesnt, that reason alone discounts the samsung to be used in any professional enviroment, end of discussion.

[isai95]

What are you smoking? The 8800GTX is faster than the GTS at high resolution with AA and AF. Sure the 8800GTS 512MB nearly matches the Ultra much of the time but only below 1920x1200. Again you generally get what you pay for and the G80 vs. G92 card argument isn't the same.

I stand by my opinion. I've seen S-IPS and PVA panels side by side and I can tell the difference. S-IPS does look better after calibration!

I never did drugs never will. I would not buy a 8800GTX to run my 21" lcd @ 1600 x 200. Also, the mayority of people don't have a 30 incher. Why lots of people are buying the GTS? Are they smoking something also? They are paying for what they need.

[DusanV]

Another vote here for Dell 3007 and 3007-HC. They are IPS monitors, so good color reproduction, no hue shifts when viewed at an angle and fast response time (I game on my 3007, it's definitely fast enough). I had a PVA monitor before for 2 days and I returned it. Input lag and hue shifts are crazy. Samsung panels are a second rate technology compared to any IPS.

[alco23]

I never did drugs never will. I would not buy a 8800GTX to run my 21" lcd @ 1600 x 200. Also, the mayority of people don't have a 30 incher. Why lots of people are buying the GTS? Are they smoking something also? They are paying for what they need.

You're the one that brought gtx vs gts 512 into the argument there. Those who bought a GTX (that are also sane) would have also purchased a monitor that runs 1920x1200 or more to make use of it. So you can't really say the GTS is "way better" than the GTX. Depends on your system.

Back to the monitor debate. Best is for the individual user to see the screens side by side and see if they can tell the difference. If they cannot then no point in them spending more for a more expensive panel. For me, I've used PVA panels and the input lag and inverse ghosting annoys me to no end (you can notice it just browsing [H]). Even the view-angle restricted TN panels annoy me less. Overall if you want to pay for top quality for work that demands good colour reproduction and you also have a picky eye then IPS panels are where you should start looking at.

[chrisf6969]

the Dell 3008, has better scalers and all built in to for doing anything.

So I'd go with it if I needed a 30" display.

Though personally, IF I was buying a big expensive monitor right now, I'd probably get the Dell 2707, I prefer the lower resolution. Its DPI is better for general web, creativity stuff, and HD content. Also, its native resolution doesn't require a dual link DVI card (unlike the 30's) and its resolution is a little better supported in games, etc...


Some people are going to disagree with me here, but try both & see as monitor preference is subjective. (find a store that carries 27" & 30" and play around on both)

[visualguy]

One disadvantage that LG panels have is their sparkly grainy look. Samsung panels suffer much less from this.

[DusanV]

One disadvantage that LG panels have is their sparkly grainy look. Samsung panels suffer much less from this.

Ah?

[kleox64]

One disadvantage that LG panels have is their sparkly grainy look. Samsung panels suffer much less from this.

small price to pay if you gain superior viewing angles and low input lag.

[kleox64]

Samsung panels are a second rate technology compared to any IPS.


Ive stopped making comparisons since the gap between the technology is so huge IMO.

[visualguy]

small price to pay if you gain superior viewing angles and low input lag.

True for some, but not others. It depends on what you do with the monitor.

[Dan_D]

True for some, but not others. It depends on what you do with the monitor.

I can't stand input lag at all. I won't tolerate it for surfing the web.

[visualguy]

I can't stand input lag at all. I won't tolerate it for surfing the web.

How would you notice input lag while surfing the web? I own multiple LG and Samsung panels, and never noticed input lag while surfing the web on any of them. On the other hand, my Samsung 204T and 243T are much nicer to look at than any of the LG panels (Dell 2001FP, 30" Apple, and Dell 3008WFP) - smooth whites with no sparkle or grain like you get on LG.

[Mr. Wolf]

My 2407WFP (v.A03) is an S-PVA panel and it looks fantastic. I've never calibrated it, but don't notice any lag, ghosting, etc. I play COD4, Crysis, Gears of War and others on my 2407 all the time with no problems at all. Admittedly, I've been using LCDs exclusively since 2003, so maybe I'd understand better if I tried these games on a good CRT. Of course, I dare not 'cuz I prefer to live in blissful ignorance rather than have all my misguided notions crushed. What am I missing about the drawbacks of PVA vs. IPS?

[hmz]

More shiny electronics? Better paint? Better color? more connectors? What else can they add to a piece of LCD sheet so a picture would really look superior to one looked thru a basic/average LCD?

Everything is in the drivers at this point! Perhaps the OLED (Organic Light Emitting Diode) monitor would show a noticeable difference. I mean day and night!

You are not necessarily right. Dan_D is correct. You get what you pay for, and of course there are difference between LCD panels. Put some Vizio or low cost panel in comparison with some Sony XBR or Samsung. Both LCD. If you don't see the difference, then you might want to get your eyes checked.

[Dan_D]

How would you notice input lag while surfing the web? I own multiple LG and Samsung panels, and never noticed input lag while surfing the web on any of them. On the other hand, my Samsung 204T and 243T are much nicer to look at than any of the LG panels (Dell 2001FP, 30" Apple, and Dell 3008WFP) - smooth whites with no sparkle or grain like you get on LG.

Trust me. I can tell the difference. Some monitors have it and some don't. There was an older Dell 19" monitor I had at work that I noticed horrid input lag on. This was a model from a few years ago. I also never said that the Samsung monitor had input lag. Though the technology it uses is generally known for that.

I have several panels at home and one of which is an S-PVA panel and I don't have input lag with it. Though sitting next to my S-IPS panels I can see the difference in color reproduction. The S-PVA is FAR inferior.

My 2407WFP (v.A03) is an S-PVA panel and it looks fantastic. I've never calibrated it, but don't notice any lag, ghosting, etc. I play COD4, Crysis, Gears of War and others on my 2407 all the time with no problems at all. Admittedly, I've been using LCDs exclusively since 2003, so maybe I'd understand better if I tried these games on a good CRT. Of course, I dare not 'cuz I prefer to live in blissful ignorance rather than have all my misguided notions crushed. What am I missing about the drawbacks of PVA vs. IPS?

Again not every panel is going to have input lag and not all people will even notice it if they do. S-PVA and TN are fast in terms of response time so ghosting won't generally be a problem. As far as the real difference between PVA and IPS it is all in the color reproduction. At least that's the real tell-tale sign that I always notice and can't get past.

[visualguy]

Again not every panel is going to have input lag and not all people will even notice it if they do. S-PVA and TN are fast in terms of response time so ghosting won't generally be a problem. As far as the real difference between PVA and IPS it is all in the color reproduction. At least that's the real tell-tale sign that I always notice and can't get past.

Ok, now that it's settled that ghosting and lag time are not inherent in PVA technology, only color reproduction is left. Care to educate us on what's inherently wrong with PVA color reproduction exactly? I don't see much difference between the colors on my Samsung and LG panels, and I'm definitely not color blind.

For example, I didn't see much difference in color reproduction between the Samsung 305T (PVA) and the 30" Apple (IPS). The IPS panel in my 3008WFP has better colors, but this is a new-generation panel. I would need to compare that against the latest and greatest from Samsung, or maybe LG indeed managed to pull ahead of Samsung, but this by itself doesn't mean that IPS is inherently better than PVA.

[rinaldo00]

Ok, now that it's settled that ghosting and lag time are not inherent in PVA technology, only color reproduction is left. Care to educate us on what's inherently wrong with PVA color reproduction exactly?

Some info I found on another site.


S-PVA vs. S-IPS

There are several particular characteristics about these two LCD types which are of interest to a creative professional. One such characteristic is the viewing angle. Don't believe marketing numbers... "170 degrees" does not mean the image will look good at 170 degrees. The clear winner in this category is S-IPS, hands down.

S-PVA screens begin to exhibit an unacceptable gamma shift when only a couple degrees off-center. Yep, a couple degrees. So, if you were viewing or working on an image that had a lot of dark colors, you would begin to see an unnatural gamma boost in the dark areas as you moved your head off center. Basically, your eyes have to be dead-center on the image to see its true colors. What if you are working on a large image that takes up most of the screen? Too bad! You'll get some exercise constantly moving your head around to be centered over the image.

S-IPS, on the other hand, will retain much more accurate gamma levels even at extreme angles.

This characteristic is something I've witnessed first-hand... the studio I work for uses Dell 2405's, and every artist complains about this phenomenon. Not such a big deal when you're just surfing the web, but very important when editing images.

Note... the following characteristics are not ones I can verify firsthand, because I can't do a side-by-side comparison at work. But they are pretty much the consensus among the info I found online.

Another issue that seems to plague S-PVA screens is inaccurate color. S-PVA screens generally are known for their bright, saturated colors... which is great for selling to the average consumer, but "brighter and more saturated" is not necessarily the best thing for graphics pros! In fact, the 2405's at work have all been calibrated with a hardware Spyder system, and in an effort to force the PVA screen towards more accurate color, the brightness is almost all the way down. S-IPS seems to be regarded as more accurate.

And finally, despite marketing numbers, many people have also reported better response times with S-IPS screens than with S-PVA. I think this trait is more dependent on the manufacturer, though.

So what are the weaknesses of S-IPS? The only consequential one (besides a slightly higher price,) is that S-IPS technology is limited in the contrast ratio it can produce. This results in some people claiming they can't get "true" blacks from their screen. However, I think this also has a lot to do with the manufacturer.


Info from wikipedia

IPS
IPS (in-plane switching) was developed by Hitachi in 1996 to improve on the poor viewing angles and color reproduction of TN panels. Most also support true 8-bit color. These improvements came at a loss of response time, which was initially on the order of 50ms. IPS panels were also extremely expensive.

IPS has since been superseded by S-IPS (Super-IPS, Hitachi in 1998), which has all the benefits of IPS technology with the addition of improved pixel refresh timing. Though color reproduction approaches that of CRTs, the contrast ratio remains relatively weak. S-IPS technology is widely used in panel sizes of 20" and above. LG and Philips remain one of the main manufacturers of S-IPS based panels.

AS-IPS – Advanced Super IPS, also developed by Hitachi in 2002, improves substantially on the contrast ratio of traditional S-IPS panels to the point where they are second only to some S-PVAs. AS-IPS is also a term used for NEC displays (e.g., NEC LCD20WGX2) based on S-IPS technology, in this case, developed by LG.Philips.
A-TW-IPS – Advanced True White IPS, developed by LG.Philips LCD for NEC, is a custom S-IPS panel with a TW (True White) color filter to make white look more natural and to increase color gamut. This is used in professional/photography LCDs.
H-IPS – Released sometime late 2006, was the H-IPS panel which is an evolution of the IPS panel which improves upon its predecessor, the S-IPS panel. The H-IPS panel can be seen in the NEC LCD2690WUXi, Mitsubishi RDT261W 26″ LCD and Apple's newest Aluminum 24" iMac.
So to sum up, the pros/cons of the H-IPS over the S-IPS:

Pros:

Much less backlight bleed.
No purple hue visible at an angle
Backlight bleed improves looking at an angle
Less noise or glitter seen on the panel surface (smoother surface)
Cons:

Still some backlight bleed in areas that are green.
Viewing angles may have sacrificed in order to improve pros.

Image of a (switched on) transreflective color TFT LCD taken under a microscope with reflected light illumination lamp off (top, self-illumination only) and on (bottom).Fringe Field Switching is a technique to accomplish wider viewing angle and transmittance on IPS displays.


MVA
MVA (multi-domain vertical alignment) was originally developed in 1998 by Fujitsu as a compromise between TN and IPS. It achieved fast pixel response (at the time), wide viewing angles, and high contrast at the cost of brightness and color reproduction. Modern MVA panels can offer wide viewing angles (second only to S-IPS technology), good black depth, good color reproduction and depth, and fast response times thanks to the use of RTC technologies. There are several "next generation" technologies based on MVA, including AU Optronics' P-MVA and A-MVA, as well as Chi Mei Optoelectronics' S-MVA.

Analysts predicted that MVA would corner the mainstream market, but instead, TN has risen to dominance. A contributing factor was the higher cost of MVA, along with its slower pixel response (which rises dramatically with small changes in brightness). Cheaper MVA panels can also use dithering/FRC.


PVA
PVA (patterned vertical alignment) and S-PVA (super patterned vertical alignment) are alternative versions of MVA technology offered by Samsung. Developed independently, it offers similar features to MVA, but boasts very high contrast ratios such as 3000:1. Value-oriented PVA panels also use dithering/FRC. S-PVA panels all use at least true 8-bit color electronics and do not use any color simulation methods. S-PVA panels offered by Eizo (at least newer ones) use even 10-bit color internally, which enables gamma and other corrections without banding. PVA and S-PVA can offer good black depth, wide viewing angles and S-PVA can offer additionally fast response times thanks to modern RTC technologies.

Sometimes MVA and PVA type displays are categorized as VA type displays.

[visualguy]

rinaldo00,

Thanks for the info, but these are the unscientific impressions of an artist who examined a very limited number of LCDs. His comment that IPS panels are capable of only lower contrast ratios than PVA is obsolete, and I don't see why his other comments should be taken seriously. All this business with "dependent on the manufacturer" doesn't make sense either. Excuse me, but it simply sounds like the guy doesn't know what he's talking about.

Both IPS and PVA technologies keep advancing at a similar, but not identical, rate from generation to generation. Sometimes one is ahead of the other in some areas, but then it is matched or superseded by the other. For example, the LM300WQ5 30" IPS panel from LG (the one used in the Dell 3008WFP) is better than the LTM300M1P01 panel from Samsung (the one used in the 305T) in many ways, but I wouldn't be surprised if it is matched by the new LTM300M1P02 panel from Samsung. Both companies keep cranking out a new generation of panels every year or two.

[jkuo1]

Well one characteristic that should not be dependent on the manufacturer or the generation of panel and is the defining difference between S-IPS and S-PVA is the comment about the gamma shift and its dependency on even slight changes in viewing angles. Are you saying that you do not see any evidence of this gamma shift on the Samsung panel? Because if there is any evidence that darker areas start to look lighter just by moving your head a few inches to your left or right and viewing slightly off center, I believe that would be the defining characteristic that is "inherently wrong" with PVA color reproduction as compared to S-IPS.

[rinaldo00]

rinaldo00,

Thanks for the info,

You are welcome. Heck, I own a S-PVA panel (the XHD3000) and I am very happy, yet the 'experts' would say since it isn't a S-IPS panel it is crap. Luckily I am not a graphics professional.

[CubicleGeek]

My 2407WFP (v.A03) is an S-PVA panel and it looks fantastic. I've never calibrated it, but don't notice any lag, ghosting, etc. I play COD4, Crysis, Gears of War and others on my 2407 all the time with no problems at all. Admittedly, I've been using LCDs exclusively since 2003, so maybe I'd understand better if I tried these games on a good CRT. Of course, I dare not 'cuz I prefer to live in blissful ignorance rather than have all my misguided notions crushed. What am I missing about the drawbacks of PVA vs. IPS?

Funny thing is... I used to think the exact same thing with my 2405, I thought it looked fantastic - likewise with the dual Samsung 173P's I ran before that. Then I picked up the 3007WFP. Running the 2405 as my second monitor and having it side-by-side, it looks like complete and utter crud compared to big brother. I guess if you really have no reference point and are happy with what you have, it's good enough. Ignorance is bliss applies very well to this situation. Personally, after owning an S-IPS screen, it's very difficult to go back.

[Mr. Wolf]

Funny thing is... I used to think the exact same thing with my 2405, I thought it looked fantastic - likewise with the dual Samsung 173P's I ran before that. Then I picked up the 3007WFP. Running the 2405 as my second monitor and having it side-by-side, it looks like complete and utter crud compared to big brother. I guess if you really have no reference point and are happy with what you have, it's good enough. Ignorance is bliss applies very well to this situation. Personally, after owning an S-IPS screen, it's very difficult to go back.
Makes a lot of sense. I'm leaning in favor of the 3007WFP-HC, but am holding off until more news of the 2708WFP is available.

[isai95]

You are not necessarily right. Dan_D is correct. You get what you pay for, and of course there are difference between LCD panels. Put some Vizio or low cost panel in comparison with some Sony XBR or Samsung. Both LCD. If you don't see the difference, then you might want to get your eyes checked.
Yes, subtle differences, but not to pay double for a monitor. Also, not everybody has 20/20 vision. I do. I can tell differences between 2 monitors. Even within 2 monitors of the same brand and model one would appear too look different somehow. But the emphesis here is what you get for your money and the use for. Majority of computer users don't use a 30 incher. Professionals have paid always a premium for Sony monitors claiming that sony is the best and greatest in the industry. Remember the debate Sony vs. NEC monitors? Aperture Grill vs. shadow mask? Sony use to charge an arm and a leg for their aperture grill monitors and even having 2 horizontal lines in the middle of the screen some people would bet their life that sony monitors image looked night and day better than NEC shadow mask monitors. NEC monitors image looked great also. I had both of them.

[Dan_D]

Funny thing is... I used to think the exact same thing with my 2405, I thought it looked fantastic - likewise with the dual Samsung 173P's I ran before that. Then I picked up the 3007WFP. Running the 2405 as my second monitor and having it side-by-side, it looks like complete and utter crud compared to big brother. I guess if you really have no reference point and are happy with what you have, it's good enough. Ignorance is bliss applies very well to this situation. Personally, after owning an S-IPS screen, it's very difficult to go back.

I'm the same way. Once you go S-IPS you never go back.

[isai95]

You are welcome. Heck, I own a S-PVA panel (the XHD3000) and I am very happy, yet the 'experts' would say since it isn't a S-IPS panel it is crap. Luckily I am not a graphics professional.
DO NOT pay attention! They always come and say that the product they buy is better than whatever you have. Just buy whatever you can afford and enjoy it. Either they buy it on credit, which is not their own money and live in debt for ever or are rich which did not work for their money either.:D
I remember being very happy with my monochrome no name monitor that a friend of mine gave me and that just displays text.:D

[Dan_D]

DO NOT pay attention! They always come and say that the product they buy is better than whatever you have. Just buy whatever you can afford and enjoy it. Either they buy it on credit, which is not their own money and live in debt for ever or are rich which did not work for their money either.:D
I remember being very happy with my monochrome no name monitor that a friend of mine gave me and that just displays text.:D

I don't buy on credit and I'm not rich either. In any case I agree that if you are happy with something than great. However what's best is often NOT subjective. You need to understand that on a technical level S-IPS panels are BETTER than S-PVA panels. This is not subjective, it is fact. The difference probably won't get noticed by most people and some people won't be willing to pay the cost difference for the S-IPS panel and that is fine.

It isn't always a matter of people thinking what they have is automatically better. In this case it seems more like everyone trying to justify what they purchased to everyone else. That's quite a bit off topic as the question in this thread has probably already been satisfactorily answered. The question was "Which 30" LCD is the best?" and the answer is simple. It will be a monitor using the most modern S-IPS panel such as the Dell 3008WFP. The technical data backs this up and the graphics professionals choose monitors like the Dell 3007WFP, 3007WFP-HC and 3008WFP for a reason. For them the choice is obvious as for color reproduction no S-PVA design can compare.

For those of you who are happy with your S-PVA panels, good for you. No one said you shouldn't be happy with them. However I'd wager that if you stuck a Dell 3007WFP-HC or 3008WFP next to your 30" S-PVA panels then you'd understand what the rest of us have been trying to tell you.

[McCartney]

You guys are slaggin' "PVAs" pretty bad...
All I know is my 275T smokes my 1st gen Apple Cinema 30" Display in PQ and Response time.
That's just my observation though.

[Dan_D]

You guys are slaggin' "PVAs" pretty bad...
All I know is my 275T smokes my 1st gen Apple Cinema 30" Display in PQ and Response time.
That's just my observation though.

S-IPS doesn't have the best response time. This is also a known fact and it really is the single largest drawback of S-IPS technology. Still even the old LG panels like the one used in the Apple Cinema 30" and the Dell 3007WFP are fast enough for playing games and they do a decent job of handling video playback. At the time they were released they were the best monitors money could buy. Today they are still good, but obviously newer technology has eclipsed them in a number of categories. Picture quality is somewhat subjective, but what you are saying is possible. Also isn't the 275T a smaller monitor than the 30" Apple and Dell monitors?

[foodfightr]

No new Apple Cinema displays announced during the MacWorld keynote. :mad:

[interec]

For those of you who are happy with your S-PVA panels, good for you. No one said you shouldn't be happy with them. However I'd wager that if you stuck a Dell 3007WFP-HC or 3008WFP next to your 30" S-PVA panels then you'd understand what the rest of us have been trying to tell you.


I don't know about 30" S-IPS and S-PVA panels, but I know for sure that the Dell 2407WFP that I have sitting in my office looks much better than Dell 3008WFP that I have sitting in my home.

- I see sparkles on 3008WFP, but not on 2407WFP.
- There is obvious backlight leakage in the corners in 3008WFP, but nothing apparent in 2407WFP.
- No dead pixels on 2407WFP (which is around 6 months old), but already 1 blue stuck pixel on my 3008WFP after a week of usage.

[isai95]

I don't know about 30" S-IPS and S-PVA panels, but I know for sure that the Dell 2407WFP that I have sitting in my office looks much better than Dell 3008WFP that I have sitting in my home.

- I see sparkles on 3008WFP, but not on 2407WFP.
- There is obvious backlight leakage in the corners in 3008WFP, but nothing apparent in 2407WFP.
- No dead pixels on 2407WFP (which is around 6 months old), but already 1 blue stuck pixel on my 3008WFP after a week of usage.

I have a friend who has a Samsung 305T and he says it looks impeccable. He uses it for photography, games, excel docs, web design, live tv, etc. No dead pixels, super clear, super nice pure whites and blacks, no backlight leakage. He paid about $1,100.00 shipped.:p

[interec]

I have a friend who has a Samsung 305T and he says it looks impeccable. He uses it for photography, games, excel docs, web design, live tv, etc. No dead pixels, super clear, super nice pure whites and blacks, no backlight leakage. He paid about $1,100.00 shipped.:p

As far as I can tell the reviews also pointed to 305T being the best 30 inch. I thought Dell 3008WFP will improve over that, but obviously thats not the case and that seemed to be confirmed by the reivews which have rated 3008WFP quite low. Hopefully, we will get some reviews on NEC 3090WQXi as well.

[Mr. Wolf]

I have a friend who has a Samsung 305T and he says it looks impeccable. He uses it for photography, games, excel docs, web design, live tv, etc. No dead pixels, super clear, super nice pure whites and blacks, no backlight leakage. He paid about $1,100.00 shipped.:p
Damn, $1100 is a helluva price for the 305T!

[andersoj]

^^^
Do you know where he got it for $1,100?

[isai95]

Damn, $1100 is a helluva price for the 305T!
Yes it is! Compared to the Dell 3008 and the Apple one it is definitely a great buy!:)
Specially if one gets a virgin one 0 dead pixels.:D

[rinaldo00]

For those of you who are happy with your S-PVA panels, good for you. No one said you shouldn't be happy with them. However I'd wager that if you stuck a Dell 3007WFP-HC or 3008WFP next to your 30" S-PVA panels then you'd understand what the rest of us have been trying to tell you.

Maybe, and if true I'll switch. But my XHD3000 has a better scaler, nicer menu system, PIP, no noticable input lag or ghosting on FPS or movies, and 0 dead pixels or backlight bleed. The color on the 3008WFP would have to be a huge improvement to counter the rest.

[rinaldo00]

As far as I can tell the reviews also pointed to 305T being the best 30 inch. I thought Dell 3008WFP will improve over that, but obviously thats not the case and that seemed to be confirmed by the reivews which have rated 3008WFP quite low. Hopefully, we will get some reviews on NEC 3090WQXi as well.

The reviews I read said that the Samsung 305T out of the box looked better than the 3007WFP-HC out of the box since the Dell has bad factory calibration. A properly calibrated Dell looks better. Maybe you should get your 3008 professionally calibrated.

[Dan_D]

Maybe, and if true I'll switch. But my XHD3000 has a better scaler, nicer menu system, PIP, no noticable input lag or ghosting on FPS or movies, and 0 dead pixels or backlight bleed. The color on the 3008WFP would have to be a huge improvement to counter the rest.

Just because your XHD3000 doesn't have ghosting or lag doens't mean that the 3008WFP does. As for the scaler I can't say. Does anyone actually know what scaler is even in the Dell 3008WFP? As for the menu system I don't care. It isn't as if I access the menu system daily. I set things and I'm done with it until I have a reason to check something. In fact. I've got no dead pixels and there is no reason to believe you'd have them on the 3008WFP. As for PIP I don't really care about that personally.

To each their own I guess. I'm not suggesting you purchase a 3008WFP for comparisons but the 3008WFP isn't any less of a monitor or inferior to your XHD3000 simply because you own the latter.

[kleox64]

Maybe, and if true I'll switch. But my XHD3000 has a better scaler, nicer menu system, PIP, no noticable input lag or ghosting on FPS or movies, and 0 dead pixels or backlight bleed. The color on the 3008WFP would have to be a huge improvement to counter the rest.


Its PVA based meaning it has lag, its inherent to the technology.

[isai95]

Do you know where he got it for $1,100?
He says he got it on Ebay. I asked him to get me one but he says the Ebay guy did not have any more but would get more soon. At the time he had 6 in stock and he sold them all.

[rinaldo00]

double post

[rinaldo00]

Just because your XHD3000 doesn't have ghosting or lag doens't mean that the 3008WFP does. As for the scaler I can't say. Does anyone actually know what scaler is even in the Dell 3008WFP? As for the menu system I don't care. It isn't as if I access the menu system daily. I set things and I'm done with it until I have a reason to check something. In fact. I've got no dead pixels and there is no reason to believe you'd have them on the 3008WFP. As for PIP I don't really care about that personally.

To each their own I guess. I'm not suggesting you purchase a 3008WFP for comparisons but the 3008WFP isn't any less of a monitor or inferior to your XHD3000 simply because you own the latter.

True, but you seem to claim the opposite, that the XHD3000 is inferior to the 3008WFP without seeing either one. Extremetech reviewed both, and while they were impessed with the Dell's PC image, the other inputs were less impressive, same with the scaler. Extremetech said this " Unfortunately, Dell isn't disclosing what video processor is being used, except to say that it's not a Silicon Optix HQV processor. " so odds are it is inferior.

A S-IPS panel does not a guarantee great monitor. Maybe the 3007WFP-HC or the new NEC is the way to go.

[rinaldo00]

Its PVA based meaning it has lag, its inherent to the technology.

True, that's why I said no noticeable lag. Maybe I just got used to it.

[Mr. Wolf]

The reviews I read said that the Samsung 305T out of the box looked better than the 3007WFP-HC out of the box since the Dell has bad factory calibration. A properly calibrated Dell looks better. Maybe you should get your 3008 professionally calibrated.
How do you calibrate these monitors?

[rinaldo00]

How do you calibrate these monitors?

You need calibation tools, such as GretagMacbeth Eye-One Display 2, or ColorVision Spyder2. This article has some reviews

http://www.drycreekphoto.com/Learn/monitor_calibration_tools.htm

[Mr. Wolf]

Geez, those are expensive. I'm no graphic artist or video producer, so I'm not convinced it'd be worth it for my LCD needs (lots of work with text, documents, writing,... and gaming, of course).

[rinaldo00]

Geez, those are expensive. I'm no graphic artist or video producer, so I'm not convinced it'd be worth it for my LCD needs (lots of work with text, documents, writing,... and gaming, of course).

Those are the way professionals do it, and are the most accurate. You can do it by eye, though it is more time consuming.

Try this site
http://www.lagom.nl/lcd-test/

[Dan_D]

True, but you seem to claim the opposite, that the XHD3000 is inferior to the 3008WFP without seeing either one. Extremetech reviewed both, and while they were impessed with the Dell's PC image, the other inputs were less impressive, same with the scaler. Extremetech said this " Unfortunately, Dell isn't disclosing what video processor is being used, except to say that it's not a Silicon Optix HQV processor. " so odds are it is inferior.

A S-IPS panel does not a guarantee great monitor. Maybe the 3007WFP-HC or the new NEC is the way to go.

I'm comparing the technology between the two and sorry but S-PVA is inferior to S-IPS. I'm not saying the Dell 3008WFP's implementation is worth a shit, but if I had to buy one or the other blind, I'd go with the Dell. Every PVA based monitor I've ever used sucked compared to my old school 3007WFP.

[rinaldo00]

I'm comparing the technology between the two and sorry but S-PVA is inferior to S-IPS. I'm not saying the Dell 3008WFP's implementation is worth a shit, but if I had to buy one or the other blind, I'd go with the Dell. Every PVA based monitor I've ever used sucked compared to my old school 3007WFP.

For graphics professionals that need color acuracy perhaps. For the others there are other features that can make a monitor with a S-PVA panel a better choice than a monitor with a S-IPS panel.

I have read a ton of monitor reviews on a ton of sites. Sometimes monitors with S-PVA panels are rated higher than monitors with S-IPS panels. Are all of those reviews wrong?

[Dan_D]

For graphics professionals that need color acuracy perhaps. For the others there are other features that can make a monitor with a S-PVA panel a better choice than a monitor with a S-IPS panel.

I have read a ton of monitor reviews on a ton of sites. Sometimes monitors with S-PVA panels are rated higher than monitors with S-IPS panels. Are all of those reviews wrong?

Technologically speaking the only advantage S-PVA really has over S-IPS is response time. Yes they are better but the S-IPS panels have come a long way in this area and are certainly good enough for gaming. As for the reviews they are often not all directly comparable to each other. I haven't read all the same reviews you have. What I know is mainly based on what I know of the technology and what I've seen in person. The picture quality is largely up to the specific panel and the design of the overal monitor. I'm speaking in terms of absolute terms here. The absolute is that PVA sucks for color reproduction and input lag is a problem with the technology as well.

I'm sure there are terrible S-IPS monitors out there and outstanding S-PVA monitors as well. So it is logical to assume that some sites may find some S-PVA monitors superior to certain S-IPS monitors. Again you'd have to give me specific reviews to look at and specific models to compare. Even then I might disagree with those reviews completely after comparing the two monitors in person.

[rinaldo00]

I'll give you a few off the top of my head. Extremetech gave the XHD3000 an 8 and gave the 3008WFP a 6. Trusted reviews preferred the Samsung 350T over the 3007WFP-HC, saying this "What’s surprising is how much better the colour accuracy on the Samsung 305T was, considering that the Samsung uses an S-PVA panel, rather than an S-IPS like this Dell. Clearly the Samsung was properly calibrated at the factory, but it still shows that Samsung’s S-PVA technology is getting better all the time. It’s also not as if the viewing angle is better on the Dell, with both screens providing excessively acute viewing angles with little or no colour or intensity drop off." PC World ranked the 305T over the 3007WFP-HC, and the HP LP3065. PC Mag ranked them XHD3000, 305T, 3007WFP

As I said, I read a ton of reviews, and I know I left some out, but that is still quite a list. Either they are all wrong, or it is more complicated than IPS beats PVA.

[Uberbob102000]

No I like the 305T and XHD3000 a whole lot and I definitely agree that it's not nearly as simple as S-PVA < S-IPS and it's not. But what Dan is trying to say is that from a pure panel perspective without scalers and the like, S-IPS is better except for response time and contrast ratio. But once a manufacturer implements that panel into a full monitor it's a crapshot to what panel comes out on top. It should be S-IPS but it may be badly implemented and the S-PVA panel may be brilliantly implemented therefore the better monitor is the PVA.

[McCartney]

S-IPS doesn't have the best response time. This is also a known fact and it really is the single largest drawback of S-IPS technology. Still even the old LG panels like the one used in the Apple Cinema 30" and the Dell 3007WFP are fast enough for playing games and they do a decent job of handling video playback. At the time they were released they were the best monitors money could buy. Today they are still good, but obviously newer technology has eclipsed them in a number of categories. Picture quality is somewhat subjective, but what you are saying is possible. Also isn't the 275T a smaller monitor than the 30" Apple and Dell monitors?

To be honest dan I sold my 30" in search of a better one. I didn't want a 3007WFP-HC since at the time it was 1800 cad and was around the time the 3008WFP-HC hype-mill was being made (Early december 07 on this foruM). I got sick and tired of waiting and I needed the best big monitor available regardless of available inputs, I ended up getting this 275T for the exact reason and I don't regret it man. I don't see any drawbacks thus far on this monitor, except that Component scaling sucks but I don't watch TV on this (just tried it).

[Tamlin_WSGF]

S-PVA's and color accuracy is a joke. Even if you calibrate a S-PVA with a DeltaE (Delta error) less then one, the actual DeltaE from where you are sitting are too extreme. The calibrator doesn't take viewing angles into account and therefore you don't get an even picture. Its like having a permanent brightness bleed. If the reviewers don't spot this, I can't say I'm putting much into their judgement of PQ either.

Here's an IPS screen and a S-PVA screen:
http://www.hardforum.com/showpost.php?p=1031371458&postcount=58

Here's the 3007WFP with same image (contributed by jupix at WSGF):

@ 0 degrees
http://jupix.info/3007wfp/00-deg-thumb.jpg (http://jupix.info/3007wfp/00-deg.jpg)

@ 5 degrees
http://jupix.info/3007wfp/05-deg-thumb.jpg (http://jupix.info/3007wfp/05-deg.jpg)

[rinaldo00]

Viewing angles are not that important to me. I don't use my monitor from the side of my desk, I sit in front of it.

[Tamlin_WSGF]

Viewing angles are not that important to me. I don't use my monitor from the side of my desk, I sit in front of it.

Check the link. Image warps at center view as well. Thats the problem. Even if you sit dead center, colors are still warped. Thats why color accuracy and PVA shouldn't be used in the same sentense. They can't be accurate no matter how well you calibrate them. Its not a problem for most, since most don't need accuracy, but its important for those who do need it. Some can find it annoying though:
http://www.hardforum.com/showthread.php?t=1257639
http://www.hardforum.com/showthread.php?t=1257216

Its a shame that reviewers don't test this. Especially those who test "color accuracy". That a screen is color accurate 2mm from the display is worthless to know if the colors are warped when light reaches your eyes due to bad angle spread of light. Image consistency is crucial when doing color critical tasks.

You like your screen and have found the screen suited for you. Nothing is wrong with that. Still, its important that facts are not clouded and the fact is that PVA's are not suited for color critical tasks.

[Dan_D]

I don't need color accuracy to a significant degree but I just find the color accuracy of some monitors so poor I can't stand it. Plus I won't tolerate input lag.

[rinaldo00]

my error-delete post

[Mr. Wolf]

I found a new Huey color calibrator on eBay for $50. I'm going to try it on my 2407 and see what happens.

[gwu168]

Viewing angles are even bigger issue for larger monitors as viewing angles of the edges become steeper. I don't understand how anyone can use anything but S-IPS for 30".

[kleox64]

Viewing angles are even bigger issue for larger monitors as viewing angles of the edges become steeper. I don't understand how anyone can use anything but S-IPS for 30".

IPS is a requirement on a 30" panel, when I saw the 305T in action I guestimated that 30-40% of the screen area had contrast shift. Do people really expect this to be acceptable for a high-end monitor?

[rinaldo00]

IPS is a requirement on a 30" panel, when I saw the 305T in action I guestimated that 30-40% of the screen area had contrast shift. Do people really expect this to be acceptable for a high-end monitor?

I guess all those reviews I posted above are all wrong.

[kleox64]

I guess all those reviews I posted above are all wrong.

I didnt say that.

The reviews dont consider the viewing angles, it does'nt matter either way the problem is there as its the single reason that PVA will never make it into the pro market.

[rinaldo00]

I didnt say that.

The reviews dont consider the viewing angles, it does'nt matter either way the problem is there as its the single reason that PVA will never make it into the pro market.

I guess you didn't see this

Trusted reviews preferred the Samsung 350T over the 3007WFP-HC, saying this "What’s surprising is how much better the colour accuracy on the Samsung 305T was, considering that the Samsung uses an S-PVA panel, rather than an S-IPS like this Dell. Clearly the Samsung was properly calibrated at the factory, but it still shows that Samsung’s S-PVA technology is getting better all the time. It’s also not as if the viewing angle is better on the Dell, with both screens providing excessively acute viewing angles with little or no colour or intensity drop off."

Perhaps PVA is no good for graphics professionals, but several websites think it is fine for consumer use.

[Yelnats]

My only real experience with *VA is with the 2405wfp. Its gamma shift at different angles was quite bad. When looking at this forum, each of my eyes saw the image with a different gamma, so it was annoying just to look at it from straight on. Dark colors disappeared when viewed straight on, and almost looked metallic.
Do newer *VA monitors have less of the gamma shift when looking perpendicular to the monitor?

Unless newer *VA monitors are significantly better, I don't see how any reviewer could rate the 3007 lower than a *va.

[kleox64]

I guess you didn't see this

Trusted reviews preferred the Samsung 350T over the 3007WFP-HC, saying this "What’s surprising is how much better the colour accuracy on the Samsung 305T was, considering that the Samsung uses an S-PVA panel, rather than an S-IPS like this Dell. Clearly the Samsung was properly calibrated at the factory, but it still shows that Samsung’s S-PVA technology is getting better all the time. It’s also not as if the viewing angle is better on the Dell, with both screens providing excessively acute viewing angles with little or no colour or intensity drop off."

Perhaps PVA is no good for graphics professionals, but several websites think it is fine for consumer use.

The review is wrong then or the panel was not PVA based, PVA and colour accuracy do not go together period... the viewing angles prevent that. Unless your breaking the laws of physics, the contrast shift and black crush are a side effect of the technology.

All those graphic artists and photographers who agree dont know what they are talking about do they?? give me a break, I'm not gona participate in an argument that has solid facts behind it. PVA is a flawed technology and I do not recommend it to anyone.

[kleox64]

My only real experience with *VA is with the 2405wfp. Its gamma shift at different angles was quite bad. When looking at this forum, each of my eyes saw the image with a different gamma, so it was annoying just to look at it from straight on. Dark colors disappeared when viewed straight on, and almost looked metallic.
Do newer *VA monitors have less of the gamma shift when looking perpendicular to the monitor?

Unless newer *VA monitors are significantly better, I don't see how any reviewer could rate the 3007 lower than a *va.

You think the 2405 was bad, add 6 inches to an allready bad screen!!!

[rinaldo00]

The review is wrong then or the panel was not PVA based, PVA and colour accuracy do not go together period... the viewing angles prevent that. Unless your breaking the laws of physics, the contrast shift and black crush are a side effect of the technology.

All those graphic artists and photographers who agree dont know what they are talking about do they?? give me a break, I'm not gona participate in an argument that has solid facts behind it. PVA is a flawed technology and I do not recommend it to anyone.

It is a fact that the 350T is a PVA panel. Let's end this by saying that what graphics professionals need and what consumers need are not the same thing.

[kleox64]

Let's end this by saying that what graphics professionals need and what consumers need are not the same thing.

agreed.

[isai95]

The review is wrong then or the panel was not PVA based, PVA and colour accuracy do not go together period... the viewing angles prevent that. Unless your breaking the laws of physics, the contrast shift and black crush are a side effect of the technology.

All those graphic artists and photographers who agree dont know what they are talking about do they?? give me a break, I'm not gona participate in an argument that has solid facts behind it. PVA is a flawed technology and I do not recommend it to anyone.
Those are apple/mac guys that would never buy other products.:p They sold their a*ss to Steve Jobs. They like those shiny products! Women type like:D All LCD monitors are the same for regular users. That does not mean that paying more you get more for one needs. Some products cost more just for the color! And stupid people pay for it. Good thing is their money or their mon:D

[kleox64]

Those are apple/mac guys that would never buy other products.:p They sold their a*ss to Steve Jobs. They like those shiny products! Women type like:D All LCD monitors are the same for regular users. That does not mean that paying more you get more for one needs. Some products cost more just for the color! And stupid people pay for it. Good thing is their money or their mon:D

I dont use apple monitors, I dont recommend them even for mac users. They are too out of date and the fashion is to move to wide-gamut displays at the moment of which the cinema displays are not, also lack of HDCP.

[APOLLO]

I dont use apple monitors, I dont recommend them even for mac users. They are too out of date and the fashion is to move to wide-gamut displays at the moment of which the cinema displays are not, also lack of HDCP.Aren't there improved revisions of the ACD? I also read about new models possibly being released this year.

[FragMan]

Hey this might be a bit off topic.- does anyone have a samsung 305t cd ? -- I dont have the cd and was curious where the driver or software was? - its nowhere to be found on the samsung site:(